Re: [RBW] Upright / Relaxed / Swept-Back - Style of Riding

[David Ross]

I sold my last drop bar bike earlier this year. One thing to keep in mind
is that pain isn’t just about the here and now, it’s a signal that you’re
doing additional damage to your body. I keep that in mind because I want to
ride for as much of the rest of my life as possible. At 51, bars that are
level with the saddle are what I would consider to be “slammed”! All of my
bikes have swept bars these days with the minimum sweep being around 30 and
the max at a touch over 70. It’s a bit of a bummer not to be able to ride
the racier stuff these days, but with my current setup I think I can stay
on the bike for another couple of decades.

On Wed, May 8, 2024 at 9:28 PM Jay  wrote:

> I was always aware of bikes with a very relaxed geometry / setup, and it
> wasn't until I started seeing Rivendell bikes and watching youtube videos
> of people riding them that I really thought about it - is it more
> comfortable than drop bars, even if I have a more neutral (not aggressive)
> position on the bike (i.e., bars close to level with saddle)?  Would this
> be a good option for just cruising around, but for 1-2 hours?  If I didn't
> get along well with flat bars on mountain bike, would swept back bars be
> better?
>
> I'm going to ramble a bit here, my apologies in advance.  I haven't
> thought long enough about this to formulate my question succinctly.
> Hopefully you get where I'm coming from.
>
> *Quick background*
> - been riding a little over 20 years (closing in on 50!)
> - started with mountain biking (hardtail, singletrack); moved to road;
> tried mountain biking two more times (I love being in nature) but didn't
> like the thrill/danger, and hated the idea of driving to the trail head;
> have been mainly on the road for last 15 years, though with 10 years of
> 'gravel' bikes/riding
> - I've had ongoing issues with my cervical spine (nothing serious) and
> this leads to some problems when riding in any sort of aggressive position
> on the bike; I see a chiro regularly; stretch a lot; workout / strength
> training; have had numerous bike fits
> - I have a Roadini, Salsa Fargo and a road bike (25mm tires, but custom
> made and really does fit like a glove, for road)
> - I don't care about performance at all, I just love riding bikes, in
> particular when roads are not busy, or on trails, gravel roads, etc.
>
> On a good day (75% of the time), I can ride any of these bikes and during
> the ride I feel pretty good (little to no pain), maybe a bit of pain after
> (could be neck/shoulders, but anywhere else really), and after stretching I
> feel great in a 1/2 to full day.  I ride 4-5x a week, workout 1-2 times
> spring-fall and more in the winter.
>
> But at least once a week, and maybe twice, I'll be riding, sometimes tired
> as it's after work, and within an hour I'm running low on energy and
> probably start to develop a bad posture on the bike, over-using my arms
> which causes problems in my neck and shoulders, leading to upper body
> aches/pains (while riding, and after).  Takes a lot of stretching and
> awareness to reset.  *This is what I'm trying to resolve (move from 75%
> to 99%)*
>
> My guess is that even with a bike like the Roadini or Salsa, with bars
> about level with the saddle, and even with a professional fitting on each,
> when I want to ride but I'm lacking energy, it goes poorly.  But is that
> because these bikes are "kind of" aggressive (when compared to say a spine
> angle closer to 70% and swept back bars)?  Or is it simply a combination of
> age, history of some 'issues', low on energy and thus bad posture kicks in,
> and would any bike be a joy to ride, or should I just go for a walk on
> those days!?
>
> I would love to hear from those who ride both drop bars and also swept
> back (or similar) in a way more relaxed geometry, or those who transitioned
> to mainly this style, because it almost fully resolved your issues, if
> they're anyway similar to mine.  *On a day when you're not feeling it,
> but you have to commute or just love to ride, do you leave the drop bar
> bike in the garage and hop on your more relaxed bike, and thus avoid most
> of the issues you would have had on the other (slightly more aggressive)
> bike?*
>
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> .
>

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[RBW] FS: Pair of Antelope Hill tires 700x55 in unopened packages

[Tom]

These are the standard tan casing variety, and were meant for a build that 
never materialized.  They sell new for $78ea on Rene Hearse.  Will sell 
each for $60, or both for $100, shipped.  More info here 

.

Tom

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[RBW] Atlantis FD clamp size?

[Stephen Merelman]

I am assuming it is 31.8mm, since it is clearly not 28.6mm. Can anyone 
confirm?

On a related note, anyone have a 31.8mm FD they want to unload? 

smm

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Re: [RBW] Ron’s Orthos

[Andrew Joseph]

Found, thanks everyone!Sent from my iPhoneOn Aug 30, 2024, at 3:55 PM, Andrew Joseph  wrote:Thanks Eliot!I was too slow on the draw and missed both bars for sale.  (I think) I could definitely be wrong. I will dig and try and find that. I haven’t quite mastered navigating this groups search functions.Best,DrewSent from my iPhoneOn Aug 30, 2024, at 3:52 PM, Eliot Balogh  wrote:Someone has some on a recent post here. Can’t recall which. Maybe 650b group On Fri, Aug 30, 2024 at 1:36 PM Andrew Joseph  wrote:Happy Friday,

Anyone willing to sell their Ron’s Ortho bars?

Silver preferably.

R,

Drew

Sent from my iPhone

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Re: [RBW] Re: Wolf Tooth 8-Bit multitool: Works well? Worth $70?

[Patrick Moore]

Garth: Thanks, understand, I also have carried multitudinous specialized
small tools instead of trying to get them all in 1 proprietary assemblage.
My problem with that is, that I tend to lose things, especially if they are
small. Also, the IDEA of a very compact tool that carries everything that I
could conceivably need for my riding is a very appealing IDEA.

I know from 9-sp chains, having bought a 50% share in a big bulk order of
cheap SRAM 9 speeders a decade ago -- I use them for my fixed gears and
ss's  b/c DIngles require 9 speed or narrower -- and I still have a few
left. But the bike in question has an 11 speed chain (10 sp drivetrain), so
pliers alas necessary.

Brian: Thanks for the details. I understand about losing small things but
I'd hope that the magnets would help with that.

I think I'm going to order one.

On Sat, Aug 31, 2024 at 6:02 AM Garth  wrote:

>
> I can't speak to it being worth $70 or not. With any multi-tool though,
> they're only as useful as the various bits can actually fit where and how
> you need them to on your particular bicycle. The angles and extentions and
> such, not to mention the tolerances of a particlar bit. Park multi-tools
> are to me notoriuosly bad in that regard. Myself I'd rather carry any
> individual tools that I've tried and actually work anywhere on my bike.
> It's not like I carry a shop kit with me, we're talking very small
> differences in weight and volume here relative to the tool kits. For
> example, SRAM 8-9 speed chain quick links don't need any pliers, your
> chains may be different. I carry a pair of disposable nitrile gloves if
> needed. It's really just knowing yourself and your various parts.
> On Friday, August 30, 2024 at 9:02:55 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>>
>> https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/equipment/bike-accessories/bike-tools-maintenance/bike-tools/tools-for-your-ride/wolf-tooth-8-bit-multi-tool-pack-pliers/p/35658/
>>
>> I've been looking for a multitool that can tighten valve stem locknuts
>> and came across this. It gets pretty good reviews -- users say that it's
>> actually usable tho' the stubby bits make some recessed bolts hard to
>> reach, and it has the all important T25 Torx wrench as well as all the
>> allens from 2 to 8, spoke wrench, valve core wrench (and valve "rasp" to
>> unclog valves), and screwdrivers all carried inside the handle which can
>> also carry a chain masterlink. The masterlink pliers double as a valve stem
>> locknut pliers.
>>
>> I think that it might be a good replacement for the older Crank Bros
>> multitool I carry on the Matthews dirt road bike.
>>
>> Has anyone used this? Do you advise paying $70 for it?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
>> ---
>>
>> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing
>> services
>>
>>
>> ---
>>
>> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,*
>>
>> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,*
>>
>> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.*
>>
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> 
> .
>


-- 

Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
---

Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing
services

---

*When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,*

*But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,*

*I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.*

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[RBW] Re: FS: Summer 2024 - White Industries, Raceface, Surly, Rene Herse, Nitto, Salsa

[Michael Ullmer]

More updates with items sold and a few price drops in *bold*:


https://photos.app.goo.gl/95TkKKbK4Jtq7BTv8

 

Handlebars

   2. Easton EC70 Carbon - $20

--25.4 Clamp 580mm wide

   3. Salsa Rustler Flat Bar - $30

--800mm wide, 31.8 Clamp

   4. Salsa Salt Flat 2 - $25

--31.8 Clamp 700mm

 

Cranks/Rings

   7. Raceface Forged Pink MTB Cranks 175mm 110/74 and Chainrings - $100

--Comes with Salsa 46t and Shimano 34t Chainrings.

   8. Raceface Turbine Black MTB Cranks 175mm 94/58 - $75
   9. White Industries 34t ENO Chainring with Bashguard - *$35*
   10. White Industries 32t ENO Chainring -* $30*

 

Saddles

 13. Specialized BG 145 - $20

--Carbon shell, Hollow Ti rails

  

Stems/Seatposts

   1. Thomson Elite Seatpost 27.2 x 410mm - *$50*
   2. KORE MTB Stem 1 1/8" 120mm 25.4 Clamp - $15

 

Tires/Wheels/Fork

   18. Rene Herse Pumpkin Ridge 650bx42 - $50

--One tire has a tear in the sidewall that I used a boot on to patch and 
ran with tubes. I had no issues. Sidewalls are pretty dirty and one tires 
has some sealant residue.

   19. Vittoria Terreno Graphene 700cx53mm /29x2.1 Folding Bead Tires - $40

--They were mounted with tubes, but have a little bit of sealant residue on 
the inside.

   20. Surly 1x1 Fork 26" Rim Brake - $50

--Some rust showing up near the dropout. Steerer is approximately 8.25" 
long. Axle to crown is measuring 400mm. Comes with star nut installed.

   21. 26" Front Wheel Cane Creek Hub, Mavic Rim - $35

--Hub is in great shape and spins smooth. Comes with a pair of Panaracer 
Pasela tires 26x1.5.

 

Miscellaneous

   24. Deore LX V-Brakes and Levers - *$15*
   
--Had these for sale earlier, dirty but functional. Levers appear to be 
bent, but again they still work.

   27. Salsa Red 30.0 Seat Collar - $10



On Friday, August 30, 2024 at 10:31:17 AM UTC-5 Michael Ullmer wrote:

> A few updates with items sold:
>
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/95TkKKbK4Jtq7BTv8
>
>  
>
> Handlebars
>
>1. Easton Monkey Lite SL Lo Rise Carbon - $20
>
> --25.4 Clamp, 610mm wide
>
>2. Easton EC70 Carbon - $20
>
> --25.4 Clamp 580mm wide
>
>3. Salsa Rustler Flat Bar - $30
>
> --800mm wide, 31.8 Clamp
>
>4. Salsa Salt Flat 2 - $25
>
> --31.8 Clamp 700mm
>
>  
>
> Cranks/Rings
>
>7. Raceface Forged Pink MTB Cranks 175mm 110/74 and Chainrings - $100
>
> --Comes with Salsa 46t and Shimano 34t Chainrings.
>
>8. Raceface Turbine Black MTB Cranks 175mm 94/58 - $75
>9. White Industries 34t ENO Chainring with Bashguard - $40
>10. White Industries 32t ENO Chainring - $35
>
>  
>
> Saddles
>
>  13. Specialized BG 145 - $20
>
> --Carbon shell, Hollow Ti rails
>
>   
>
> Stems/Seatposts
>
>14. Thomson Elite X4 Stem - 90mm 31.8 Clamp - $50
>15. Thomson Elite Seatpost 27.2 x 410mm - $55
>16. KORE MTB Stem 1 1/8" 120mm 25.4 Clamp - $15
>
>  
>
> Tires/Wheels/Fork
>
>18. Rene Herse Pumpkin Ridge 650bx42 - $50
>
> --One tire has a tear in the sidewall that I used a boot on to patch and 
> ran with tubes. I had no issues. Sidewalls are pretty dirty and one tires 
> has some sealant residue.
>
>19. Vittoria Terreno Graphene 700cx53mm /29x2.1 Folding Bead Tires - 
>$40
>
> --They were mounted with tubes, but have a little bit of sealant residue 
> on the inside.
>
>20. Surly 1x1 Fork 26" Rim Brake - $50
>
> --Some rust showing up near the dropout. Steerer is approximately 8.25" 
> long. Axle to crown is measuring 400mm. Comes with star nut installed.
>
>21. 26" Front Wheel Cane Creek Hub, Mavic Rim - $35
>
> --Hub is in great shape and spins smooth. Comes with a pair of Panaracer 
> Pasela tires 26x1.5.
>
>  
>
> Miscellaneous
>
>24. Salsa Rasta Front Skewer - $25
>
>
>1. Shimano XTR Front Skewer - $15
>2. Deore LX V-Brakes and Levers - $20
>
> --Had these for sale earlier, dirty but functional. Levers appear to be 
> bent, but again they still work.
>
>27. Salsa Red 30.0 Seat Collar - $15
>
>
>
> On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 3:28:07 PM UTC-5 Michael Ullmer wrote:
>
>> Cross-posted from the i-bob list:
>>
>>
>> Consolidating a number of items after a summer of reshuffling the family 
>> bike stable. Assume a flat $8 shipping for all items except the handlebars, 
>> fork and wheel, those will be at cost, UPS Ground. Bundling discounts 
>> encouraged.
>>
>>
>> https://photos.app.goo.gl/95TkKKbK4Jtq7BTv8
>>
>>  
>>
>> Handlebars
>>
>>1. Easton Monkey Lite SL Lo Rise Carbon - $20
>>
>> --25.4 Clamp, 610mm wide
>>
>>2. Easton EC70 Carbon - $20
>>
>> --25.4 Clamp 580mm wide
>>
>>3. Salsa Rustler Flat Bar - $30
>>
>> --800mm wide, 31.8 Clamp
>>
>>4. Salsa Salt Flat 2 - $25
>>
>> --31.8 Clamp 700mm
>>
>>5. Ritchey Comp Beacon Drop Handlebars - $25
>>
>> --31.8 Clamp, 44cm Wide, 65mm Reach, 80mm Drop
>>
>>6. Nitto Mustache 25.4 - $20
>>
>> --Lots of corrosion on the outside, but nothing some bar tape wouldn't 
>> cover up.
>>
>>  
>>
>> Cranks/Rings
>>
>>7. Raceface Forged Pink MTB Cranks 175mm 110/74 a

[RBW] Re: Atlantis FD clamp size?

[Nick A.]

Hey there,

I'm running a 46/30 with a shimano tricolor FD and a 28.6 braze-on adapter 
on my 2022 Atlantis.

Hope it's helpful.

Nick in Falls Church VA

On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 7:12:16 PM UTC-4 Kim H. wrote:

> I have a stock Shimano front derailleur from my Clem with a clamp diameter 
> of 31.9mm that I am not using. It worked well for a 2x crankset with 34/24 
> rings.  
> I can find out specifically what model it is and take pictures of it, if 
> you like.
> Email me, if you are interested. 
>
> Kim Hetzel. 
>
> On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 3:14:44 PM UTC-7 smer...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I am assuming it is 31.8mm, since it is clearly not 28.6mm. Can anyone 
>> confirm?
>>
>> On a related note, anyone have a 31.8mm FD they want to unload? 
>>
>> smm
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Wolf Tooth 8-Bit multitool: Works well? Worth $70?

[Brian Turner]

I have one of these. It’s a nice tool that packs a lot into a small package. I particularly like the chain pliers and the valve tools. You can also store an extra quick link inside the tool.The only minor complaint I have is the fact that everything is held together magnetically. One of the magnets on mine came out, but I found it stuck to one of the other bits, and I superglued it back in. Also, I’ve lost a few of the bits over the years. Fortunately, you can buy replacement bit sets from Wolf Tooth.BrianLex KY On Aug 31, 2024, at 8:02 AM, Garth  wrote:I can't speak to it being worth $70 or not. With any multi-tool though, they're only as useful as the various bits can actually fit where and how you need them to on your particular bicycle. The angles and extentions and such, not to mention the tolerances of a particlar bit. Park multi-tools are to me notoriuosly bad in that regard. Myself I'd rather carry any individual tools that I've tried and actually work anywhere on my bike. It's not like I carry a shop kit with me, we're talking very small differences in weight and volume here relative to the tool kits. For example, SRAM 8-9 speed chain quick links don't need any pliers, your chains may be different. I carry a pair of disposable nitrile gloves if needed. It's really just knowing yourself and your various parts.On Friday, August 30, 2024 at 9:02:55 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote:https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/equipment/bike-accessories/bike-tools-maintenance/bike-tools/tools-for-your-ride/wolf-tooth-8-bit-multi-tool-pack-pliers/p/35658/I've been looking for a multitool that can tighten valve stem locknuts and came across this. It gets pretty good reviews -- users say that it's actually usable tho' the stubby bits make some recessed bolts hard to reach, and it has the all important T25 Torx wrench as well as all the allens from 2 to 8, spoke wrench, valve core wrench (and valve "rasp" to unclog valves), and screwdrivers all carried inside the handle which can also carry a chain masterlink. The masterlink pliers double as a valve stem locknut pliers.I think that it might be a good replacement for the older Crank Bros multitool I carry on the Matthews dirt road bike.Has anyone used this? Do you advise paying $70 for it?Thanks.-- Patrick MooreAlburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum---Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing services---When thou didst not, savage, know thine own meaning,But wouldst gabble like a thing most brutish,I endowed thy purposes with words that made them known.




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[RBW] Re: Atlantis FD clamp size?

[Stephen Merelman]

Alas, my 28.6 units definitively don't fit. 

This frame is the last iteration of the Atlantis. Riv says this about it, 
which is a little inscrutable: "an ovalized seat tube bottom, from a round 
28.6, to a lateral 31.8 x 25.4 oval (starts as inch-and-an-eighth, gets 
squished to an inch by inch and a quarter)."

This seems to imply a 31.8 is the right size,  but I can't find that 
written down anywhere official. 
On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 8:43:54 PM UTC-4 thetaper...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Hey there,
>
> I'm running a 46/30 with a shimano tricolor FD and a 28.6 braze-on adapter 
> on my 2022 Atlantis.
>
> Hope it's helpful.
>
> Nick in Falls Church VA
>
> On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 7:12:16 PM UTC-4 Kim H. wrote:
>
>> I have a stock Shimano front derailleur from my Clem with a clamp 
>> diameter of 31.9mm that I am not using. It worked well for a 2x crankset 
>> with 34/24 rings.  
>> I can find out specifically what model it is and take pictures of it, if 
>> you like.
>> Email me, if you are interested. 
>>
>> Kim Hetzel. 
>>
>> On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 3:14:44 PM UTC-7 smer...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> I am assuming it is 31.8mm, since it is clearly not 28.6mm. Can anyone 
>>> confirm?
>>>
>>> On a related note, anyone have a 31.8mm FD they want to unload? 
>>>
>>> smm
>>>
>>

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[RBW] The Heaviest Rivendell

[dstein]

I didn’t want my first post in years to be a FS: one (see previous post), 
so thought I’d contribute to the discussion :). I enjoy reading about the 
‘lightest rivendell’ in the other thread, but…what is your heaviest 
Rivendell?!? No rules. Whatever you got on it right now.

Mine is a Rosco Bubbe (bronze) at 26 pounds, no water bottles or bags. I 
was a bit surprised, gonna have to load it up some more. In fact I had 3 
bikes all right around 26 pounds, including a Frank Jones, Sr. 26 seems to 
be the sweet spot. 

My heaviest bikes in the stable is a Jones at 34 pounds. But somehow feels 
the lightest?

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[RBW] Re: Looking for a 59cm Clem

[Tom]

Tristen, good luck with your Clem search.  I am 6' tall with a 90 pbh.  
I've had two 59 Clem H models at different times, ridden on roads, paths, 
and some single track.  For more off-roadish riding, I'd suggest:

   - Get a 59.  The Clem is a looong, big bike, and the 59 will be plenty 
   big enough for your 91 pbh.
   - Consider an index shifter for the rear if you're off roading will 
   include a good amt of single track.  Friction shifting bikes around tight 
   quick uphill/downhill turns is just too clumsy.  Others here have said the 
   same.  Yes you can make friction shifting work, it's not ideal.  Really 
   depends on the flow of your single track.
   - A Jones bar works so well on an off road Clem, as does a bullmoose.  
   Of course they work well on roads too, and you'll have a lot of bar real 
   estate to hang/mount things when not bombing around.
   - I liked 2.3 Mezcals for rooty, sometimes slippery single track.  
   Although I was surprised at how well Nano's did on that surface.  I loved 
   G-One Speeds (2") on a clem too, but more for hard packed paths topped with 
   a dusting of sand, twigs, etc., and roads.

Tom

On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 2:21:43 AM UTC-4 triste...@gmail.com wrote:

> Howdy Bunch! 
>
> I’ve been dreaming about owning a Rivendell for a long time now and I’m 
> finally in a position to make happen! My PBH is 91 I’ve been going back and 
> forth between a 59 and a 64 Clem. I live in Sacramento and spend a decent 
> amount of time riding off road in Northern California. Any suggestions 
> would be greatly appreciated. 
>
> -Tristen 
>

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Re: [RBW] A Different Kind of RR

[Bill Lindsay]

"when are you going to meet me in GR so we can experience this lunacy 
simultaneously?"

I'll let you know if something materializes in late September.

BL

On Friday, August 30, 2024 at 3:13:31 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> Bill, I heartily solicit and accept your approvals! 
>
> I think the line of not being precious is also out of MY hands…I seem to 
> go on these adventures with little control over the details (like, I have 
> not the foggiest idea of where I am at any given time ever, so whatever 
> they say I have to do) and then have to face the aftermath. I spent  on 
> that curated little purple sparkler and I will probably spend  fixing 
> it after these GR guys get done with us. 
>
> In fact, Bill, when are you going to meet me in GR so we can experience 
> this lunacy simultaneously? I bet it’s not too far from your Michigan 
> whereabouts; I promise it will be worth the drive. 
>
> Little Brother Ben, I knew you’d love the look of that Atlantis. It is 
> totally up to your filthy bike standards! I still think J should clean it. 
> Also, I know you would love this ride. Take a vacation!
> L
> On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 5:06:39 PM UTC-4 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> Leah
>>
>> I vigorously approve of your wanton disregard for the stern guidance you 
>> received from the Jargon Police Department (JPD).  Keep on Wilding!  
>> I disapprove of the thought of an older man falling hard and having a 
>> hard time getting up the next day.  I don't like that part of the story
>> I conditionally approve of not being precious with your bike.  There is a 
>> line that you get to draw, and then get to decide if you've crossed the 
>> line you made.  It's out of my hands...
>> I strenuously withhold comment regarding whether or not you are too old 
>> for this kind of activity.  That tops the list of "Things that are not my 
>> call"  
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>> On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 1:16:02 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> 
>>> I went out wilding again in GR last night. This time I took a young guy 
>>> I know from a bike committee we served on together. He is almost a kid. 
>>> Like, mid 20s. I’ll call him Jack. This is his Surly, which he is proud of:
>>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>>
>>> The bikes began to roll in and Jack was STOKED about all of them. We 
>>> live in a roadie city, and rare is it we see anyone on bikes like ours. 
>>> Jack saw bikes IRL he has only seen online. He was absolutely elated.
>>>
>>> [image: image1.jpeg]
>>>
>>> I mentioned that the most dangerous spots would be the front and the 
>>> back. Also, we’d be running any and all red lights.
>>>
>>> “I’m down,” he said, coolly. 
>>>
>>> J rolled up on his Atlantis. “All your bikes are in the same state of 
>>> filth and disrepair, I exclaimed, pulling him into a hug.
>>> [image: image1.jpeg]
>>>
>>> [image: image2.jpeg]
>>> “It’s C&O dirt”, J said, defensively. 
>>> That ride was months ago.
>>> [image: image3.jpeg]
>>>
>>> Last night was a special event - the bike polo event. J took us on a 
>>> winding route through the city and ended at the new bike polo courts, which 
>>> J tells me are the best bike polo courts in the country. He routed us 
>>> through GR historic bike polo places along the way, like this scary space, 
>>> where they used to play until they were removed from the property as they 
>>> were a “liability.”
>>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>>
>>> We had the usual hair-raising experiences. A guy took a stick to the 
>>> wheel riding up a hill and went over his bars. Our mob of 86 riders was 
>>> forced to suddenly veer off the road to allow the screeching ambulance to 
>>> roar by. We had to scramble down an embankment and lift our rigs over train 
>>> tracks before ascending one final grassy hill to reach our courts.
>>>
>>> The bike polo people were waiting with speakers and microphone, alcohol 
>>> and other things at the ready and for the taking. I did not do the taking. 
>>> Revelry ensued. The bike polo matches began. There were novices and 
>>> experts. Lots of crashing. The bikes for this are special - they have one 
>>> brake, a front disc, usually, and it’s got a guard. Polo bikes have low 
>>> gearing and twitchy handling. Some have nets in the spokes.
>>> [image: image2.jpeg][image: image3.jpeg][image: image4.jpeg]
>>>
>>> [image: image5.jpeg]
>>> Pictured, some of the 86 bikes that were ridden to the courts that night.
>>> [image: image6.jpeg]
>>>
>>> The Platypus attracted excessive attention by both folks who knew Riv 
>>> and who had never heard of it. One man said, “The more I look at this the 
>>> more I see..this bike is CURATED. You thought about this bike when you 
>>> built it.” The words “deep custom” were bandied about. I must say that men 
>>> have been overwhelmingly fond of the tacky My Little Platy, which I did not 
>>> expect.
>>>
>>> At 11 pm, J rallied us to leave. He mentioned that he would be “shooting 
>>> from the hip” for the r

Re: [RBW] The Heaviest Rivendell

[Patrick Moore]

Fun thread; I'll play. Digital scale.

My 2 contestants are not Rivs but were built using Rivs as models, so
perhaps they count. Ready to ride with 2 cages and 2 pedals, etc.

Matthews #1 "Road Bike For Dirt;" 33.25 lb with full Large Revelate
"Tangle" (?? I think) frame bag full of off road repair kit for goathead
country), Kelpie 90 mm (arc) 150% gauge (sheet + struts) fenders, rear
rack, full lighting system, and empty Carradice Super C Rack Top Bag. (I
was pleasantly surprised that the ensemble was this light.)

Matthews #1 "Road Bike For Road" Riv Road Clone: 28.59 lb with VO 26" 50 mm
fenders, f + r racks, stuffed-full Ruthworks Large seat bag, full lighting
sytem, and the heavy bit: 1956 ASC 3 speed fixed gear hub -- but not the
pair of older Ortlieb Sports Packers that are generally on the rear rack.
These probably weigh about 4 lb the pair. I am dismayed that it weighs so
much, if I think about it too hard.

I think I measured this same bike at 26 with Surley flip flop fixed wheel +
17/19 Dingle and no seat bag, and I think that sans racks and fenders and
any luggage but with lighting and pedals and cages it's about 25 lb with
ASC hub, 21 with Surly hub.

My 1 remaining Rivendell weighs 18 lb on the nose without the Small
Sackville and repair kit.

On Sat, Aug 31, 2024 at 11:15 AM dstein  wrote:

> I didn’t want my first post in years to be a FS: one (see previous post),
> so thought I’d contribute to the discussion :). I enjoy reading about the
> ‘lightest rivendell’ in the other thread, but…what is your heaviest
> Rivendell?!? No rules. Whatever you got on it right now.
>
> Mine is a Rosco Bubbe (bronze) at 26 pounds, no water bottles or bags. I
> was a bit surprised, gonna have to load it up some more. In fact I had 3
> bikes all right around 26 pounds, including a Frank Jones, Sr. 26 seems to
> be the sweet spot.
>
> My heaviest bikes in the stable is a Jones at 34 pounds. But somehow feels
> the lightest?
>
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> 
> .
>


-- 

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---

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[RBW] Re: Upright / Relaxed / Swept-Back - Style of Riding

[Jay]

And the verdict: not for me.  Initially it was fun.  Felt very different 
from drop bars or flat/mtb bars.  I had a good fit with a longer stem I 
used, was sized up by the shop and the fit was probably as good as it would 
get.  First ride was 30 minutes and I made a couple of tweaks as my wrists 
were bent awkwardly.  Second ride was over an hour and I felt myself 
wanting to change hand positions, but really couldn't.  I'm just used to 
drop bars, level with the saddle, where I can rest my hands on the levers, 
ramps, tops, and drops; slight bend forward, and that slightly different 
posture that comes with the different hand positions that keeps me loose. 
 When I got back on my Roadini with its drops it initially felt strange, 
but after a 2+ ride I was back in heaven (zero upper body discomfort).

I'm glad I tried it though, because I would always be wondering if it was 
for me.

On Saturday, July 20, 2024 at 11:21:15 AM UTC-4 Jay wrote:

> Update: I'm swapping the bars on my Salsa Fargo.  Going with the VO 
> Granola.  I can use them with stems I have on hand, just had to add brake 
> levers, grips and a Sram Apex flat bar shifter.  Need hew cables/housing 
> anyway, so all-in-all the experiment won't break the bank.  I'll report 
> back in a couple of weeks after it's built up and, hopefully, dialled in.
>
> Very little chance I'll switch the bars on my Roadini.  I'm really happy 
> with that set up and feel like I will *not* be making any changes to it 
> for a long time (which is a delight, for someone who's always making 
> changes to dial in fit).
>
> On Sunday, May 26, 2024 at 7:33:52 PM UTC-4 Jay wrote:
>
>> I ended up sticking with drop bars, but making some changes after a good 
>> conversation with my chiro and a few rides on the three bikes where I paid 
>> a lot of attention to where I had pain, and my posture on those rides.
>>
>> On the Roadini and Salsa, I was using 42cm bars (at the hoods hoods) with 
>> 12 degrees of flare.  First time I went up from 40cm.  In previous fittings 
>> I was told I can run a 38cm as I have narrow shoulders.  It's a trend these 
>> days to run wider, I tried it, but it really backfired given my 
>> pre-existing neck/shoulder issue.  When on the hoods my arms were not a 
>> straight line from my body, they were out a bit, and this was a minor 
>> (major at times) pain.  I replaced those bars, have ridden each bike once 
>> (1.5-2.5 hours) and it was instantly noticeable.  Pain gone.  Both of those 
>> bikes have the bars upright (tops level with saddle, hoods higher) and not 
>> stretched out.  Road bike has 40cm bars, but the reach is long and drop is 
>> 2.5cm below saddle (making the drops unreachable for me).  That's being 
>> rectified next.
>>
>> I may try swept back one day, but for now I do love drop bars and the 
>> varied hand positions, and it was much cheaper to replace two bars and 
>> re-use the table (success on both counts).
>>
>> On Wednesday, May 8, 2024 at 9:28:41 PM UTC-4 Jay wrote:
>>
>>> I was always aware of bikes with a very relaxed geometry / setup, and it 
>>> wasn't until I started seeing Rivendell bikes and watching youtube videos 
>>> of people riding them that I really thought about it - is it more 
>>> comfortable than drop bars, even if I have a more neutral (not aggressive) 
>>> position on the bike (i.e., bars close to level with saddle)?  Would this 
>>> be a good option for just cruising around, but for 1-2 hours?  If I didn't 
>>> get along well with flat bars on mountain bike, would swept back bars be 
>>> better?
>>>
>>> I'm going to ramble a bit here, my apologies in advance.  I haven't 
>>> thought long enough about this to formulate my question succinctly. 
>>>  Hopefully you get where I'm coming from.
>>>
>>> *Quick background*
>>> - been riding a little over 20 years (closing in on 50!)
>>> - started with mountain biking (hardtail, singletrack); moved to road; 
>>> tried mountain biking two more times (I love being in nature) but didn't 
>>> like the thrill/danger, and hated the idea of driving to the trail head; 
>>> have been mainly on the road for last 15 years, though with 10 years of 
>>> 'gravel' bikes/riding
>>> - I've had ongoing issues with my cervical spine (nothing serious) and 
>>> this leads to some problems when riding in any sort of aggressive position 
>>> on the bike; I see a chiro regularly; stretch a lot; workout / strength 
>>> training; have had numerous bike fits
>>> - I have a Roadini, Salsa Fargo and a road bike (25mm tires, but custom 
>>> made and really does fit like a glove, for road)
>>> - I don't care about performance at all, I just love riding bikes, in 
>>> particular when roads are not busy, or on trails, gravel roads, etc.
>>>
>>> On a good day (75% of the time), I can ride any of these bikes and 
>>> during the ride I feel pretty good (little to no pain), maybe a bit of pain 
>>> after (could be neck/shoulders, but anywhere else really), and after 
>>> stretching I feel great 

Re: [RBW] A Different Kind of RR

[Jay]

I love the variety of bikes, and the wild feel to the whole extravaganza. 
 I've never been on a ride like that, but I'm sure one taste and you 
wouldn't ever forget it!

On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 7:56:02 AM UTC-4 brok...@gmail.com wrote:

> These are my kind of group rides. While we don’t get as large a turnout, 
> we occasionally have these types of “anything goes” social rides here in 
> our town.
> I’ve never, ever had fun on a traditional roadie group ride. Ever. The 
> first time I experienced a social ride like this, it was a game-changer.
>
> Brian
> Lex KY 
>
> On Aug 31, 2024, at 7:24 AM, ascpgh  wrote:
>
> What an awesome collection of bicyclists and rides! 
>
>
> Everyone has their own history, it can be read in the build of their bikes 
> (I've pointed this out before). They've all had adventures in their own 
> pursuits and defined what is "the line" for themselves on those rides. Put 
> them all together and you get those great GR event rides (and bikes),  with 
> Leah documenting them! A little planning, some patronage and some ad hoc 
> action. 
>
> It appears that the magic is a minimum of cohesion within a core group who 
> bear a breadth of experiences attracting others on who are the front end of 
> their own bell curve of riding adventures. 
>
> What is precious are the memories, the pictures and the ability to share 
> those experiences. Not the things. Precious things haven't crossed the line 
> yet nor bear record of events of excursions from the comfort zone.
>
> Andy Cheatham
> Pittsburgh
>
> On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 4:16:02 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> 
>> I went out wilding again in GR last night. This time I took a young guy I 
>> know from a bike committee we served on together. He is almost a kid. Like, 
>> mid 20s. I’ll call him Jack. This is his Surly, which he is proud of:
>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>
>> The bikes began to roll in and Jack was STOKED about all of them. We live 
>> in a roadie city, and rare is it we see anyone on bikes like ours. Jack saw 
>> bikes IRL he has only seen online. He was absolutely elated.
>>
>> [image: image1.jpeg]
>>
>> I mentioned that the most dangerous spots would be the front and the 
>> back. Also, we’d be running any and all red lights.
>>
>> “I’m down,” he said, coolly. 
>>
>> J rolled up on his Atlantis. “All your bikes are in the same state of 
>> filth and disrepair, I exclaimed, pulling him into a hug.
>> [image: image1.jpeg]
>>
>> [image: image2.jpeg]
>> “It’s C&O dirt”, J said, defensively. 
>> That ride was months ago.
>> [image: image3.jpeg]
>>
>> Last night was a special event - the bike polo event. J took us on a 
>> winding route through the city and ended at the new bike polo courts, which 
>> J tells me are the best bike polo courts in the country. He routed us 
>> through GR historic bike polo places along the way, like this scary space, 
>> where they used to play until they were removed from the property as they 
>> were a “liability.”
>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>
>> We had the usual hair-raising experiences. A guy took a stick to the 
>> wheel riding up a hill and went over his bars. Our mob of 86 riders was 
>> forced to suddenly veer off the road to allow the screeching ambulance to 
>> roar by. We had to scramble down an embankment and lift our rigs over train 
>> tracks before ascending one final grassy hill to reach our courts.
>>
>> The bike polo people were waiting with speakers and microphone, alcohol 
>> and other things at the ready and for the taking. I did not do the taking. 
>> Revelry ensued. The bike polo matches began. There were novices and 
>> experts. Lots of crashing. The bikes for this are special - they have one 
>> brake, a front disc, usually, and it’s got a guard. Polo bikes have low 
>> gearing and twitchy handling. Some have nets in the spokes.
>> [image: image2.jpeg][image: image3.jpeg][image: image4.jpeg]
>>
>> [image: image5.jpeg]
>> Pictured, some of the 86 bikes that were ridden to the courts that night.
>> [image: image6.jpeg]
>>
>> The Platypus attracted excessive attention by both folks who knew Riv and 
>> who had never heard of it. One man said, “The more I look at this the more 
>> I see..this bike is CURATED. You thought about this bike when you built 
>> it.” The words “deep custom” were bandied about. I must say that men have 
>> been overwhelmingly fond of the tacky My Little Platy, which I did not 
>> expect.
>>
>> At 11 pm, J rallied us to leave. He mentioned that he would be “shooting 
>> from the hip” for the route and that it would have “a little gravel.” But I 
>> know what he really means. I warned Jack. We headed out in the dark, along 
>> the railroad tracks. Sure enough, we had to make our way along those tracks 
>> with the earth sloping on us and the “gravel” was actually rocks - like 
>> golf balls. We ended up hiking our bikes for a lot of it. In the dark. On 
>> uneven ground. An older man took a bad fall, landing splayed across t

Re: [RBW] Looking for an Atlantis Frame - 64ish

[Matthew Williams]

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sfc/bik/d/san-francisco-64-teal-rivendell-atlantis/7773097977.html
64 Teal Rivendell Atlantis - bicycles - by owner - bike sale - craigslist
sfbay.craigslist.org


> On Aug 23, 2024, at 6:49 AM, 2xFnord  wrote:
> 
> Thanks for all the leads so far, I appreciate it. I might also be interested 
> in your Appaloosas in big boy sizes. 
> 
> On Thursday, August 22, 2024 at 6:17:21 PM UTC-4 2xFnord wrote:
>> Anyone got a line on an Atlantis Frame in 64 or 65 for the older ones, 
>> possibly a 62 in the newer variety? Thanks!
> 
> 
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>  
> .

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[RBW] Re: Wolf Tooth 8-Bit multitool: Works well? Worth $70?

[Garth]

I can't speak to it being worth $70 or not. With any multi-tool though, 
they're only as useful as the various bits can actually fit where and how 
you need them to on your particular bicycle. The angles and extentions and 
such, not to mention the tolerances of a particlar bit. Park multi-tools 
are to me notoriuosly bad in that regard. Myself I'd rather carry any 
individual tools that I've tried and actually work anywhere on my bike. 
It's not like I carry a shop kit with me, we're talking very small 
differences in weight and volume here relative to the tool kits. For 
example, SRAM 8-9 speed chain quick links don't need any pliers, your 
chains may be different. I carry a pair of disposable nitrile gloves if 
needed. It's really just knowing yourself and your various parts.
On Friday, August 30, 2024 at 9:02:55 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote:

>
> https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/equipment/bike-accessories/bike-tools-maintenance/bike-tools/tools-for-your-ride/wolf-tooth-8-bit-multi-tool-pack-pliers/p/35658/
>
> I've been looking for a multitool that can tighten valve stem locknuts and 
> came across this. It gets pretty good reviews -- users say that it's 
> actually usable tho' the stubby bits make some recessed bolts hard to 
> reach, and it has the all important T25 Torx wrench as well as all the 
> allens from 2 to 8, spoke wrench, valve core wrench (and valve "rasp" to 
> unclog valves), and screwdrivers all carried inside the handle which can 
> also carry a chain masterlink. The masterlink pliers double as a valve stem 
> locknut pliers.
>
> I think that it might be a good replacement for the older Crank Bros 
> multitool I carry on the Matthews dirt road bike.
>
> Has anyone used this? Do you advise paying $70 for it?
>
> Thanks.
>
> -- 
>
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
> ---
>
> Executive resumes, LinkedIn profiles, bios, letters, and other writing 
> services
>
>
> ---
>
> *When thou didst not, savage, k**now thine own meaning,*
>
> *But wouldst gabble like a** thing most brutish,*
>
> *I endowed thy purposes w**ith words that made them known.*
>

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[RBW] Re: Quickbeam FS

[J]

Size would be helpful. And at least a singular photo for the peanut gallery?

On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 2:24:51 AM UTC-4 michaelj...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Selling my QB, as it doesn’t get ridden much these days owing to knee 
> issues. It’s currently set up with a Dirt Drop stem and Albatross bars, but 
> I can swap those for Nitto drops and Shimano 600 levers. Pedals are old 
> dual sided SPD/clip compatible. Saddle is a B17 in very good shape. 
> Condition is good, except the paint and decal are scratched on one side 
> from when some Jerry decided to push over a row of parked bikes.
>
> Asking $1200. I’m in the Northwest Detroit suburbs, and I’d rather not 
> ship unless the buyer can arrange it. Message me for photos.
>
> Mike
>

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Re: [RBW] A Different Kind of RR

[ascpgh]

What an awesome collection of bicyclists and rides! 

Everyone has their own history, it can be read in the build of their bikes 
(I've pointed this out before). They've all had adventures in their own 
pursuits and defined what is "the line" for themselves on those rides. Put 
them all together and you get those great GR event rides (and bikes),  with 
Leah documenting them! A little planning, some patronage and some ad hoc 
action. 

It appears that the magic is a minimum of cohesion within a core group who 
bear a breadth of experiences attracting others on who are the front end of 
their own bell curve of riding adventures. 

What is precious are the memories, the pictures and the ability to share 
those experiences. Not the things. Precious things haven't crossed the line 
yet nor bear record of events of excursions from the comfort zone.

Andy Cheatham
Pittsburgh

On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 4:16:02 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> 
> I went out wilding again in GR last night. This time I took a young guy I 
> know from a bike committee we served on together. He is almost a kid. Like, 
> mid 20s. I’ll call him Jack. This is his Surly, which he is proud of:
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> The bikes began to roll in and Jack was STOKED about all of them. We live 
> in a roadie city, and rare is it we see anyone on bikes like ours. Jack saw 
> bikes IRL he has only seen online. He was absolutely elated.
>
> [image: image1.jpeg]
>
> I mentioned that the most dangerous spots would be the front and the back. 
> Also, we’d be running any and all red lights.
>
> “I’m down,” he said, coolly. 
>
> J rolled up on his Atlantis. “All your bikes are in the same state of 
> filth and disrepair, I exclaimed, pulling him into a hug.
> [image: image1.jpeg]
>
> [image: image2.jpeg]
> “It’s C&O dirt”, J said, defensively. 
> That ride was months ago.
> [image: image3.jpeg]
>
> Last night was a special event - the bike polo event. J took us on a 
> winding route through the city and ended at the new bike polo courts, which 
> J tells me are the best bike polo courts in the country. He routed us 
> through GR historic bike polo places along the way, like this scary space, 
> where they used to play until they were removed from the property as they 
> were a “liability.”
> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> We had the usual hair-raising experiences. A guy took a stick to the wheel 
> riding up a hill and went over his bars. Our mob of 86 riders was forced to 
> suddenly veer off the road to allow the screeching ambulance to roar by. We 
> had to scramble down an embankment and lift our rigs over train tracks 
> before ascending one final grassy hill to reach our courts.
>
> The bike polo people were waiting with speakers and microphone, alcohol 
> and other things at the ready and for the taking. I did not do the taking. 
> Revelry ensued. The bike polo matches began. There were novices and 
> experts. Lots of crashing. The bikes for this are special - they have one 
> brake, a front disc, usually, and it’s got a guard. Polo bikes have low 
> gearing and twitchy handling. Some have nets in the spokes.
> [image: image2.jpeg][image: image3.jpeg][image: image4.jpeg]
>
> [image: image5.jpeg]
> Pictured, some of the 86 bikes that were ridden to the courts that night.
> [image: image6.jpeg]
>
> The Platypus attracted excessive attention by both folks who knew Riv and 
> who had never heard of it. One man said, “The more I look at this the more 
> I see..this bike is CURATED. You thought about this bike when you built 
> it.” The words “deep custom” were bandied about. I must say that men have 
> been overwhelmingly fond of the tacky My Little Platy, which I did not 
> expect.
>
> At 11 pm, J rallied us to leave. He mentioned that he would be “shooting 
> from the hip” for the route and that it would have “a little gravel.” But I 
> know what he really means. I warned Jack. We headed out in the dark, along 
> the railroad tracks. Sure enough, we had to make our way along those tracks 
> with the earth sloping on us and the “gravel” was actually rocks - like 
> golf balls. We ended up hiking our bikes for a lot of it. In the dark. On 
> uneven ground. An older man took a bad fall, landing splayed across the 
> railroad tracks, still clipped in to his bike. He managed to get up but he 
> might not be getting up out of bed tomorrow.
>
> I’m learning not to be precious on these adventures. My stuff always comes 
> back worse than when I brought it. I found my beloved custom Oakley night 
> riding glasses in the grass, nosepiece and one bow laying separate from the 
> frame. One lens is irreparably scratched. My Platypus was knocked about as 
> I hoisted it over obstacles and one fender is now rubbing, one PDX 
> breakaway tab cracked. I’m missing a little hide on my shin from the pedal 
> pins. 
>
> I dropped the kid back at his place and got home just before 1 am. 
>
> I am too old for this. 
>
> I am doing it again next week.
>
>

[RBW] Re: The Heaviest Rivendell

[John Bokman]

Dave, which Jones do you have? SWB, LWB? custom?

John

On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 10:15:41 AM UTC-7 dstein wrote:

> I didn’t want my first post in years to be a FS: one (see previous post), 
> so thought I’d contribute to the discussion :). I enjoy reading about the 
> ‘lightest rivendell’ in the other thread, but…what is your heaviest 
> Rivendell?!? No rules. Whatever you got on it right now.
>
> Mine is a Rosco Bubbe (bronze) at 26 pounds, no water bottles or bags. I 
> was a bit surprised, gonna have to load it up some more. In fact I had 3 
> bikes all right around 26 pounds, including a Frank Jones, Sr. 26 seems to 
> be the sweet spot. 
>
> My heaviest bikes in the stable is a Jones at 34 pounds. But somehow feels 
> the lightest?
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Marin Peninsula

[John Dewey]

Black Point is a great loop. 

Good lunch stop right under the bridge and then steep climb up and over to 
return. I think of Sonny Rollins every time I ride out there.

JD. 

On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 6:02:19 AM UTC-7 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Novato over to Black Point via Atherton is manageable. I can't recommend 
> hopping on 37 to get to Sears Point, the bridge out of Black Point is high 
> speed with a narrow "bike lane" not worthy of the name. 
>
> Joe Bernard 
> Clearlake CA [image: Screenshot_20240829_055924.jpg]
>
> On Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 2:33:51 AM UTC-7 Peter Adler wrote:
>
>> The east side - you mean along the bayshore? That's the Bay Trail:
>>
>>
>> https://mtc.ca.gov/operations/regional-trails-parks/san-francisco-bay-trail
>>
>>
>> https://mtc.ca.gov/operations/regional-trails-parks/san-francisco-bay-trail/bay-trail-interactive-map
>>
>> If memory serves, in most of the Marin segments that aren't currently 
>> specified for bike access, that doesn't mean there's nothing at all - it 
>> just means that they're (usually) paved roads with no special provisions 
>> for cyclists. But motorists on the bayside of Marin are accustomed to 
>> cyclists on the roadways, so I wouldn't automatically suspect difficulty.
>>
>> I haven't ridden that area since Bicycle Odyssey's closeout sale last 
>> year, but Sausalito up to San Rafael is pretty smooth sailing. I'm 
>> unfamiliar with the north end past China Camp, but Novato/Black Point/Sears 
>> Point looks pretty straightforward.
>>
>> A long time back, the Metropolitan Transit Commission published the 
>> entire map in segments - sort of a collection of turnsheet-sized cards, 
>> with turnsheet instructions on one side and a route map on the other. They 
>> don't seem to list it for purchase as a physical set any more, but perhaps 
>> you can contact themto see if they still have one lying around.
>>
>>
>> https://mtc.ca.gov/operations/regional-trails-parks/san-francisco-bay-trail/map-numbers
>>
>> What start point and end/turnaround point did you have in mind?
>>
>> Peter Adler
>> who really needs to bike over the Richmond-San Rafael Bridge while he 
>> still can
>> Berkeley, California/USA
>>
>> On Wednesday, August 28, 2024 at 10:53:19 AM UTC-7 campyo...@me.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Is it possible to ride all the way up the east side of the Marin 
>> peninsula? I haven’t been out that way in quite a while. 
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] A Different Kind of RR

[Brian Turner]

These are my kind of group rides. While we don’t get as large a turnout, we occasionally have these types of “anything goes” social rides here in our town.I’ve never, ever had fun on a traditional roadie group ride. Ever. The first time I experienced a social ride like this, it was a game-changer.BrianLex KY On Aug 31, 2024, at 7:24 AM, ascpgh  wrote:What an awesome collection of bicyclists and rides! Everyone has their own history, it can be read in the build of their bikes (I've pointed this out before). They've all had adventures in their own pursuits and defined what is "the line" for themselves on those rides. Put them all together and you get those great GR event rides (and bikes),  with Leah documenting them! A little planning, some patronage and some ad hoc action. It appears that the magic is a minimum of cohesion within a core group who bear a breadth of experiences attracting others on who are the front end of their own bell curve of riding adventures. What is precious are the memories, the pictures and the ability to share those experiences. Not the things. Precious things haven't crossed the line yet nor bear record of events of excursions from the comfort zone.Andy CheathamPittsburghOn Thursday, August 29, 2024 at 4:16:02 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:I went out wilding again in GR last night. This time I took a young guy I know from a bike committee we served on together. He is almost a kid. Like, mid 20s. I’ll call him Jack. This is his Surly, which he is proud of:The bikes began to roll in and Jack was STOKED about all of them. We live in a roadie city, and rare is it we see anyone on bikes like ours. Jack saw bikes IRL he has only seen online. He was absolutely elated.I mentioned that the most dangerous spots would be the front and the back. Also, we’d be running any and all red lights.“I’m down,” he said, coolly. J rolled up on his Atlantis. “All your bikes are in the same state of filth and disrepair, I exclaimed, pulling him into a hug.“It’s C&O dirt”, J said, defensively. That ride was months ago.Last night was a special event - the bike polo event. J took us on a winding route through the city and ended at the new bike polo courts, which J tells me are the best bike polo courts in the country. He routed us through GR historic bike polo places along the way, like this scary space, where they used to play until they were removed from the property as they were a “liability.”We had the usual hair-raising experiences. A guy took a stick to the wheel riding up a hill and went over his bars. Our mob of 86 riders was forced to suddenly veer off the road to allow the screeching ambulance to roar by. We had to scramble down an embankment and lift our rigs over train tracks before ascending one final grassy hill to reach our courts.The bike polo people were waiting with speakers and microphone, alcohol and other things at the ready and for the taking. I did not do the taking. Revelry ensued. The bike polo matches began. There were novices and experts. Lots of crashing. The bikes for this are special - they have one brake, a front disc, usually, and it’s got a guard. Polo bikes have low gearing and twitchy handling. Some have nets in the spokes.Pictured, some of the 86 bikes that were ridden to the courts that night.The Platypus attracted excessive attention by both folks who knew Riv and who had never heard of it. One man said, “The more I look at this the more I see..this bike is CURATED. You thought about this bike when you built it.” The words “deep custom” were bandied about. I must say that men have been overwhelmingly fond of the tacky My Little Platy, which I did not expect.At 11 pm, J rallied us to leave. He mentioned that he would be “shooting from the hip” for the route and that it would have “a little gravel.” But I know what he really means. I warned Jack. We headed out in the dark, along the railroad tracks. Sure enough, we had to make our way along those tracks with the earth sloping on us and the “gravel” was actually rocks - like golf balls. We ended up hiking our bikes for a lot of it. In the dark. On uneven ground. An older man took a bad fall, landing splayed across the railroad tracks, still clipped in to his bike. He managed to get up but he might not be getting up out of bed tomorrow.I’m learning not to be precious on these adventures. My stuff always comes back worse than when I brought it. I found my beloved custom Oakley night riding glasses in the grass, nosepiece and one bow laying separate from the frame. One lens is irreparably scratched. My Platypus was knocked about as I hoisted it over obstacles and one fender is now rubbing, one PDX breakaway tab cracked. I’m missing a little hide on my shin from the pedal pins. I dropped the kid back at his place and got home just before 1 am. I am too old for this. I am doing it again next week.LeahOn Aug 11, 2024, at 9:40 PM, Leah Peterson  wrote:Ohh, it’s worse than you think. I have 3 (thre

Re: [RBW] Northern Hemisphere Summer 2024 Photos

[Jay]

It has been fun following this thread.  In the beginning, summer was just 
starting and that meant longer days with lots of sunlight.  I'm not a fan 
of the heat, but I do like light!  As it's nearly September, I feel the 
shift already; when I leave my house for a pre-work ride I'm now using a 
headlight, and the woods are quite dark just before 6:30am.  I actually 
enjoy this time of the year, the additional layers that are, sometimes, 
required.  Looking forward to the next crop of photos.

On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 11:38:04 AM UTC-4 Chris Halasz wrote:

> Late summer late evening ride in the local woods: 
>
> [image: Clem_Woods.jpg]
>
> And an end of summer 'photo': 
>
> [image: 2024_09_02.jpg]
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, August 28, 2024 at 10:05:39 AM UTC-7 Ted Durant wrote:
>
>>
>> > On Aug 28, 2024, at 9:53 AM, John Bokman  wrote: 
>> > 
>> > Ted, your GLSam looks splendid with the California backdrop! But, do 
>> you think you could have caught Lael had you ridden West Coast Sam? 
>> > 
>>
>>
>> Hah, no, ‘fraid not. Maybe on my Riv Road, but then I’d have really 
>> suffered on the climb with its 39x26 “small” gear. 
>>
>> Ted Durant 
>> Milwaukee WI USA
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Clem musings

[Richard Rose]

Interesting. Are you (did you?) use the Ergon GC1 - the ones specifically made for swept back bars? I have them on my Clem with Bosco’s & Gus with Hope Cyclery Albacore.  The clamp is hard but does not come into play for me. I too am pretty obsessed with these handlebars & yes, you almost cannot make them too high.Sent from my iPhoneOn Aug 30, 2024, at 11:04 PM, David Ross  wrote:The Ergons aren’t great for swept bars. I have a pair on my Gus and they’re about to be replaced. The issue is the hard retaining clamp at the back of the grip. I have a pair of these on one of my other bikes and they are hands down the best ergos for swept bars:https://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/equipment/bike-accessories/bike-handlebar-grips-tape/bike-handlebar-grips/bontrager-xr-endurance-elite-recycled-grip-set/p/5277812/These are relatively soft yet durable and they’re much easier on the hands. Really fat grips like the Jones Bar grips also work well for me, but I prefer lock on grips. I’m unhealthily obsessed with swept bars and have probably spent more time and money than I should have getting the right fit. They are really difficult to set up correctly as there are so many variable. Bar height is one of the most critical elements and I’ve found that the higher the bar, the less everything else matters. I ride some really technical stuff on my bikes, so I prefer a wider bar for better leg clearance. I have my bars made by Keaton at Doom Bars, and I highly recommend this route if you’re having a hard time finding the right fit. I just installed some of his bars on my Gus. They’re basically oversized albatross bars that measure 707mm wide. On Thu, Aug 29, 2024 at 6:46 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:Breaking off from the Gus thread to think out loud about a Clem addition to my stable.Tire width: thanks, Nick; that's really good to know. Has the Clem design been altered recently to allow fatter tires? I have vague memories of asking about max tire width several times before and hearing that ~50 mm was max ...?Just looked at the frame specs: max width for all sizes is given as 55 mm? Is this just proactive conservatism?Bar: Alexis: I'd really like to try something like the Billie or Choco or Albatross flipped upside down; or perhaps a much narrower North Road ditto, since I dislike really wide bars; but I've at least a score of non-drops and have never, ever found one that doesn't hurt my left palm -- very sensitive -- after a couple of miles. The closest was a Map Ahearne bar severely trimmed with Ergon grips, but even with that, going back to a (basically no-reach) Hover drop, this on the long-tt Monocog, was like coming home again.I see that the effective tt for the 59 is 68.5 mm. I'll have to figure out how much of that you get back from the 71.5* sta and the 69.5 hta compared to my usual ~56.5 cm with 73 sta. But I suppose I could get back 60 or 70 mm with a no-reach stem compare to my usual 80 and use a very short reach bar like the 70 mm Hover instead of the 115 mm-reach RH Maes Parallel and make up any leftovers with the higher bar placement I'd expect for such a bike.In fact, with the max tire width no longer a question, the 2 remaining hesitations are vertical dropouts and the bar question. Oh, and a third: the temptation to keep upgrading a nice beater until I am no longer comfortable leaving it locked outside.I want to use an IGH or single speed hub. I could use hubs with a freewheel and use a tensioner but I'd really  like a fixed drivetrain. I'm tempted to try the floating chainring chain tensioning solution which should be relatively easy with the very long stays.So the upshot is I want to take a nice frame and use it for something contrary to what it was designed for. I suppose that's typical.Meanwhile I'll fret about it until, maybe, I do something about it. But a Clem is on a provisional short list.On Wed, Aug 28, 2024 at 12:35 PM Nick Shoemaker  wrote:... @Patrick: My Clem is a size 64 on 700c Cliffhangers ( 25mm internal width) running tubes - I didn't have calipers on hand, but my measuring tape estimate came to ~65-66mm for the 29x2.6" Mezcal. It certainly runs bigger than the 29x2.6" Nobby Nic that I used for a short time, which is my only other point of reference. I also totally agree with you on unpaved tire pressures - back in my 'racy' days I would run ~16psi on my tubeless 26x2.4" - even 20psi resulted in a noticeable hit to traction. I'm about 20lbs heaver now (140>160), but I'm guessing I had the big Mezcals down to ~20psi with tubes on my last ride and they felt great.On Wed, Aug 28, 2024 at 3:04 PM R. Alexis  wrote:Patrick,What non drop bars are you considering? The Alt-Bars that are out there seem to work well. At least for me. I have a set of early Jones titanium H-Bars with the J bend on my Waterford 1400 mountain bike and a set of Surly Open Bars on the Gary Fisher Gemini tandem mounted on the front. Both bars are comfortable. I have seve

[RBW] Re: Atlantis FD clamp size?

[Kim H.]

I have a stock Shimano front derailleur from my Clem with a clamp diameter 
of 31.9mm that I am not using. It worked well for a 2x crankset with 34/24 
rings.  
I can find out specifically what model it is and take pictures of it, if 
you like.
Email me, if you are interested. 

Kim Hetzel. 

On Saturday, August 31, 2024 at 3:14:44 PM UTC-7 smer...@gmail.com wrote:

> I am assuming it is 31.8mm, since it is clearly not 28.6mm. Can anyone 
> confirm?
>
> On a related note, anyone have a 31.8mm FD they want to unload? 
>
> smm
>

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