Re: Django Vs Rails
If you are looking for something pythonic, full featured and very easy to use, you should check this out: http://karrigell.sourceforge.net Give it a try and let me know how it goes... Cheers, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: New project coming up...stay with Python, or go with a dot net language??? Your thoughts please!
> Boa Constructor, Iron Python etc... it seems all these projects get started, > but never finished. I don't know Boa (never liked it, never used it), but you could try PythonCard: much higher level, easier and more productive. As for Ironpython seems to be moving full steam towards a stable release (current version is 0.9.2). And once it's ready, integration with other MS technologies will be assured, so you shouldn't be concerned about that. If not Ironpython, Boo (which could be considered almost an static version of Python for .NET) would be a great choice. It is already integrated to SharpDevelop and soon it will be compliant with .NET 2.0. It seems your concerns are all related to the future, and I think that no matter what implementation of python you use, the future looks brighter than ever, because the same code base will run on .NET, Pypy (which will support many platforms) and java (through Jython) . What other language gives you so many options? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: New project coming up...stay with Python, or go with a dot net language??? Your thoughts please!
If you read again my comment, I said "almost" an static version of Python for .NET. That means that it's not a Python implementation, but another language. It takes a lot from python though, and it is aknowledeged by its creator in the first paragraph of its homepage. And if you still feel the need to argue, please don't do it with me, do it with Guido Van Rossum himself, who said that Boo is 95% Python, but statically typed... http://aws.typepad.com/aws/2005/01/amazon_devcon_g_5.html Although he makes clear that he doesn't want python to become Boo. So, we can safely say that Boo is "almost" a static python implementation. Wether you like or not, is another problem, but please, do not insist with your reiterative anti-boo ranting. I'm not a Boo evangelist and I don't think I'm perpetuating any "nonsense". I just made a simple comment in reply to an specific question, and I think this comment is very pertinent. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: New project coming up...stay with Python, or go with a dot net language??? Your thoughts please!
> that Boo isn't enough like Python to > be a kind of Python - not necessarily a criticism, though, but an > observation. This is correct. I completely agree with you and I'm not saying that boo is python. Again, I just said that it could be considered "almost" a static python implementation for .NET. It has many similarities, but also some fundamental differences, therefore, it is a different language. However, I think its similarities make it "pythonic" enough (or closely related to python) to be considered, commented and appreciated by the people in this mailing list. Unfortunately, others disagree with this idea, and insist (over and over again) that Boo is not python or that it has nothing to do with it. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: When someone from Britain speaks, Americans hear a "British accent"...
Grant Edwards ha escrito: > While we're off this topic again topic, I was watching a BBC > series "Space Race" the other night. The British actors did a > passable job with the American accents in the scenes at Fort > Bliss in Texas, but the writers wrote British English lines for > them to speak in their American accents... Continuing with this off-topic thread about british accent and movies... I've always asked myself why do Hollywood movies about the Roman Empire show the Emperors and all the nobles speaking with british accent? They were italians for God's sake! Anyway, I can't imagine Julius Caesar speaking like Vito Corleone... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for .NET and IronPython
I just want to clarify that the above mentioned web site (www.ironpython.com) is no longer maintained. If you want to get updated information on IronPython, you should visit this site: www.gotdotnet.com/Workspaces/Workspace. aspx?id=ad7acff7-ab1e-4bcb-99c0-57ac5a3a9742 Or the mailing list here: http://lists.ironpython.com/pipermail/users-ironpython.com/ By the way, the current version is 0.9.3 and it's advancing at a pretty fast pace towards version 1.0. Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: which feature of python do you like most?
I've never used Perl, but I know other c-like laguages, and I can tell you what I like about python: - It is concise, clear and to the point. - No useless characters like curly braces and semicolons cluttering it syntax,. - Very readable and elegant. - One obvious way to do each task, not thousands (easier to learn, easier to remember), and this way is shorter, easier and more straightforward than any other. - Great built-in data structures. - And all of its features, but very specially, list comprehensions and slicing. I can't live without them! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python worth it??
I was in you situation, and I'll tell you what worked for me: Online tutorials: I suggest starting out with Josh Cogliati's "Non-Programmers tutorial for Python" (http://www.honors.montana.edu/~jjc/easytut/easytut/) . It is an ideal introduction for a complete beginner, very easy to follow and right to the point. After that, I'd suggest: - A byte of Python by Swaroop C. H. (http://www.byteofpython.info/) This one is also a very easy and complete introduction. This would be enough to get you going and comfortable with Python, but, you may still need some good and simple introduction to object oriented programing. For that, I suggest Alan Gauld's "Learning to Program" (http://www.freenetpages.co.uk/hp/alan.gauld/). Pay special attention to the object oriented programming chapter. It has a simple "banking accounts" example that was a real eye opener for me. Of course, It won't hurt if you check regularly the official tutorial by Guido Van Rossum, but I wouldn't use it as a step to step introduction, because it seems more like an overview of the language. More indicated for someone who's looking for something specific. Good luck! Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: HTML generation vs PSP vs Templating Engines
With Karrigell (http://karrigell.sf.net/), all you need to know is Python and HTML. No templates, no python-like or special languages, only pure and simple python. You can embedd python into html or, if it better suits your programming tyle, you can embed html into python. Why don't you give it a try? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: HTML generation vs PSP vs Templating Engines
I meant that it is not strictly necessary to use templates in Karrigell, although you can use Cheetah if you want. I'm not used to templates mainly because I'm familiar with the way PHP works and, for simple dynamic sites like those I work on, this is the simpliest approach. Another reason is that I'm a little bit lazy for learning yet another language, be it a python-like one or a template one. Also, I feel that Python is easy enough for having to resort to another language. I usually create my pages with Dreamweaver or any other visual tool, and once the design is ready, I add a few python lines to it which, combined with modules that are separated from the html code, work wonders on my sites. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: the PHP ternary operator equivalent on Python
This could be done easier this way:
L = [('odd','even')[n%2] for i in range(8)]
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: the PHP ternary operator equivalent on Python
This could be done easier this way:
L = [('even','odd')[n%2] for n in range(8)]
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python book for a non-programmer
Read my reply here from another thread: http://groups.google.com/group/comp.lang.python/browse_thread/thread/25aada3c22ce6e66/cc69fd0c78384e5b?q=luis+cogliati's&rnum=1#cc69fd0c78384e5b -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: How to get started in GUI Programming?
IMHO, the easier alternative for building GUI apps with Python is PythonCard. It is based on wxWindows, and it lets you build gui apps by dragging and dropping widgets on a form, just like VB or Delphi. It is very high level and very easy to learn and use. http://pythoncard.sourceforge.net/ Another alternative, also based in wxWindows, is Boa Constructor, but I wouldn't recomend it over Pythoncard. Good luck! Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: How to get started in GUI Programming?
Try PythonCard (http://pythoncard.sf.net). Like VB or Delphi (drag and drop widgets), but much simpler, easy and fun. It's based on wxWidgets, and it gives your apps a native look, no matter your platform (much nicer than Tkinter, which looks uglier and dated). -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: python speed
Pypy is not the only promisory project we have for seeing Python running like compiled languages. Shed Skin is already a quite usable Python-to-C++ compiler which, in version 0.5.1, can actually compile many python scripts to fully optimized stand-alone executables. Next version will probably support the use of the standard python library and many, many exciting enhancements. The main difference between these two projects is that while PYPY aims to support 100% of python semantics including (all its dynamic features) on top of a virtual machine. It uses type inference for static compilation and just-in-time techniques. On the other hand, Shed Skin is purely a static compiler that translates python to c++ and then compiles to a stand alone executable. It will never support the most dynamic features of Python, but in most cases, it only requires to restrict our coding style a little bit to avoid these features and produce highly optimized code. http://shedskin.sf.net http://shed-skin.blogspot.com/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Favorite flavor of Linux? (for python or anything else)
> Looking to replace my older flavor of linux with something new. . .What > are some of your favorites for python programming and anything else? Ubuntu is developed by Canonical, a company owned by Mark Shuttleworth. This guy is a fan of both linux and python, so if you want a linux distro that gets along well with python, I guess Ubuntu is the best choice. If you read his website http://www.markshuttleworth.com/, you'll see that this guy encourages development of software in Python, and he even gransts money for developers. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Favorite flavor of Linux? (for python or anything else)
malv wrote: > Being a fan of linux and python and granting money doesn't make your OS > better or worse. > I believe that shipping a linux with a compiler DIFFERENT from the one > that was used to build the kernel is not very bright. It may never > bother some users, but few software developpers will like this idea. > malv Hmmm... I'm not an expert in this subject but isn't Ubuntu based on Debian? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Favorite flavor of Linux? (for python or anything else)
It's not only about having python installed. It's also about the tools that come with the distro. I've played with Ubuntu's live Cd a little bit, and I saw it comes with a lot of python related software, such as Boa Constructor, several ides, editors, etc... I ignore if other distros count with them as well.. Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: is python more popular than coldfusion?
worzel wrote: > Wth respect to coldfusion, is there much doubt about the fact that Python is > a more prominent and important technology? > > How is colfusion percieved by the Python community? Many people belive > coldfusion is becomeing irrelavant and is on its death bed - do Python folk > generally feel this way about it? I think this is a little bit like comparing oranges to apples... I wouldn't say Coldfusion is a programming language. It is a tag based scripting language designed for web development and, as such, it is very easy to learn and use, but its application domain is limited to the web. It comes in handy if you're a designer with no programming skills and you want to hook your site to a database or do some easy web development, but I think that professional developers (non-designers) use other alternatives ranging from php (open source, free) to asp.net (propietary -MS). On the other hand, python is a general purpose programming language and it can be used for almost anything you can think of. It is not just a web scripting language. My advice: if you want to learn something for getting a job and making a living, forget about Coldfusion. It is ok for a web designer or for a hobbyist who doesn't know and doesn't want to know about programming, but who needs to get the job done with the least delay. Now if you're serious about making a living as a programmer, and you are willing to study and learn, (and provided you're new to programming) I would highly recommend python as your first language. It is very easy to learn and with it, you'll learn advanced programming concepts quickier and easier than by studying java, for example, because its syntax is cleaner and much more concise, easy to read and to the point. Then, and once you have a good grasp about the basics of programming and object oriented concepts, you will be able to learn any other language such as java or c# (for making big bucks). And if you are not interested in learning another language, python alone will make a very good general purpose programming language. Why the way, it's also very fun! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: is python more popular than coldfusion?
> by the way, does anybody want to buy any coldfusion books :) I have Sam's Teach Yourself Coldfusion by Charles Mohnike, which I bought in 2001. By this time I used to think that I was learning rocket science the easy way, and thinking about learning php or asp was really scary... these codes looked very complex for my uninitiated eyes. However, It was good for grasping the logic of interacting with a database through sql and making my website dynamic. Soon I realized that finding a cheap CF hosting wasn't easy at all, and I started to read about php. Php is also for web development, but it gave me the basic knowledge to understand programming. However, I wanted to learn a more general purpose language and I don't remember how, I landed in pythonland. Let me tell you that I could learn python basics in just a few hours. Once I got the interpreter running, I couldn't stop! Just get one of the many tutorial available on the web and start playing. YOU'LL SEE IT'S ADDICTIVE. If you want to start from zero, I suggest Josh Cogliati's beginner tutorial. Another good introduction is A Byte of Python (google this), or any of the ones quoted in Python's web site. Learning Python is a good book too (especially the second edition). Enjoy! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Getting rid of "self."
You can do it easier now without any black magic: class c: def __init__(s): s.x = 1 s.y = 2 s.hi = "Hi there!" The word "self" is not mandatory. You can type anything you want instead of self, as long as you supply a keyword in its place (it can be "self", "s" or whatever you want). -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
else condition in list comprehension
Hi there, I'd like to know if there is a way to add and else condition into a list comprehension. I'm sure that I read somewhere an easy way to do it, but I forgot it and now I can't find it... for example: z=[i+2 for i in range(10) if i%2==0] what if I want i to be "i-2" if i%2 is not equal to 0? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: else condition in list comprehension
Thank you guys! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: else condition in list comprehension
It's me wrote: > > z = [i + (2, -2)[i % 2] for i in range(10)] > > But then why would you want to use such feature? Wouldn't that make the > code much harder to understand then simply: > > z=[] > for i in range(10): > if i%2: > z.append(i-2) > else: > z.append(i+2) > > Or are we trying to write a book on "Puzzles in Python"? Once you get used to list comprehensions (and it doesn't take long), they are a more concise and compact way to express these operations. I think that writing 6 lines instead of 1 could be more readable of you are a beginner, but after playing a little bit with listcomps for the first time, you'll see they are very practical yet readable. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python.org, Website of Satan
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > python.org = 194.109.137.226 > > 194 + 109 + 137 + 226 = 666 > > What is this website with such a demonic name and IP address? What > evils are the programmers who use this language up to? You dared to unveil our secret. Now we'll have to kill you... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: The next Xah-lee post contest
Peter Hansen wrote: > Arthur wrote: > > Steve Holden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >>Would there, I wonder, be any enthusiasm for a "Best Xah Lee impression" > >>prize at PyCon? > > > > And the rules of the game, if he shows? > > Arthur, if Xah Lee shows up at Pycon, he most definitely will > not be giving the best impression... > > -Peter Have you visited his website? I kind of like this guy... it's like he has a few bugs in his brain, but other parts are surprisingly interesting. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: The next Xah-lee post contest
alex23 wrote: > Luis M. Gonzalez wrote: > > I kind of like this guy... it's like he has a few bugs in his brain, > > but other parts are surprisingly interesting. > > Which bits especially impress you, the rampant misogyny or the > unwarranted intellectual arrogance? I didn't say that I'm "impressed". I just said that some things he says are somewhat interesting, funny and weird. I think he, as character, is a little bit excentric and far from nornal, but he is absolutely harmless. And to tell you the truth, I don't understand the animosity and aggressiveness demonstrated against him. Those who are offended by his posts, should just go ahead and read someone else's posts intead of starting World War III. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is there a market for python developers?
Peter Hansen wrote: > Yes. Man of few words... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: An Ode To My Two Loves
Jamey, Really, you should try to steer clear from your computer from time to time... Your mental health is more important than python or ruby, don't lose it! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: When someone from Britain speaks, Americans hear a "British accent"...
Grant Edwards wrote: > That depends on the accent. I believe that's probably true for > the educated south of England, BBC, received pronunciation. I > don't think that's true for some of the other dialects from > northern areas (e.g. Liverpool) or the "cockney" accent. What's exactly the "cockney" accent? Is it related to some place or it's just a kind of slang? I'm not sure, but I think that I read somewhere that it is common in some parts of London, and that it is a sign of a particular social class, more than a regionalism. Is that true? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: When someone from Britain speaks, Americans hear a "British accent"...
Well, yes, it is kinda off topic, but very interesting... Being myself an argentine with spanish as mother tongue and a very bad English, it's hard foro me to tell the difference between accents. I can hardly tell an Irish from an English... But what I did tell is the broad range of different accents within London when I visited the city in 2001. Some people seemed to speak very clear to me, and others seemed to be speaking german! And as far as I know, all these people were british, not immigrants (and very hard to find indeed...). Cheers, Luis - Original Message - From: "Simon Brunning" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Luis M. Gonzalez" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Cc: Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 5:20 AM Subject: Re: When someone from Britain speaks, Americans hear a "British accent"... On 29 Jun 2005 15:34:11 -0700, Luis M. Gonzalez <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > What's exactly the "cockney" accent? > Is it related to some place or it's just a kind of slang? A cockney is a *real* Londoner, that is, someone born within the City of London, a.k.a The Square Mile. More specifically, it's someone born "within the sound of Bow Bells" - i.e. close to St Mary le Bow, London - <http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=EC2V+6AU>. This is within the theoretical sound of Bow Bells, you understand - there have been frequent and lengthy periods during which Bow Bells have not been rung at all. There are in fact no longer any hospitals with maternity units within the sound of Bow Bells, so there will be vanishingly few cockneys born in future. Strangely enough, this makes *me* a cockney, though I've never lived in the square mile, and my accent is pretty close to received. I do *work* in the City, though! The cockney accent used to be pretty distinct, but these days it's pretty much merged into the "Estuary English" accent common throughout the South East of England. > I'm not sure, but I think that I read somewhere that it is common in > some parts of London, and that it is a sign of a particular social > class, more than a regionalism. Is that true? Cockney was London's working class accent, pretty much, thought it was frequently affected by members of the middle classes. Estuary English has taken over its position as the working class accent these days, but with a much wider regional distribution. How off topic is this? Marvellous! -- Cheers, Simon B, [EMAIL PROTECTED], http://www.brunningonline.net/simon/blog/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for everything?
Let me express it with an exaple (by the way, sorry for my bad english): Suppose you are planning to build a house. You have two choices: - Option one: Buy several thousands bricks, doors, tiles, windows, etc... put them all together according to the blueprints and build your home. - Option two: Get loads of sand, concrete, wood and raw materials, make your own bricks, make each door and windows with your prefered kind of wood, design and make your tiles, etc.. and after a long, long time, create a unique, one of a kind house. Option one would be like using Python for creating your programs. It gives you all the built-in functions and high level data structures with which you can create a solution for almost any kind of problem you might want to solve. You don't have to spend time allocating memmory, using pointers, creting your data structures from scratch, etc, etc.. because it's all there already available for you, and all these time consuming, error-prone tasks are very well hadled by python itself. Option two is like using C: It gives you full control in the creating on your program, but 90% of the times (or more) you might think "do I really need to go through all this hassle?". Sure, it will be faster but, "do I really need this extra speed?". I think that with the current processors, speed and performance is less an isue than it was a few years ago. Most of the times, developing time is paramount. And even if you need very good execution speed for a given task, you can still code an extension in c or c++ and keep all the benefits of a high level programming language such as python. And if these arguments still can't convince you, be adviced that there's a very ambicious and exciting project called "Pypy" which aims to create a high performance python implementation, and it is being developed very succesfully. They say that the secret goal is being faster than c... and I'm not sure but I think that there's a tentative hard line set to december of 2006. Check it out: http://codespeak.net/pypy/index.cgi?news Cheers, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Good starterbook for learning Python?
Before buying a book, I suggest starting out with at least one of these beginners tutorials available in internet: - Non-Programmers Tutorial For Python by Josh Cogliati (honors.montana.edu/~jjc/easytut/easytut/) - A Byte of Python by Swaroop CH (www.byteofpython.info) There are many others, but these ones are very good. The first one is best for someone who knows nothing about programing, and the second one is probably better for you, since you already have some experience. It's good for absolute beginners though. Books: - Learning Python by Mark Lutz - Core Python by Wesley Chun Regards, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: I am a Java Programmer
I'm sorry for you, nobody deserves to program in Java ... I'm glad you decided to stand up for your human rights. Go learn python! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Yet Another Python Web Programming Question
Try Karrigell ( http://karrigell.sourceforge.net ). And let me know what you think... Cheers, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What is your favorite Python web framework?
I really like Karrigell ( http://karrigell.sourceforge.net ). It is, IMHO, the most pythonic framework because all you need to know is the python language. You don't need to learn any template or special language, you only use plain and regular python. It also gives you a lot of freedom when choosing a programming style: you can code python inside html (just like in PHP or ASP) or you can code html within python. It also lets you map databases to objects and you can use the included database Gadfly or any other that has a python api. The downside: it currectly works with its built-in server, and although you can use it alongside Apache or Xitami, there's still no way to do it with mod_python, and as far as I know, there's no hosting providers with Karrigell instaled. It is being used mainly by people who run their websites from their own computers. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What is your favorite Python web framework?
Peter Hansen wrote: > Gerhard Haering wrote: > > On Mon, Jul 18, 2005 at 09:06:21AM -0400, Peter Hansen wrote: > >>I'm not familiar with this expression. What do you mean by "black horse"? > > > > Maybe "the Ferrari of pythonic frameworks" (black horse on yellow > > background being the symbol of Ferrari). > > I know there are "black sheep" in some families, and "dark horse > candidates". Also yellow-bellied sapsuckers. There's a "black horse" > fish in the Mississippi valley (also, quite coincidentally, of the > sucker family). Not entirely sure that was the intended connotation. :-) > > -Peter I'm used to make those mistakes too... This mailing list taught me more English than Python for sure. I read the expression "Dark horse contender" many times, and i guess it has some reminiscence from medieval times and the cavalry stories. It meaning is something like the "unknown that could be the new champ", someone intriguing and mysterious who doesn't unveil its skills untill showtime. Am I right? Cheers, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Opinions on KYLIX 3 (Delphi 4 Linux)
I'd suggest you take another path: Since we're in a python mailing list, I assume you like python, so instead of Kylix (or Object Pascal), you could try Boo (boo.codehaus.org) . Boo is not python, but it is very similar. It could be described as a statically typed version of python for the .NET framework (it also works in Linux with Mono and in Mac Osx). It has borrowed from python as much syntax as possible and uses a handy type inference system, which allows you to code without having to declare types everywhere, making it very similar to a dynamic language while being static. As I said, "it is not python" (Peter Hansen, please don't jump to my jugular...), but it's been inspired and takes a lot from it. In words of Guido Van Rossum, it is 95% python. You get all the niceties you got used to enjoy in python, such as list comprehensions, generator expressions, slicing, dictionaries, lists, etc, etc.. and you get all the speed and performance of a static language for free. As for IDEs, you can use SharpDevelop in Windows (free) or MonoDevelop in Linux (free). And if you are patient, soon you'll be able o use regular python in .NET and Mono, and I'm sure that there will be support for SharpDevelop and MonoDevelop for it as well. At the present time, python for .NET (code named Ironpython) is still at pre-alpha state (version 0.7.6). -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Opinions on KYLIX 3 (Delphi 4 Linux)
Luis M. Gonzalez wrote: > As I said, "it is not python" (Peter Hansen, please don't jump to my > jugular...) Hey Pete, I was joking on that one! Here's the missing smiley ;-) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: python certification
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > i want to get a small certificate or diploma in python. > it should be online cuz i live in pakistan and wont have teast centers > near me. > it should be low cost as i am not rich. > and hopefully it would be something like a a begginer certification cuz > i am new to python. Hmm... I think I can help you. By the way, how much are you willing to spend? You know, getting a high grade is also important...:-) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python IDE
linuxfreak wrote: > Hi guys, >Got going with python...and i must say its a pretty cool language. > Been using Xemacs to write me programs. But I want an IDE that would > give me auto-completion, online help and the like... Tried SPE and > Dr.Pyhton but the former crashes regulary and the latter is quite > unweildy and does not have a great many features. I quite like the UML > feature found in SPE but the damn thing crashes way too often. What are > you guys using and what do you think is the best IDE...or should i > stick with Xemacs/emacs??? Have you tried PyCrust? http://sourceforge.net/projects/pycrust/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: mod_python Apache/2.0.52 (Win32) Python 2.4
Dieter Raber wrote: > Hi there, > > I am wondering if there is a mod_python for the above configuration. I > downloaded mod_python-3.1.3.win32-py2.3.exe, which of course as the > name implies keeps on asking me for a python 2.3 installation. I > imagine one could cheat a little bit with a fake registry entry that > says it was about python 2.3 but that points to python 2.4. Then again > I don't know what entry mod_python's installer is looking for. > > Thanks for your help > > Dieter Hi there, A couple of months ago, I went though the hassle of trying to install mod_python and unfortunately, there is no easy way of doing it separately, because you have to take care about each component's version, that should match the other component's one... If you one to do it all at once and get it working, try Apache2Triad: http://apache2triad.net/ This is a package inspired in EasyPhp and PhpTriad and. It installs all the required software (plus a lot of other programs - check the website). It is aimed at webdevelopers who don't want to deal with individual instalations or configurations. The only downside is that it will install many programs that you are probably not interested in... but you might like it. Cheers, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: mod_python Apache/2.0.52 (Win32) Python 2.4
Dieter Raber wrote: > Hi there, > > I am wondering if there is a mod_python for the above configuration. I > downloaded mod_python-3.1.3.win32-py2.3.exe, which of course as the > name implies keeps on asking me for a python 2.3 installation. I > imagine one could cheat a little bit with a fake registry entry that > says it was about python 2.3 but that points to python 2.4. Then again > I don't know what entry mod_python's installer is looking for. > > Thanks for your help > > Dieter Hi there, A couple of months ago, I went though the hassle of trying to install mod_python and unfortunately, there is no easy way of doing it separately, because you have to take care about each component's version, that should match the other component's one... If you one to do it all at once and get it working, try Apache2Triad: http://apache2triad.net/ This is a package inspired in EasyPhp and PhpTriad and. It installs all the required software (plus a lot of other programs - check the website). It is aimed at webdevelopers who don't want to deal with individual instalations or configurations. The only downside is that it will install many programs that you are probably not interested in... but you might like it. Cheers, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: need for speed
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > hi everyone > can someone suggest me where find a lot programming tricks for > achieving the top speed in python? > thanks everyone for patience Check this out: http://wiki.python.org/moin/PythonSpeed/PerformanceTips -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
IronPython 0.9 Released
IronPython 0.9 Released(8/2/2005 10:28:41 AM) http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?familyid=cf5ae627-5df1-4f8a-ba8b-d64f0676f43f&displaylang=en -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Newer than a Newbe
linuxfreak wrote: > Look at Karrigell. Its a web framework for Python > > http://karrigell.sourceforge.net I second this suggestion. Karrigell is a pleasure to work with and I'm sure it will appeal any python fun who dare to play with it. I also hope Pierre (its developer) lose some of his modesty and start to show off this beatifull framework :-) because so far, he's been reluctant to promote it until he is 100% sure it's mature and stable (it's been ready for a long time though). -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Py: a very dangerous language
Well, I have no problems going to bed. The problem is that while sleeping, I keep on coding in my head... Sometimes I reach the "A ha!" state, then I wake up, turn on the my pc and type the solution. I'm a little bit worried though... I don't even have erotic dreams anymore! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Py: a very dangerous language
This is great! It's absolutely useless, like a real therapist, but it's free! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: IronPython 0.9 Released
could ildg wrote: > Why is iron python runs so fast but jython runs so slow while C# and > java seem very much the same? I've been playing with Ironpython since its first release and, in my experience, it is not faster than Cpython, although this is what they claim. Anyway, it is in alpha stage so lets wait until it's mature... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python for Webscripting (like PHP)
Mod_python has a PSP (python server pages - ala php) implementation. However it's still not mature enough and, imho, it has a serious drawback in its way to handle indentation. But this is just the first release and I hope it will improve in the near future. My favorite is Karrigell ( http://karrigell.sourceforge.net ). It is a pleasure to work with, minimalistic, simple and to the point. No template language needed, just regular python and html and, as far as I know, mod_python integration is uderway. Hope it helps... Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Karrigell tutorial published
Karrigell has new tutorial here: http://karrigell.sourceforge.net/en/tutorial.html For those who don't know what Karrigell is, I'd just say that it is the most pythonic, simple, fun, straightforward and full-featured web framework available today. Check it out! http://karrigell.sourceforge.net/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: New Arrival to Python
Windows Apps: Since you said "professional looking" applications, I assume you mean graphical interfaces (windows - GUI): If so, I recomend PythonCard ( http://pythoncard.sourceforge.net/ ). It is very easy to use, very similar to Visual Basic or Delphi (drag and drop widgets on a form...). Web Development: An excellent choice for simple (and complex, but easy) web development in Python is Karrigell ( http://pythoncard.sourceforge.net/ ). It is not an IDE, but a web framework. The coding can de made with the standard IDLE or simply notepad. Books: Learning Python 2nd Edition. Very good and complete introduction to python. Online resources: A byte of Python (google this) Dive into Python (for more experienced programmers) Hope this helps... Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: New Arrival to Python
Windows Apps: Since you said "professional looking" applications, I assume you mean graphical interfaces (windows - GUI): If so, I recomend PythonCard ( http://pythoncard.sourceforge. net/ ). It is very easy to use, very similar to Visual Basic or Delphi (drag and drop widgets on a form...). Web Development: An excellent choice for simple (and complex, but easy) web development in Python is Karrigell ( http://karrigell.sourceforge. net/ ). It is not an IDE, but a web framework. The coding can de made with the standard IDLE or simply notepad. Books: Learning Python 2nd Edition. Very good and complete introduction to python. Online resources: A byte of Python (google this) Dive into Python (for more experienced programmers) Hope this helps... Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python / web
Karrigell is a very good option. Easy to learn and easy to use. In words of his author: "Karrigell is a simple web programming solution, written in Python. It has been designed to be really simple to use : integrated web server and data base ( gadfly), easy access to environement data and form fields, yet full-featured and powerful : Python script execution in the same process as the server (no CGI), server pages including html and Python code (similar to PHP, JSP, ASP), easy handling of authentication, session management, localization features, etc Karrigell can also work with external web servers : Apache and Xitami are currently supported. All current databases (sqlite, MySql, PostGresQL, etc) can be used with the corresponding Python API's. A convenient way of using databases with a dictionary-like syntax is provided for gadfly and sqlite " -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Ode to python
I guess we all say foolishness when we're in love... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: First release of Shed Skin, a Python-to-C++ compiler.
This is great news. Congratulations! By the way, I read in your blog that you would be releasing a windows intaller soon. Have you, or anyone else, managed to do it? Cheers, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: WYSIWYG wxPython "IDE"....?
Try PythonCard. Very simple, very easy and based on wxPython. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Pypy - Which C modules still need converting to py?
Also you can browse the Pypy-Dev archives here: http://codespeak.net/pipermail/pypy-dev/ and post messages here: pypy-dev@codespeak.net regards, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Learning Python - resources and ideas
Regarding rec.photo.equipment.35mm... this is not his fault. Yesterday I tried posting to comp.lang.python and, for some strange reason, it was posted momentarily to this group. Regarding Cody's question: If you are an absolute newby, try Josh Cogliati's python tutorial for non-programmers (google this). I learned the basics with it. Then you can try any of the other resources listed in www.python.org. If you're willing to buy a book, try "Learning Python 2nd.Ed" by Mark Lutz or "Core Python" by Wesley Chun. Regards, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: creating .NET clients with python
At this time, Ironpython is in pre-alpha state, not suitable for production work. However, we will have news about it in the next Pycon 2005, which will be held by the end of March. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Using reverse iteration to clean up a list
Well, I'm not sure if this is what you want, but you could use a
dictionary:
>>> d={}
>>> for i,e in L:
if d.has_key(i):
d[i] += e
else:
d[i] = e
>>> d
{'A': 500, 'B': 200}
>>>
--
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Is Python like VB?
Mike, I've got a very good news for you which, to my surprise, nobody mentioned in this thread: Right now, Micrsoft is developing a .NET version of Python ( http://www.ironpython.com ). It has been started as an open source project by Jim Hugunin, which was later hired by Microsoft to keep on working on it. So soon, you'll have an excellent language like Python (which is much better, easier amd powerful than Visual Basic) and you'll be able to create GUI programs with Visual Studio, just like you use to do with VB6. Meanwhile, you can start playing with the language (which is still in pre-alpha state, version 0.6). -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Python 2.3.5 ?
I'm confussed... Python 2.4 (final) hs been released a few days ago, but now I see that Python 2.3.5 is being worked on. Why? What does it mean? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Python 2.3.5 ?
I'm confussed... Python 2.4 (final) hs been released a few days ago, but now I see that Python 2.3.5 is being worked on. Why? What does it mean? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: from vb6 to Python
MarcoL wrote: > Hello, > I am a VB6 programmer and I would like to learn a new high level > language (instead of restarting from scratch with .NET... I'd like to add that by going with Python, you'll also be able to develop for .NET. Check this out: www.ironpython.com . Since the development of Ironpython is now being funded by Microsoft, you'll get the best of both worlds: An already excellent cross-platform, object oriented language and a fully compliant .NET language for Windows and Linux (through Mono and DotGnu). For now, I suggest using PythonCard for building GUI apps. It is *very* easy to learn and use, especially for someone coming from VB6. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: from vb6 to Python
Martijn Faassen wrote: > Unfortunately this is currently not near production use, and whether > Microsoft is funding IronPython development is up in the air: It's true that he Ironpython's mailing list is a little bit innactive, but this is just because there's only one person in charge of Ironpython at this moment (although Microsoft was looking to hire a new developer to help on this). However, the innactivity is due to the fact that Jim Hugunin, its developer, has begun working for MS just a couple of months ago, and as he says, there are tons of new CLR features to learn that are applicable to dynamic languages. You should also give credit to Jim: he's the man who developed Jython, which is a complete inplementation of Python written in Java. He also created Numeric and co-authored Aspect, another programming language. So I'm sure that Ironpython will be a reality soon, and a very good one... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python mascot proposal
Hey Dimitri, I completely agree with you in that Python needs once for all a cool logo. I like your design very much, but I have a few thoughts about it: 1) I think that Python's logo should reflect its power. If we use a mascot as its image, we would be giving the wrong idea: that Python is a "toy" language, instead of a very good alternative to other mainstream languages. 2) We should also bear in mind Guido's oppinion about using a snake for identifying Python. 3) And finally, we should consider it very seriously. Image is not everything, but it is very important for "marketing" a product. I'm sure that if Java didn't have a cool name and a cool logo, it wouldn't have been that succesfull. I don't mean to sound like I'm rejecting your idea. I really like it alot, and it is an excellent mascot. It's just that I wouldn't use a mascot... I'd rather use a more "killer" image. Something that reflects power and excellence. What do you think? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: do you master list comprehensions?
I guess the simplest way to do it is like this: >>> data = [['foo','bar','baz'],['my','your'],['holy','grail']] >>> result=[w for d in data for w in d] >>> result ['foo', 'bar', 'baz', 'my', 'your', 'holy', 'grail'] >>> -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: do you master list comprehensions?
I guess the simplest to do it is like this: >>> data = [['foo','bar','baz'],['my','your'],['holy','grail']] >>> result=[w for d in data for w in d] >>> result ['foo', 'bar', 'baz', 'my', 'your', 'holy', 'grail'] >>> -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python mascot proposal
> > But before pushing forward any particular design, maybe it will make > > sense to make some sort of official logo contest on Python's main > > website and post it on /. ? > I was waiting for someone to propose that :-) I'm new to this list and Python in general, but I think that this sort of things are always decided by Guido. I think we have two options: 1) Simply start the contest and see what happens. If it attrackts many competitors, I guess it will be considered by the core developers. 2) Ask for permition and let them define the rules. Perhaps the BDFL is reading this thread and has something to say about it? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Best book on Python?
This is a very good introduction online: www.g2swaroop.net/byte-of-python I also suggest: - Learning Python 2nd Ed. - Core Python You can also try these online resources: - Dive into Python - Thinking in Python -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python mascot proposal
Stephan, Since you're one of the directors of the Python Software Foundation, could you let them know about this discussion in order to get their approval? If they agree, maybe you can tell us where and how to held the contest. Just one thought: I think that it would be good to not determine a deadline for the contest. We should let anyone submit their designs until a clear winner shows up, or until Guido or the board of directors chooses a winner. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Boo who? (was Re: newbie question)
> Why? If it's virtually identical, why would anyone bother even > visiting that site? ;-) > > But I suspect you mean that the syntax of the language is virtually > identical, while probably there are some significant differences. > Maybe in the richness of its standard library? Or the size of > its community? Or something else The difference is that it runs on the .NET frmework (and Mono). So instead of using the python standard libraries, you use the .NET ones. Regarding its syntax, it is very similar to Python. However the language is statically typed, not dynamic. Anyway, you don't have to declare types too often, because it uses a very good type inference system. For all those reasons, Boo has very good performance. In theory, it's performance is equal to C# or any other .NET compliant language, but it is still in phase of development (although quite usable for many tasks). So I guess it has many characteristics that make it a very interesting language for any python fan. And for those concerned with speed and performance, it is god send. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Boo who? (was Re: newbie question)
Peter Hansen wrote: > And given that Boo is *not* virtually identical to Python*, > pointing it out to a self-proclaimed newbie with a question > about enums seems like nothing more than an ill-chosen > moment to do a little proselytizing. Why not just start > a thread about Boo and point it out to those of us who > have never heard of it? That wouldn't raise any hackles... > By the way, are you a moderator of this mailing list? I'm asking you because I use to read your daily posts giving guidlines on how to post, what to say or what not to say, and I wonder if this is your role in this group. Is it? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Boo who? (was Re: newbie question)
Steve, I didn't want to be agressive at all. Although now that I read again my post, it seems a little bit harsh... But I see that very often in this list, some replies show much of intolerance and very little politeness. And in my oppinion, this is one of these cases. I don't know what Doug Holton did to get such a lesson of posting rules, since I think his comments were expressed in a propper way and they were definetely python related. This is not the first time it happens. A couple of times I suffered myself this kind of attitudes and I chose to keep quiet for the sake of peace, but I think it's time to point out some limits to those who act as self-entitled moderators. Being a moderator is ok, but not being a bouncer. Regards, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Boo who? (was Re: newbie question)
Steve and Steve N°2, I agree with Steve N°1 that we are all entitled to express our oppinions, and this is the way it should be. I don't want to give the impression that I have something personal against anyone here, and I agree that this list is quite civilized, but again, I'm basing my comments in previous posts, not only this one. For example, if someone says something like: > And given that Boo is *not* virtually identical to Python*, > pointing it out to a self-proclaimed newbie with a question > about enums seems like nothing more than an ill-chosen > moment to do a little proselytizing. I get the impression that if the topic raised is not of interest of this person, it shouldn't be mentioned in this list at all. What about the others? I found this comment very interesting. I don't like when someone else comes up and invites the poster to shut up. Let's see another comment: > Why not just start > a thread about Boo and point it out to those of us who > have never heard of it? That wouldn't raise any hackles... By the way, Doug already started this topic, as suggested by Peter, some time ago. And if you search this thread, you'll see how it finished... he was invited to move the thread to another mailing list. I remember also another occasion where I dared to say that Python is slow, and all I got was an onrush of flames. I wanted to discuss about pypy, starkiller, ironpython, and other exciting ongoing projects... but it was imposible, everybody seemed to be very offended and it was impossible to get the thread back on track. This is what I call intolerance. Usually, those people are always the same ones. Anyway, I don't want to make a big deal of this. I just expressed my oppinion. If I offended someone, please accept my most sincere apologies. Regards, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Boo who? (was Re: newbie question)
Istvan Albert wrote: > All that boo does is borrows a few syntactical constructs > from python. Calling it virtually identical > is *very* misleading. That's right. I wouldn't say it is *virtually identical* because Boo is not Python (and this was clearly stated in its web site). It is an statically typed language while Python is dynamic, and it was designed to run on the .NET framework. However, it's syntax is *very* similar, and I'm sure that any Python aficionado would be able to learn it in a few minutes. > I've downloaded and tried it when you first made this claim > and it turned out that boo couldn't directly run even > the simplest python programs This is because Boo is not Python. It is very similar, but there are some obvious differences. > speed was slower than that of the corresponding python program. > I think this entitles me to be irked by your post above. You should consider that if you don't declare the types (as it is supposed in any statically typed language) or if you don't understand well how its type inference works, Boo would consider each variable as type "object", therefore its execution speed would be similar to that of a dynamic language. I think that if you use Boo correctly, its performance would be as good as any other .NET compliant language. Anyway, Boo is still a work in progress and not ready for production (although quite usable at its current state). Finally, I want to say that although many people in this list may not be interested in this language, I'm sure that there could be many others that will find it very interesting. (Especially those who are forced to work in a Microsoft centric company). In these cases, Boo is like programming in c# with a python-like syntax. As for the first ones, there's no reason to bash this project gratuitelly. It is as important and "python related" as other projects such as PyPy, Stackless, Prothon, etc... I encourage everyone to give it a try, and if still you're not convinced, well, you can ignore any thread that mentions it and go on happily with your life... regards, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Boo who? (was Re: newbie question)
Terry Reedy wrote: > > [gratuitously] I agree with this... > well, my english is bad. I know! > > but I think this is silly. PyPy is an alternate implementation of Python, > not a different language. Stackless is a compiled extension, like many > others, that works with the standard implementation or maybe still a minor > modification thereof. you're right, but what when I say "python related", I mean that it has something or a lot in common with python, and as such, it could be of interest to any python fan. Why being extremists? Python is a programming language, a tool. It is not a religion, is it? Programmers use different tools, and this could be a very interesting one for someone who already knows python. > > > Prothon, etc... > > This I again agree with. I understand that Prothon is also a *different* > though Python inspired language. Also that it is still under development. > I have no idea of which has diverged more or whether they have mostly gone > in the same or different directions (a possibly interesting topic for a > post). But neither are as 'Python related' as Python itself. > > Terry J. Reedy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Boo who? (was Re: newbie question)
I agree with you, and I don't understand why so many people insist in "banning" the word "Boo" in this list. What's the problem guys? Is this a taboo or something? Isn't this list open for discussion of all things related to Python? Isn't Boo related to Python? And if you think it is not "related enough", what's the problem if somebody mentions it here? I find interesting the topic and I like to hear about it from time to time, as well as many other topics (prothon, ironpython, stackless, pypy, etc, etc). Please people, relax... peace! -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: newbie question
Fredrik Lundh wrote: > it's the new Boo marketing motto: "have you harrassed a Pythoneer today?" Fredrik, I think you're being a little bit injust. As far as I could see, everythime the word "boo" is typed, some sort of censorship or plain bashing comes up, and I think this is not fair. In my case, if some topic or thread is not of my interest, I simply skip it. Why don't we all do the same and live in peace? :-) By the way, this is from comp.lang.python home page: "Pretty much anything Python-related is fair game for discussion, and the group is even fairly tolerant of off-topic digressions" Seeing what was going on in this thread, I think that we probably should delete this part, because this is getting far from "fairly tolerant". -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: newbie question
Peter, Thank you for taking the time to reply in such a detailed and polite way. I'm satisfied by your last post and, although I beg to disagree in a few points, I'm glad to see that we are all slowly going back to a civil way of expressing ourselves. Regarding my first post in this thread, I hope I didn't offend you. I just wanted to point out that there were some attitudes from you and from others that, in my oppinion, were a little bit too harsh. Sometimes it seems that instead of replying, you are making absolute statements intended to disqualify other people's oppinions, leaving no place for a continuing discussion of these matters. But I want to say that I recognize your labor here when it comes to help newbies and the time you spend in this list particicipating and contributing. And I also recognize that you are capable of "slowing down" and make your thoughts clear. As for your comment about Boo: > Boo is not Python related. It's that simple. Boo has some > passing resemblance to Python, and claims that it's much > more than that are patently false. And clearly designed > to be marketing propaganda to get more Boo users onboard Perhaps I don't measure that relativity with the same ruler, but as far as I could see when playing with Boo, it is very similar to Python. Anyway, I don't want to appear as a promoter or evangelist of Boo, I'm just someone who tested it and liked it. Also, you should consider that, preferences aside, there might be pythonistas in situations where they are forced to work with Microsoft technologies, and since programmers use tools (and we are discussing about tools here, not religions) I think it's pertinent to discuss it here. Amyway, I wouldn't want to use this list to talk about Boo, because I think that the best place to do it is comp.lang.boo. However, since I think it is definetely python related (I know you disagree, but others don't) I see no harm in mentioning it here occasionally. regards, Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Boo who? (was Re: newbie question)
Don't worry.. Now we'll make a big group hug therapy and friends again! Cheers, Luis Philippe C. Martin wrote: > Sorry but I really feel this incredible waste of energy is polluting an, > otherwise, excellent and helpful mailing list. > > > Best regards, > > Philippe -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Guido & Optional Static Typing
Hi folks, This is an interesting new article (published today Dec. 23). Guido discusses the possibility of adding optional static typing to Python: http://www.artima.com/weblogs/viewpost.jsp?thread=85551 -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Guido & Optional Static Typing
Sorry... I just realized that somebody else already had started a thread on this... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Optional Static Typing
I don't understand why this discussion on optional static typing came up right at this moment. As far as I know, it has been discussed many times in the past, and there even was a SIG that simply died... but it seems that it never was something of much interest to python developers (that's my impression, I might be wrong). Now, that the Pypy project is steadily advancing (and which is aimed at making Python faster while keeping it dynamic and simple), why has this topyc been raised? Also there's starkiller, which deals with agressive type inference and compilation to native code. If these projects are serious and are well headed, then I don't know why we are talking now of static typing. Lets say that Pypy and/or Starkiller end up as succesful projects, what would be the advantage of having static typing in Python? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Optional Static Typing
> > I don't understand why this discussion on optional static typing came > > up right at this moment. > > Because Guido made some notes on it. > > http://www.artima.com/weblogs/viewpost.jsp?thread=85551 > > merry christmas. > Stephen. Yes, I know Guido did it. But I wonder why at this moment, just when things seem to be directed in a complete opposite way and with good chance of success (as I said: Pypy, Starkiller, etc). -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Optional Static Typing
Robert Kern wrote: > Automatic type inferencing is great, but sometimes the inference is > "object". Being able to supply more information about types helps > Starkiller keep the inferences tight and specific. Hmm... I'm not an expert in this subject at all, but I think that when the inference is "object", as you said, is because the type couldn't be inferred so it defaults to object, which is the more general type of all. For example, this is what happens in Boo, which is the only language I know (a little bit) that uses type inference. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Optional Static Typing
Robert Kern wrote: > Starkiller, at least, can deal with cases where a variable might be one > of a set of types and generates code for each of this set. Explicit type > declarations can help keep these sets small and reduces the number of > times that Starkiller needs to fall back to PyObject_* calls. Will we be able to see it anytime soon? I'm eagerly waiting for its release. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: IronPython 0.7 released!
James wrote: > http://www.gotdotnet.com/workspaces/workspace.aspx?id=ad7acff7-ab1e-4bcb-99c0-57ac5a3a9742 This is what I get when I follow this link: "Operational Troubleshooting in Progress" I've been visiting ironpython's site all day long searching for news but nothing... Has anyone managed to download the new release? If so please, would you email it to me at luismgz at gmail.com ?? -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: dictionary: sorting the values preserving the order
Another alternative:
d1 = {'a':4,'b':5,'c':1,'d':2,'e':3}
il=[(v,k) for k,v in d1.items()]
il.sort()
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Re: Python's use in RAD
Check this out: http://pythoncard.sourceforge.net/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Python is incredible!
You are not the first lisper who fell inlove with Python... Check this out: http://www.paulgraham.com/articles.html -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Visual Python, really "Visual"?
The IDEs you've been looking at have no visual GUI designers. For that, you can check Boa Constructor or PythonCard. These two are based on the wxPython toolkits. There are other commercial IDEs based on QT but I cannot comment on these cause I've never used them. Visual Python is a plug-in for Visual Studio, but it only gives you syntax highlitning, code completion and things like that. No visual GUI designer at all... IMHO, Komodo or WingIde don't offer anything that can't be found in free products. For example , if you download PythonCard (which is a GUI designer) you get also PyCrust, which is a cool and lightweight IDE that gives you almost all the features of Komodo or WingIDE for free. PythonCard is not as fully complete as Visual Studio or Delphi, but it offers a very simple way of building GUIs by dragging and droping widgets (ala Visual Basic). Its features are somewhat basic but enough for creating simple GUI apps. Hope it helps... -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Visual Python, really "Visual"?
> You're poorly informed. Komodo, for instance, does indeed offer a GUI > designer for tkinter. You're right. Sorry... I guess I exagerated a little bit :-) I tried Komodo and WingIDE some time ago, but it was just a quick look. I had the impression that they didn't offer much more than other free IDEs, but I'm not one of those who rely on IDEs 40 hours a week... Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Still Loving Python
I just wanted to mention that, according to the latest news from Ironpython's mailing list, an Ironpython plug-in for Visual Studio is on the works. Read on: Aaron Marten wrote: > Hi Giles, > I'm on the Visual Studio SDK team here at Microsoft. In > co-operation with the IronPython team, we're currently working on > integrating IronPython into Visual Studio as a sample to ship in our > SDK. We've just released a CTP with the first version of this here: > > http://affiliate.vsipmembers.com/downloads/41/UserFileDownload.ashx > > I also blogged a bit about the Dec CTP release of the Visual Studio SDK > here: > http://blogs.msdn.com/aaronmar/archive/2005/12/09/502202.aspx > > Note that right now, the integration code is in an incomplete state, but > we do have the beginnings of a project system and language service > working. Note that right now, the integration is only available as a > preview sample in the Visual Studio SDK, so you'll have to agree to our > license to get the code. > > Thanks! > Aaron Marten (Microsoft) -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which Python web framework is most like Ruby on Rails?
As fas as I know, TurboGears is not very different. But it is a project that unifies many different third party components into one integrated package. Its main component is CherryPy, which is a known python web framework. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: What is unique about Python?
Perhaps you should ask yourself why you like Python first, and then you'll probably have an answer. I'd say that Python is all about productivity. You can get more done in less time and with fewer lines of code because it's more consice, flexible and expressive. It's also very clear, easy to write and easy to read. You don't need to compile before running your code, and its interactivity lets you experiment and try different approaches faster and better when writing algorithms. This leads to better results and much faster than with any other traditional language. Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which Python web framework is most like Ruby on Rails?
Sorry for the interruption, but... Has anyone tried KARRIGELL?? I find hard to believe there is any easier python framework than this one. It's incredibly flexible, very fun, very powerful and with an almost flat learning curve. Go check it out (NOW!) http://karrigell.sourceforge.net/ -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Which Python web framework is most like Ruby on Rails?
> Karrigell can also work with . . . all the databases for which a Python > API exists (sqlite, mySql, PostGreSQL, ZODB, etc). Well, that's exactly what makes KARRIGELL so especial. It is very flexible and lets you use whatever database or component you want. It doesn't force you to use an specific package for each task. It doesn't force you either to learn and use any templating language (you don't need it!), although you can do it if you want. The traditional "Hello world" page, can be coded like this: print "Hello World" No boilerplate code, no need to write a class or to fidle with strange configurations. It's simply python! The only problem with KARRIGELL, I guess, is that its creator is very humble and doesn't like to advertise his creature. He is not very fond of "marketing" ... This is too bad because I feel that other frameworks are getting a lot of the attention that Karrigells deserve... Luis -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
