Re: Python evolution: Unease
The Python advocates who claim that Python is well-documented and take exception to when someone say it isn't. Their idea of "it's well-documented" seems to be "if there's parts that you think are poorly documented, feel free to document it". What kind of nonsense is that? I'm not sure which planet you come from but open source is open source for a reason. IMO gratitude is the only thing which can be given back to the contributors of open source projects not "what you've given me for FREE is not good enough, go back and do a better job (and by the way I don't really know how you can do a better job) so I can make money off your free time". I don't even expect this much from software I pay for. Being a python user (not contributer) for the past few years I personally think the Python docs are GREAT. If it's not in the reference, it can be found in the source (again thank god for open source), if it's not in the source you have google, then google groups then ASPN python cookbook. If you're not smart enough to do this, well learn. It'll help you become a better programmer. Anyone who thinks Python docs suck haven't browsed javadocs lately, or MSDN. Software advocacy, which Python has an awful lot of, involves extolling the virtues of a program as it exists in the present. Not as it could potentially exist if someone hypothetically added a bunch of work that hasn't yet been done. Python is good software, but its advocates are making claims that Python itself doesnt live up to. You should be more accurate. Quote "Python is good software, but its advocates are making claims that [you think it] doesnt live up to". I guess everyone is allowed to have their own opinion. And no, I don't feel a responsibility to do the missing work, since I'm not the one making those advocacy claims. Good on ya. Huy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Next step after pychecker
Paul Rubin wrote: Philippe Fremy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: I would like to develop a tool that goes one step further than pychecker to ensure python program validity. The idea would be to get close to what people get on ocaml: a static verification of all types of the program, without any kind of variable declaration. This would definitely brings a lot of power to python. You know, I've always thought that ML-style type inference is an impressive technical feat, but why is it so important to not use declarations? This is an aspect I've never really understood. You know, I think I agree ;-). Just because you don't declare the types, doesn't mean you can change the implicit type willy nilly anyway; at least for more complex programs anyway. In fact, it would be safer to have type checking when you want to do something like this. I currently needed to change a number parameter to a string parameter (found out order_no wasn't just numbers as specs had specified). Of course this parameter was being used in a great many places. Changing it was a bit scary because we had to make sure it wasn't being treated as a number anywhere throughout the code. Yes good coverage with unit tests would have helped but unfortunately we do not yet have good coverage. TDD is a quite hard to practice as a beginner. Cheers, Huy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Big development in the GUI realm
RM wrote: For all you GUI developers, things just got a little more interesting. Trolltech will soon be offering the QT GUI toolkit for Windows under the GPL license. That means that PyQt may become a much more popular option in the near future. Unfortunately, some things available for the commercial customers of Trolltech are not available to the GPL users. For example, from their FAQ, it seems that no precompiled binaries will be provided. Support for comercial compilers will not be built in, only for gcc (through Cygwin?). Isn't this just the same thing with a different spin. There was always an available distribution for linux for non-commercial use. Windows was always the problem. You still can't use it for windows without knowing how to compile the thing on windows. huy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: pre-PEP: Print Without Intervening Space
Marcin Ciura wrote: Duncan Booth wrote: import sys def nospace(value, stream=None): '''Suppress output of space before printing value''' stream = stream or sys.stdout stream.softspace = 0 return str(value) I'm teaching Python as the first programming language to non-computer scientists. Many of the toy programs would be simpler with the double comma syntax. Presently, having a choice whether to teach my students the result += fn(x) way or your way, I would still opt for the former. Best regards, Marcin Since you're teaching python, why not teach the python way instead of inventing a new way. print 'The phone number is (%s) %s' % (extension, number) IMO is by far the superior and clearest way for string concatenation for any purpose eg. printing or assignment. This would mean you are making your students lives easier by showing them one good method of doing string concatenation which can be applied to printing as well. Huy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: Best GUI for small-scale accounting app?
Dave Cook wrote: On 2004-12-20, Paul Rubin wrote: I think I can put together a useable (but not visually stunning) web interface faster than I can put together any pure client-side interface. Web browser "widgets" seem pretty limited to me, though. You don't even have something as simple as a combo box (i.e. an editable entry with a drop down), let alone the rich set of widgets something like wxwidgets offers. Also web development doesn't seem as coherent to me as development with a good GUI framework. I think it depends on your target audience. Many people love simplicity. Many people hate multiple tabs, tree structures, deep nested menus etc etc. If you wanted to make a web program as complex as a rich client program then it's probably a bad idea to do as a web program. But If you wanted to keep it simple, then I'd go with a web program any day. Huy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: PHP vs. Python
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone know which is faster? I'm a PHP programmer but considering getting into Python ... did searches on Google but didn't turn much up on this. Thanks! Stephen Is PHP too slow for your needs ? Is that the reason for changing ? If it is, then Python might not satisfy your need. If it isn't, have you thought about why you want to use Python ? If you have, are there greater benefits in total over PHP from what you understand of both PHP and PYthon. Not sure where you are currently at with your evaluation of Python so if you could outline a few more points on your needs, wants, and expectations it would help when answering your questions about Python. Huy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
apostrophe or double quote?
I've been unable to find information clarifying this but. What is the difference between 'somestring' and "somestring"? When I use type() it still reports as string. If there is a difference could someone point me to documentation or explain when to use and when not to? Hope I sound clear. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Re: apostrophe or double quote?
Thank you for all your help; it makes perfect sense now. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
PyGTK
Hi, I'm new to Python, and GUI development, but am no novice to backend programming. Aside from mastering the standard language, I will eventually be developing applications dealing with images and controls. Thus forth I have been testing out PyGTK & it appears to be quite robust (that and I like the fact of cross-platform compatibility). What I am curious to know is whether anyone has come across any noteworthy gui development platforms. Cross compatibility is not a must, but a bonus. Good documentation and clarity is essential for me. Also, I imagine I can use modules for image manipulation in tandem with the GUI interface? Any comments or speculations are looked forward to. Just thought I'd see if there's anything out there the community knows I may not be currently aware of. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Strange socket problem
Hi,
I'm using cherrypy to provide a user interface for users to start a
linux server program eg. os.system("nohup myserver.py &"). The problem
is that if I stop cherrypy server and restart, I get the "Address
Already In Use" problem until I stop myserver.py. Can someone shed some
light on why this happens ? Why would the socket be held up in the other
process ?
Thanks
Huy
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Re: Strange socket problem
Hi Jeff,
Thanks for your help. Although I haven't confirmed this, I think you
just hit my nail on the head. I thought os.system was like a totally
separate process though, i.e nothing is shared. not the usual fork()
call within the program.
Regards,
Huy
Jeff Epler wrote:
> When using os.system(), files that are open in the parent are available
> in the child, as you can see here in Linux' listing of the files open by
> the child program:
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] jepler]$ python -c 'f = open("/tmp/test", "w"); print
> f.fileno(); import os; os.system("ls -l /proc/self/fd")'
> 3
> total 5
> lrwx-- 1 jepler jepler 64 Jun 15 07:25 0 -> /dev/pts/2
> lrwx-- 1 jepler jepler 64 Jun 15 07:25 1 -> /dev/pts/2
> lrwx-- 1 jepler jepler 64 Jun 15 07:25 2 -> /dev/pts/2
> l-wx-- 1 jepler jepler 64 Jun 15 07:25 3 -> /tmp/test
> lr-x-- 1 jepler jepler 64 Jun 15 07:25 4 -> /proc/3108/fd
>
> You may be able to set the FD_CLOEXEC flag on the files that should not
> be passed to children, something like this:
> old = fcntl.fcntl(fd, fcntl.F_GETFD)
> fcntl.fcntl(fd, fcntl.F_SETFD, old | fcntl.FD_CLOEXEC)
> Refer to a real Unix reference for more information on what FD_CLOEXEC
> does.
>
> You may want to replace the use of os.system() with fork + close files
> + exec. Then "myserver.py" will no longer have the listening socket
> descriptor of your cherrypy server.
>
> Python 2.4's 'subprocess' module may work better in this respect than
> os.system. It seems to include support for requesting that fds be
> closed in the child (the close_fds parameter to subprocess.Popen)
>
> Jeff
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Re: Deviation from object-relational mapping (pySQLFace)
On Oct 12, 11:19 am, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > I have made a simple python module to handle SQL > databases:https://fedorahosted.org/pySQLFace/wiki > Its goal to separate relational database stuff (SQL) from algorythmic > code (python). A SQLFace is a facade initialized with a configuration > file (XML). It provides callable command objects for each sql query. > The call substitutes template variables with its parameters, and > returns the result of the query. > I would like to get some opinions on this approach. > Thanks. Best use of XML for SQL generation/use I have seen is Ibatis SQLMAPS. This focuses on the right things i.e queries and mapping values to/ from objects. It would be great if python had such a tool. Huy -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Uninstall old python version(Python 3.9.7)
I had uninstalled Python 3.9.7 before but it wasn't uninstalled completely. I found it still in my computer and when I click "uninstall", it sent me a board "No Python 3.9 installation was detected". Of course, it won't be an issue if it defaulted my main Python version on my computer and I can't use some libraries I installed like numpy, matplotlib, networkx,... To solve my python homework. I found some help on the internet but it wasn't improved. I don't know how to fix it. Please help me. Thanks and Regards, Cong Huy Sent from [1]Mail for Windows References Visible links 1. https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986 -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
Uninstall old python version(Python 3.9.7)
I uninstalled Python 3.9.7 but I can't delete completely. And I received a notification "no Python 3.9 was detected". Of course, it won't be an issue if it defaulted my python version on my computer and it makes me can't use some libraries I installed before like numpy, matplotlib and network to solve my homework. I don't know how to fix it. Help me, please. Sent from [1]Mail for Windows References Visible links 1. https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986 -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
