Re: Programming Language for Systems Administrator

2005-04-12 Thread Buck Nuggets
>> I also tried SAP-DB before.

>Now known as (or was, last time I checked) "MaxDB by MySQL"

and formerly known as the pre-relational dbms 'Adabas'.  I think the
only reason for its continued existance is that SAP was hoping for a
very low cost, low-end database years ago.  However, the database world
has changed substantially over the last ten years: you can get
postgresql and firebird for nothing, and db2 & oracle are often under
$1000 for a small server.

With that in mind I can't think of a database that's more of a has-been
than maxdb.  Maybe something from the 70s like IMS-DB or Model 204?

buck

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Re: database in python ?

2005-04-12 Thread Buck Nuggets
> In truth, although postgres has more features, MySQL is probably
> better for someone who is just starting to use databases to develop
> for: the chances are higher that anyone using their code will have
> MySQL than Postgres, and they aren't going to need the features
> that Postgresql has that MySQL doesn't.  IMO, this has changed
> since only a year or two ago, when MySQL didn't support foreign-key
> constraints.

mysql does deserve serious consideration now that it supports
transactions.  However, keep in mind:

1.  mysql doesn't support transactions - one of its io layers (innodb)
does.  If you're hoping to get your application hosted you will find
that most mysql installations don't support innodb.  And due to the
bugs in mysql, when you attempt to create a transaction-safe table in
mysql if innodb isn't available it will just silently create it in
myisam, and your transactions will be silently ignored.

2.  mysql is still missing quite a few database basics - views are the
most amazing omission, but the list also includes triggers and stored
procedures as well.  Although most of these features are included in
the new beta, they aren't yet available in production.

3.  mysql has an enormous number of non-standard features such as
comment formatting, how nulls work, concatenation operator, etc.  This
means that you'll learn non-standard sql, and most likely write
non-portable sql.

4.  additionally, mysql has a peculiar set of bugs - in which the
database will change your data and report no exception.  These bugs
were probably a reflection of mysql's marketing message that the
database should do nothing but persist data, and data quality was the
responsibility of the application.  This self-serving message appears
to have been dropped now that they are catching up with other products,
but there's a legacy of cruft that still remains.  Examples of these
errors include:  silent truncation of strings to fit max varchar
length, allows invalid dates, truncation of numeric data to fit max
numeric values, etc.

5.  cost: mysql isn't expensive, but it isn't free either.  Whether or
not you get to use it for free depends on how you interpret their
licensing info and faq.  MySQL's recommendation if you're confused (and
many are) is to license the product or call one of their reps.

Bottomline - mysql has a lot of marketshare, is improving, and I'm sure
that it'll eventually be a credible product.  But right now it's has a
wide range of inexcusable problems.

More info at http://sql-info.de/mysql/gotchas.html

buck

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Re: database in python ?

2005-04-12 Thread Buck Nuggets
> It's not a bug if you didn't RTFM.

Maybe it's not a bug if it's the only DBMS you've ever used and you
actually believe that overriding explicit & critical declaratives is a
valid "design choice".  But it is a bug if it's still only partially
supported in a beta version that nobody is yet hosting.

But maybe this release will actually fix ten years of negligence in one
fell swoop - and all these issues will be easily eliminated.  But just
in case that turns out to be difficult, and there's some reason it has
taken all this time to achive, just wait and see what this guys finds:
   http://sql-info.de/mysql/gotchas.html

BTW, you should upgrade, they're now on 5.0.3.  Their support site
appears to be down right now (timeouts) so I can't check the new bug
list, but since 5.0.2 is beta, it may have introduced more problems
than it solved.

buck

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