Re: Does py2app improves speed?

[Ian Kelly]

On Wed, Nov 23, 2011 at 11:36 PM, Ricardo Mansilla
 wrote:
> Hi everyone..
> My question is exactly as in the subject of This Mail.
> I have made a Python  script which is to slow and i have heard (and common 
> sense also suggest) that if you use some libraries to "frozen" the script the 
> performance improves substantially. So I need to know; is This a myth or it 
> is a fact?
> Thanks in advance for your time.

I would not expect any speedup.  You might see some difference in
loading times, but the actual program being run is still just the
Python interpreter running your script, and that's not going to run
any faster.

I had a coworker who wrapped up one of his applications with py2exe /
pyInstaller on the theory that since his program would be run from a
network share, it would be faster to load a single exe over the
network than a bunch of .pyc files plus the files needed to run the
interpreter.  I can't tell any difference, though.

Cheers,
Ian
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Re: Capturing SIGSTOP

[Chris Angelico]

On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 5:36 PM, Steven D'Aprano
 wrote:
>    os.kill(os.getpid(), signal.SIGSTOP)  # Hit myself with a brick.
>

Sometimes there'll be a raise() function but it's going to do the same
thing. Yep, that would be the way to do it.

ChrisA
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Re: Capturing SIGSTOP

[Chris Angelico]

On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 5:36 PM, Steven D'Aprano
 wrote:
>    os.kill(os.getpid(), signal.SIGSTOP)  # Hit myself with a brick.
>
>
> It seems to work for me (on Linux), but is it the right way?

And - if your system has SIGTSTP, it'll have SIGSTOP and this will be
how it works. (Windows has neither.) This code will probably work fine
on all modern Unix-like systems, but if it fails anywhere, it'll be
for lack of SIGTSTP I would say.

ChrisA
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Re: python shell that saves history of typed in commands that will persist between reboots

[Tim Golden]

On 24/11/2011 06:22, Chris Angelico wrote:

On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 5:11 PM, Steven D'Aprano
  wrote:

One of us is confused, and I'm pretty sure it's you :)

Tim went on to say "Obviously this only applies when an underlying cmd
session persists", which I understood as implying that he too is using
Linux where Ctrl-Z stops the process, but does not exit it.


Entirely possible :) I blithely assumed from the fact that he said
"dir" that it was Windows, but it goes to show what happens when you
assume.


Ahem. Sorry for any confusion caused. The OP was asking about the
situation on Windows, and I was responding in that context. The
Ctrl-Z thing is what *exits* the interpreter on Windows (a la Ctrl-D
on Linux).

In short - on Windows, within one cmd shell you can open and exit
the interpreter as many times as you like and the Python command
history will be retained via the cmd shell's history mechanism,
and kept distinct from the history of other things you may type
into the cmd shell.

If you exit the cmd shell then that history is lost, and I'm not
aware of any mechanism for retaining it.

All this may or may not be of any use to the OP. I was responding
to this comment by Steven:

"The default interactive interpreter for Python doesn't have persistent
history, so if you exit the interpreter and restart it, your commands
are gone."


TJG

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reading optional configuration from a file

[Ulrich Eckhardt]

Hi!

I have a few tests that require a network connection. Typically, the 
target will be localhost on port 2. However, sometimes these 
settings differ, so I want to be able to optionally set them.


What I'm currently doing is this:

try:
from settings import REMOTE_HOST, REMOTE_PORT
except ImportError:
REMOTE_HOST = 'localhost'
REMOTE_PORT = 2

This works fine. However, there are actually a few more settings that 
can be overridden, so I changed the whole thing to this:


try:
from settings import *
if not 'REMOTE_HOST' in locals():
REMOTE_HOST = 'localhost'
if not 'REMOTE_PORT' in locals():
REMOTE_PORT = 2
except ImportError:
REMOTE_HOST = 'localhost'
REMOTE_PORT = 2

Yes, wildcard imports are dangerous, but that's something I don't mind 
actually, this is an internal tool for clueful users. Still, this is 
ugly, since the defaults are stored redundantly, so I went to this variant:


REMOTE_HOST = 'localhost'
REMOTE_PORT = 2
try:
from settings import *
except ImportError:
pass

Now, in order to avoid ambiguities, I thought about using relative 
imports, but there I'm stomped because wildcard imports are not 
supported for relative imports, it seems.



How would you do it? Any other suggestions?

Cheers!

Uli
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suitability of python

[Rudra Banerjee]

Dear friends,
I am a newbie in python and basically i use python for postprocessing
like plotting, data manipulation etc.
Based on ease of programming on python I am wondering if I can consider
it for the main development as well. My jobs (written on fortran) runs
for weeks and quite CPU intensive. How python works on these type of
heavy computation? 
Any comment or reference is welcome.

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Re: suitability of python

[Laurent Claessens]

Le 24/11/2011 13:31, Rudra Banerjee a écrit :

Dear friends,
I am a newbie in python and basically i use python for postprocessing
like plotting, data manipulation etc.
Based on ease of programming on python I am wondering if I can consider
it for the main development as well. My jobs (written on fortran) runs
for weeks and quite CPU intensive. How python works on these type of
heavy computation?
Any comment or reference is welcome.



If you need mathematical power (especially symbolic computations), you 
should also consider Sage[1] which is kind of a module of math over 
python. In some situations, Sage is the "correct" successor of Fortran 
instead of plain python.


Well, it does not answers the question, but ...

Laurent

[1] http://sagemath.org

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Re: suitability of python

[Dave Angel]

On 11/24/2011 07:31 AM, Rudra Banerjee wrote:

Dear friends,
I am a newbie in python and basically i use python for postprocessing
like plotting, data manipulation etc.
Based on ease of programming on python I am wondering if I can consider
it for the main development as well. My jobs (written on fortran) runs
for weeks and quite CPU intensive. How python works on these type of
heavy computation?
Any comment or reference is welcome.

If I take your description at face value, then I'd say that stock 
CPython would be slower than Fortran.  If the CPU-intensive parts had to 
be rewritten in CPython, they'd be slower than the Fortran they replace, 
by somewhere between 10:1 and 500:1.  Further, if you've already got 
those Fortran algorithms written and debugged, why rewrite them?  And 
finally, even for new code, you might be getting ideas for your 
algorithms from journals and other resources, where the examples may 
well be done in Fortran, so productivity might be best in Fortran as well.


HOWEVER, you don't have to use stock CPython, alone.  It could be that 
some of your Fortran algorithms are written in shared libraries, and 
that you could get your CPython code to call them to do the "heavy 
lifting."  Or it could be that numpy, sage, or other 3rd party libraries 
might be usable for your particular problems, and that speed is then 
comparable to Fortran.  Or it could be that one of the alternative 
Python implementations might be fast enough.


Or it could even be that you're mistaken that the present code is even 
CPU intensive.


Or it could be that by the time you recode the problem in Python, you 
discover a more efficient algorithm, and that way gain back all the 
speed you theoretically lost.


There are tools to measure things, though I'm not the one to recommend 
specifics.  And those probably depend on your platform as well.


The last Fortran that I wrote was over 40 years ago.  I'm afraid when I 
need speed, I usually use C++.  But if I were starting a personal 
math-intensive project now, I'd try to prototype it in Python, and only 
move portions of it to Fortran or other compiled language.  Only the 
portions that measurably took too long.  And those portions might be 
rewritten in Cython, C++, or Fortran, depending on what kind of work 
they actually did.


Another alternative that might make sense is to use Python as a "macro 
language" to Fortran, where you call out to Python to automate some 
tasks within the main program.  I have no experience with doing that, 
but I assume it'd be something like how MSWord can call out to VBA 
routines.  And it'd make the most sense when the main app is already 
written, and the macro stuff is an afterthought.


I think the real point is that it doesn't have to be "all or nothing."  
I suspect that the pieces you're already doing in Python are calling out 
to pre-existing libraries as well.  So your plotting code does some 
massaging, and then calls into some plotting library, or even execs a 
plotting executable.


--

DaveA

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Re: Does py2app improves speed?

[Ricardo Mansilla]

Well, that's sad... I think Im gonna end getting back to C++ for This.  But 
anyway, thanks a lot for the quick answer... 
Bye.
-- 
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Re: Does py2app improves speed?

[Dave Angel]

On 11/24/2011 08:26 AM, Ricardo Mansilla wrote:

Well, that's sad... I think Im gonna end getting back to C++ for This.  But 
anyway, thanks a lot for the quick answer...
Bye.
Just because Py2app doesn't improve speed doesn't mean there aren't 
other ways to gain speed, while still using the Python language for all 
or most of the app. There have been lots of threads on the topic.


--

DaveA

--
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Re: Does py2app improves speed?

[Ricardo Mansilla]

Most of méthods for improving the speed are related to efficient memory 
management and using specific structures for a specific tasks... But i have 
already optimized my code (which is very short actually) following all these 
rules and it is very slow yet. 
Do you think there is another way to do This? Probably i'm missing something 
here...

On 24/11/2011, at 07:38, Dave Angel  wrote:

> On 11/24/2011 08:26 AM, Ricardo Mansilla wrote:
>> Well, that's sad... I think Im gonna end getting back to C++ for This.  But 
>> anyway, thanks a lot for the quick answer...
>> Bye.
> Just because Py2app doesn't improve speed doesn't mean there aren't other 
> ways to gain speed, while still using the Python language for all or most of 
> the app. There have been lots of threads on the topic.
> 
> -- 
> 
> DaveA
> 
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Re: Does py2app improves speed?

[Matt Joiner]

Yes. Try posting your code.

On Fri, Nov 25, 2011 at 1:02 AM, Ricardo Mansilla
 wrote:
> Most of méthods for improving the speed are related to efficient memory 
> management and using specific structures for a specific tasks... But i have 
> already optimized my code (which is very short actually) following all these 
> rules and it is very slow yet.
> Do you think there is another way to do This? Probably i'm missing something 
> here...
>
> On 24/11/2011, at 07:38, Dave Angel  wrote:
>
>> On 11/24/2011 08:26 AM, Ricardo Mansilla wrote:
>>> Well, that's sad... I think Im gonna end getting back to C++ for This.  But 
>>> anyway, thanks a lot for the quick answer...
>>> Bye.
>> Just because Py2app doesn't improve speed doesn't mean there aren't other 
>> ways to gain speed, while still using the Python language for all or most of 
>> the app. There have been lots of threads on the topic.
>>
>> --
>>
>> DaveA
>>
> --
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
>
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Re: python shell that saves history of typed in commands that will persist between reboots

[Ulrich Eckhardt]

Am 17.11.2011 00:59, schrieb Ben Finney:

David Robinow  writes:

but your code works fine on Windows. Thanks.


I'm glad to know that. Perhaps you could investigate why, and suggest an
update to the above documentation if it's wrong? The bug tracker at
http://bugs.python.org/>  would be the appropriate place for such a
suggestion.


Interestingly, on MS Windows (XP here), every commandline program 
inherits the history functionality (browsing with cursor up/down) from 
the shell it runs in. That means the program itself doesn't have to 
supply any of that, but also that it can't customize any of that...


The history is not persistent though, it is restricted to that shell. 
Still, this might explain why it never bothered anyone enough to fix 
things properly. ;)


Uli
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Re: reading optional configuration from a file

[Matt Joiner]

    REMOTE_HOST = 'localhost'    REMOTE_PORT = 2    try:
from .settings import *    except ImportError:        pass
This works? If you're using an old version of Python you may need to
mess about with __future__.

On Thu, Nov 24, 2011 at 10:56 PM, Ulrich Eckhardt
 wrote:
> Hi!
>
> I have a few tests that require a network connection. Typically, the target
> will be localhost on port 2. However, sometimes these settings differ,
> so I want to be able to optionally set them.
>
> What I'm currently doing is this:
>
>    try:
>        from settings import REMOTE_HOST, REMOTE_PORT
>    except ImportError:
>        REMOTE_HOST = 'localhost'
>        REMOTE_PORT = 2
>
> This works fine. However, there are actually a few more settings that can be
> overridden, so I changed the whole thing to this:
>
>    try:
>        from settings import *
>        if not 'REMOTE_HOST' in locals():
>            REMOTE_HOST = 'localhost'
>        if not 'REMOTE_PORT' in locals():
>            REMOTE_PORT = 2
>    except ImportError:
>        REMOTE_HOST = 'localhost'
>        REMOTE_PORT = 2
>
> Yes, wildcard imports are dangerous, but that's something I don't mind
> actually, this is an internal tool for clueful users. Still, this is ugly,
> since the defaults are stored redundantly, so I went to this variant:
>
>    REMOTE_HOST = 'localhost'
>    REMOTE_PORT = 2
>    try:
>        from settings import *
>    except ImportError:
>        pass
>
> Now, in order to avoid ambiguities, I thought about using relative imports,
> but there I'm stomped because wildcard imports are not supported for
> relative imports, it seems.
>
>
> How would you do it? Any other suggestions?
>
> Cheers!
>
> Uli
> --
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
>
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Re: Does py2app improves speed?

[Dave Angel]

On 11/24/2011 09:02 AM, Ricardo Mansilla wrote:

Most of méthods for improving the speed are related to efficient memory 
management and using specific structures for a specific tasks... But i have 
already optimized my code (which is very short actually) following all these 
rules and it is very slow yet.
Do you think there is another way to do This? Probably i'm missing something 
here...

On 24/11/2011, at 07:38, Dave Angel  wrote:


On 11/24/2011 08:26 AM, Ricardo Mansilla wrote:

Well, that's sad... I think Im gonna end getting back to C++ for This.  But 
anyway, thanks a lot for the quick answer...
Bye.

Just because Py2app doesn't improve speed doesn't mean there aren't other ways 
to gain speed, while still using the Python language for all or most of the 
app. There have been lots of threads on the topic.

--

DaveA



(Please don't top-post.  If you put your comments ahead of the part 
you're quoting, you confuse us)


Several ways to speed up code.

1) use language features to best advantage
2) use 3rd party libraries that do certain things well
3) use best algorithms, subject to #1 and #2
4) have someone else review the code (perhaps on the list, perhaps 
within your own organization)

5) measure  (eg. profile it)
6) use optimizing tools, such as pypy or Cython.
7) rewrite parts of it in another language
8) get a faster processor
9) rewrite it all in another language

It takes experience to choose between these, and each project is 
different.  But even the most experienced developers will frequently 
guess entirely wrong where the bottleneck is, which is why you measure 
if you care.



--

DaveA
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WAVE file writing, confused about setsampwidth(n)

[Alex van der Spek]

I am confused about the Wave_write object setsampwidth(n).

Is the sample width n the total sample width, i.e. for a stereo sample 
consisting of short (2 byte) integers; n=4 or is the sample width the number 
of bytes in either the left or the right channel?


Regards,
Alex van der Spek 


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DTrace probes in Python 2.7 (and next 3.3)

[Jesus Cea]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hi all.

I have spend some time trying to integrate DTrace probes in official
Python: Currently I have a patch to python 2.7, and my plan in to
integrate officially in 3.3.

The initial probes were based on previous work from OpenSolaris, and
similar, but currently I have quite a few more probes. Current details
in


The probes are tested under Solaris 10 x86 and x86-64. I would need
somebody to try on Solaris 10 Sparc (32 and 64 bits), Solaris 11,
OpenIndiana, FreeBSD (seems to need a kernel recompilation to enable
user mode tracing, check Google), Mac (I doubt it works as is), etc.,
any other platform running DTrace. What about SystemTap compatibility?

Details: 

How to check: .

The easier way to get the patch is to clone my repository at
 (with mercurial) and move to the
branch "dtrace-issue13405_2.7". Keep the clone around if you plan to
try future versions of this patch, including the future 3.3 version.

You can manually apply the patch in
 to python 2.7.2+
sourcecode. The patch is developed against version 3c3009f63700
(2011-11-14). It might not apply cleanly to 2.7.2 sourcecode (not
checked). I will provide a direct patch to 2.7.3 when available. Maybe
to 2.7.2 if there is demand.

This is still work in progress. I will improve support with your
feedback. I am considering probes to monitor GIL and thinking how to
monitor C function calls from Python in an easy and fast way. Feedback
very welcomed.

Please, if you care about this, test it and provide some feedback :).

PS: Better post feedback in the bug tracker that by personal email :-).

- -- 
Jesus Cea Avion _/_/  _/_/_/_/_/_/
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jabber / xmpp:j...@jabber.org _/_/_/_/  _/_/_/_/_/
.  _/_/  _/_/_/_/  _/_/  _/_/
"Things are not so easy"  _/_/  _/_/_/_/  _/_/_/_/  _/_/
"My name is Dump, Core Dump"   _/_/_/_/_/_/  _/_/  _/_/
"El amor es poner tu felicidad en la felicidad de otro" - Leibniz
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jc5616IRnHxGAxxuoTscCRRN88zsPVY6i71QMxK2BOS+zXMdcrsBajLrmx1UIzHY
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Re: Tree data structure with: single, double and triple children option along with AVM data at each node

[Miki Tebeka]

There a many ways to do this, here's one:

from collections import namedtuple
Tree = namedtuple('Tree', ['feature', 'children'])
t = Tree(1, [Tree('hello', []), Tree(3, [])])
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YOU MUST KNOW THIS MAN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[BV]

In The Name Of Allah,
Most Gracious, Most Merciful
YOU MUST KNOW THIS MAN
MUHAMMAD

You may be an atheist or an agnostic; or you may belong to anyone of
the religious denominations that exist in the world today. You may be
a Communist or a believer in democracy and freedom. No matter what you
are, and no matter what your religious and political beliefs, personal
and social habits happen to be - YOU MUST STILL KNOW THIS MAN!
He was by far the most remarkable man that ever set foot on this
earth. He preached a religion, founded a state, built a nation, laid
down a moral code, initiated numberless social and political reforms,
established a dynamic and powerful society to practice and represent
his teachings, and completely revolutionized the worlds of human
thought and action for all times to come.
HIS NAME IS MUHAMMAD, peace and blessings of Almighty God be upon him
and he accomplished all these wonders in the unbelievably short span
of twenty-three years.
Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him was born in
Arabia on the 20th of August, in the year 570 of the Christian era,
and when he died after 63 years, the whole of the Arabian Peninsula
had changed from paganism and idol-worship to the worship of One God;
from tribal quarrels and wars to national solidarity and cohesion;
from drunkenness and debauchery to sobriety and piety; from
lawlessness and anarchy to disciplined living; from utter moral
bankruptcy to the highest standards of moral excellence. Human history
has never known such a complete transformation of a people or a place
before or since!
The Encyclopedia Britannica calls him "the most successful of all
religious personalities of the world". Bernard Shaw said about him
that if Muhammad were alive today he would succeed in solving all
those problems which threaten to destroy human civilization in our
times. Thomas Carlysle was simply amazed as to how one man, single-
handedly, could weld warring tribes and wandering Bedouins into a most
powerful and civilized nation in less than two decades. Napoleon and
Gandhi never tired of dreaming of a society along the lines
established by this man in Arabia fourteen centuries ago.
Indeed no other human being ever accomplished so much, in such diverse
fields of human thought and behavior, in so limited a space of time,
as did Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him. He
was a religious teacher, a social reformer, a moral guide, a political
thinker, a military genius, an administrative colossus, a faithful
friend, a wonderful companion, a devoted husband, a loving father -
all in one. No other man in history ever excelled or equaled him in
any of these difficult departments of life.
The world has had its share of great personalities. But these were one
sided figures who distinguished themselves in but one or two fields
such as religious thought or military leadership. None of the other
great leaders of the world ever combined in himself so many different
qualities to such an amazing level of perfection as did Muhammad,
peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon him.
The lives and teachings of other great personalities of the world are
shrouded in the mist of time. There is so much speculation about the
time and the place of their birth, the mode and style of their life,
the nature and detail of their teachings and the degree and measure of
their success or failure that it is impossible for humanity today to
reconstruct accurately and precisely the lives and teachings of those
men.
Not so this man Muhammad, peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon
him. Not only was he born in the fullest blaze of recorded history,
but every detail of his private and public life, of his actions and
utterances, has been accurately documented and faithfully preserved to
our day. The authenticity of the information so preserved is vouched
for not only by faithful followers but also by unbiased critics and
open-minded scholars.
At the level of ideas there is no system of thought and belief-secular
or religious, social or political-which could surpass or equal ISLAM-
the system which Muhammad peace and blessings of God Almighty be upon
him propounded. In a fast changing world, while other systems have
undergone profound transformations, Islam alone has remained above all
change and mutation, and retained its original form for the past 1400
years. What is more, the positive changes that are taking place in the
world of human thought and behavior, truly and consistently reflect
the healthy influence of Islam in these areas. Further, it is not
given to the best of thinkers to put their ideas completely into
practice, and to see the seeds of their labors grow and bear fruit, in
their own lifetime. Except of course, Muhammad, peace and blessings of
God Almighty be upon him, who not only preached the most wonderful
ideas but also successfully translated each one of them into practice
in his own lifetime. At the time of his death his teachings were n

Re: [oi-dev] DTrace probes in Python 2.7 (and next 3.3)

[Andrzej Szeszo]

Hi Jesus

Just noticed that there is a python 2.7 package in Oracle's userland 
repo here:




It includes DTrace patch. Did you see/use that?

Andrzej

On 24/11/2011 16:46, Jesus Cea wrote:

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Hi all.

I have spend some time trying to integrate DTrace probes in official
Python: Currently I have a patch to python 2.7, and my plan in to
integrate officially in 3.3.

The initial probes were based on previous work from OpenSolaris, and
similar, but currently I have quite a few more probes. Current details
in


The probes are tested under Solaris 10 x86 and x86-64. I would need
somebody to try on Solaris 10 Sparc (32 and 64 bits), Solaris 11,
OpenIndiana, FreeBSD (seems to need a kernel recompilation to enable
user mode tracing, check Google), Mac (I doubt it works as is), etc.,
any other platform running DTrace. What about SystemTap compatibility?

Details:

How to check:.

The easier way to get the patch is to clone my repository at
  (with mercurial) and move to the
branch "dtrace-issue13405_2.7". Keep the clone around if you plan to
try future versions of this patch, including the future 3.3 version.

You can manually apply the patch in
  to python 2.7.2+
sourcecode. The patch is developed against version 3c3009f63700
(2011-11-14). It might not apply cleanly to 2.7.2 sourcecode (not
checked). I will provide a direct patch to 2.7.3 when available. Maybe
to 2.7.2 if there is demand.

This is still work in progress. I will improve support with your
feedback. I am considering probes to monitor GIL and thinking how to
monitor C function calls from Python in an easy and fast way. Feedback
very welcomed.

Please, if you care about this, test it and provide some feedback :).

PS: Better post feedback in the bug tracker that by personal email :-).

- -- 
Jesus Cea Avion _/_/  _/_/_/_/_/_/

j...@jcea.es - http://www.jcea.es/ _/_/_/_/  _/_/_/_/  _/_/
jabber / xmpp:j...@jabber.org _/_/_/_/  _/_/_/_/_/
.  _/_/  _/_/_/_/  _/_/  _/_/
"Things are not so easy"  _/_/  _/_/_/_/  _/_/_/_/  _/_/
"My name is Dump, Core Dump"   _/_/_/_/_/_/  _/_/  _/_/
"El amor es poner tu felicidad en la felicidad de otro" - Leibniz
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux)
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Re: What I do and do not know about installing Python on Win 7 with regard to IDLE.

[W. eWatson]

On 11/23/2011 2:29 PM, Alan Meyer wrote:

On 11/23/2011 12:38 PM, W. eWatson wrote:

So unless Alan Meyer has further interest in this, it looks like it's at
an end.

It may be time to move on to c++.



C++ is a ton of fun. You haven't lived until you've made a syntax error
in a template instantiation and seen a hundred cascading error messages
from included files that you didn't know you included.

Unlike Python, it really builds character.

I say, go for it!

Alan
So posting the results of the adventure you put me on has no further way 
to proceed?

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Re: What I do and do not know about installing Python on Win 7 with regard to IDLE.

[W. eWatson]

Whoops, I thought I was replying to Matt Meyers just above you. However, 
I think he chimed in above about ActiveState back on the 22nd.


In any case, I think this thread has ceased to be productive.

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Re: What I do and do not know about installing Python on Win 7 with regard to IDLE.

[W. eWatson]

On 11/23/2011 10:29 AM, Arnaud Delobelle wrote:

On 23 November 2011 17:38, W. eWatson  wrote:
[...]

It may be time to move on to c++.


Good Luck.  Bye!


"We, pardn meee." -- Steve Martin
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Re: Does py2app improves speed?

[Dominic Binks]

On 11/23/2011 10:36 PM, Ricardo Mansilla wrote:

Hi everyone..
My question is exactly as in the subject of This Mail.
I have made a Python  script which is to slow and i have heard (and common sense also 
suggest) that if you use some libraries to "frozen" the script the performance 
improves substantially. So I need to know; is This a myth or it is a fact?
Thanks in advance for your time.


Depending on the code you have pypy may be faster - I've seen it both 
significantly faster and about the same as CPython.


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Re: reading optional configuration from a file

[Ben Finney]

Ulrich Eckhardt  writes:

> I have a few tests that require a network connection. Typically, the
> target will be localhost on port 2. However, sometimes these
> settings differ, so I want to be able to optionally set them.

I subscribe to the view that an application's user-configurable settings
should be data, not executable code.

For this purpose, you will want to investigate the Python standard
library modules ‘json’ http://docs.python.org/library/json> and
‘configparser’ http://docs.python.org/library/configparser>.

-- 
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Re: What I do and do not know about installing Python on Win 7 with regard to IDLE.

[Alexander Kapps]

On 24.11.2011 22:22, W. eWatson wrote:

Whoops, I thought I was replying to Matt Meyers just above you.


Above who? As said by somebody already, most people use a 
mail-client (Thunderbird/Outlook) or a Usenet client to read this 
forum. Google Groups is (In My Opinion at least) just crap (and 
should be blocked/forbidden. It's *the* one spam sender already)

Please always post enough context,

Now, we are talking about Python 3.2.* on Win7, correct? I only have 
Win7 32bit in a VBox VM, but still.


Please paste the following into a "python.reg", file, then 
right-click on that file and choose the fist option (the one wihch 
is in bold font, something like install/insert/insert or however 
it's called in your language. In my German versin it's called 
"Zusammenführen")


Do you get an "Edit with IDLE" then?




Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00

[HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Python.File]
@="Python File"

[HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Python.File\DefaultIcon]
@="C:\\Python32\\DLLs\\py.ico"

[HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Python.File\shell]

[HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Python.File\shell\Edit with IDLE]

[HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Python.File\shell\Edit with IDLE\command]
@="\"C:\\Python32\\pythonw.exe\" 
\"C:\\Python32\\Lib\\idlelib\\idle.pyw\" -e \"%1\""


[HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Python.File\shell\open]

[HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\Python.File\shell\open\command]
@="\"C:\\Python32\\python.exe\" \"%1\" %*"


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Re: What I do and do not know about installing Python on Win 7 with regard to IDLE.

[Alexander Kapps]

On 25.11.2011 00:18, Alexander Kapps wrote:


Do you get an "Edit with IDLE" then?


And even if not. Why are you so obsessive about IDLE? I mean, 
seriously, IDLE is just a bare-level if-nothing-else-is-available 
editor/IDE. It's better than notepad, OK.


I really don't buy it, that your are willing to move to C++ (or even 
just change the language) just because the default editor is not 
available in the context menu.

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Re: [oi-dev] DTrace probes in Python 2.7 (and next 3.3)

[Jesus Cea]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 24/11/11 19:49, Andrzej Szeszo wrote:
> Hi Jesus
> 
> Just noticed that there is a python 2.7 package in Oracle's
> userland repo here:
> 
> 
>
> 
> 
> It includes DTrace patch. Did you see/use that?

That was my starting point.

Talking about that... How is the license going?. Mailing the guy...

- -- 
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Re: What I do and do not know about installing Python on Win 7 with regard to IDLE.

[Steven D'Aprano]

On Thu, 24 Nov 2011 17:25:23 -0600, Tony the Tiger wrote:

> On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 17:43:20 -0800, Dennis Lee Bieber wrote:
> 
>> Windows PowerShell includes more than one hundred basic core cmdlets,
>> and you can write your own cmdlets and share them with other users.
> 
> Oh, goodie! They've found yet another way to infect a Windows system. :)

My Linux system includes compilers or interpreters for C, Pascal, 
Haskell, Forth, Python, Ruby, PHP, Javascript, Java, bash, csh, zsh, sh, 
awk, sed, Perl, SQL, Tcl, Tk, OpenXion, and very likely others. Most of 
these were supplied by the vendor. I could write my own executable code, 
"cmdlets" if you will, in any of these languages, and share them with 
others.

So by your reasoning, that's at least 20 ways to infect my Linux system. 
I never realised just how insecure Linux must be!

If "sharing code" is considered to be synonymous with "infection", what 
does that say about the Free and Open Source Software movement?



Linux-users-aren't-the-only-people-allowed-to-write-shell-scripts-ly y'rs,


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Re: What I do and do not know about installing Python on Win 7 with regard to IDLE.

[Steven D'Aprano]

On Fri, 25 Nov 2011 00:18:44 +0100, Alexander Kapps wrote:

> Now, we are talking about Python 3.2.* on Win7, correct? I only have
> Win7 32bit in a VBox VM, but still.

I believe that W. eWatson's problems occurred when he installed a 32-bit 
version of Python 3.2 on a 64-bit version of Windows 7. Either the 32-bit 
installer doesn't set the default file associations correctly on 64-bit 
systems, or W. eWatson has mangled his registry by making arbitrary 
changes to file associations, and now even the correct 64-bit installer 
can't set the associations correctly.

As far as I can tell, nobody running the 64-bit version of Windows 7 has 
chimed in to either confirm or refute W. eWatson's claim that IDLE 
doesn't show up, so we have no way of telling whether it doesn't show up 
due to a lack in the installer, or because eWatson has (slightly) broken 
his system and has inadvertently prevented it from showing up.

Fixing the associations is a Windows issue, not a Python issue. Even if 
it turns out that the installer does neglect to set up menu commands for 
IDLE (which should be reported as a feature request on the bug tracker), 
this is not a problem best solved here, although we can do our best. It 
would be best solved on a Window forum, where experts on Windows can give 
advice.


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Steven
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Re: What I do and do not know about installing Python on Win 7 with regard to IDLE.

[Alexander Kapps]

On 25.11.2011 01:04, Steven D'Aprano wrote:


So by your reasoning, that's at least 20 ways to infect my Linux system.
I never realised just how insecure Linux must be!


Yes, there are 20+ ways to "infect" your (and mine) Linux system. 
You cannot trust *any* kind of 3rd party code. Period.


Have you ever added a 3rd party repo (PPA or such). Have you ever 
added some Firefox addon or installed some 3rd-party addition (of 
any kind) to some program)


Where is the protection now?

The main difference here is, that Linux makes it easy to seperate 
administrative accounts from end-user accounts,


The custom addon/cmdlet/whatever I give you has the same dangers on 
Linux as on windows. If you blindly install it, you're owned!



If "sharing code" is considered to be synonymous with "infection", what
does that say about the Free and Open Source Software movement?


Completely besides the topic. It's not about "sharing code", but 
about the seperation between normal and administrative user on the 
OS level (which Windows still doesn't have by default).



Linux-users-aren't-the-only-people-allowed-to-write-shell-scripts-ly y'rs,


But-Linux-Users-aren't-root-by-default-ly y'rs.

:)
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Re: suitability of python

[Terry Reedy]

On 11/24/2011 7:31 AM, Rudra Banerjee wrote:

Dear friends,
I am a newbie in python and basically i use python for postprocessing
like plotting, data manipulation etc.
Based on ease of programming on python I am wondering if I can consider
it for the main development as well. My jobs (written on fortran) runs
for weeks and quite CPU intensive. How python works on these type of
heavy computation?


The first killer app for Python was running Fortran code from within 
Python. People use Python for both pre- and post-processing. For small 
jobs, this enabled running Fortran interactively.


This lead to Numerical Python, now Numpy, SciPy, and later Sage and 
other scientific and Python packages. I believe SciPy has an f2py 
(fortran to py) module to help with running Fortran under Python (but it 
has been years since I read the details).


Detailed questions might get better answers on, for instance, a scipy list.

--
Terry Jan Reedy

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Re: What I do and do not know about installing Python on Win 7 with regard to IDLE.

[Terry Reedy]

On 11/24/2011 7:16 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:


As far as I can tell, nobody running the 64-bit version of Windows 7 has
chimed in to either confirm or refute W. eWatson's claim that IDLE
doesn't show up,


On the contrary, back when he first posted, I stated that 64-bit Python 
3.2.2 on my 64-bit Windows 7 works fine, just as he wants it to.



so we have no way of telling whether it doesn't show up
due to a lack in the installer, or because eWatson has (slightly) broken
his system and has inadvertently prevented it from showing up.


I also noted that I had slightly screwed up my previous machine, and the 
installers never fixed up the deviation. So I gave him a better 
alternative that I use. He has ignored that and most everything else I 
posted.


When he later revealed that IDLE does not run by any means, that he 
should fix *that* before worrying about right-clicks.



Fixing the associations is a Windows issue, not a Python issue. Even if
it turns out that the installer does neglect to set up menu commands for
IDLE (which should be reported as a feature request on the bug tracker),


The installer for each version has been setting up commands for IDLE for 
perhaps a decade or more.


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Terry Jan Reedy

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Return of an old friend

[Rick Johnson]

Hello Fellow Pythonistas,

I am very glad to be back after an unfortunate incident caused my
Google account to be deleted. Unfortunately for those of you that have
been following along and supporting my crusade to bring fairness and
humility to the python community, my old posts under "rantingrick"
have all been deleted from Google Groups. However, you can always
search the python-list archives if you need a jog down memory lane.

Actually this accidental deletion may have been a good thing as i've
had some extra time to muse on the innards of Python4000.

In any event, this announcement is intended to be a new call to arms
for my brothers and sisters who fight the good fight, and for those of
you who despise me , well, this might be a good time to add my new
moniker to your kill files.

Thanks, and happy Thanksgiving everyone!
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memory leaks - tools and docs

[Aljosa Mohorovic]

i've been trying to find memory leaks in a wsgi application using
gunicorn to run it and after a lot of time invested in research and
testing tools i did find a lot of useful information (most really old)
but i'm left with a feeling that this should be easier, better
documented and with tools that generate better data.

if anybody can share some tips, links, docs or better tools with
better reports i would really appreciate it.
i'm not against paying for a good tool so any recommendation is
appreciated.

i mostly used http://guppy-pe.sourceforge.net/#Heapy but found
http://pysizer.8325.org/ and http://code.google.com/p/pympler/ also
interesting.

Aljosa
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Re: memory leaks - tools and docs

[Mike C. Fletcher]

On 11-11-24 10:00 PM, Aljosa Mohorovic wrote:
> i've been trying to find memory leaks in a wsgi application using
> gunicorn to run it and after a lot of time invested in research and
> testing tools i did find a lot of useful information (most really old)
> but i'm left with a feeling that this should be easier, better
> documented and with tools that generate better data.
>
> if anybody can share some tips, links, docs or better tools with
> better reports i would really appreciate it.
> i'm not against paying for a good tool so any recommendation is
> appreciated.
>
> i mostly used http://guppy-pe.sourceforge.net/#Heapy but found
> http://pysizer.8325.org/ and http://code.google.com/p/pympler/ also
> interesting.
>
> Aljosa
Meliae is a similar tool wrt collecting memory-usage information.

RunSnakeRun can process Meliae dumps to produce visualizations of the
memory used in the process.

HTH,
Mike

https://launchpad.net/meliae
http://www.vrplumber.com/programming/runsnakerun/

-- 

  Mike C. Fletcher
  Designer, VR Plumber, Coder
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  http://blog.vrplumber.com

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Re: suitability of python

[88888 Dihedral]

On Friday, November 25, 2011 8:51:10 AM UTC+8, Terry Reedy wrote:
> On 11/24/2011 7:31 AM, Rudra Banerjee wrote:
> > Dear friends,
> > I am a newbie in python and basically i use python for postprocessing
> > like plotting, data manipulation etc.
> > Based on ease of programming on python I am wondering if I can consider
> > it for the main development as well. My jobs (written on fortran) runs
> > for weeks and quite CPU intensive. How python works on these type of
> > heavy computation?
> 
> The first killer app for Python was running Fortran code from within 
> Python. People use Python for both pre- and post-processing. For small 
> jobs, this enabled running Fortran interactively.
> 
> This lead to Numerical Python, now Numpy, SciPy, and later Sage and 
> other scientific and Python packages. I believe SciPy has an f2py 
> (fortran to py) module to help with running Fortran under Python (but it 
> has been years since I read the details).
> 
> Detailed questions might get better answers on, for instance, a scipy list.
> 
> -- 
> Terry Jan Reedy

If pyhthon just handles the user interface and glue logics of well written 
python modules that are most written c, the speed of running python pyc  is OK. 
  
Of course the object reference updating required  in OOP is completely 
supported by python. 



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Re: suitability of python

[alex23]

Terry Reedy  wrote:
> This lead to Numerical Python, now Numpy, SciPy, and later Sage and
> other scientific and Python packages. I believe SciPy has an f2py
> (fortran to py) module to help with running Fortran under Python (but it
> has been years since I read the details).

Andrew Dalke recently did some work on f2pypy, as a step toward
running Fortran under PyPy:

http://www.dalkescientific.com/writings/diary/archive/2011/11/09/f2pypy.html

If PyPy's Numpy support was more advanced, I'd probably recommend the
OP start there.
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Re: python shell that saves history of typed in commands that will persist between reboots

[alex23]

On Nov 24, 6:51 pm, Tim Golden  wrote:
> The
> Ctrl-Z thing is what *exits* the interpreter on Windows (a la Ctrl-D
> on Linux).

With ActivePython, Ctrl-D works as well, which is a godsend as I'm
constantly working across Windows & linux.

> In short - on Windows, within one cmd shell you can open and exit
> the interpreter as many times as you like and the Python command
> history will be retained via the cmd shell's history mechanism,
> and kept distinct from the history of other things you may type
> into the cmd shell.

And again, I'm definitely not seeing this. Inside the one cmd shell,
each instance of Python has no recollection of the history of the last.
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Re: python shell that saves history of typed in commands that will persist between reboots

[alex23]

Tim Golden  wrote:
> The interpreter inherits the command shell's history function:
> Open a cmd window and then a Python session. Do some stuff.
>
> Ctrl-Z to exit to the surrounding cmd window.
> Do some random cmd stuff: dir, cd, etc.
>
> Start a second Python session. up-arrow etc. will bring back
> the previous Python session's commands (and not the ones you
> entered in the surrounding shell)

This isn't true, at least not for ActivePython 2.7.2.5 under Windows
7-64. The second session has no history whatsoever.
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Re: memory leaks - tools and docs

[Christian Heimes]

Am 25.11.2011 04:00, schrieb Aljosa Mohorovic:
> i mostly used http://guppy-pe.sourceforge.net/#Heapy but found
> http://pysizer.8325.org/ and http://code.google.com/p/pympler/ also
> interesting.

Guppy is a extremely powerful tool because it can also track non GC
objects without a debug build of Python. I only wished it would have a
user friendly and easy to script interface. The _.more thing is killing
me. :(

I'm using a very simple and almost for free approach to keep track of
memory usage with psutil. After every unit test case I store RSS and VM
size with psutil.Process(os.getpid()).get_memory_info(),
threading.active_count(), len(gc.garbage) and len(gc.get_objects()). It
doesn't show what's going wrong, but it helps me to isolate the code
paths, that may introduce memory leaks and reference cycles. Since we
use continuous integration (Jenkins) I can track down regressions more
easily, too.

Christian

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Re: suitability of python

[Alan Meyer]

On 11/24/2011 07:31 AM, Rudra Banerjee wrote:

Dear friends,
I am a newbie in python and basically i use python for postprocessing
like plotting, data manipulation etc.
Based on ease of programming on python I am wondering if I can consider
it for the main development as well. My jobs (written on fortran) runs
for weeks and quite CPU intensive. How python works on these type of
heavy computation?
Any comment or reference is welcome.



I would expect that a language that compiles intensive math programming 
to machine language will be much more than an order of magnitude faster 
than a program that does the same thing by interpreting byte code.


If you study all of the Python math libraries I'm guessing you'll find 
modules that do a lot, conceivably all, of what you want in compiled 
machine language, but when held together with Python it may or may not 
be as efficient as fortran.  I'm guessing there's not much out there 
that is as efficient as fortran for purely numerical work.


I think your division of labor using fortran for the CPU intensive math 
parts and python for post-processing is a pretty good one.  It takes 
advantage of the strength of each language.  In addition, it completely 
separates the two parts so that they aren't really dependent on each 
other.  You can change the fortran any way you want without breaking the 
python code as long as you output the same format, and of course you can 
change the python any way you want. Programs in each language don't even 
have to know that any other language is involved.


My only suggestion is to see if you can get a profiler to see what's 
happening inside that weeks long running fortran program.  You might 
find some surprises.  I once wrote a 5,000 line program that was slower 
than I had hoped.  I ran it through a profiler and it showed me that I 
was spending more than 50 percent of my time on one single line of my 
code that called a simple library routine ("strcpy").  I wrote the 
simple library routine inline instead adding just a few lines of code. 
It cut the total execution time of the whole program in half.


Alan
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Re: What I do and do not know about installing Python on Win 7 with regard to IDLE.

[Steven D'Aprano]

On Thu, 24 Nov 2011 20:06:24 -0500, Terry Reedy wrote:

> On 11/24/2011 7:16 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> 
>> As far as I can tell, nobody running the 64-bit version of Windows 7
>> has chimed in to either confirm or refute W. eWatson's claim that IDLE
>> doesn't show up,
> 
> On the contrary, back when he first posted, I stated that 64-bit Python
> 3.2.2 on my 64-bit Windows 7 works fine, just as he wants it to.

Ah, sorry about that Terry! This thread, or multiple threads, is long and 
confusing and I obviously haven't been able to keep track of who said 
what.



-- 
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Re: Return of an old friend

[Matt Joiner]

I haven't heard of you before, but feel like I've missed out on something.

Do you (or someone else) care to link to some of your more contentious work?

On Fri, Nov 25, 2011 at 1:19 PM, Rick Johnson
 wrote:
> Hello Fellow Pythonistas,
>
> I am very glad to be back after an unfortunate incident caused my
> Google account to be deleted. Unfortunately for those of you that have
> been following along and supporting my crusade to bring fairness and
> humility to the python community, my old posts under "rantingrick"
> have all been deleted from Google Groups. However, you can always
> search the python-list archives if you need a jog down memory lane.
>
> Actually this accidental deletion may have been a good thing as i've
> had some extra time to muse on the innards of Python4000.
>
> In any event, this announcement is intended to be a new call to arms
> for my brothers and sisters who fight the good fight, and for those of
> you who despise me , well, this might be a good time to add my new
> moniker to your kill files.
>
> Thanks, and happy Thanksgiving everyone!
> --
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
>
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online form filling jobs

[brisk brisk]

online form filling jobs
http://onlinejobsprocess.weebly.com/
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Strange result ffor object to bool

[ZhouPeng]

Hi all,

In my program, I get a listen element by
listen = graphics.find("listen")

print listen is 
print type listen is 
I am sure listen is not None and can be accessed properly.

But print bool(listen) is False
if not listen  is True

-- 
Zhou Peng
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