Re: [Python-Dev] Adding Type[C] to PEP 484

2016-05-20 Thread Sven R. Kunze

On 15.05.2016 19:30, Guido van Rossum wrote:
Right. I still have no good intuition for what Type[BasicUser, 
ProUser] would mean so I think you should be required to use the 
Union, which is clear. Type[] should only allow one parameter.


Type[A, B] reminds me of isinstance(obj, (A, B)).


Sven
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[Python-Dev] Buildbots now always run tests in subprocesses

2016-05-20 Thread Victor Stinner
Hi,

I modified regrtest to not ignore -j1 anymore (issue #25285). I also
modified Tools/buildbot/test.bat to add the -j1 option (-j1 was
already used on UNIX on "make buildbottest").

All buildbots will now run each test file in a fresh subprocess. It
helps to restrict all kinds of side effects of unit tests to a single
file. The drawback is that buildbots will be less efficient to detect
side effects of unit tests.


By the way, I also changed regrtest output in "multiprocess mode"
(when -jN is used) to add "passed" to test names:
---
$ ./python -m test -j1
...
Run tests in parallel using 1 child processes
0:00:00 [  1/401] test_grammar passed
0:00:00 [  2/401] test_opcodes passed
0:00:01 [  3/401] test_dict passed
---

When tests are run sequentially, the output is different:
---
$ ./python -u -m test
...
Run tests sequentially
0:00:00 [  1/401] test_grammar
0:00:00 [  2/401] test_opcodes
0:00:00 [  3/401] test_dict
...
---

In multiprocess mode, regrtest displays the name of the test which
just completed. In sequential mode, it displays the name of the test
which is currently running.

Maybe the output of sequential mode can also be enhanced, but I made
the minimum change to avoid breaking regrtest. Some parts of the code
rely on the regrtest output format. I added many unit tests to
test_regrtest, but not everything is tested yet.

Victor
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[Python-Dev] Summary of Python tracker Issues

2016-05-20 Thread Python tracker

ACTIVITY SUMMARY (2016-05-13 - 2016-05-20)
Python tracker at http://bugs.python.org/

To view or respond to any of the issues listed below, click on the issue.
Do NOT respond to this message.

Issues counts and deltas:
  open5504 ( +3)
  closed 33322 (+52)
  total  38826 (+55)

Open issues with patches: 2381 


Issues opened (33)
==

#26741: subprocess.Popen should emit a ResourceWarning in destructor i
http://bugs.python.org/issue26741  reopened by haypo

#27015: subprocess.CalledProcessError's repr changes based on kwargs, 
http://bugs.python.org/issue27015  opened by Taywee

#27016: BlockingIOError not raised inside function.
http://bugs.python.org/issue27016  opened by [email protected]

#27019: Reduce marshal stack depth for 2.7 on Windows debug build
http://bugs.python.org/issue27019  opened by db3l

#27020: os.writev() does not accept generators (as buffers argument)
http://bugs.python.org/issue27020  opened by mmarkk

#27021: It is not documented that os.writev() suffer from SC_IOV_MAX
http://bugs.python.org/issue27021  opened by mmarkk

#27022: expose sendmmsg() syscall  in sockets API
http://bugs.python.org/issue27022  opened by mmarkk

#27024: IDLE shutdown glitch when started by import
http://bugs.python.org/issue27024  opened by terry.reedy

#27025: More human readable generated widget names
http://bugs.python.org/issue27025  opened by serhiy.storchaka

#27026: async/await keywords are missing from reference docs
http://bugs.python.org/issue27026  opened by hongminhee

#27027: add is_android in test.support to detect Android platform
http://bugs.python.org/issue27027  opened by xdegaye

#27029: Remove support of deprecated mode 'U' in zipfile
http://bugs.python.org/issue27029  opened by serhiy.storchaka

#27030: Remove deprecated re features
http://bugs.python.org/issue27030  opened by serhiy.storchaka

#27032: Remove deprecated html.parser.HTMLParser.unescape()
http://bugs.python.org/issue27032  opened by serhiy.storchaka

#27033: Change the decode_data default in smtpd to False
http://bugs.python.org/issue27033  opened by serhiy.storchaka

#27035: Cannot set exit code in atexit callback
http://bugs.python.org/issue27035  opened by Melebius

#27036: Mark up of references in different form
http://bugs.python.org/issue27036  opened by serhiy.storchaka

#27037: Universal newline support for zipFile.ZipExtFile.read() is not
http://bugs.python.org/issue27037  opened by David Pitchford

#27038: Make os.DirEntry exist
http://bugs.python.org/issue27038  opened by brett.cannon

#27043: Describe what ‘inspect.cleandoc’ does to synopsis line.
http://bugs.python.org/issue27043  opened by bignose

#27048: distutils._msvccompiler._get_vc_env() fails with UnicodeDecode
http://bugs.python.org/issue27048  opened by ebarry

#27050: Demote run() below the high level APIs in subprocess docs
http://bugs.python.org/issue27050  opened by ncoghlan

#27051: Create PIP gui
http://bugs.python.org/issue27051  opened by upendra-k14

#27052: Python2.7.11+ as in Debian testing and Ubuntu 16.04 LTS crashe
http://bugs.python.org/issue27052  opened by Ján Jockusch

#27054: Python installation problem: No module named 'encodings'
http://bugs.python.org/issue27054  opened by [email protected]

#27060: Documentation of assertItemsEqual in unittest is VERY misleadi
http://bugs.python.org/issue27060  opened by vitaly

#27062: `inspect` doesn't have `__all__`
http://bugs.python.org/issue27062  opened by leewz

#27063: Some unittest loader tests are silently skipped by mistake
http://bugs.python.org/issue27063  opened by serhiy.storchaka

#27064: Make py.exe default to Python 3 when used interactively
http://bugs.python.org/issue27064  opened by paul.moore

#27066: SystemError if custom opener returns -1
http://bugs.python.org/issue27066  opened by barry

#27067: Improve curses tests
http://bugs.python.org/issue27067  opened by serhiy.storchaka

#27068: Add a detach() method to subprocess.Popen
http://bugs.python.org/issue27068  opened by haypo

#27069: webbrowser creates zombi processes in the background mode
http://bugs.python.org/issue27069  opened by haypo



Most recent 15 issues with no replies (15)
==

#27067: Improve curses tests
http://bugs.python.org/issue27067

#27063: Some unittest loader tests are silently skipped by mistake
http://bugs.python.org/issue27063

#27060: Documentation of assertItemsEqual in unittest is VERY misleadi
http://bugs.python.org/issue27060

#27051: Create PIP gui
http://bugs.python.org/issue27051

#27043: Describe what ‘inspect.cleandoc’ does to synopsis line.
http://bugs.python.org/issue27043

#27038: Make os.DirEntry exist
http://bugs.python.org/issue27038

#27032: Remove deprecated html.parser.HTMLParser.unescape()
http://bugs.python.org/issue27032

#27030: Remove deprecated re features
http://bugs.python.org/issue27030

#27029: Remove support of deprecated mode 'U' in zipfile
http://bugs.python.org/issue27029

#27021: It i

[Python-Dev] Why does PEP 7/8 explicitly suggest 2 spaces after a period?

2016-05-20 Thread Brett Cannon
Is there a specific reason for calling out two spaces in comments after a
period(I realize it's probably for consistency, but I sure don't ever think
about this when I write comment)? Otherwise who actually still writes using
two spaces after punctuation? :)
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Re: [Python-Dev] Why does PEP 7/8 explicitly suggest 2 spaces after a period?

2016-05-20 Thread Guido van Rossum
In Emacs, the paragraph reflow commands still try to keep a period
followed by only one space together on a line, under the assumption
that it might be something like `Dr. Brett Cannon`. A reasonable HTML
generator should ignore the second space. So all in all I still like
the two-space rule -- not so much for readability but because of
tooling.

On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 9:27 AM, Brett Cannon  wrote:
> Is there a specific reason for calling out two spaces in comments after a
> period(I realize it's probably for consistency, but I sure don't ever think
> about this when I write comment)? Otherwise who actually still writes using
> two spaces after punctuation? :)
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] Why does PEP 7/8 explicitly suggest 2 spaces after a period?

2016-05-20 Thread Bernardo Sulzbach

On 05/20/2016 01:27 PM, Brett Cannon wrote:

Is there a specific reason for calling out two spaces in comments after a
period(I realize it's probably for consistency, but I sure don't ever think
about this when I write comment)? Otherwise who actually still writes using
two spaces after punctuation? :)



I've also asked myself this question. It may have made more sense back 
then, but nowadays I only get double spaces after a period if Ms. Vim 
decides to use them there for me, making me do substitution magic to 
"clean" it later on.


There may even be a way to disable this in Vim (without changing the 
sources and recompiling), but I never looked after it.


For modern monospaced typefaces and screen resolutions one space after a 
period is as readable (arguably even better looking) than two.

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Re: [Python-Dev] Why does PEP 7/8 explicitly suggest 2 spaces after a period?

2016-05-20 Thread Facundo Batista
On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 1:27 PM, Brett Cannon  wrote:

> Is there a specific reason for calling out two spaces in comments after a
> period(I realize it's probably for consistency, but I sure don't ever think
> about this when I write comment)? Otherwise who actually still writes using
> two spaces after punctuation? :)

I couldn't find it in the reference but AFAIK is something that is
also done in ReStructured Text.

Regards,

-- 
.Facundo

Blog: http://www.taniquetil.com.ar/plog/
PyAr: http://www.python.org/ar/
Twitter: @facundobatista
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[Python-Dev] Removing the provisional label from pathlib

2016-05-20 Thread Brett Cannon
Three questions:

   1. Should pathlib gain __fspath__() all the way back to 3.4?
   2. Should pathlib's constructor support __fspath__() all the way back to
   3.4? (separate question as os.fspath() will only be in 3.6; and if we
   backport I'm not looking forward to making Typeshed happy w/o os.PathLike
   being available only in 3.6 :/)
   3. Should the docs from 3.4 and forward reflect the removal of the
   provisional status? (I assume yes, but wanted to double-check)

And a quick thanks to Guido for removing `path` from pathlib for me
already. :)
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Re: [Python-Dev] Why does PEP 7/8 explicitly suggest 2 spaces after a period?

2016-05-20 Thread Ethan Furman

On 05/20/2016 09:27 AM, Brett Cannon wrote:


Is there a specific reason for calling out two spaces in comments after
a period(I realize it's probably for consistency, but I sure don't ever
think about this when I write comment)? Otherwise who actually still
writes using two spaces after punctuation? :)


I do!!  :)

The period is a full-stop punctuation mark, but visually obscure [1]. 
The two spaces reinforces its full-stop nature [2].


white-space-matters-ly yrs,

--
~Ethan~


[1] I'm pretty sure "obscure" is not the word I want, but it's  close.

[2] No, I'm not happy with the decision to drop to one space after a
period in modern grammar [3].

[3] At least, at the colleges my daughter has attended.
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Re: [Python-Dev] Why does PEP 7/8 explicitly suggest 2 spaces after a period?

2016-05-20 Thread Guido van Rossum
ALso, in case anyone reading this didn't realize, this is a classic
internet debate that has been going on for decades (just not on
python-dev). Just Google it.

On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 9:40 AM, Facundo Batista
 wrote:
> On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 1:27 PM, Brett Cannon  wrote:
>
>> Is there a specific reason for calling out two spaces in comments after a
>> period(I realize it's probably for consistency, but I sure don't ever think
>> about this when I write comment)? Otherwise who actually still writes using
>> two spaces after punctuation? :)
>
> I couldn't find it in the reference but AFAIK is something that is
> also done in ReStructured Text.
>
> Regards,
>
> --
> .Facundo
>
> Blog: http://www.taniquetil.com.ar/plog/
> PyAr: http://www.python.org/ar/
> Twitter: @facundobatista
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-- 
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Re: [Python-Dev] Removing the provisional label from pathlib

2016-05-20 Thread Guido van Rossum
Let's start in 3.6 with all this. I added path to 3.4 because I didn't
realize it was in security-mode only. I've now undone all my work
there. Let's not disturb it again, not even its docs.

I don't think there's an "upstream" repo for pathlib (like there still
is for asyncio) and I don't think there's much of a point in
supporting __fspath__ in pathlib if there's no os.fspath(). It would
only encourage hackery in apps that want to play with __fspath__.

On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 9:43 AM, Brett Cannon  wrote:
> Three questions:
>
> Should pathlib gain __fspath__() all the way back to 3.4?
> Should pathlib's constructor support __fspath__() all the way back to 3.4?
> (separate question as os.fspath() will only be in 3.6; and if we backport
> I'm not looking forward to making Typeshed happy w/o os.PathLike being
> available only in 3.6 :/)
> Should the docs from 3.4 and forward reflect the removal of the provisional
> status? (I assume yes, but wanted to double-check)
>
> And a quick thanks to Guido for removing `path` from pathlib for me already.
> :)
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] PyGC_Collect ignores state of `enabled`

2016-05-20 Thread Neil Schemenauer
Nick Coghlan  wrote:
> PEP 3121 is insufficient, since a lot of extension modules can't (or
> at least haven't) adopted it in practice.
> https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0489/ has some more background on
> that (since it was the first step towards tackling the problem in a
> different way that extension module authors may be more likely to
> actually adopt)

My idea is that if we can cleanup the built-in extension modules
then maybe that would be enough to stop doing a lot of the
finalization hacks (e.g. module dict clearing).  If 3rd party
extension modules are not fixed, then some finalizers that used to
be called might no longer get called.

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Re: [Python-Dev] Why does PEP 7/8 explicitly suggest 2 spaces after a period?

2016-05-20 Thread Bernardo Sulzbach

On 05/20/2016 09:27 AM, Brett Cannon wrote:

The period is a full-stop punctuation mark, but visually obscure [1].


It is small. This does not make it hard to notice, however. Not to 
mention that it will usually be followed by a capitalized letter, which 
further highlights it. Commas usually use more pixels or ink and the 
tiny size of the period makes it quite distinguishable to me.


This email-based "tennis" match could go on for quite a while as Guido 
pointed out and there are several good points for both sides. This is 
not a critic to the thread, which regarded PEP 7/8 and seems perfectly 
fine. This is also not a critic to Cannon's view on this.


Who is right in the end? ~One space defenders~ Nobody. There is no 
single right solution to this. As there is no single right decision 
regarding tabs or spaces~, except for spaces, always use spaces~. 
Consistency is what really matters (assuming we agree that one space is 
enough to make it visible).

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Re: [Python-Dev] Why does PEP 7/8 explicitly suggest 2 spaces after a period?

2016-05-20 Thread Brett Cannon
On Fri, 20 May 2016 at 09:46 Guido van Rossum  wrote:

> ALso, in case anyone reading this didn't realize, this is a classic
> internet debate that has been going on for decades (just not on
> python-dev). Just Google it.
>

Yes, I don't mean to suggest we should change the two space specification
to one-space, just why specify at all to that granularity of formatting?

-Brett


>
> On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 9:40 AM, Facundo Batista
>  wrote:
> > On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 1:27 PM, Brett Cannon  wrote:
> >
> >> Is there a specific reason for calling out two spaces in comments after
> a
> >> period(I realize it's probably for consistency, but I sure don't ever
> think
> >> about this when I write comment)? Otherwise who actually still writes
> using
> >> two spaces after punctuation? :)
> >
> > I couldn't find it in the reference but AFAIK is something that is
> > also done in ReStructured Text.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > --
> > .Facundo
> >
> > Blog: http://www.taniquetil.com.ar/plog/
> > PyAr: http://www.python.org/ar/
> > Twitter: @facundobatista
> > ___
> > Python-Dev mailing list
> > [email protected]
> > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
> > Unsubscribe:
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/guido%40python.org
>
>
>
> --
> --Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] Why does PEP 7/8 explicitly suggest 2 spaces after a period?

2016-05-20 Thread Guido van Rossum
Because Emacs. :-) I am going to mute this thread now.

On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 11:40 AM, Brett Cannon  wrote:
>
>
> On Fri, 20 May 2016 at 09:46 Guido van Rossum  wrote:
>>
>> ALso, in case anyone reading this didn't realize, this is a classic
>> internet debate that has been going on for decades (just not on
>> python-dev). Just Google it.
>
>
> Yes, I don't mean to suggest we should change the two space specification to
> one-space, just why specify at all to that granularity of formatting?
>
> -Brett
>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 9:40 AM, Facundo Batista
>>  wrote:
>> > On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 1:27 PM, Brett Cannon  wrote:
>> >
>> >> Is there a specific reason for calling out two spaces in comments after
>> >> a
>> >> period(I realize it's probably for consistency, but I sure don't ever
>> >> think
>> >> about this when I write comment)? Otherwise who actually still writes
>> >> using
>> >> two spaces after punctuation? :)
>> >
>> > I couldn't find it in the reference but AFAIK is something that is
>> > also done in ReStructured Text.
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> >
>> > --
>> > .Facundo
>> >
>> > Blog: http://www.taniquetil.com.ar/plog/
>> > PyAr: http://www.python.org/ar/
>> > Twitter: @facundobatista
>> > ___
>> > Python-Dev mailing list
>> > [email protected]
>> > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
>> > Unsubscribe:
>> > https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/guido%40python.org
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> --Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)



-- 
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Re: [Python-Dev] Removing the provisional label from pathlib

2016-05-20 Thread Brett Cannon
On Fri, 20 May 2016 at 09:56 Guido van Rossum  wrote:

> Let's start in 3.6 with all this. I added path to 3.4 because I didn't
> realize it was in security-mode only. I've now undone all my work
> there. Let's not disturb it again, not even its docs.
>
> I don't think there's an "upstream" repo for pathlib (like there still
> is for asyncio) and I don't think there's much of a point in
> supporting __fspath__ in pathlib if there's no os.fspath(). It would
> only encourage hackery in apps that want to play with __fspath__.
>

WFM. I'll let 3.4 and 3.5 just stay as they are and make all PEP 519
changes a 3.6 thing.

I'll update the implementation task list shortly.

-Brett


>
> On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 9:43 AM, Brett Cannon  wrote:
> > Three questions:
> >
> > Should pathlib gain __fspath__() all the way back to 3.4?
> > Should pathlib's constructor support __fspath__() all the way back to
> 3.4?
> > (separate question as os.fspath() will only be in 3.6; and if we backport
> > I'm not looking forward to making Typeshed happy w/o os.PathLike being
> > available only in 3.6 :/)
> > Should the docs from 3.4 and forward reflect the removal of the
> provisional
> > status? (I assume yes, but wanted to double-check)
> >
> > And a quick thanks to Guido for removing `path` from pathlib for me
> already.
> > :)
> >
> > ___
> > Python-Dev mailing list
> > [email protected]
> > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
> > Unsubscribe:
> > https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/guido%40python.org
> >
>
>
>
> --
> --Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
>
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Re: [Python-Dev] Removing the provisional label from pathlib

2016-05-20 Thread Victor Stinner
2016-05-20 18:56 GMT+02:00 Guido van Rossum :
> Let's start in 3.6 with all this. I added path to 3.4 because I didn't
> realize it was in security-mode only.

I also had to ask the question to myself about branches, that's why I
wrote this table ;-)
https://docs.python.org/devguide/#status-of-python-branches

By the way, is it still up to date? Python 3.2 end-of-line is
documented as 2016-02-20, so its status should be end-of-life, no?

Georg Brandl scheduled a 3.2.7 release at the end of February 2016,
but I don't see it on python.org and I don't recall its announcement.
https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2016-February/143300.html

Georg: any update on the Python 3.2 last release?

Victor
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Re: [Python-Dev] Why does PEP 7/8 explicitly suggest 2 spaces after a period?

2016-05-20 Thread Philip Jenvey
So is line breaks before or after operators .

--
Philip Jenvey

> On May 20, 2016, at 9:46 AM, Guido van Rossum  wrote:
> 
> ALso, in case anyone reading this didn't realize, this is a classic
> internet debate that has been going on for decades (just not on
> python-dev). Just Google it.
> 
> On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 9:40 AM, Facundo Batista
>  wrote:
>> On Fri, May 20, 2016 at 1:27 PM, Brett Cannon  wrote:
>> 
>>> Is there a specific reason for calling out two spaces in comments after a
>>> period(I realize it's probably for consistency, but I sure don't ever think
>>> about this when I write comment)? Otherwise who actually still writes using
>>> two spaces after punctuation? :)
>> 
>> I couldn't find it in the reference but AFAIK is something that is
>> also done in ReStructured Text.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> --
>> .Facundo
>> 
>> Blog: http://www.taniquetil.com.ar/plog/
>> PyAr: http://www.python.org/ar/
>> Twitter: @facundobatista
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> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> --Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
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Re: [Python-Dev] Removing the provisional label from pathlib

2016-05-20 Thread Georg Brandl
On 05/20/2016 09:15 PM, Victor Stinner wrote:
> 2016-05-20 18:56 GMT+02:00 Guido van Rossum :
>> Let's start in 3.6 with all this. I added path to 3.4 because I didn't
>> realize it was in security-mode only.
> 
> I also had to ask the question to myself about branches, that's why I
> wrote this table ;-)
> https://docs.python.org/devguide/#status-of-python-branches
> 
> By the way, is it still up to date? Python 3.2 end-of-line is
> documented as 2016-02-20, so its status should be end-of-life, no?
> 
> Georg Brandl scheduled a 3.2.7 release at the end of February 2016,
> but I don't see it on python.org and I don't recall its announcement.
> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/2016-February/143300.html
> 
> Georg: any update on the Python 3.2 last release?

Still waiting for some last security update. I sent another mail to
python-dev that announced the delay, I think.

Georg



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