Re: [opensource-dev] Snowstorm Daily Scrum Summary - 08/16/2010
No amount of rationalizing will make acceptable a bad implementation of a design feature- it's better to accept there are serious design flaws and address it quickly. Will From: Esbee Linden (Sarah Hutchinson) Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 10:15 PM To: opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com Subject: [opensource-dev] Snowstorm Daily Scrum Summary - 08/16/2010 Date: 08/16/2010 Wiki version of the Daily Scrum summary can be found here: https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Snowstorm_Daily_Scrum_Archive == GENERAL NOTES == Q OOO until further notice. == DAILY SCRUM == === Aimee === PAST a.. Added build.sh and BuildParams to the exported repo and got TeamCity builds working. b.. Looking into EXT-8645 Incoming IM voice call notification doesn't appear if disable/enable voice chat FUTURE a.. Continue with EXT-8645 b.. Set myself up a work repo from viewer-development. c.. Make a start on importing GCC > 4.1 build issues from Snowglobe? d.. Be available to the Open Sourcers to help them adjust to the new structure (while I adjust myself too! :) IMPEDIMENTS a.. None. === Tofu === OOO === Oz === PAST a.. Sent pre-announcement emails to opensource-dev and tpvd-announce lists a.. Set up IW SLCC b.. Invitation to IW meeting on Monday b.. Drafted "How To Propose A Viewer Change" wiki page c.. Got a TeamCity build of oz/viewer-development a.. Checked in license change for oz/viewer-development (ready to go) FUTURE a.. Do a wiki page on hg workflow b.. In-World developer meeting c.. Clean up wiki documentation of Snowstorm IMPEDIMENTS a.. None === Q === OOO === Esbee === PAST a.. Finished deck for SLCC b.. Presented with Oz & Q at SLCC FUTURE a.. Final prep on Snowstorm community announcement blog post (posting today) b.. Finish work on public backlog format & prepare to publish c.. Follow up on SLCC feedback d.. Attend inworld developer meeting e.. Prepare for Sprint planning tomorrow f.. Work on Wiki pages with Oz g.. Bring Scrum platform to the meeting spot to Hippotropolis IMPEDIMENTS a.. None === Paul === PAST a.. BUG EXT-8588 (URL-like name of group is shown as hyperlink in group mini-inspector) a.. In progress. b.. BUG EXT-8372 ([TRUNCATION] ALL LANGS Untranslated dropdown list items in Preferences > Sound & Media (French viewer) "Default system device", "No device", "Microphone (...)" etc.) a.. Discussing with Eli, waiting for response. Bug was reopened but I cannot repro. Attached screenshots. FUTURE a.. BUG EXT-8588 (URL-like name of group is shown as hyperlink in group mini-inspector) IMPEDIMENTS a.. none === Andrew === PAST a.. Bug EXT-8658 (Offline participants of Add hoc chat are shown in Recent Tab). a.. Fixed and sent for review b.. EXT-6527 (IM chat history log in plain text mode looks ugly when displays avatar SLURLs). a.. Investigated. Will fix tomorrow c.. EXT-8635 (Replace "no matches found" with "loading" in the My Outfits tab). a.. Consulted with Sergey. Probably fixed. Will test and submit for review tomorrow d.. Task EXT-8425 [HARD CODED] ALL LANGS: Unlocalized keyboard keys under Advanced menu > Shortcuts (French viewer). a.. Found a problem I introduced. Fixed and sent for review FUTURE a.. Fix debugger b.. EXT-6527 (IM chat history log in plain text mode looks ugly when displays avatar SLURLs). IMPEDIMENTS a.. None. === Vadim === PAST a.. Task EXT-8564 (Add option fo take off wearables via "Wearing" Tab): a.. Implemented. b.. Major bug EXT-6766 (The number of characters allowed in the Chat Edit Window in Vewer 2 does not match 1024 as required): a.. Investigated, set back to fixed. c.. Bug EXT-8357 (ESC will not de-focus the sidebar): a.. Fixed. d.. Bug EXT-8630 (Ctrl-Shift-W hides all chat until a viewer restart): a.. Investigated, need to discuss with AA tomorrow. FUTURE a.. other bugs IMPEDIMENTS a.. none === Sergey === PAST a.. Critical bug (EXT-8636) There is no 'worn' prefix for COF items from 'My Outfits' tab if change outfit few times a.. Fixed. Uploaded for review. b.. Bug (EXT-8421) [HARD CODED] ALL LANGS Several strings are untranslated under Group Profile Land/Assets (French viewer) a.. WIP. Not sure if we can translate the date string received from server. FUTURE: a.. Bug (EXT-8421) [HARD CODED] ALL LANGS Several strings are untranslated under Group Profile Land/Assets (French viewer) IMPEDIMENTS a.. none === Anya === PAST a.. mostly QA coordination issues b.. appearance ownership FUTURE a.. crashhunters b.. discus future of PE's current backlog, other bugfixing within the big picture. IMPEDIMENTS a.. none ---
Re: [opensource-dev] Open Viewer Development Announcement
"It is absolutely not going to happen, and any suggestion to that effect will be ignored." So much for "It's your world your imagination" This has been apparent for some time now. Thanks for being 100% clear and now I think we have found the issue that keeps LL firmly planted in "It's our world our imagination" enjoy the decline, blame it on metrics, the economy your next door neighbor and his little dog too. -- From: "Latif Khalifa" Sent: Tuesday, August 17, 2010 6:01 AM To: "Yoz Grahame" Cc: Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Open Viewer Development Announcement > On Tue, Aug 17, 2010 at 4:27 AM, Yoz Grahame wrote: >> >> The Snowstorm project is aimed at dramatically increasing community >> involvement in Viewer development and improving communications around it. > > Very nice words indeed. But not new. Shall we look into what happens > when user experience clashes with, in my view, a very short sighted > decision by one of the "product owners". Is it "our JIRA, you lose", > or does improving user experience really matters. > > https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/WEB-1819 > > Patch is attached and tested. > > Latif > ___ > Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev > Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything?
Found this morning, forgive me for not noting where, but it puts it in context: Anonymous said... Why did they do that? Well, you may recall that Emerald (more specifically the libemkdu library in it) was caught leaking personally-identifiable information about its users in an encrypted form that could be read by Emerald developers. They were then caught continuing to do so after the developers in question claimed the problem was fixed, just with stronger encryption that made it harder to prove. iheartanime.com is the website of the person who figured out how to decrypt the secret information they were leaking both times, and the website on which he publicised this issue. It's basically a vendatta attack against someone who revealed the Emerald developers had been up to no good. From: Simon Disk Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 9:47 AM To: Phox Cc: opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com Subject: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything? On Sat, Aug 21, 2010 at 7:48 PM, Phox wrote: (Since then, all additional metadata information has been removed from emkdu). The change in encryption was simply a result of inertia being able to decode the viewer window title information. It is my understanding that the emku was placing the hidden viewer window title information into the baked textures. So in one sentence you are saying the information was removed. And in the next you are saying it is still there just encrypted better so others cannot decode it and out you. Which is it? ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything?
They may be waiting to make a formal announcement before they pull the plug on the viewer- didn't they make a policy of not allowing any viewer to connect that wasn't on the list? I think so- -- From: "Gareth Nelson" Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 2:50 PM To: "Lance Corrimal" Cc: Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything? > As they shouldn't be! > Although one does wonder whether users are now at risk of being banned > if they keep using it > > On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 7:01 PM, Lance Corrimal > wrote: >> Am Sunday 22 August 2010 schrieb L. Christopher Bird: >>> On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 11:32 AM, Jesse Barnett >> wrote: >>> > Ignoring this and giving the all clear with no other action taken >>> > on the part of Linden Lab will instead demonstrate that the TPV >>> > is a worthless scrap of paper. >>> >>> Correction, it only exist on paper if printed. The proper phrase is >>> "a worthless configuration of pixels" >>> >>> The TPVP makes it clear what the consequences are for breaking the >>> policy. 8c says: >>> >>> "If a Third-Party Viewer or your use or distribution of it violates >>> this Policy or any Linden Lab policy, your permission to access >>> Second Life using the Third-Party Viewer shall terminate >>> automatically. You acknowledge and agree that we may require you >>> to stop using or distributing a Third-Party Viewer for accessing >>> Second Life if we determine that there is a violation." >>> >>> So either the lab will enforce this, or they will say "Well you are >>> so popular you can screw around all you want". Is Emerald the >>> viewer "too big to fail"? >>> >>> -- ZenMondo >> >> I just looked and emerald's not in the tpv directory anymore. >> ___ >> Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: >> http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev >> Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting >> privileges >> > > > > -- > “Lanie, I’m going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for > everyone. That’s worth going to jail for. That’s worth anything.” - > Printcrime by Cory Doctrow > > Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. > See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html > ___ > Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev > Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting > privileges ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything?
hmm ok I may be wrong but remember a rush to update viewers from the approved list, didn't look over my shoulder and just for good housekeeping I don't venture from approved viewers. Seriously hope you are wrong or there will be little to no control over who gets to connect. -- From: "Gareth Nelson" Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 3:25 PM To: "Will" Cc: "Lance Corrimal" ; Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything? > As I understand it, you don't need to be in the list, just comply with > the policy. > > On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 8:19 PM, Will wrote: >> They may be waiting to make a formal announcement before they pull the >> plug >> on the viewer- didn't they make a policy of not allowing any viewer to >> connect that wasn't on the list? I think so- >> >> -- >> From: "Gareth Nelson" >> Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 2:50 PM >> To: "Lance Corrimal" >> Cc: >> Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: >> is >> the policy worth anything? >> >>> As they shouldn't be! >>> Although one does wonder whether users are now at risk of being banned >>> if they keep using it >>> >>> On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 7:01 PM, Lance Corrimal >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Am Sunday 22 August 2010 schrieb L. Christopher Bird: >>>>> >>>>> On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 11:32 AM, Jesse Barnett >>>> >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> > Ignoring this and giving the all clear with no other action taken >>>>> > on the part of Linden Lab will instead demonstrate that the TPV >>>>> > is a worthless scrap of paper. >>>>> >>>>> Correction, it only exist on paper if printed. The proper phrase is >>>>> "a worthless configuration of pixels" >>>>> >>>>> The TPVP makes it clear what the consequences are for breaking the >>>>> policy. 8c says: >>>>> >>>>> "If a Third-Party Viewer or your use or distribution of it violates >>>>> this Policy or any Linden Lab policy, your permission to access >>>>> Second Life using the Third-Party Viewer shall terminate >>>>> automatically. You acknowledge and agree that we may require you >>>>> to stop using or distributing a Third-Party Viewer for accessing >>>>> Second Life if we determine that there is a violation." >>>>> >>>>> So either the lab will enforce this, or they will say "Well you are >>>>> so popular you can screw around all you want". Is Emerald the >>>>> viewer "too big to fail"? >>>>> >>>>> -- ZenMondo >>>> >>>> I just looked and emerald's not in the tpv directory anymore. >>>> ___ >>>> Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: >>>> http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev >>>> Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting >>>> privileges >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> “Lanie, I’m going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for >>> everyone. That’s worth going to jail for. That’s worth anything.” - >>> Printcrime by Cory Doctrow >>> >>> Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. >>> See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html >>> ___ >>> Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: >>> http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev >>> Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting >>> privileges >> >> > > > > -- > “Lanie, I’m going to print more printers. Lots more printers. One for > everyone. That’s worth going to jail for. That’s worth anything.” - > Printcrime by Cory Doctrow > > Please avoid sending me Word or PowerPoint attachments. > See http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/no-word-attachments.html ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything?
Then this is confusing, to be listed you have to within the policy "approved" for lack of a better word: Someone please clarify- "If a Third-Party Viewer or your use or distribution of it violates this Policy or any Linden Lab policy, your permission to access Second Life using the Third-Party Viewer shall terminate automatically." To me it sounds like any viewer not on the list is not approved and that means by their own statement it will not be allowed to connect. -- From: "Gareth Nelson" Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 4:10 PM To: "Will" Cc: "Lance Corrimal" ; Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything? > There isn't anything in the policy itself which says you must be > listed, there is however a note on the directory page warning users to > be wary of unlisted viewers. > > On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 8:54 PM, Will wrote: >> hmm ok I may be wrong but remember a rush to update viewers from the >> approved list, didn't look over my shoulder and just for good >> housekeeping I >> don't venture from approved viewers. Seriously hope you are wrong or >> there >> will be little to no control over who gets to connect. >> >> -- >> From: "Gareth Nelson" >> Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 3:25 PM >> To: "Will" >> Cc: "Lance Corrimal" ; >> >> Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: >> is >> the policy worth anything? >> >>> As I understand it, you don't need to be in the list, just comply with >>> the policy. >>> >>> On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 8:19 PM, Will wrote: >>>> >>>> They may be waiting to make a formal announcement before they pull the >>>> plug >>>> on the viewer- didn't they make a policy of not allowing any viewer to >>>> connect that wasn't on the list? I think so- >>>> >>>> -- >>>> From: "Gareth Nelson" >>>> Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 2:50 PM >>>> To: "Lance Corrimal" >>>> Cc: >>>> Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party >>>> viewers: >>>> is >>>> the policy worth anything? >>>> >>>>> As they shouldn't be! >>>>> Although one does wonder whether users are now at risk of being banned >>>>> if they keep using it >>>>> >>>>> On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 7:01 PM, Lance Corrimal >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Am Sunday 22 August 2010 schrieb L. Christopher Bird: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Sun, Aug 22, 2010 at 11:32 AM, Jesse Barnett >>>>>> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> > Ignoring this and giving the all clear with no other action taken >>>>>>> > on the part of Linden Lab will instead demonstrate that the TPV >>>>>>> > is a worthless scrap of paper. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Correction, it only exist on paper if printed. The proper phrase is >>>>>>> "a worthless configuration of pixels" >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The TPVP makes it clear what the consequences are for breaking the >>>>>>> policy. 8c says: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> "If a Third-Party Viewer or your use or distribution of it violates >>>>>>> this Policy or any Linden Lab policy, your permission to access >>>>>>> Second Life using the Third-Party Viewer shall terminate >>>>>>> automatically. You acknowledge and agree that we may require you >>>>>>> to stop using or distributing a Third-Party Viewer for accessing >>>>>>> Second Life if we determine that there is a violation." >>>>>>> >>>>>>> So either the lab will enforce this, or they will say "Well you are >>>>>>> so popular you can screw around all you want". Is Emerald the >>>>>>> viewer "too big to fail"? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- ZenMondo >>>>>> >>>>>> I just looked and emerald's not in the tpv directory anymore. >>>>>
Re: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything?
Posted by Bubblesort moments ago- by way of the Alphaville Herald: "This just in: LLG just released his own viewer named Emergence!" http://code.google.com/p/emergence-viewer/ -- From: "Michael Daniel" Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2010 5:16 PM To: Subject: [opensource-dev] Malicious payloads in third-party viewers: is the policy worth anything? > Confirmed by Paisley Beebe, a talk show host: > http://tonightlivewithpaisleybeebe.com/ > > Should be a good show tonight. I'm actually looking forward to hearing > what Rose Borchovski has to say more than whatever BS the Emerald team > cooks up. > > ~Bubblesort Triskaidekaphobia > > == > Miro Dollas wrote: > > Do you have a cite for that, Tateru? Not saying it is false, I'd just > like to see it in context if possible. > > On 08/22/2010 01:38 PM, Tateru Nino wrote: >>/ Arabella has also resigned. > />/ > />/ On 23/08/2010 3:32 AM, Jesse Barnett wrote: > />>/ Fractured has stepped down and out of the Emerald picture > />>/ > />>/ http://blog.modularsystems.sl/2010/08/22/emerald-off-with-his-head/ > />>/ > />>/ But it is painfully obvious that the comments are being heavily > />>/ moderated and I know that neither of mine have gotten through. > />>/ > />>/ The Phox is still in the hen house and it is going to take much more > />>/ then this token response to restore confidence. Anyone watching the > />>/ videos and listening to their voices can see that a complete > />>/ reorganization needs to be done and transparency demonstrated and > />>/ verified. > />>/ > />>/ I hope that the upper echelons of Linden Lab are not fooled by the > />>/ blog post and instead demand that more action be taken. At the bare > />>/ minimum, they need to be delisted until real change has been shown. > />>/ > />>/ Ignoring this and giving the all clear with no other action taken on > />>/ the part of Linden Lab will instead demonstrate that the TPV is a > />>/ worthless scrap of paper. > />>/ > />>/ Jesse Barnett > />>/ > />>/ > />>/ ___ > />>/ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: > />>/ http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev > />>/ Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting > privileges > />/ > />/ -- > />/ Tateru Nino > />/ Contributing Editorhttp://massively.com/ > /> > > ___ > Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev > Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting > privileges ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
Re: [opensource-dev] Display names, again.
Oz, what is Linden Labs position on Emerald and will they be making a public announcement? (not a lawyer just a concerned resident, remember them?) From: Oz Linden (Scott Lawrence) Sent: Monday, August 23, 2010 1:28 PM To: opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Display names, again. On 2010-08-23 11:50, Moriz Gupte wrote: @Oz Linden, I feel your pain of being submerged with noise, but unfortunately this is the price you have to pay for listening. And you cannot afford not to listen because there are gems in that noise that will help your own work and LL in general. So take the noise as part of business, that would be my advice to you. I'm listening... and filtering out all amateur lawyers (and will be really really surprised if any of what I've seen is coming from anyone who's actually passed the Bar anywhere). I'd much rather have to listen to noise than to silence. ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
