Re: [opensource-dev] macOS 10.14 deprecation of OpenGL, what does this mean for SL?
On Mon, 4 Jun 2018 15:25:55 -0700, Kadah Coba wrote: > So just heard about this, not sure if this was known about before this. > https://developer.apple.com/macos/whats-new/ > > "Apps built using OpenGL and OpenCL will continue to run in macOS 10.14, > but these legacy technologies are deprecated in macOS 10.14. Games and > graphics-intensive apps that use OpenGL should now adopt Metal." > > There's doing the same on iOS too, not that it effects us. > > Knowing Apple's way, could likely assume 10.15 or 10.16 may not support > OpenGL at all, or at worse, a later update of 10.14.x. Apple always has been an horrible company when it comes to computing standards: they produce closed platforms with closed software and apparently did not yet understand that the computing world trend is the exact opposite, with more and more cross-platform software using open standards so that they can be compiled and used under any OS with minimal efforts and adaptation. If they want to keep shooting in their foot, so be it. Developers (and Open Source ones will be the first) will simply stop developing Apple- compatible software and Apple will end up as a niche platform (which they pretty much are already, when we speak about *serious* computing: any example of servers or super-computers running under any Apple OS ?). For me, it always has been a total mystery that people could even *consider* buying their expensive, poorly performing, deprecation- scheduled stuff. As for OpenGL, Apple's drivers always sucked at it (big time), so it's perhaps that they simply finally admit they are incompetent programmers, unable to produce reliable and good performing OpenGL drivers. Henri. ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
Re: [opensource-dev] macOS 10.14 deprecation of OpenGL, what does this mean for SL?
On Mon, 4 Jun 2018 22:41:48 -0700, Dahlia Trimble wrote: > But seriously, perhaps LL should consider writing a new viewer with a > modern, API-agnostic rendering layer. OpenGL is stagnant on just about > every platform now. OpenGL is not stagnant (v4.6 dates only from July 2017): it is simply mature. However, next generation OpenGL is not v5.0 but rather Vulkan (the latter allowing to take a much larger benefit from multi-core CPUs, at the cost of a lower level API and thus more work and complexity for the 3D application programmers). As for SL viewers, I'd love to see a Vulkan renderer developed, but I doubt it will happen any time soon... Henri. ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
Re: [opensource-dev] macOS 10.14 deprecation of OpenGL, what does this mean for SL?
But Vulkan bears virtually no resemblance to OpenGL. Some might consider it next generation OpenGL but it's really a whole new API, based on "Mantle" from AMD. It's also much more difficult to use than OpenGL and requires more systems programming expertise than typical graphics oriented APIs. It's also not supported by Apple either, but I've heard some good things about MoltenVK (a Vulkan abstraction on top of Metal). On Tue, Jun 5, 2018 at 1:27 AM, Henri Beauchamp wrote: > On Mon, 4 Jun 2018 22:41:48 -0700, Dahlia Trimble wrote: > > > But seriously, perhaps LL should consider writing a new viewer with a > > modern, API-agnostic rendering layer. OpenGL is stagnant on just about > > every platform now. > > OpenGL is not stagnant (v4.6 dates only from July 2017): it is simply > mature. > > However, next generation OpenGL is not v5.0 but rather Vulkan (the latter > allowing to take a much larger benefit from multi-core CPUs, at the cost of > a lower level API and thus more work and complexity for the 3D application > programmers). > > As for SL viewers, I'd love to see a Vulkan renderer developed, but I doubt > it will happen any time soon... > > Henri. > ___ > Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev > Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting > privileges > ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
Re: [opensource-dev] macOS 10.14 deprecation of OpenGL, what does this mean for SL?
On 6/4/2018 10:41 PM, Dahlia Trimble wrote: > I can't believe that Apple will remove an API that so many > applications use. I've seen Apple do worse in the past with less warning. Apple disabled SSLv3 by default in iOS 9 and an OSX update (maybe around 10.11, can't remember) without warning. This would have been fine since any updated server would also support TLS, except Apple screwed up somewhere and many Apple apps, like Mail, would still attempt to connect using SSLv3 but then fail with a typically Apple style unhelpful error when the OS doesn't allow it to use SSLv3 because the app's plist config doesn't allow for an exception. I got around this by disabling SSLv3 and enforcing TLS only, which flagged dayed email for Apple users. Before I did that, if they updated to iOS9, they couldn't get email; after I made the changes, they required iOS9, and likely an account delete and readd on their phone because Apple. ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
Re: [opensource-dev] macOS 10.14 deprecation of OpenGL, what does this mean for SL?
SSLv3 was disabled because it’s exploitable! https://www.us-cert.gov/ncas/alerts/TA14-290A On June 5, 2018 at 4:05:36 PM, Kadah Coba (kadah.c...@gmail.com) wrote: On 6/4/2018 10:41 PM, Dahlia Trimble wrote: > I can't believe that Apple will remove an API that so many > applications use. I've seen Apple do worse in the past with less warning. Apple disabled SSLv3 by default in iOS 9 and an OSX update (maybe around 10.11, can't remember) without warning. This would have been fine since any updated server would also support TLS, except Apple screwed up somewhere and many Apple apps, like Mail, would still attempt to connect using SSLv3 but then fail with a typically Apple style unhelpful error when the OS doesn't allow it to use SSLv3 because the app's plist config doesn't allow for an exception. I got around this by disabling SSLv3 and enforcing TLS only, which flagged dayed email for Apple users. Before I did that, if they updated to iOS9, they couldn't get email; after I made the changes, they required iOS9, and likely an account delete and readd on their phone because Apple. ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges ___ Policies and (un)subscribe information available here: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting privileges
