Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider

[Hitomi Tiponi]

Yes it's possible (see attached) - but something like that says 'landscape' or 
'plants' to me.





From: Argent Stonecutter 
To: Hitomi Tiponi 
Cc: a...@skyhighway.com; opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com
Sent: Mon, 13 June, 2011 1:58:54
Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider

On 2011-06-12, at 17:30, Hitomi Tiponi wrote:
> /me looks forward to seeing someone draw this one in a 16x16 pixel grid :)

I think three small pine trees could be rendered in a 16x16 grid.
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Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider

[Opensource Obscure]

While clear, such an icon doesn't look much self-explaining to me
with regard to its associated Draw Distance functionality.

I still feel binoculars may be the best option.

Binoculars may not be a commonly used glyph outside of SL,
but it's a fact that many Second Life features are just .. not commonly
used features. In most applications / online services / information
environments or RL appliances, you just don't have the concept
of "Draw Distance" or anything similar.

On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 11:49, Hitomi Tiponi  wrote:
> Yes it's possible (see attached) - but something like that says 'landscape'
> or 'plants' to me.
>
> 
> From: Argent Stonecutter 
> To: Hitomi Tiponi 
> Cc: a...@skyhighway.com; opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com
> Sent: Mon, 13 June, 2011 1:58:54
> Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider
>
> On 2011-06-12, at 17:30, Hitomi Tiponi wrote:
>> /me looks forward to seeing someone draw this one in a 16x16 pixel grid :)
>
> I think three small pine trees could be rendered in a 16x16 grid.
>
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-- 
Opensource Obscure
--
http://twitter.com/oobscure - http://opensourceobscure.com/lol
discuss Second Life Viewer 2: http://j.mp/slv2group
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Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider

[Carlo Wood]

I think that no matter what you draw, the icon
will not be clear to the majority of people.

The icon only needs to be recognizable to those
who saw it before. They will have to learn
it's meaning from the tool tip imho.

Nevertheless, binoculars are usually used for
either zoom or search, so I think another icon
would be better.

Thinking about an avatar with a (half) sphere
around it, I'd use as icon a circle with a dot
in it, or a half circle with a vertical line
in the center, ie:
   _ - _
 .   .
   / O \
   --|--

On Mon, 13 Jun 2011 12:14:11 +0200
Opensource Obscure  wrote:
> While clear, such an icon doesn't look much self-explaining to me
> with regard to its associated Draw Distance functionality.
> 
> I still feel binoculars may be the best option.
> 
> Binoculars may not be a commonly used glyph outside of SL,
> but it's a fact that many Second Life features are just .. not
> commonly used features. In most applications / online services /
> information environments or RL appliances, you just don't have the
> concept of "Draw Distance" or anything similar.
> 
> On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 11:49, Hitomi Tiponi
>  wrote:
> > Yes it's possible (see attached) - but something like that says
> > 'landscape' or 'plants' to me.
> >
> > 
> > From: Argent Stonecutter 
> > To: Hitomi Tiponi 
> > Cc: a...@skyhighway.com; opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com
> > Sent: Mon, 13 June, 2011 1:58:54
> > Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider
> >
> > On 2011-06-12, at 17:30, Hitomi Tiponi wrote:
> >> /me looks forward to seeing someone draw this one in a 16x16 pixel
> >> grid :)
> >
> > I think three small pine trees could be rendered in a 16x16 grid.
> >
> > ___
> > Policies and (un)subscribe information available here:
> > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev
> > Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting
> > privileges
> >
> 
> 
> 



-- 
Carlo Wood 
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[opensource-dev] Good project idea: Lightweight markup support for chat text

[Oz Linden (Scott Lawrence)]

Haravikk Mistral filed an interesting suggestion that we support markup 
for formatting text similar to what most wikis (and our jira) support:

https://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-25942

This would make an excellent project for an open source contributor (or 
small team).   We would want to preserve some of the existing chat text 
behaviors such as '/me' handling and automatic creation of links.  I 
suspect that the implementation would provide an opportunity to do some 
code cleanup and refactoring.


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Re: [opensource-dev] Review Request: VWR-24889: When a bake texture upload fails, retry instead of giving up.

[Oz Linden]

---
This is an automatically generated e-mail. To reply, visit:
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---



indra/newview/lltexlayer.h


This would be more clear as an enum: when looking at a call to this method, 
a value 'true' or 'false' is much less informative that 'isHighestRes' or 
'isLowRes'



indra/newview/lltexlayer.cpp


These should be 'static'; they don't need to be visible to the linker.



indra/newview/lltexlayer.cpp


what's with the minus one here?   


- Oz


On March 1, 2011, 8:58 a.m., Thickbrick Sleaford wrote:
> 
> ---
> This is an automatically generated e-mail. To reply, visit:
> http://codereview.secondlife.com/r/152/
> ---
> 
> (Updated March 1, 2011, 8:58 a.m.)
> 
> 
> Review request for Viewer.
> 
> 
> Summary
> ---
> 
> When a bake upload fails, the viewer doesn't retry it, and subsequently 
> doesn't send a AgentSetAppearance message. This can happen without the user 
> being aware, leaving the avatar looking good on their screen, but not updated 
> to the same outfit on other people's screens. The avatar will remain in that 
> state until the user does something that causes a rebake (manually rebake or 
> change outfit.) The solution here is to retry the upload after a small delay.
> 
> What this diff changes: when a full-res upload fails, retry to upload it 
> after a 5s delay, up to 5 times (in case the cap is available, last attempt 
> is via the old asset store.) Also, some clearer log messages. This implements 
> an old *FIX: comment:
> // *FIX: retry upload after n seconds, asset server could be busy
> 
> This isn't needed for low res uploads, because they don't block subsequent 
> full-res uploads (mNeedsUpload isn't set to FALSE in 
> LLTexLayerSetBuffer::doUpload in low-res uploads.)
> 
> 
> This addresses bug VWR-24889.
> http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-24889
> 
> 
> Diffs
> -
> 
>   indra/newview/llassetuploadresponders.h 767feb16f05f 
>   indra/newview/llassetuploadresponders.cpp 767feb16f05f 
>   indra/newview/lltexlayer.h 767feb16f05f 
>   indra/newview/lltexlayer.cpp 767feb16f05f 
> 
> Diff: http://codereview.secondlife.com/r/152/diff
> 
> 
> Testing
> ---
> 
> Attempted outfit changes using a problematic connection (not recently used 
> outfits to avoid using cached bakes). Looked for "Baked full res texture 
> upload for  failed" log messages, observed the subsequent 
> retries and successful upload for that region. Observed that eventually the 
> fully-baked avatar is visible to other users.
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Thickbrick
> 
>

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Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider

[Ricky]

Thus far I'm in favor of the eye icon. Lately I've been using the
Unreal Developers Kit a lot for classwork, and there is even a 8x8 or
so eye icon that is still legible, though most of the eye icons are
larger.  None have lashes, just the arcs and iris dot.

Once the icon is set, people will get used to it fast.  The issue here
is that there is no "standard" (de facto or otherwise) for an icon
that represents draw distance.  I can't even find a program that has
an icon for the draw distance setting: most either have the setting
hidden in a config menu or, as in Blender, in a sidebar with a textual
heading.

We just don't want to try to redefine an icon that has an existent
strong meaning.  Camera iris is used for brightness, scaled trees (and
magnifying glass) for zoom, magnifying glass and binoculars for
search.  The eye though has no strong meaning in my mind.  UDK uses
the eye for "lock selected actor to the camera" - not exactly an
intuitive use, but they rolled with it.

Ricky
Cron Stardust

On Sun, Jun 12, 2011 at 12:01 PM, Trilo Byte  wrote:
> Agreed regarding the magnifying glass icon - it's used both in SL and in some 
> browsers as an icon representing Search.
>
> The problem with using a 1 tree/many trees approach is that a) that's already 
> used to denote zoom, not viewing distance, and b) that type of display works 
> best when it's on either side of the control in question (either side of  the 
> zoom rocker on a digital camera, for example.
>
> I like the binoculars icon idea, but agree that it could cause confusion 
> since other applications commonly use the symbol for search.
>
> An eye icon has merit, since it controls how much the user sees.  Given the 
> 16x16 pixel constraint, I think the rays/lines coming off the eye would be 
> less clear, and may cause some possible confusion with the speaker/volume 
> icon (which is exactly what you want to avoid).  Speaker icon for what you 
> hear, eye for what you see, seems pretty straightforward, and a tooltip when 
> moused over/used would further eliminate confusion.
>
> As for the notice to pop up when the setting gets raised too high, how about 
> using "caution" in place of "warning". - subtle change in language makes the 
> message read more like helpful guidance.
>
> On Jun 11, 2011, at 4:08 PM, Jonathan Welch wrote:
>
>> While testing the updated graphic I've been looking at the cautionary
>> wording on the slider and am not happy with it.  There is no good way
>> to align the text so it looks nice in all languages and the width of
>> the slider would have to be wide enough to support the longest word in
>> whatever language that happens to be.
>>
>> I am thinking that a warning notification message could be sent if the
>> draw distance is adjusted up past a certain threshold.  Much more
>> explanatory text could be put into this notice and it would also be
>> i10n friendly.
>>
>> Warning: You have just set your draw distance to a large value.  This
>> may cause poor system response.
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Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider

[Lance Corrimal]

I think small binoculars for short range and large ones for long range 
makes the most sense. but since this has been discussed to death, how 
about this, taken from my digital camera...

the glyph for "really short draw distance" is a simplified flower 
(think "closeup" on the presets menu on your casio camera), and the 
glyph for "really loong draw distance" is a simplified mountain 
range (think of the "landscape" setting on the same camera)

and besides that, i think the slider should have a field that shows 
the actual value of the draw distance, and it should change the range 
based on powers of two: 32, 64, 128, 256, 512, 1024

that being said, whats with the symbols anyways. just put in a text 
field with the actual value, and a hovertip that says "this slider 
changes the draw distance. too high values will slow you down to a 
crawl." way less clutter. look at dolphin viewer 2, restrained life, 
and the starlight skins for reference.


bye,
LC




Am Montag, 13. Juni 2011 schrieb Carlo Wood:
> I think that no matter what you draw, the icon
> will not be clear to the majority of people.
> 
> The icon only needs to be recognizable to those
> who saw it before. They will have to learn
> it's meaning from the tool tip imho.
> 
> Nevertheless, binoculars are usually used for
> either zoom or search, so I think another icon
> would be better.
> 
> Thinking about an avatar with a (half) sphere
> around it, I'd use as icon a circle with a dot
> in it, or a half circle with a vertical line
> in the center, ie:
>_ - _
>  .   .
>/ O \
>--|--
> 
> On Mon, 13 Jun 2011 12:14:11 +0200
> 
> Opensource Obscure  wrote:
> > While clear, such an icon doesn't look much self-explaining to me
> > with regard to its associated Draw Distance functionality.
> > 
> > I still feel binoculars may be the best option.
> > 
> > Binoculars may not be a commonly used glyph outside of SL,
> > but it's a fact that many Second Life features are just .. not
> > commonly used features. In most applications / online services /
> > information environments or RL appliances, you just don't have
> > the concept of "Draw Distance" or anything similar.
> > 
> > On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 11:49, Hitomi Tiponi
> > 
> >  wrote:
> > > Yes it's possible (see attached) - but something like that says
> > > 'landscape' or 'plants' to me.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > From: Argent Stonecutter 
> > > To: Hitomi Tiponi 
> > > Cc: a...@skyhighway.com; opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com
> > > Sent: Mon, 13 June, 2011 1:58:54
> > > Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance
> > > slider
> > > 
> > > On 2011-06-12, at 17:30, Hitomi Tiponi wrote:
> > >> /me looks forward to seeing someone draw this one in a 16x16
> > >> pixel grid :)
> > > 
> > > I think three small pine trees could be rendered in a 16x16
> > > grid.
> > > 
> > > ___
> > > Policies and (un)subscribe information available here:
> > > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev
> > > Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated
> > > posting privileges

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Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider

[Lance Corrimal]

this just in from my wife:

the globe icon that's used for "places" in the new search would be a 
nice choice:
small globe on the left for "short draw distance", large globe on the 
right for "large draw distance".

bye,
LC
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Re: [opensource-dev] Review Request: VWR-24889: When a bake texture upload fails, retry instead of giving up.

[Thickbrick Sleaford]

> On June 13, 2011, 8:20 a.m., Oz Linden wrote:
> > indra/newview/lltexlayer.cpp, line 518
> > 
> >
> > what's with the minus one here?

mUploadFailCount counts failures, while BAKE_UPLOAD_ATTEMPTS is the number of 
attempts. When doUpload() is called for the last attempt, mUploadFailCount 
equals BAKE_UPLOAD_ATTEMPTS - 1, since the last failure hasn't occurred yet. 
This tries to do the last upload via the old asset store (UDP), just in case 
the HTTP capability isn't working. Does this still makes sense, or will the 
asset store not be supported soon anyway?


> On June 13, 2011, 8:20 a.m., Oz Linden wrote:
> > indra/newview/lltexlayer.h, line 369
> > 
> >
> > This would be more clear as an enum: when looking at a call to this 
> > method, a value 'true' or 'false' is much less informative that 
> > 'isHighestRes' or 'isLowRes'

I'm not sure that an enum would make this clearer. This is never called with 
hard-coded values, and the value for the only call to this c'tor is taken from 
the result (BOOL) of mTexLayerSet::isLocalTextureDataFinal. Converting the BOOL 
to an enum, just to check later for equality to one of the enum values seems 
redundant to me.


- Thickbrick


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---


On March 1, 2011, 8:58 a.m., Thickbrick Sleaford wrote:
> 
> ---
> This is an automatically generated e-mail. To reply, visit:
> http://codereview.secondlife.com/r/152/
> ---
> 
> (Updated March 1, 2011, 8:58 a.m.)
> 
> 
> Review request for Viewer.
> 
> 
> Summary
> ---
> 
> When a bake upload fails, the viewer doesn't retry it, and subsequently 
> doesn't send a AgentSetAppearance message. This can happen without the user 
> being aware, leaving the avatar looking good on their screen, but not updated 
> to the same outfit on other people's screens. The avatar will remain in that 
> state until the user does something that causes a rebake (manually rebake or 
> change outfit.) The solution here is to retry the upload after a small delay.
> 
> What this diff changes: when a full-res upload fails, retry to upload it 
> after a 5s delay, up to 5 times (in case the cap is available, last attempt 
> is via the old asset store.) Also, some clearer log messages. This implements 
> an old *FIX: comment:
> // *FIX: retry upload after n seconds, asset server could be busy
> 
> This isn't needed for low res uploads, because they don't block subsequent 
> full-res uploads (mNeedsUpload isn't set to FALSE in 
> LLTexLayerSetBuffer::doUpload in low-res uploads.)
> 
> 
> This addresses bug VWR-24889.
> http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-24889
> 
> 
> Diffs
> -
> 
>   indra/newview/llassetuploadresponders.h 767feb16f05f 
>   indra/newview/llassetuploadresponders.cpp 767feb16f05f 
>   indra/newview/lltexlayer.h 767feb16f05f 
>   indra/newview/lltexlayer.cpp 767feb16f05f 
> 
> Diff: http://codereview.secondlife.com/r/152/diff
> 
> 
> Testing
> ---
> 
> Attempted outfit changes using a problematic connection (not recently used 
> outfits to avoid using cached bakes). Looked for "Baked full res texture 
> upload for  failed" log messages, observed the subsequent 
> retries and successful upload for that region. Observed that eventually the 
> fully-baked avatar is visible to other users.
> 
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Thickbrick
> 
>

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[opensource-dev] PO Review Build

[Oz Linden (Scott Lawrence)]

A number of open source contributions are ready for a functional review

STORM-787 
   Mute Gestures Button 
STORM-956 
   Ability to mute dialogs by muting object (or object owner) 
STORM-1103 
   Nearby sidebar minimap should be optional 
STORM-1273 
   Duplicate entries in settings.xml 
STORM-1293 

   Make user aware of the "CTRL + Up/Down Arrow" feature (which scrolls
   back message history) 
STORM-1313 
   Fix for Storm-956 crashes viewer when connected to non-LL grids 




http://automated-builds-secondlife-com.s3.amazonaws.com/hg/repo/oz_viewer-poreview/rev/232771/index.html


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[opensource-dev] Post Open Developer User Group meeting

[WolfPup Lowenhar]

For this discussion please refer to :

https://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Open_Development_User_Group/Archive/2011-06
-13-post-meeting

 

This was an in world discussion of making llconvexdecompositionstub
  into a
functional and working Open Source. Most of you may think I'm still a PITA
with this subject but this is something that needs to be addressed and the
main people that can is the Open Source Developer community. We need to get
this functional BEFORE mesh goes live on the main grid. We do have the mesh
enabled sims on aditi to be able to test with so that we can know if we are
getting it working and working right for the most part.

 

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Re: [opensource-dev] Review Request: VWR-24889: When a bake texture upload fails, retry instead of giving up.

[Thickbrick Sleaford]

---
This is an automatically generated e-mail. To reply, visit:
http://codereview.secondlife.com/r/152/
---

(Updated June 13, 2011, 2:39 p.m.)


Review request for Viewer.


Changes
---

- Fixed typo in comment ("intermediary").
- Changed file-scope constants to static const.
- At Oz's suggestion (in email), delays are now exponential. Oz suggested 
leaving this to hammer the server indefinitely, but I feel more comfortable 
with a limit of 7 attempts. The first attempt is immediate, and 6 retries are 
done with delays: 2s, 4s, ... 64s. The delays sum up to 126 seconds.


Summary
---

When a bake upload fails, the viewer doesn't retry it, and subsequently doesn't 
send a AgentSetAppearance message. This can happen without the user being 
aware, leaving the avatar looking good on their screen, but not updated to the 
same outfit on other people's screens. The avatar will remain in that state 
until the user does something that causes a rebake (manually rebake or change 
outfit.) The solution here is to retry the upload after a small delay.

What this diff changes: when a full-res upload fails, retry to upload it after 
a 5s delay, up to 5 times (in case the cap is available, last attempt is via 
the old asset store.) Also, some clearer log messages. This implements an old 
*FIX: comment:
// *FIX: retry upload after n seconds, asset server could be busy

This isn't needed for low res uploads, because they don't block subsequent 
full-res uploads (mNeedsUpload isn't set to FALSE in 
LLTexLayerSetBuffer::doUpload in low-res uploads.)


This addresses bug VWR-24889.
http://jira.secondlife.com/browse/VWR-24889


Diffs (updated)
-

  indra/newview/llassetuploadresponders.h df4801993ea4 
  indra/newview/llassetuploadresponders.cpp df4801993ea4 
  indra/newview/lltexlayer.h df4801993ea4 
  indra/newview/lltexlayer.cpp df4801993ea4 

Diff: http://codereview.secondlife.com/r/152/diff


Testing
---

Attempted outfit changes using a problematic connection (not recently used 
outfits to avoid using cached bakes). Looked for "Baked full res texture upload 
for  failed" log messages, observed the subsequent retries and 
successful upload for that region. Observed that eventually the fully-baked 
avatar is visible to other users.


Thanks,

Thickbrick

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Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider

[aklo]

While clear, such an icon doesn't look much self-explaining to me
with regard to its associated Draw Distance functionality.

I still feel binoculars may be the best option.

Binoculars may not be a commonly used glyph outside of SL,
but it's a fact that many Second Life features are just .. not commonly
used features. In most applications / online services / information
environments or RL appliances, you just don't have the concept
of "Draw Distance" or anything similar.

On Mon, Jun 13, 2011 at 11:49, Hitomi Tiponi 
wrote:
> > Yes it's possible (see attached) - but something like that says
'landscape'
> > or 'plants' to me.
> >
> > 
> > From: Argent Stonecutter 
> > To: Hitomi Tiponi 
> > Cc: a...@skyhighway.com; opensource-dev@lists.secondlife.com
> > Sent: Mon, 13 June, 2011 1:58:54
> > Subject: Re: [opensource-dev] Review viewer -- draw distance slider
Hey guys,

i had an idea and i tried to draw it, but it was sorta disappointing.  It
looks sorta ok at 32x32, but at 16x16 it starts to get kinda, "Huh?"  See,
it's supposed to be a hand drawing.  Like holding a pencil, with an arrow
underneath it pointing the direction it's drawing.  i attached a copy of
the 32x32 one to this message.

You can laugh at it and call it names if you want.  It was just an idea. 
i've been sick like fever puking for three days and today one of my teeth
started on the pain like please just give me to the CIA and let them
torture me to death thing, so it's not like you could possibly make
anything hurt worse.  Maybe it will even give someone a better idea?  i
can do way better graphic art, too, but maybe not while i'm shaking,
sweating, and trying not to scream myself unconscious.

Have fun!

- AK

> >
> > On 2011-06-12, at 17:30, Hitomi Tiponi wrote:
>> >> /me looks forward to seeing someone draw this one in a 16x16 pixel
grid :)
> >
> > I think three small pine trees could be rendered in a 16x16 grid.
> >
> > ___
> > Policies and (un)subscribe information available here:
> > http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/OpenSource-Dev
> > Please read the policies before posting to keep unmoderated posting
> > privileges
> >


-- Opensource Obscure -- http://twitter.com/oobscure -
http://opensourceobscure.com/lol discuss Second Life Viewer 2:
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Re: [opensource-dev] PO Review Build

[Anya Kanevsky]

2011/6/13 Oz Linden (Scott Lawrence) 

>  A number of open source contributions are ready for a functional review
>
>  STORM-787  Mute Gestures
> Button
>
approved, great stuff

>  STORM-956  Ability to mute
> dialogs by muting object (or object owner)
>
this is an old closed jira and I see no recent activity on it - what is the
current change?


>  STORM-1103  Nearby sidebar
> minimap should be optional
>
approved, great stuff too!


>  STORM-1273  Duplicate
> entries in settings.xml
>
approved

>  STORM-1293  Make user aware
> of the "CTRL + Up/Down Arrow" feature (which scrolls back message history)
>
esbee's going to run this by UX

>  STORM-1313  Fix for
> Storm-956 crashes viewer when connected to non-LL grids
>

>
> http://automated-builds-secondlife-com.s3.amazonaws.com/hg/repo/oz_viewer-poreview/rev/232771/index.html
>
>
>
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