Re: how to find dependencies when building a new kernel
On Nov 30, 2011, at 12:15 PM, Torsten Valentin wrote: >> dmesg is the lazy way to get this info, the same info is written to >> /var/log/messages during boot. Are you saying your system is so >> stripped down you don't even log anything? > > Yep. And because the only persistent memory is Flash (32MB, which > quickly dies if you permanently write to it), the whole system runs > inside a RAMDISK only. And there is no terminal or ssh. Modifying the > system means setting up a new system with modified /sbin/init each time. Would you be able to use TFTP to try booting test kernels off a remote machine? That's how I tend to do it when I'm trying not to write to flash on my routers while I'm building test kernels. You only have to change flags in the bootloader (of course, I have no idea how feasible that is for you, either; when you say there's no terminal, I assume you probably can't do that except through /etc/boot.conf). - Dave
Re: Something similar to Soekris boards, for server applications
On Nov 30, 2011, at 1:12 PM, Bentley, Dain wrote: > I second that. I run an atom 330 with two gigs of RAM and two 500gig drives in > a raid for development server at home is a 1u case. It performs great and its > low power My router runs an Atom Mini-ITX board. Nothing heavy duty, but it's a dual-core Atom (N550, dual-core 64-bit with Hyperthreading, so OpenBSD sees it as 4 cores). Jetway also has a really neat "daughterboard" system which is basically a small 66 MHz PCI risier card; my router runs on the 3 Intel NIC daughtercard they have (leaving an extra 2 Realtek ports). It also has a Mini-PCIe slot, which I fitted with a wireless card (currently the Centrino Advanced-N 6230, which doesn't work with OpenBSD and I don't have time to work on the driver ATM). If you're running a server, you could fit whatever you wanted in there that goes in a Mini-PCIe slot (crypto card, etc). My particular board is the NC9C-550, which I've been happy with (though the BIOS is really badly done; you have to turn off the energy saving feature in the BIOS to make it turn on at AC power restoration, which is just stupid). I've been otherwise quite happy with it. - Dave
Re: Something similar to Soekris boards, for server applications
On Nov 30, 2011, at 2:18 PM, Mehma Sarja wrote: > I'm putting a Supermicro Atom D510 in the field as a SSD-based firewall and boot server for 158 users. And a Supermicro D525 as a file server with a 1 TB drive. Where they are going, they have power issues and low-power systems, with a UPS, might just survive. Each is maxed out with 4GB RAM. And I am also keeping one application per machine for simple maintenance and 'safeguard' performance. I should also note that if you're considering an Atom N550, it has a limit of 2GB RAM (which is odd, considering it's 64-bit running DDR3 and its predecessor, the N525, maxes out at 4GB of DDR2). Crucial seems to think that's not the case, and I can't convince them otherwise. - Dave
Re: Narcicism?
On Dec 1, 2011, at 10:25 AM, John Tate wrote: > On Thu, Dec 1, 2011 at 7:20 PM, Scott McEachern wrote: > >> On 12/01/11 02:28, John Tate wrote: >> >>> I think I've found a bug in the OpenBSD crowd. They bug the hell out of me >>> and my little mistakes. >>> >>> I am not talking about people who actually have a solution, but I can't >>> seem to ask anything on this list without parrots coming along picking on >>> me. I think some people just hang out here because it's the most anal >>> bunch >>> of hackers ever, in recorded history. What are your experiences? >>> >> > I'm 24 years old. I was a Linux hacker since I was 13. I am a bit of a guru > and do my own Kerberos and such on an all BSD/Linux network. OpenBSD and > Debian Linux. I love OpenBSD, I'm a bit weird because I use bash. I can put > up with being made fun of. At 13 I didn't just start learning Linux I > started learning C++ as well. I failed to apprehend it properly at that > age, but at an older age I relearned it well. I am the guru sort of guy, I > know a hell of a lot but I'm still connecting it and in that sense still > learning. I'm wary of 24-year-olds calling themselves gurus. I'm only 28, but for me, that's at least old enough to know that there's a lot I don't know. I think you'll find most of the "serious" people on this list also started programming in the language of their respective times about the same time you did. The problem is not the list or the operating system, it's your attitude. Yes, you find yourself getting picked on a lot, but at times it's largely because you've been sloppy. When I get picked on because I've been sloppy, I take it in stride and try to learn a lesson from it (at work, they apply a "Dave Riley Coefficient" of about 2.5 to any time estimates I make, for example, because I'm consistently bad at it; it's something I'm still working on, but there's no reason for me to take it personally). This is not the list to come to if you want hand-holding or soothing words to assure you that you're master of your domain. It's not an operating system for people who don't like digging into the guts of things, which is partly why it's not wildly popular. To that extent, there's an expectation that if you have a problem with NFS, and Google hasn't provided the instant answer you expected, you might dig around in the (very good) documentation to see how it really works instead of just asking for the quick answers. To wit: Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for the night. Set fire to a man, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life. - Terry Pratchett So if you get burned over and over because of the same goof (not RTFMing), perhaps it's time to stop complaining about being cold. - Dave
Re: Narcicism?
On Dec 1, 2011, at 2:39 PM, Dmitrij Czarkoff wrote: > On Thu, Dec 1, 2011 at 4:25 PM, John Tate wrote: >> I'm 24 years old. I was a Linux hacker since I was 13. >> <...> >> At 13 I didn't just start learning Linux I started learning C++ as well. > > Are You sure? You wrote C++ Linux kernel code in 2000? Really? To be fair, he didn't say that. - Dave
Re: Narcicism?
On Dec 2, 2011, at 3:45 PM, Dmitrij Czarkoff wrote: > On Thu, Dec 1, 2011 at 9:09 PM, David Riley wrote: >> On Dec 1, 2011, at 2:39 PM, Dmitrij Czarkoff wrote: >> >>> On Thu, Dec 1, 2011 at 4:25 PM, John Tate wrote: >>>> I'm 24 years old. I was a Linux hacker since I was 13. >>>> <...> >>>> At 13 I didn't just start learning Linux I started learning C++ as well. >>> >>> Are You sure? You wrote C++ Linux kernel code in 2000? Really? >> >> To be fair, he didn't say that. > > Being an XYZ hacker means programming XYZ in non-trivial, advanced > ways, doesn't it? As he only mentioned C++, I assume that he only knew > C++ by then. So, if the only programming language he knew was C++ and > he programmed Linux, I conclude that he did his Linux hacking in C++. > Where am I wrong? I guess I'm running on the assumption that since C++ is a superset of C (with caveats, of course, some of which are why they're not Linus' preference for the kernel), one has to know C before knowing C++ (or at least as a product of knowing it). That, of course, does not mean one is *good* at C; I've seen plenty of people crippled in writing straight procedural code because they never bothered to learn how to do it right. The other inference you could make is that he already knew C when he started "hacking Linux" and started learning C++ at the same time. That's the conclusion I drew. You could easily draw both conclusions, I guess, since the wording was a smidge ambiguous. - Dave
Re: Narcicism?
On Dec 2, 2011, at 4:20 PM, Dmitrij Czarkoff wrote: > On Fri, Dec 2, 2011 at 10:11 PM, David Riley wrote: >> one has to know C before knowing C++ > > Well, I don't know how it happens in US or Canada, but in Russia > ordinarily people first learn C++, and then (may be) C. Yes, knowing > C++ implies substantial knowledge of C, but the point still stands. He > didn't say a word about C, which would have been more relevant, so I > assume that he was exaggerating his involvement with Linux and > hacking. The way it typically works in the US is that no one learns anything of any value unless they do it themselves. :-) Our high schools are still teaching Java as a first language in some cases, which hopefully in Russia gets you dragged out and shot. - Dave
Re: RAM seen vs. RAM available HP ML 570 G2
On Dec 7, 2011, at 10:05 AM, Nomen Nescio wrote: >> Yes, exactly. OpenBSD supports >4GB RAM only on 64-bit architectures. > > Isn't that a limitation of Intel x32 rather than an OpenBSD limitation? Yes and no; higher-end Intel 32-bit parts from the Pentium Pro upward supported Physical Address Extension, which (IIRC) gave 36 bits of physical address space (similar to how you could have 18 or 22 bits of address space on a 16-bit PDP-11 through the magic of memory mapping). Your virtual addresses are limited to 32 bits still, so any given process could only use 4 GB, but the total amount of RAM in the system could be larger. - Dave
Re: OpenBSD recommendation
On Oct 23, 2011, at 9:41 PM, Daniel Villarreal wrote: > Zantgo, > Just to get you started, I recommend just installing OpenBSD 4.9 for now, on > a dedicated hard drive, so you can get a basic setup going. > > Let me know how it goes. > > take care, > Daniel Villarreal I'll echo that; you would do well to get used to operating a BSD system if you're used to Linux. It's different in a lot of conventions, some of which will catch you off guard. I'll be glad to help if I can, though I'll warn that my Spanish is basically limited to what I can guess from Latin and the little bit I hear in everyday life. :-) - Dave
Re: ThinkPad 600 screen size.
On Nov 4, 2011, at 12:59 PM, Stefan Unterweger wrote: > * David Walker on Fri, Nov 04, 2011 at 07:20:43PM +1030: >> This BIOS is ... sad. >> It's mouse driven - the cursor is a bird that flaps its wings. :[ > > Some people at IBM really had too much time at their hands... Reminds me actually of the really awful AMI WinBIOS that came on a 486 board I had a while ago. It was actually a pretty nice board except for that, but whoever decided that the BIOS needed a "friendly" mouse-driven interface ought to be dragged out into the street and shot.
