Media Server To Replace iTunes?

[Sabahattin Gucukoglu]

Hi guys, and especially those with NAS products or other similar do-it-yourself 
mass storage inclinations. :)

Unless my research has misled me, the only solution Apple offers for the 
increasingly common situation of needing access to a central media library with 
multiple devices around the house is Home Sharing.  But Home Sharing requires 
an always-on Mac or Windows box, running iTunes, and provides no way for adding 
to or editing the library stored on the remote machine, or downloading content 
to an iOS device.  This makes it rather unsuitable, by itself.  Moving the 
iTunes library onto the NAS works for storage, but is still fundamentally a 
single-user solution, and still requires syncing for satellite devices for any 
media other than music (which requires the cloud) or an open copy of iTunes 
(which requires that access be coordinated).  In fact, after all of the reading 
I’ve done, I’ve never had more respect for Microsoft: their media centre was 
not only designed to run unattended, but even helpfully incorporated any files 
you added into any of its watch folders.  I’m utterly astonished that Apple 
never predicted this use case.

So, I have to ask: how have you, dear reader, solved this problem?

I would like as much of the following to be true as is reasonably possible:
Compatibility with all existing protected and unprotected iTunes library 
content except apps (but including Audible books downloaded direct from 
Audible). Clients should maintain keys.
A server component that can run on a NAS (preferably Open-Source code).
Stream as well as download, on all devices.  No syncing, please.
As much integration with iTunes as possible (tracks metadata and library 
changes).
As much remote manipulation as possible (new media, change metadata).
Avoids the cloud.  Apple lossless is a dead zone for iTunes Match, as are large 
libraries, but I’ll renew if need be.
AirPlay and Apple TV are nice-to-have, but are not really required because of 
iOS relays.

I am willing to seriously consider, if there’s a real need:
Virtual Windows machines running iTunes housed on my server, if remote desktop 
is available or other tools can be used to update the library and metadata.
A dedicated Mac for iTunes, as well as the OS X server cache for cloud content, 
hacked so it writes its data to the network shares of my NAS.
Filesystem-based navigation, if all else fails for downloads and playback, as 
long as it works on iOS for satellite jaunts.
A compromise to use iTunes, only for protected content. (I’ll stop buying 
protected content.)
Surrender.  Continue centralising the library on the NAS, use my iMac only, 
sync all but the music, and keep renewing iTunes Match.

Your thoughts gratefully appreciated.

Cheers,
Sabahattin

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Re: Apple TV 4th Gen

[Sabahattin Gucukoglu]

Not until BBC iPlayer gets rolled out and has the same coverage as their 
dreadful web player.

But that, of course, is just me.

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Re: Apple TV 4th Gen

[Brian Fischler]

Like many have said it really depends on what you are looking to use it for. As 
far as streaming movies from iTunes it is fantastic as I have been ripping all 
my DVDs to an external hard drive. Considering all my DVDs have been sitting in 
boxes for 7 years because I can no longer read what each DVD is nor do I have 
an accessible DVD player for the menu this process makes the AppleTV well worth 
it. Also if you are a cable subscriber you can unlock a lot of features. If you 
have the money go ahead and get the 32 gig model unless you are a big gamer 
than you may want to go with the bigger hard drive. Also the updated remote 
iPhone app makes for a much better typing experience and the bigger touch area 
on the iPhone is also nice.
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 8:22 AM, Sabahattin Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
> Not until BBC iPlayer gets rolled out and has the same coverage as their 
> dreadful web player.
> 
> But that, of course, is just me.
> 
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Optimising voice-over for use with Dragon?

[Trahern Culver]

hi all,  I have recently acquired a copy of Dragon five for Mac OS X for 
use on university course, is there anything I can do to optimise voice-over 
for use with DragonDictate? Your help with this question would be most 
welcome kind regards Trey.

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Re: How to create a multi part archive compressed on the mac.

[Sabahattin Gucukoglu]

Be aware that the technique of using split and cat, while certainly effective, 
is not actually the same thing as producing what the current zip tools call 
“Split” (or, before then, “Spanned”) archives.  For the production of the 
former from an already-created zip file, see zipsplit(1), which is part of 
InfoZIP and is also already on your Mac (requires command-line foo).  The 
resulting files will include the necessary magic header, and end up as 
file.zip, file.z00, file.z01, and so forth.

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Re: How to create a multi part archive compressed on the mac.

['Chris Blouch' via MacVisionaries]

My understanding is that it will create the splits to contain whole 
files. So if you are compressing a folder full of little files then 
zipsplit can work well. If you are trying to split a single large file, 
like a video file, then zipsplit won't be able to break it up. It's also 
limited to 2GB per split file. You have to specify the max number of 
bytes per split file with the -n parameter. So if you wanted 10MB files 
you would put -n 10485760. zipsplit also won't take data piped into it 
so you have to create the zip file first then run zipsplit on that. The 
unixy way using split and cat is just more robust but at least with 
terminal on osx you have lots of ways to do things. Of course the real 
unixy way would be to use tar -zcvf to create a compressed archive. Tar 
stands for Tape Archive, which gives you an idea how far back that 
command goes. In all cases doing "man command_name" will give you the 
manual page for whatever command you want to know about. "man tar" will 
give you all the options and examples for the tar command, and yes, you 
can do "man man" to find out how to use the man command :)


CB

On 12/16/15 9:51 AM, Sabahattin Gucukoglu wrote:

Be aware that the technique of using split and cat, while certainly effective, 
is not actually the same thing as producing what the current zip tools call 
“Split” (or, before then, “Spanned”) archives.  For the production of the 
former from an already-created zip file, see zipsplit(1), which is part of 
InfoZIP and is also already on your Mac (requires command-line foo).  The 
resulting files will include the necessary magic header, and end up as 
file.zip, file.z00, file.z01, and so forth.



--
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Re: Apple TV 4th Gen

[Jonathan Mosen]

BBC iPlayer was released for Apple TV 4 a couple of days ago, complete with 
live streaming of BBC channels, and audio description. It's awesome.
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org

> On 17/12/2015, at 2:22 AM, Sabahattin Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
> Not until BBC iPlayer gets rolled out and has the same coverage as their 
> dreadful web player.
> 
> But that, of course, is just me.
> 
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Most efficient way to read emails

[Traci Duncan]

Hi all,

I’d like to here how people read their emails in Mac Mail.  Personally, I’m 
finding it rather cumbersome & time consuming.  Here is what I typically do…  
Hopefully, y’all have a better way.

I use classic layout.  Quick-nav is off & I hit right arrow to open the message 
thread.  I navigate to the earliest message in the discussion & hit command-o 
to open.  Once I’ve read that message, command-w to close, then delete.  I then 
arrow up to the next message in the thread.  I do this until I’m done reading 
the discussion.

I’ve had inconsistent success with opening a thread by command-o, then using 
vo-j to jump message to message, but this doesn’t work all the time.

Please, any tips?  Does anyone use the other layout in mail?  Is it faster?  
The one little time saver I miss, is deleting a message right from the message 
window.  It seems I need to close it first to successfully delete it.

Thank you, I appreciate the help.
Traci

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Re: Apple TV 4th Gen

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

My guess is, I have to be in the U K to use it though, no?

Chris.

  - Original Message - 
  From: Jonathan Mosen 
  To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 10:34 AM
  Subject: Re: Apple TV 4th Gen


  BBC iPlayer was released for Apple TV 4 a couple of days ago, complete with 
live streaming of BBC channels, and audio description. It's awesome.

  Jonathan Mosen
  Mosen Consulting
  Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
  http://Mosen.org


On 17/12/2015, at 2:22 AM, Sabahattin Gucukoglu  wrote:


Not until BBC iPlayer gets rolled out and has the same coverage as their 
dreadful web player.

But that, of course, is just me.

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Re: Most efficient way to read emails

[Gerard Doody]

Hi all, I use the original mac default to read my mail by unchecking the 
classical mail box.  this is found i “viewing” 
Then by using the jump command (voj) I can move between the message list and 
the text itself.  When I get to the messages table I can then delete messages.  
When I was using the layout with the classical box checked, I just hit enter on 
the mail I wished to read and then commandj-w to close it.  I hope that helps. 
JerryDoody
jerrydood...@gmail.com 
On Dec 16, 2015, at 10:57 am, Traci Duncan  wrote:

Hi all,

I’d like to here how people read their emails in Mac Mail.  Personally, I’m 
finding it rather cumbersome & time consuming.  Here is what I typically do…  
Hopefully, y’all have a better way.

I use classic layout.  Quick-nav is off & I hit right arrow to open the message 
thread.  I navigate to the earliest message in the discussion & hit command-o 
to open.  Once I’ve read that message, command-w to close, then delete.  I then 
arrow up to the next message in the thread.  I do this until I’m done reading 
the discussion.

I’ve had inconsistent success with opening a thread by command-o, then using 
vo-j to jump message to message, but this doesn’t work all the time.

Please, any tips?  Does anyone use the other layout in mail?  Is it faster?  
The one little time saver I miss, is deleting a message right from the message 
window.  It seems I need to close it first to successfully delete it.

Thank you, I appreciate the help.
Traci

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RE: Most efficient way to read emails

[M. Taylor]

Hello Traci,

I am a huge fan of the Mac Mail application.  In fact, I think it the absolute 
best resource that the Mac has to offer.  With it, I can go through hundreds 
and hundreds of messages in just a few minutes with a minimum of keystrokes as 
VoiceOver automatically reads each message as it comes into focus.  

Having said this, there are a few things one must do in which to get this to 
happen.

IN this post, I will only sketch out the broad strokes as a more detailed 
description would take more time to list than I have, at the moment.

1.
You must use the Default layout view, complete with the preview pane intact.  
More simply put, do not modify the default view.

2.
You must use the conversation view with all conversations, collapsed.  

3.
Your primary navigation key will be the Tab Key along with the arrow keys.  
Generally speaking, there is no need to use the enter key, the command+o key 
combo nor the command+w key-combo.

If you would like more details on how to use the application as I do, please 
send me a message, off-list and we can schedule a time for a live walk-through, 
via phone.

Mark   

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Traci Duncan
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 7:57 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Most efficient way to read emails

Hi all,

I’d like to here how people read their emails in Mac Mail.  Personally, I’m 
finding it rather cumbersome & time consuming.  Here is what I typically do…  
Hopefully, y’all have a better way.

I use classic layout.  Quick-nav is off & I hit right arrow to open the message 
thread.  I navigate to the earliest message in the discussion & hit command-o 
to open.  Once I’ve read that message, command-w to close, then delete.  I then 
arrow up to the next message in the thread.  I do this until I’m done reading 
the discussion.

I’ve had inconsistent success with opening a thread by command-o, then using 
vo-j to jump message to message, but this doesn’t work all the time.

Please, any tips?  Does anyone use the other layout in mail?  Is it faster?  
The one little time saver I miss, is deleting a message right from the message 
window.  It seems I need to close it first to successfully delete it.

Thank you, I appreciate the help.
Traci

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RE: Apple TV 4th Gen

[george b]

Jonathen,

 

I do a search in the app store BBC iPlayer, and I get a bunch of choices like 
radio things which do I pick to get the t v things

 

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Jonathan Mosen
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 07:35
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple TV 4th Gen

 

BBC iPlayer was released for Apple TV 4 a couple of days ago, complete with 
live streaming of BBC channels, and audio description. It's awesome.

Jonathan Mosen

Mosen Consulting

Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training

http://Mosen.org

 

On 17/12/2015, at 2:22 AM, Sabahattin Gucukoglu mailto:listse...@me.com> > wrote:

 

Not until BBC iPlayer gets rolled out and has the same coverage as their 
dreadful web player.

But that, of course, is just me.

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Re: Apple TV 4th Gen

[Jonathan Mosen]

Hi George, you'll need an account in the UK App Store. And you'll also need 
technology to overcome the geo-blocking of the content. In the case of Apple 
TV, that would have to be a DNS redirection service such as UnoTelly or 
Unblock-US.
My audio book, Imagine There's No Countries, covers both subjects. 
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org

> On 17/12/2015, at 6:10 AM, george b  wrote:
> 
> Jonathen,
>  
> I do a search in the app store BBC iPlayer, and I get a bunch of choices like 
> radio things which do I pick to get the t v things
>  
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>  
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> ] On Behalf Of Jonathan Mosen
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 07:35
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> Subject: Re: Apple TV 4th Gen
>  
> BBC iPlayer was released for Apple TV 4 a couple of days ago, complete with 
> live streaming of BBC channels, and audio description. It's awesome.
> Jonathan Mosen
> Mosen Consulting
> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
> http://Mosen.org 
>  
>> On 17/12/2015, at 2:22 AM, Sabahattin Gucukoglu > > wrote:
>>  
>> Not until BBC iPlayer gets rolled out and has the same coverage as their 
>> dreadful web player.
>> 
>> But that, of course, is just me.
>> 
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Re: Apple TV 4th Gen

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

That's kind of what I suspected.

Thanks for the heads up.

Chris.

  - Original Message - 
  From: Jonathan Mosen 
  To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 12:21 PM
  Subject: Re: Apple TV 4th Gen


  Hi George, you'll need an account in the UK App Store. And you'll also need 
technology to overcome the geo-blocking of the content. In the case of Apple 
TV, that would have to be a DNS redirection service such as UnoTelly or 
Unblock-US.
  My audio book, Imagine There's No Countries, covers both subjects. 

  Jonathan Mosen
  Mosen Consulting
  Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
  http://Mosen.org


On 17/12/2015, at 6:10 AM, george b  wrote:


Jonathen,

I do a search in the app store BBC iPlayer, and I get a bunch of choices 
like radio things which do I pick to get the t v things

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jonathan Mosen
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 07:35
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple TV 4th Gen

BBC iPlayer was released for Apple TV 4 a couple of days ago, complete with 
live streaming of BBC channels, and audio description. It's awesome.
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org

  On 17/12/2015, at 2:22 AM, Sabahattin Gucukoglu  wrote:

  Not until BBC iPlayer gets rolled out and has the same coverage as their 
dreadful web player.

  But that, of course, is just me.

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RE: Apple TV 4th Gen

[george b]

Thanks for the heads up

 

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Jonathan Mosen
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 09:21
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple TV 4th Gen

 

Hi George, you'll need an account in the UK App Store. And you'll also need 
technology to overcome the geo-blocking of the content. In the case of Apple 
TV, that would have to be a DNS redirection service such as UnoTelly or 
Unblock-US.

My audio book, Imagine There's No Countries, covers both subjects. 

Jonathan Mosen

Mosen Consulting

Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training

http://Mosen.org

 

On 17/12/2015, at 6:10 AM, george b mailto:gbma...@gmail.com> > wrote:

 

Jonathen,

 

I do a search in the app store BBC iPlayer, and I get a bunch of choices like 
radio things which do I pick to get the t v things

 

From:   macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
[  
mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jonathan Mosen
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 07:35
To:   macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple TV 4th Gen

 

BBC iPlayer was released for Apple TV 4 a couple of days ago, complete with 
live streaming of BBC channels, and audio description. It's awesome.

Jonathan Mosen

Mosen Consulting

Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training

  http://Mosen.org

 

On 17/12/2015, at 2:22 AM, Sabahattin Gucukoglu <  
listse...@me.com> wrote:

 

Not until BBC iPlayer gets rolled out and has the same coverage as their 
dreadful web player.

But that, of course, is just me.

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my impressions of El Capitan

[Mike Arrigo]

Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, 
glad you enjoyed it.
el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows 
such as the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, 
that setting does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've 
tried the new way of not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, 
honestly I prefer the previous way of handling this. When using the new 
settings, you have to navigate over every item in a tool bar to get 
past it, with the standard setting, you can simply skip what you're not 
interested in. I wasn't sure if system integrity protection would cause 
any problems, but so far it hasn't been an issue.


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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[Brian Howerton]

Yeah, I am definitely a fan of the standard way of voiceover interaction.  
Trying the new ways seems weird to me after being used to the standard way for 
so long.
Brian
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:13 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
> 
> Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, glad you 
> enjoyed it.
> el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows such as 
> the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, that setting 
> does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've tried the new way of 
> not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, honestly I prefer the 
> previous way of handling this. When using the new settings, you have to 
> navigate over every item in a tool bar to get past it, with the standard 
> setting, you can simply skip what you're not interested in. I wasn't sure if 
> system integrity protection would cause any problems, but so far it hasn't 
> been an issue.
> 
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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[Mary Otten]

I am still on Yosemite. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this new way of 
interaction simply a choice? If so, that would seem to be the best of all 
worlds, since people who like it can have it, and those who can't don't have 
to. I can certainly see times when it would be better to do the new way. And 
for people coming to the Mac, having to do all that interaction is kind of a 
pain in the whatever.
Mary

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 16, 2015, at 11:14 AM, Brian Howerton  wrote:
> 
> Yeah, I am definitely a fan of the standard way of voiceover interaction.  
> Trying the new ways seems weird to me after being used to the standard way 
> for so long.
> Brian
>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:13 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
>> 
>> Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, glad you 
>> enjoyed it.
>> el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows such as 
>> the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, that setting 
>> does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've tried the new way of 
>> not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, honestly I prefer the 
>> previous way of handling this. When using the new settings, you have to 
>> navigate over every item in a tool bar to get past it, with the standard 
>> setting, you can simply skip what you're not interested in. I wasn't sure if 
>> system integrity protection would cause any problems, but so far it hasn't 
>> been an issue.
>> 
>> -- 
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>> Visionaries list.
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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[Brian Howerton]

Definitely is a choice.
Brian
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:17 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> I am still on Yosemite. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this new way of 
> interaction simply a choice? If so, that would seem to be the best of all 
> worlds, since people who like it can have it, and those who can't don't have 
> to. I can certainly see times when it would be better to do the new way. And 
> for people coming to the Mac, having to do all that interaction is kind of a 
> pain in the whatever.
> Mary
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 11:14 AM, Brian Howerton  wrote:
>> 
>> Yeah, I am definitely a fan of the standard way of voiceover interaction.  
>> Trying the new ways seems weird to me after being used to the standard way 
>> for so long.
>> Brian
>>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:13 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, glad 
>>> you enjoyed it.
>>> el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows such 
>>> as the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, that 
>>> setting does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've tried the 
>>> new way of not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, honestly I 
>>> prefer the previous way of handling this. When using the new settings, you 
>>> have to navigate over every item in a tool bar to get past it, with the 
>>> standard setting, you can simply skip what you're not interested in. I 
>>> wasn't sure if system integrity protection would cause any problems, but so 
>>> far it hasn't been an issue.
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
>>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
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IPod touch sixth generation and Bluetooth or airplay

[Mary Otten]

I am sending this to both lists because it is possible there are some iPod 
touch users on the Mac visionaries list who are not on the VI phone list. I am 
interested in your experiences with iPod touch sixth generation using Bluetooth 
or airplay. Using my iPhone, I have noticed some strange anomalies with the 
volume when using Bluetooth, such that the music volume goes down. I have 
noticed with airplay that sometimes the voice over volume goes down. I do not 
have audio ducking on. And I wonder are people with iPod touches experiencing 
this? One really strange example happens with my UE megaboom pair of speakers. 
When I use that with my iPhone, the volume on the speaker to which the phone is 
directly connected via Bluetooth takes a major hit. If I connect an android 
device to Bluetooth that same speaker has no problem, and stereo balance is 
maintained. That's one of the few good things I can say for the Nexus device I 
recently bought, but that is another story entirely. My interest is in the iPod 
touch, wondering if this is a problem unique to iPhones, unique to my iPhone, 
or something general with iOS 9 and these devices.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

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Re: Most efficient way to read emails

[Georgina Joyce]

Hello,

I too am a fan of the Apple mail. I do not use classic view., I have 5 lines 
showing. I just curser down and 5 lines is enough to judge whether I  want to 
open it. Most messages I don’t bother. I just hit the delete key. This is using 
the wired keyboard. I only expand the thread I want to read. I haven’t found 
how to have 5 lines displayed for individual messages in a thread. I hit return 
to open message if I want to read more than the 5 lines. Or in a threaded 
message. I also use a smart mailbox with all my unread messages. Other rules 
for my PayPal receipts for example, are automatically moved into their 
respective mailboxes. I do need to open such messages to gain the read flag.

HTH

Gena


> On 16 Dec 2015, at 16:26, M. Taylor  wrote:
> 
> Hello Traci,
> 
> I am a huge fan of the Mac Mail application.  In fact, I think it the 
> absolute best resource that the Mac has to offer.  With it, I can go through 
> hundreds and hundreds of messages in just a few minutes with a minimum of 
> keystrokes as VoiceOver automatically reads each message as it comes into 
> focus.  
> 
> Having said this, there are a few things one must do in which to get this to 
> happen.
> 
> IN this post, I will only sketch out the broad strokes as a more detailed 
> description would take more time to list than I have, at the moment.
> 
> 1.
> You must use the Default layout view, complete with the preview pane intact.  
> More simply put, do not modify the default view.
> 
> 2.
> You must use the conversation view with all conversations, collapsed.  
> 
> 3.
> Your primary navigation key will be the Tab Key along with the arrow keys.  
> Generally speaking, there is no need to use the enter key, the command+o key 
> combo nor the command+w key-combo.
> 
> If you would like more details on how to use the application as I do, please 
> send me a message, off-list and we can schedule a time for a live 
> walk-through, via phone.
> 
> Mark   
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Traci Duncan
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 7:57 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Most efficient way to read emails
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I’d like to here how people read their emails in Mac Mail.  Personally, I’m 
> finding it rather cumbersome & time consuming.  Here is what I typically do…  
> Hopefully, y’all have a better way.
> 
> I use classic layout.  Quick-nav is off & I hit right arrow to open the 
> message thread.  I navigate to the earliest message in the discussion & hit 
> command-o to open.  Once I’ve read that message, command-w to close, then 
> delete.  I then arrow up to the next message in the thread.  I do this until 
> I’m done reading the discussion.
> 
> I’ve had inconsistent success with opening a thread by command-o, then using 
> vo-j to jump message to message, but this doesn’t work all the time.
> 
> Please, any tips?  Does anyone use the other layout in mail?  Is it faster?  
> The one little time saver I miss, is deleting a message right from the 
> message window.  It seems I need to close it first to successfully delete it.
> 
> Thank you, I appreciate the help.
> Traci
> 
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RE: IPod touch sixth generation and Bluetooth or airplay

[george b]

The stero function with the mega boom speakers and Bluetooth do not work

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 11:34
To: VIPhone 'Carol Pearson' via ; 
macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: IPod touch sixth generation and Bluetooth or airplay

I am sending this to both lists because it is possible there are some iPod 
touch users on the Mac visionaries list who are not on the VI phone list. I am 
interested in your experiences with iPod touch sixth generation using Bluetooth 
or airplay. Using my iPhone, I have noticed some strange anomalies with the 
volume when using Bluetooth, such that the music volume goes down. I have 
noticed with airplay that sometimes the voice over volume goes down. I do not 
have audio ducking on. And I wonder are people with iPod touches experiencing 
this? One really strange example happens with my UE megaboom pair of speakers. 
When I use that with my iPhone, the volume on the speaker to which the phone is 
directly connected via Bluetooth takes a major hit. If I connect an android 
device to Bluetooth that same speaker has no problem, and stereo balance is 
maintained. That's one of the few good things I can say for the Nexus device I 
recently bought, but that is another story entirely. My interest is in the iPod 
touch, wondering if this is a problem unique to iPhones, unique to my iPhone, 
or something general with iOS 9 and these devices.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[Robin]

HeyMike,

Have you EVER recorded a PodCast in which you demonstrated VO 
(VoiceOver) with Apple's iWorksSuite (Pages,Numbers,& 
KeyNote,etc.)??? JustWondering


And, if not, would you be interested in doing so? I presume since 
they are FREE with the purchase of an iDevice and/or Mac, that would 
benefit some of "us" TotallyBlind & LowVision users of AppleComputers


Thanx 4 YourPodcasts, they are GreatlyAppreciated! I'll Listen to 
YourLatest1 when I get the opportunity to do so.

At 11:13 AM 12/16/2015, you wrote:
Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, 
glad you enjoyed it.
el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows 
such as the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool 
bar, that setting does not stick, at least not when using list view. 
I've tried the new way of not interacting with items such as tool 
bars, but, honestly I prefer the previous way of handling this. When 
using the new settings, you have to navigate over every item in a 
tool bar to get past it, with the standard setting, you can simply 
skip what you're not interested in. I wasn't sure if system 
integrity protection would cause any problems, but so far it hasn't 
been an issue.


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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[Donna Goodin]

Sorry if this has been covered before, but what is the "new way?"  I'm still on 
Yosemite as well.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 1:17 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> I am still on Yosemite. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this new way of 
> interaction simply a choice? If so, that would seem to be the best of all 
> worlds, since people who like it can have it, and those who can't don't have 
> to. I can certainly see times when it would be better to do the new way. And 
> for people coming to the Mac, having to do all that interaction is kind of a 
> pain in the whatever.
> Mary
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 11:14 AM, Brian Howerton  wrote:
>> 
>> Yeah, I am definitely a fan of the standard way of voiceover interaction.  
>> Trying the new ways seems weird to me after being used to the standard way 
>> for so long.
>> Brian
>>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:13 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, glad 
>>> you enjoyed it.
>>> el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows such 
>>> as the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, that 
>>> setting does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've tried the 
>>> new way of not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, honestly I 
>>> prefer the previous way of handling this. When using the new settings, you 
>>> have to navigate over every item in a tool bar to get past it, with the 
>>> standard setting, you can simply skip what you're not interested in. I 
>>> wasn't sure if system integrity protection would cause any problems, but so 
>>> far it hasn't been an issue.
>>> 
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Re: Language switching, what makes that happen?

[Michael Marshall]

god if only language switching would work on the mac, i would love the german 
voice to read german words and then switch back to english as you have been 
able to do on JAWS since 2003
> On 16 Dec 2015, at 2:24 PM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> My understanding is, if the language is set to a specific voice / language, 
> that voice will attempt to read everything. However, if the language is set 
> to default, language will switch depending on the language flag in the text. 
> Set the rotor to language. Use the vertical flick to switch to default 
> language. Note: unless a different language is in the text, default will set 
> to the language set as default in settings, general, accessibility, 
> voiceover, languages.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 16 Dec 2015, at 13:58, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> I sometimes get emails that have mixed Russian and English. The language 
>> switching is wonderful on the iPhone. It just reads the Russian, then reads 
>> the English, then goes back to Russian. It is really great. So today, I got 
>> an email that had English and German. I don't have German in my language 
>> rotor, so I put it there, thinking that perhaps that might be the key to 
>> getting the language switching I was hoping for. no dice. Alex just went 
>> right ahead and read the German words. Not too good. So I switched to the 
>> German voice,and then it was reading English words. Also not too good. My 
>> guess is that the Russian switching works so well because a different 
>> alphabet is being used. Does that jive with others  experiences? I have also 
>> seen my language switch to Arabic and to some Asian language that I don't 
>> recognize from time to time. Again, those languages use different alphabets 
>> then the Roman. That's my theory. Do others find similar? And in such case, 
>> how could I get language switching from English to another language that 
>> uses the Roman alphabet?
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
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Re: Mail saying no sender

[Alex Hall]

This sounds basic, I know, but have you restarted Mail, or even the whole 
computer? If something weird like that happens to me, a restart usually clears 
it right up.
> On Dec 15, 2015, at 21:06, Agent086b  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> since the latest update to OSX when arrowing down a list of messages in a 
> mailbox where I used to hear the senders name I now hear no sender.
> I have had my sited wife take a look and where the sender should be she can 
> see the words no sender.
> Can anybody offer any help on this one.
> Max.
> 
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mehg...@icloud.com




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Re: Most efficient way to read emails

[Alex Hall]

For what it's worth, I also use the five-line preview. Often, this is enough to 
let me read the entire message, or at least most of it. If I need to open it, I 
press enter, and VO reads it automatically. I can press vo-a to speed up the 
reading process, but that's not usually necessary. When done, cmd-w closes the 
message and I'm back in the list.

I always keep the preview pane closed, because with it opened, arrowing past a 
message is enough to mark it 'read' even if I didn't read it. I also use the 
modern layout, because the classic one doesn't support the preview text I 
mentioned before. yes, classic layout lets me sort the order of columns in the 
messages table, but losing that preview isn't worth saving a second by hearing 
the subject first, to me at least.

This is a highly personal choice, and is based on what you are used to, how you 
read messages, and so on. Play with both layouts and see which you like best. I 
really can't offer anything more specific than that, because the 'best' way is 
subjective.
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 14:39, Georgina Joyce  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I too am a fan of the Apple mail. I do not use classic view., I have 5 lines 
> showing. I just curser down and 5 lines is enough to judge whether I  want to 
> open it. Most messages I don’t bother. I just hit the delete key. This is 
> using the wired keyboard. I only expand the thread I want to read. I haven’t 
> found how to have 5 lines displayed for individual messages in a thread. I 
> hit return to open message if I want to read more than the 5 lines. Or in a 
> threaded message. I also use a smart mailbox with all my unread messages. 
> Other rules for my PayPal receipts for example, are automatically moved into 
> their respective mailboxes. I do need to open such messages to gain the read 
> flag.
> 
> HTH
> 
> Gena
> 
> 
>> On 16 Dec 2015, at 16:26, M. Taylor  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello Traci,
>> 
>> I am a huge fan of the Mac Mail application.  In fact, I think it the 
>> absolute best resource that the Mac has to offer.  With it, I can go through 
>> hundreds and hundreds of messages in just a few minutes with a minimum of 
>> keystrokes as VoiceOver automatically reads each message as it comes into 
>> focus.  
>> 
>> Having said this, there are a few things one must do in which to get this to 
>> happen.
>> 
>> IN this post, I will only sketch out the broad strokes as a more detailed 
>> description would take more time to list than I have, at the moment.
>> 
>> 1.
>> You must use the Default layout view, complete with the preview pane intact. 
>>  More simply put, do not modify the default view.
>> 
>> 2.
>> You must use the conversation view with all conversations, collapsed.  
>> 
>> 3.
>> Your primary navigation key will be the Tab Key along with the arrow keys.  
>> Generally speaking, there is no need to use the enter key, the command+o key 
>> combo nor the command+w key-combo.
>> 
>> If you would like more details on how to use the application as I do, please 
>> send me a message, off-list and we can schedule a time for a live 
>> walk-through, via phone.
>> 
>> Mark   
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Traci Duncan
>> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 7:57 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Most efficient way to read emails
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> I’d like to here how people read their emails in Mac Mail.  Personally, I’m 
>> finding it rather cumbersome & time consuming.  Here is what I typically do… 
>>  Hopefully, y’all have a better way.
>> 
>> I use classic layout.  Quick-nav is off & I hit right arrow to open the 
>> message thread.  I navigate to the earliest message in the discussion & hit 
>> command-o to open.  Once I’ve read that message, command-w to close, then 
>> delete.  I then arrow up to the next message in the thread.  I do this until 
>> I’m done reading the discussion.
>> 
>> I’ve had inconsistent success with opening a thread by command-o, then using 
>> vo-j to jump message to message, but this doesn’t work all the time.
>> 
>> Please, any tips?  Does anyone use the other layout in mail?  Is it faster?  
>> The one little time saver I miss, is deleting a message right from the 
>> message window.  It seems I need to close it first to successfully delete it.
>> 
>> Thank you, I appreciate the help.
>> Traci
>> 
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Re: Most efficient way to read emails

[joseph hudson]

Hi Tracy, you might leave try using command delete. This will also delete a 
message. I also use enter, to open a message.
Joseph Hudson
Email
jhud7...@gmail.com 
I device support
Telephone
2543007667
Skype
joseph.hudson89 facebook
https://www.facebook.com/joseph.hudson.9404 

Twitter
https://twitter.com/josephhudson89 

FaceTime/iMessage
jhud7...@yahoo.com 
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 9:57 AM, Traci Duncan  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I’d like to here how people read their emails in Mac Mail.  Personally, I’m 
> finding it rather cumbersome & time consuming.  Here is what I typically do…  
> Hopefully, y’all have a better way.
> 
> I use classic layout.  Quick-nav is off & I hit right arrow to open the 
> message thread.  I navigate to the earliest message in the discussion & hit 
> command-o to open.  Once I’ve read that message, command-w to close, then 
> delete.  I then arrow up to the next message in the thread.  I do this until 
> I’m done reading the discussion.
> 
> I’ve had inconsistent success with opening a thread by command-o, then using 
> vo-j to jump message to message, but this doesn’t work all the time.
> 
> Please, any tips?  Does anyone use the other layout in mail?  Is it faster?  
> The one little time saver I miss, is deleting a message right from the 
> message window.  It seems I need to close it first to successfully delete it.
> 
> Thank you, I appreciate the help.
> Traci
> 
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Re: Mail saying no sender

[Agent086b]

Hi,
yes first thing I tried was quit Mail then re-load. When this did not work I 
re-started the Mac.
Further to this when I started the Mac today I now see the senders for each 
email.
I only noticed this problem since the latest update to OS X. Anyway doesn’t 
matter at the moment as working properly. I did wonder if it was an ISP problem.
Thanks for the suggestion.
Max. 
> On 17 Dec 2015, at 6:47 AM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> This sounds basic, I know, but have you restarted Mail, or even the whole 
> computer? If something weird like that happens to me, a restart usually 
> clears it right up.
>> On Dec 15, 2015, at 21:06, Agent086b > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> since the latest update to OSX when arrowing down a list of messages in a 
>> mailbox where I used to hear the senders name I now hear no sender.
>> I have had my sited wife take a look and where the sender should be she can 
>> see the words no sender.
>> Can anybody offer any help on this one.
>> Max.
>> 
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> 
> 
> --
> Have a great day,
> Alex Hall
> mehg...@icloud.com 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: IPod touch sixth generation and Bluetooth or airplay

[Mary Otten]

Hi George, are you talking about the mega boom and stereo not working on the 
iPod touch? In general? Or where? It doesn't fact work just fine with an 
android device. I know, because I have two of those speakers and I can play 
stereo just fine. Even on the iPhone, it tries to work, but the volume is so 
out of balance that it's not a good experience at all.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 16, 2015, at 11:40 AM, george b  wrote:
> 
> The stero function with the mega boom speakers and Bluetooth do not work
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 11:34
> To: VIPhone 'Carol Pearson' via ; 
> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: IPod touch sixth generation and Bluetooth or airplay
> 
> I am sending this to both lists because it is possible there are some iPod 
> touch users on the Mac visionaries list who are not on the VI phone list. I 
> am interested in your experiences with iPod touch sixth generation using 
> Bluetooth or airplay. Using my iPhone, I have noticed some strange anomalies 
> with the volume when using Bluetooth, such that the music volume goes down. I 
> have noticed with airplay that sometimes the voice over volume goes down. I 
> do not have audio ducking on. And I wonder are people with iPod touches 
> experiencing this? One really strange example happens with my UE megaboom 
> pair of speakers. When I use that with my iPhone, the volume on the speaker 
> to which the phone is directly connected via Bluetooth takes a major hit. If 
> I connect an android device to Bluetooth that same speaker has no problem, 
> and stereo balance is maintained. That's one of the few good things I can say 
> for the Nexus device I recently bought, but that is another story entirely. 
> My interest is in the iPod touch, wondering if this is a problem unique to 
> iPhones, unique to my iPhone, or something general with iOS 9 and these 
> devices.
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
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Multiple documents open in iOS

[Phil Halton]

Is it possible to have Multiple documents open in either iPhone or iPad. I want 
to be able to edit Multiple documents much like you would in TextEdit on Mac OS 
X. What pages for iOS allow Multiple documents to be open at once are there any 
other programs that would allow this

Sent from my IPhone

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Persistence of hot spots

[dan dunfee]

Hi,

Am I correct in recalling that hot spots are saved?  By that I mean for a 
given application they persist each time it is opened?


Is there a hot spot preference file that could be saved and reused or some 
other method to prevent manual setting each time an application is opened?


Thanks.
XB

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Re: IPod touch sixth generation and Bluetooth or airplay

[Brett C.]

I have the same experience. Though I have audio ducking off, I notice a huge 
airplay sound improvement when I turn voiceover off with a home button triple 
press while the music is playing.

> On Dec 16, 2015, at 12:34 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> I am sending this to both lists because it is possible there are some iPod 
> touch users on the Mac visionaries list who are not on the VI phone list. I 
> am interested in your experiences with iPod touch sixth generation using 
> Bluetooth or airplay. Using my iPhone, I have noticed some strange anomalies 
> with the volume when using Bluetooth, such that the music volume goes down. I 
> have noticed with airplay that sometimes the voice over volume goes down. I 
> do not have audio ducking on. And I wonder are people with iPod touches 
> experiencing this? One really strange example happens with my UE megaboom 
> pair of speakers. When I use that with my iPhone, the volume on the speaker 
> to which the phone is directly connected via Bluetooth takes a major hit. If 
> I connect an android device to Bluetooth that same speaker has no problem, 
> and stereo balance is maintained. That's one of the few good things I can say 
> for the Nexus device I recently bought, but that is another story entirely. 
> My interest is in the iPod touch, wondering if this is a problem unique to 
> iPhones, unique to my iPhone, or something general with iOS 9 and these 
> devices.
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[matthew dyer]

Hi Mike.

After listening to your podcast, I decided to do a clean install of el capitan 
and I find that things run much better.  I have how ever one question, When 
doing the reformat, I selected the main drive not the macintosh HD partition 
that was already and select ed.  Should I have done so?  I found a couple of 
problems  after doing this.  First, I did not see my macintosh HD after 
reformatting and had to reboot back to my Bootable Installer.  In doing so, I 
was then able to see the macintosh, but for some reason I had only 260 GB on my 
drive and had to resize the drive to get more space.  Any how, I also found 
that though I was connected to the network, After signing in to my apple id I 
keep seeing the message, item temporally unavailable.  The only work around was 
to boot to the internet recovery  and install ml then upgrade to el capitan 
from there.  Is there anything I can do to avoid this message in the future?  
Thanks.

Matthew


> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:13 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
> 
> Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, glad you 
> enjoyed it.
> el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows such as 
> the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, that setting 
> does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've tried the new way of 
> not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, honestly I prefer the 
> previous way of handling this. When using the new settings, you have to 
> navigate over every item in a tool bar to get past it, with the standard 
> setting, you can simply skip what you're not interested in. I wasn't sure if 
> system integrity protection would cause any problems, but so far it hasn't 
> been an issue.
> 
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Re: Most efficient way to read emails

[Alex Hall]

You can cmd-delete, that'll work. Just plain delete will do the same thing, and 
is quicker to hit. Unless there's a difference between the two commands which I 
don't know? That's definitely possible.
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 14:56, joseph hudson  wrote:
> 
> Hi Tracy, you might leave try using command delete. This will also delete a 
> message. I also use enter, to open a message.
> Joseph Hudson
> Email
> jhud7...@gmail.com 
> I device support
> Telephone
> 2543007667
> Skype
> joseph.hudson89 facebook
> https://www.facebook.com/joseph.hudson.9404 
> 
> Twitter
> https://twitter.com/josephhudson89  
> 
> FaceTime/iMessage
> jhud7...@yahoo.com 
>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 9:57 AM, Traci Duncan > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> I’d like to here how people read their emails in Mac Mail.  Personally, I’m 
>> finding it rather cumbersome & time consuming.  Here is what I typically do… 
>>  Hopefully, y’all have a better way.
>> 
>> I use classic layout.  Quick-nav is off & I hit right arrow to open the 
>> message thread.  I navigate to the earliest message in the discussion & hit 
>> command-o to open.  Once I’ve read that message, command-w to close, then 
>> delete.  I then arrow up to the next message in the thread.  I do this until 
>> I’m done reading the discussion.
>> 
>> I’ve had inconsistent success with opening a thread by command-o, then using 
>> vo-j to jump message to message, but this doesn’t work all the time.
>> 
>> Please, any tips?  Does anyone use the other layout in mail?  Is it faster?  
>> The one little time saver I miss, is deleting a message right from the 
>> message window.  It seems I need to close it first to successfully delete it.
>> 
>> Thank you, I appreciate the help.
>> Traci
>> 
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Re: Most efficient way to read emails

[Jonathan C. Cohn]

I have tested, that you can change the order the columns in the standard view 
of mail using AppleScript. 


Jonathan Cohn 

> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:52 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> For what it's worth, I also use the five-line preview. Often, this is enough 
> to let me read the entire message, or at least most of it. If I need to open 
> it, I press enter, and VO reads it automatically. I can press vo-a to speed 
> up the reading process, but that's not usually necessary. When done, cmd-w 
> closes the message and I'm back in the list.
> 
> I always keep the preview pane closed, because with it opened, arrowing past 
> a message is enough to mark it 'read' even if I didn't read it. I also use 
> the modern layout, because the classic one doesn't support the preview text I 
> mentioned before. yes, classic layout lets me sort the order of columns in 
> the messages table, but losing that preview isn't worth saving a second by 
> hearing the subject first, to me at least.
> 
> This is a highly personal choice, and is based on what you are used to, how 
> you read messages, and so on. Play with both layouts and see which you like 
> best. I really can't offer anything more specific than that, because the 
> 'best' way is subjective.
>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 14:39, Georgina Joyce  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello,
>> 
>> I too am a fan of the Apple mail. I do not use classic view., I have 5 lines 
>> showing. I just curser down and 5 lines is enough to judge whether I  want 
>> to open it. Most messages I don’t bother. I just hit the delete key. This is 
>> using the wired keyboard. I only expand the thread I want to read. I haven’t 
>> found how to have 5 lines displayed for individual messages in a thread. I 
>> hit return to open message if I want to read more than the 5 lines. Or in a 
>> threaded message. I also use a smart mailbox with all my unread messages. 
>> Other rules for my PayPal receipts for example, are automatically moved into 
>> their respective mailboxes. I do need to open such messages to gain the read 
>> flag.
>> 
>> HTH
>> 
>> Gena
>> 
>> 
>>> On 16 Dec 2015, at 16:26, M. Taylor  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello Traci,
>>> 
>>> I am a huge fan of the Mac Mail application.  In fact, I think it the 
>>> absolute best resource that the Mac has to offer.  With it, I can go 
>>> through hundreds and hundreds of messages in just a few minutes with a 
>>> minimum of keystrokes as VoiceOver automatically reads each message as it 
>>> comes into focus.  
>>> 
>>> Having said this, there are a few things one must do in which to get this 
>>> to happen.
>>> 
>>> IN this post, I will only sketch out the broad strokes as a more detailed 
>>> description would take more time to list than I have, at the moment.
>>> 
>>> 1.
>>> You must use the Default layout view, complete with the preview pane 
>>> intact.  More simply put, do not modify the default view.
>>> 
>>> 2.
>>> You must use the conversation view with all conversations, collapsed.  
>>> 
>>> 3.
>>> Your primary navigation key will be the Tab Key along with the arrow keys.  
>>> Generally speaking, there is no need to use the enter key, the command+o 
>>> key combo nor the command+w key-combo.
>>> 
>>> If you would like more details on how to use the application as I do, 
>>> please send me a message, off-list and we can schedule a time for a live 
>>> walk-through, via phone.
>>> 
>>> Mark   
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Traci Duncan
>>> Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 7:57 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Most efficient way to read emails
>>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> I’d like to here how people read their emails in Mac Mail.  Personally, I’m 
>>> finding it rather cumbersome & time consuming.  Here is what I typically 
>>> do…  Hopefully, y’all have a better way.
>>> 
>>> I use classic layout.  Quick-nav is off & I hit right arrow to open the 
>>> message thread.  I navigate to the earliest message in the discussion & hit 
>>> command-o to open.  Once I’ve read that message, command-w to close, then 
>>> delete.  I then arrow up to the next message in the thread.  I do this 
>>> until I’m done reading the discussion.
>>> 
>>> I’ve had inconsistent success with opening a thread by command-o, then 
>>> using vo-j to jump message to message, but this doesn’t work all the time.
>>> 
>>> Please, any tips?  Does anyone use the other layout in mail?  Is it faster? 
>>>  The one little time saver I miss, is deleting a message right from the 
>>> message window.  It seems I need to close it first to successfully delete 
>>> it.
>>> 
>>> Thank you, I appreciate the help.
>>> Traci
>>> 
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Re: IPod touch sixth generation and Bluetooth or airplay

[Mary Otten]

Hi Brett,
Do you have a phone or an iPod touch or both? I'm just trying to narrow this 
down to see if it is phones only, or if it also affects iPod touches. I don't 
know why it wouldn't affect both, but I also don't know anything about the 
hardware design.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 16, 2015, at 12:47 PM, Brett C.  wrote:
> 
> I have the same experience. Though I have audio ducking off, I notice a huge 
> airplay sound improvement when I turn voiceover off with a home button triple 
> press while the music is playing.
> 
>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 12:34 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> I am sending this to both lists because it is possible there are some iPod 
>> touch users on the Mac visionaries list who are not on the VI phone list. I 
>> am interested in your experiences with iPod touch sixth generation using 
>> Bluetooth or airplay. Using my iPhone, I have noticed some strange anomalies 
>> with the volume when using Bluetooth, such that the music volume goes down. 
>> I have noticed with airplay that sometimes the voice over volume goes down. 
>> I do not have audio ducking on. And I wonder are people with iPod touches 
>> experiencing this? One really strange example happens with my UE megaboom 
>> pair of speakers. When I use that with my iPhone, the volume on the speaker 
>> to which the phone is directly connected via Bluetooth takes a major hit. If 
>> I connect an android device to Bluetooth that same speaker has no problem, 
>> and stereo balance is maintained. That's one of the few good things I can 
>> say for the Nexus device I recently bought, but that is another story 
>> entirely. My interest is in the iPod touch, wondering if this is a problem 
>> unique to iPhones, unique to my iPhone, or something general with iOS 9 and 
>> these devices.
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[Mike Arrigo]

It's a choice, yes.
Original message:
I am still on Yosemite. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this new way 
of interaction simply a choice? If so, that would seem to be the best 
of all worlds, since people who like it can have it, and those who 
can't don't have to. I can certainly see times when it would be better 
to do the new way. And for people coming to the Mac, having to do all 
that interaction is kind of a pain in the whatever.

Mary



Sent from my iPhone



On Dec 16, 2015, at 11:14 AM, Brian Howerton  wrote:


Yeah, I am definitely a fan of the standard way of voiceover 
interaction.  Trying the new ways seems weird to me after being used to 
the standard way for so long.

Brian

On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:13 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:


Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, 
glad you enjoyed it.
el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows 
such as the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, 
that setting does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've 
tried the new way of not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, 
honestly I prefer the previous way of handling this. When using the new 
settings, you have to navigate over every item in a tool bar to get 
past it, with the standard setting, you can simply skip what you're not 
interested in. I wasn't sure if system integrity protection would cause 
any problems, but so far it hasn't been an issue.



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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[Mike Arrigo]

Voiceover provides an option when for example, you move over a toolbar, 
you don't have to interact with it, all of the items will be presented, 
you then simply move to the next thing on the screen.

Original message:
Sorry if this has been covered before, but what is the "new way?"  I'm 
still on Yosemite as well.

Cheers,
Donna

On Dec 16, 2015, at 1:17 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:


I am still on Yosemite. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this new way 
of interaction simply a choice? If so, that would seem to be the best 
of all worlds, since people who like it can have it, and those who 
can't don't have to. I can certainly see times when it would be better 
to do the new way. And for people coming to the Mac, having to do all 
that interaction is kind of a pain in the whatever.

Mary



Sent from my iPhone



On Dec 16, 2015, at 11:14 AM, Brian Howerton  wrote:


Yeah, I am definitely a fan of the standard way of voiceover 
interaction.  Trying the new ways seems weird to me after being used to 
the standard way for so long.

Brian

On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:13 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:


Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, 
glad you enjoyed it.
el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows 
such as the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, 
that setting does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've 
tried the new way of not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, 
honestly I prefer the previous way of handling this. When using the new 
settings, you have to navigate over every item in a tool bar to get 
past it, with the standard setting, you can simply skip what you're not 
interested in. I wasn't sure if system integrity protection would cause 
any problems, but so far it hasn't been an issue.



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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[Mike Arrigo]

If you selected the drive itself, which is what I did, you need to 
choose guid partition, and the format should be mac OS extended 
journaled. It provides a place to type in a name for your volume, if 
you don't type anything, it will call it untitled. I've done this 
process with all 3 of my macs and have not had any of the issues you describe.

Original message:

Hi Mike.


After listening to your podcast, I decided to do a clean install of el 
capitan and I find that things run much better.  I have how ever one 
question, When doing the reformat, I selected the main drive not the 
macintosh HD partition that was already and select ed.  Should I have 
done so?  I found a couple of problems  after doing this.  First, I did 
not see my macintosh HD after reformatting and had to reboot back to my 
Bootable Installer.  In doing so, I was then able to see the macintosh, 
but for some reason I had only 260 GB on my drive and had to resize the 
drive to get more space.  Any how, I also found that though I was 
connected to the network, After signing in to my apple id I keep seeing 
the message, item temporally unavailable.  The only work around was to 
boot to the internet recovery  and install ml then upgrade to el 
capitan from there.  Is there anything I can do to avoid this message 
in the future?  Thanks.



Matthew




On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:13 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:


Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, 
glad you enjoyed it.
el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows 
such as the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, 
that setting does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've 
tried the new way of not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, 
honestly I prefer the previous way of handling this. When using the new 
settings, you have to navigate over every item in a tool bar to get 
past it, with the standard setting, you can simply skip what you're not 
interested in. I wasn't sure if system integrity protection would cause 
any problems, but so far it hasn't been an issue.



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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[Raymond Foret Jr]

Funny you should mention that Mike.  I just got my Mac back from the shop and 
they formated the drive to Journaled rather than Mac OS extended Journaled.  
Should I be concerned about this?  Am I necessarily loosing anything by this?  
and, one final point, if I wanted to reformast to extended Journaled, I'd have 
to do a clean install after reformatting and wiping the drive?


!

Sent from my Mac, The Only computer with full accessibility for the blind 
built-in

Sincerely, The Constantly Barefooted Ray,

Still a very happy Comcast XFinity Voice Guidance, Mac, Verizon Wireless 
iPhone6+ and Apple TV user!

> On Dec 16, 2015, at 3:57 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
> 
> If you selected the drive itself, which is what I did, you need to choose 
> guid partition, and the format should be mac OS extended journaled. It 
> provides a place to type in a name for your volume, if you don't type 
> anything, it will call it untitled. I've done this process with all 3 of my 
> macs and have not had any of the issues you describe.
> Original message:
>> Hi Mike.
> 
>> After listening to your podcast, I decided to do a clean install of el 
>> capitan and I find that things run much better.  I have how ever one 
>> question, When doing the reformat, I selected the main drive not the 
>> macintosh HD partition that was already and select ed.  Should I have done 
>> so?  I found a couple of problems  after doing this.  First, I did not see 
>> my macintosh HD after reformatting and had to reboot back to my Bootable 
>> Installer.  In doing so, I was then able to see the macintosh, but for some 
>> reason I had only 260 GB on my drive and had to resize the drive to get more 
>> space.  Any how, I also found that though I was connected to the network, 
>> After signing in to my apple id I keep seeing the message, item temporally 
>> unavailable.  The only work around was to boot to the internet recovery  and 
>> install ml then upgrade to el capitan from there.  Is there anything I can 
>> do to avoid this message in the future?  Thanks.
> 
>> Matthew
> 
> 
>>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:13 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
> 
>>> Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, glad 
>>> you enjoyed it.
>>> el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows such 
>>> as the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, that 
>>> setting does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've tried the 
>>> new way of not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, honestly I 
>>> prefer the previous way of handling this. When using the new settings, you 
>>> have to navigate over every item in a tool bar to get past it, with the 
>>> standard setting, you can simply skip what you're not interested in. I 
>>> wasn't sure if system integrity protection would cause any problems, but so 
>>> far it hasn't been an issue.
> 
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Re: Most efficient way to read emails

[matthew dyer]

Hi,

I just use the default mail view.  vo will read a few lines of the message 
without opening the message and it is usually enough to decide what I want to 
do with the message such as delete or reply etc.  If it is a thread of 
messages, I just press enter to open each message and cmd w to close the 
message after I am done with it.  HTH.

Matthew


> On Dec 16, 2015, at 11:17 AM, Gerard Doody  wrote:
> 
> Hi all, I use the original mac default to read my mail by unchecking the 
> classical mail box.  this is found i “viewing” 
> Then by using the jump command (voj) I can move between the message list and 
> the text itself.  When I get to the messages table I can then delete 
> messages.  
> When I was using the layout with the classical box checked, I just hit enter 
> on the mail I wished to read and then commandj-w to close it.  I hope that 
> helps. 
> JerryDoody
> jerrydood...@gmail.com 
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 10:57 am, Traci Duncan  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I’d like to here how people read their emails in Mac Mail.  Personally, I’m 
> finding it rather cumbersome & time consuming.  Here is what I typically do…  
> Hopefully, y’all have a better way.
> 
> I use classic layout.  Quick-nav is off & I hit right arrow to open the 
> message thread.  I navigate to the earliest message in the discussion & hit 
> command-o to open.  Once I’ve read that message, command-w to close, then 
> delete.  I then arrow up to the next message in the thread.  I do this until 
> I’m done reading the discussion.
> 
> I’ve had inconsistent success with opening a thread by command-o, then using 
> vo-j to jump message to message, but this doesn’t work all the time.
> 
> Please, any tips?  Does anyone use the other layout in mail?  Is it faster?  
> The one little time saver I miss, is deleting a message right from the 
> message window.  It seems I need to close it first to successfully delete it.
> 
> Thank you, I appreciate the help.
> Traci
> 
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Re: my impressions of El Capitan

[Donna Goodin]

Thanks, Mike.  I just upgraded, so I guess I'm about to find out whether I like 
the new way or not. :)  thanks for the explanation.
Cheers,
Donna
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 3:53 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
> 
> Voiceover provides an option when for example, you move over a toolbar, you 
> don't have to interact with it, all of the items will be presented, you then 
> simply move to the next thing on the screen.
> Original message:
>> Sorry if this has been covered before, but what is the "new way?"  I'm still 
>> on Yosemite as well.
>> Cheers,
>> Donna
>>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 1:17 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
>>> I am still on Yosemite. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this new way of 
>>> interaction simply a choice? If so, that would seem to be the best of all 
>>> worlds, since people who like it can have it, and those who can't don't 
>>> have to. I can certainly see times when it would be better to do the new 
>>> way. And for people coming to the Mac, having to do all that interaction is 
>>> kind of a pain in the whatever.
>>> Mary
> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
> 
 On Dec 16, 2015, at 11:14 AM, Brian Howerton  wrote:
> 
 Yeah, I am definitely a fan of the standard way of voiceover interaction.  
 Trying the new ways seems weird to me after being used to the standard way 
 for so long.
 Brian
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:13 PM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
> 
> Hey everyone, thanks for the kind words about the upgrade pod cast, glad 
> you enjoyed it.
> el Capitan works well, the only bug I've found is, in finder windows such 
> as the hard drive or your home folder, if you hide the tool bar, that 
> setting does not stick, at least not when using list view. I've tried the 
> new way of not interacting with items such as tool bars, but, honestly I 
> prefer the previous way of handling this. When using the new settings, 
> you have to navigate over every item in a tool bar to get past it, with 
> the standard setting, you can simply skip what you're not interested in. 
> I wasn't sure if system integrity protection would cause any problems, 
> but so far it hasn't been an issue.
> 
> --
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Roxio Easy VHS to DVD for Mac - VHS to DVD Conversion Software

[Traci Duncan]

Hi all, I have been thinking of my old VHS tapes in storage & would like to 
take another look at them.  Possibly preserve some of them.  Has anyone tried 
such a project on the Mac?  It looks like the below software is the favorable 
option.  Any thoughts?



> http://www.roxio.com/enu/products/easy-vhs-to-dvd/mac/overview.html 
> 

Thanks,
Traci

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Re: Roxio Easy VHS to DVD for Mac - VHS to DVD Conversion Software

[Vaughn Brown]

I am curious to hear more on this as my partner has a lot of her horse
competitions on tape. It be nice to put them onto DVD for her.
Vaughn

On 12/16/15, Traci Duncan  wrote:
> Hi all, I have been thinking of my old VHS tapes in storage & would like to
> take another look at them.  Possibly preserve some of them.  Has anyone
> tried such a project on the Mac?  It looks like the below software is the
> favorable option.  Any thoughts?
>
>
>
>> http://www.roxio.com/enu/products/easy-vhs-to-dvd/mac/overview.html
>> 
>
> Thanks,
> Traci
>
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-- 
Vaughn Brown
Berklee College of Music Graduate, Bachelor in Music, Drummer, educator
504-202-8492
http://www.vaughnbrown.net

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Re: Roxio Easy VHS to DVD for Mac - VHS to DVD Conversion Software

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

My friend actually got this exact app for her mac, and said it worked really 
well.  Now, that said, she's sighted and practically knows next to nothing 
about Voiceover, so I can't vouch, nor can she, for accessibility, but over 
all, the program does work, provided it's accessible.

Chris.

  - Original Message - 
  From: Traci Duncan 
  To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 6:14 PM
  Subject: Roxio Easy VHS to DVD for Mac - VHS to DVD Conversion Software


  Hi all, I have been thinking of my old VHS tapes in storage & would like to 
take another look at them.  Possibly preserve some of them.  Has anyone tried 
such a project on the Mac?  It looks like the below software is the favorable 
option.  Any thoughts?






http://www.roxio.com/enu/products/easy-vhs-to-dvd/mac/overview.html



  Thanks,
  Traci



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Re: Roxio Easy VHS to DVD for Mac - VHS to DVD Conversion Software

[Christopher-Mark Gilland]

Wow!  Someone who competes in horse competitions!  That is awesome!  If 
she's blind, I'd like to hear more off list about this, and how she does it.


My little second cousin does that kind a thing, but granted, she's sighted.

Anyway, let's get back on topic.  LOL!  My private e-mail is:

clgillan...@gmail.com

Chris.

- Original Message - 
From: "Vaughn Brown" 

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 6:43 PM
Subject: Re: Roxio Easy VHS to DVD for Mac - VHS to DVD Conversion Software



I am curious to hear more on this as my partner has a lot of her horse
competitions on tape. It be nice to put them onto DVD for her.
Vaughn

On 12/16/15, Traci Duncan  wrote:
Hi all, I have been thinking of my old VHS tapes in storage & would like 
to

take another look at them.  Possibly preserve some of them.  Has anyone
tried such a project on the Mac?  It looks like the below software is the
favorable option.  Any thoughts?




http://www.roxio.com/enu/products/easy-vhs-to-dvd/mac/overview.html



Thanks,
Traci

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--
Vaughn Brown
Berklee College of Music Graduate, Bachelor in Music, Drummer, educator
504-202-8492
http://www.vaughnbrown.net

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Re: IPod touch sixth generation and Bluetooth or airplay

[Brett C.]

I use both. The experienced I shared is with the iPod touch 6.


> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:39 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> Hi Brett,
> Do you have a phone or an iPod touch or both? I'm just trying to narrow this 
> down to see if it is phones only, or if it also affects iPod touches. I don't 
> know why it wouldn't affect both, but I also don't know anything about the 
> hardware design.
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 12:47 PM, Brett C.  wrote:
>> 
>> I have the same experience. Though I have audio ducking off, I notice a huge 
>> airplay sound improvement when I turn voiceover off with a home button 
>> triple press while the music is playing.
>> 
>>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 12:34 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I am sending this to both lists because it is possible there are some iPod 
>>> touch users on the Mac visionaries list who are not on the VI phone list. I 
>>> am interested in your experiences with iPod touch sixth generation using 
>>> Bluetooth or airplay. Using my iPhone, I have noticed some strange 
>>> anomalies with the volume when using Bluetooth, such that the music volume 
>>> goes down. I have noticed with airplay that sometimes the voice over volume 
>>> goes down. I do not have audio ducking on. And I wonder are people with 
>>> iPod touches experiencing this? One really strange example happens with my 
>>> UE megaboom pair of speakers. When I use that with my iPhone, the volume on 
>>> the speaker to which the phone is directly connected via Bluetooth takes a 
>>> major hit. If I connect an android device to Bluetooth that same speaker 
>>> has no problem, and stereo balance is maintained. That's one of the few 
>>> good things I can say for the Nexus device I recently bought, but that is 
>>> another story entirely. My interest is in the iPod touch, wondering if this 
>>> is a problem unique to iPhones, unique to my iPhone, or something general 
>>> with iOS 9 and these devices.
>>> Mary
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
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Re: Media Server To Replace iTunes?

[erik burggraaf]

Hi,  I am thinking Tonido on a raspberry pi.  I should be able to report more 
on this after christmas.

Best,

Erik Burggraaf


> On Dec 16, 2015, at 5:12 AM, Sabahattin Gucukoglu  wrote:
> 
> Hi guys, and especially those with NAS products or other similar 
> do-it-yourself mass storage inclinations. :)
> 
> Unless my research has misled me, the only solution Apple offers for the 
> increasingly common situation of needing access to a central media library 
> with multiple devices around the house is Home Sharing.  But Home Sharing 
> requires an always-on Mac or Windows box, running iTunes, and provides no way 
> for adding to or editing the library stored on the remote machine, or 
> downloading content to an iOS device.  This makes it rather unsuitable, by 
> itself.  Moving the iTunes library onto the NAS works for storage, but is 
> still fundamentally a single-user solution, and still requires syncing for 
> satellite devices for any media other than music (which requires the cloud) 
> or an open copy of iTunes (which requires that access be coordinated).  In 
> fact, after all of the reading I’ve done, I’ve never had more respect for 
> Microsoft: their media centre was not only designed to run unattended, but 
> even helpfully incorporated any files you added into any of its watch 
> folders.  I’m utterly astonished that Apple never predicted this use case.
> 
> So, I have to ask: how have you, dear reader, solved this problem?
> 
> I would like as much of the following to be true as is reasonably possible:
> Compatibility with all existing protected and unprotected iTunes library 
> content except apps (but including Audible books downloaded direct from 
> Audible). Clients should maintain keys.
> A server component that can run on a NAS (preferably Open-Source code).
> Stream as well as download, on all devices.  No syncing, please.
> As much integration with iTunes as possible (tracks metadata and library 
> changes).
> As much remote manipulation as possible (new media, change metadata).
> Avoids the cloud.  Apple lossless is a dead zone for iTunes Match, as are 
> large libraries, but I’ll renew if need be.
> AirPlay and Apple TV are nice-to-have, but are not really required because of 
> iOS relays.
> 
> I am willing to seriously consider, if there’s a real need:
> Virtual Windows machines running iTunes housed on my server, if remote 
> desktop is available or other tools can be used to update the library and 
> metadata.
> A dedicated Mac for iTunes, as well as the OS X server cache for cloud 
> content, hacked so it writes its data to the network shares of my NAS.
> Filesystem-based navigation, if all else fails for downloads and playback, as 
> long as it works on iOS for satellite jaunts.
> A compromise to use iTunes, only for protected content. (I’ll stop buying 
> protected content.)
> Surrender.  Continue centralising the library on the NAS, use my iMac only, 
> sync all but the music, and keep renewing iTunes Match.
> 
> Your thoughts gratefully appreciated.
> 
> Cheers,
> Sabahattin
> 
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google drive mac os10 problems please help.

[Trahern Culver]

hi all, my university uses google drive for uploading course documents ECt. 
I downloaded the google drive app to my mac and i'm trying to find the 
setting to change my account but i can't find the google drive menu any 
where its not in the status bar does any one know what the problem is and 
how to solve it? your help with this problem would be grate thanks in 
advance trey.

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Re: google drive mac os10 problems please help.

[Alex Hall]

I've not used it, but Google Music puts itself into System Preferences. perhaps 
Drive does the same thing? See if there's a preference item for it; it will 
probably be near the end of the list of buttons in System Preferences.
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 21:06, Trahern Culver  wrote:
> 
> hi all, my university uses google drive for uploading course documents ECt. I 
> downloaded the google drive app to my mac and i'm trying to find the setting 
> to change my account but i can't find the google drive menu any where its not 
> in the status bar does any one know what the problem is and how to solve it? 
> your help with this problem would be grate thanks in advance trey.
> 
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Have a great day,
Alex Hall
mehg...@icloud.com




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Airplay weirdness with iPhone running iOS 9 .2

[Mary Otten]

I was using my phone to play radio tunes via airplay through my stereo, which 
as an airport express connected. I had turn voiceover off, because I believe 
that the quality of the airplay is better when voiceover is not there. When I 
was done playing radiotunes,  I wanted to turn voiceover back on, so I could 
shut airplay off. Much to my surprise, voiceover started playing through my 
stereo speakers. I have no idea why this happened. I have not seen this ever. 
What might cause it? If I turn voiceover off and back on shall I expect it to 
start coming through my stereo whenever I have airplay active? This just seems 
to be another aspect of the bug that has entered the iOS echo system with iOS 
9. Bluetooth doesn't act right. Sound volume fluctuates. Bluetooth earpieces 
stop working. It's just screwed up. Apple needs to fix it, but it is all over 
the place. And they always say it is device specific. I don't believe that for 
a minute.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

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Re: Most efficient way to read emails

[Jonathan Mosen]

Hi Jonathan, this is quite exciting to me. So does that mean you could write a 
script that puts the subject column first, and that upon running that script, 
the change would stick?
If so, I would be super interested in such a script. It would be even better if 
the settings were folder specific, but I'm guessing that's not possible?
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org

> On 17/12/2015, at 10:15 AM, Jonathan C. Cohn  wrote:
> 
> I have tested, that you can change the order the columns in the standard view 
> of mail using AppleScript. 
> 
> 
> Jonathan Cohn 
> 
> On Dec 16, 2015, at 2:52 PM, Alex Hall  > wrote:
> 
>> For what it's worth, I also use the five-line preview. Often, this is enough 
>> to let me read the entire message, or at least most of it. If I need to open 
>> it, I press enter, and VO reads it automatically. I can press vo-a to speed 
>> up the reading process, but that's not usually necessary. When done, cmd-w 
>> closes the message and I'm back in the list.
>> 
>> I always keep the preview pane closed, because with it opened, arrowing past 
>> a message is enough to mark it 'read' even if I didn't read it. I also use 
>> the modern layout, because the classic one doesn't support the preview text 
>> I mentioned before. yes, classic layout lets me sort the order of columns in 
>> the messages table, but losing that preview isn't worth saving a second by 
>> hearing the subject first, to me at least.
>> 
>> This is a highly personal choice, and is based on what you are used to, how 
>> you read messages, and so on. Play with both layouts and see which you like 
>> best. I really can't offer anything more specific than that, because the 
>> 'best' way is subjective.
>>> On Dec 16, 2015, at 14:39, Georgina Joyce >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello,
>>> 
>>> I too am a fan of the Apple mail. I do not use classic view., I have 5 
>>> lines showing. I just curser down and 5 lines is enough to judge whether I  
>>> want to open it. Most messages I don’t bother. I just hit the delete key. 
>>> This is using the wired keyboard. I only expand the thread I want to read. 
>>> I haven’t found how to have 5 lines displayed for individual messages in a 
>>> thread. I hit return to open message if I want to read more than the 5 
>>> lines. Or in a threaded message. I also use a smart mailbox with all my 
>>> unread messages. Other rules for my PayPal receipts for example, are 
>>> automatically moved into their respective mailboxes. I do need to open such 
>>> messages to gain the read flag.
>>> 
>>> HTH
>>> 
>>> Gena
>>> 
>>> 
 On 16 Dec 2015, at 16:26, M. Taylor >>> > wrote:
 
 Hello Traci,
 
 I am a huge fan of the Mac Mail application.  In fact, I think it the 
 absolute best resource that the Mac has to offer.  With it, I can go 
 through hundreds and hundreds of messages in just a few minutes with a 
 minimum of keystrokes as VoiceOver automatically reads each message as it 
 comes into focus.  
 
 Having said this, there are a few things one must do in which to get this 
 to happen.
 
 IN this post, I will only sketch out the broad strokes as a more detailed 
 description would take more time to list than I have, at the moment.
 
 1.
 You must use the Default layout view, complete with the preview pane 
 intact.  More simply put, do not modify the default view.
 
 2.
 You must use the conversation view with all conversations, collapsed.  
 
 3.
 Your primary navigation key will be the Tab Key along with the arrow keys. 
  Generally speaking, there is no need to use the enter key, the command+o 
 key combo nor the command+w key-combo.
 
 If you would like more details on how to use the application as I do, 
 please send me a message, off-list and we can schedule a time for a live 
 walk-through, via phone.
 
 Mark   
 
 -Original Message-
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
  
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
 ] On Behalf Of Traci Duncan
 Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2015 7:57 AM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
 
 Subject: Most efficient way to read emails
 
 Hi all,
 
 I’d like to here how people read their emails in Mac Mail.  Personally, 
 I’m finding it rather cumbersome & time consuming.  Here is what I 
 typically do…  Hopefully, y’all have a better way.
 
 I use classic layout.  Quick-nav is off & I hit right arrow to open the 
 message thread.  I navigate to the earliest message in the discussion & 
 hit command-o to open.  Once I’ve read that message, command-w to close, 
 then delete.  I then arrow up

Re: Airplay weirdness with iPhone running iOS 9 .2

[Jonathan Mosen]

Hi Mary, I've personally not seen any evidence that turning off VoiceOver gives 
a better AirPlay Experience, so have never done this. But if turning VOiceOver 
back on causes it to be sent to the AirPlay device, you could use your rotor to 
choose the audio destination option, and set it to your phone. It would be a 
pretty laborious task as VO over AirPlay is hella sluggish.
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org

> On 17/12/2015, at 4:47 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> I was using my phone to play radio tunes via airplay through my stereo, which 
> as an airport express connected. I had turn voiceover off, because I believe 
> that the quality of the airplay is better when voiceover is not there. When I 
> was done playing radiotunes,  I wanted to turn voiceover back on, so I could 
> shut airplay off. Much to my surprise, voiceover started playing through my 
> stereo speakers. I have no idea why this happened. I have not seen this ever. 
> What might cause it? If I turn voiceover off and back on shall I expect it to 
> start coming through my stereo whenever I have airplay active? This just 
> seems to be another aspect of the bug that has entered the iOS echo system 
> with iOS 9. Bluetooth doesn't act right. Sound volume fluctuates. Bluetooth 
> earpieces stop working. It's just screwed up. Apple needs to fix it, but it 
> is all over the place. And they always say it is device specific. I don't 
> believe that for a minute.
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
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Re: google drive mac os10 problems please help.

[Andrew Lamanche]

I have to go to work shortly but I've just opened google drive app on my mac.  
It has no windows as such to navigate round, but once opened, I have found an 
icon for google drive in the menu extra.  Activate menu extra with vo+m pressed 
twice quickly and then use vo+arrow to move round the menu.  When I have heard 
Google drive, I routed my mouse to the vo cursor with vo+command+f5, and then 
performed mouse click with vo+shift+spacebar.  Google drive menu opened.  I 
could then vo+up and down arrow some choices.  Have a look and good luck.  
Sorry have to rush.

Andrew
> On 17 Dec 2015, at 02:06, Trahern Culver  wrote:
> 
> hi all, my university uses google drive for uploading course documents ECt. I 
> downloaded the google drive app to my mac and i'm trying to find the setting 
> to change my account but i can't find the google drive menu any where its not 
> in the status bar does any one know what the problem is and how to solve it? 
> your help with this problem would be grate thanks in advance trey.
> 
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