Re: Lilypond Terminates on Start-Up

[Jean Abou Samra]

Le lundi 18 septembre 2023 à 18:13 +, Zone Dremik a écrit :
> Hello,
> 
> This is a follow-up concerning Frescobaldi start-up problems on Mac Ventura
> 13.5 (I should clarify that this is an issue that only occurs when I first
> start Frescobaldi after having powered-on the computer). 
> 
> I upgraded to Frescobaldi 3.3.0 via MacPorts. That worked very well, but the
> anomalous behavior is the same. 
> 
> If I double-click a .ly file icon in the Mac Finder, I get the start-up
> animation and Frescobaldi splash screen. No menus appear and the file is not
> opened. 
> 
> Mac system show Frescobaldi not responding. 
> 
> If I go back and double-click the .ly file icon,(while Frescobaldi is running,
> but not responding) the file opens in the usual Frescobaldi window-set, along
> with the menus at the top of the screen. However, everything is inoperative,
> and still shows Not Responding in Mac system activity monitor. 
> 
> There is no response when clicking menus, and I can not select and edit the
> code. I must force quit. 
> 
> I tried waiting up to ten minutes, so see if it was just busy or slow.
> 
> At this point, I can start Frescobaldi from the app icon and then double-click
> a .ly file-icon, and everything runs properly. I can quit and start again
> without problems, until I power-off the computer. 



Not sure why I didn't think about it earlier, but this may be
https://github.com/frescobaldi/frescobaldi/issues/428
or a variant of it.

When Frescobaldi freezes, if you click its icon on the dock, does it come back?

As you can see, that issue is an old problem that remained a mystery to everyone
until I was able to find (after lots of searching) a plausible cause last May. I
haven't been able to produce a fix yet (though there was some progress towards
simplifying the creation of app bundles, which could help).

Historically, macOS has been a pain to support for Frescobaldi (and LilyPond)
because of the peculiar user interface and distribution requirements imposed by
the platform, but also and most importantly the acute lack of contributors to
Frescobaldi on macOS. (This has been a problem for LilyPond itself too, by the
way.) Most contributors, including the original Frescobaldi author and most of
the currently active people (like myself) are running Linux. That Frescobaldi
kept working on macOS was basically a heroic effort by Davide Liessi, who
however has little time for it. Some people like Jacques Menu kindly offered to
help building installers, from detailed instructions, which is how the latest
release has an installer for Apple Silicon machines. But the set of people with
both Python / PyQt skills plus familiarity with Frescobaldi's source code, and a
working macOS environment, is basically reduced to Davide, who doesn't have
time. There is also a remote machine on MacStadium that I can use, but the
connection is horrendously slow and breaks frequently and the system is old.
That doesn't really scale. I know that there are repeated complaints about (non-
blocking) oddities like this on macOS, but unfortunately it will remain hard to
fix them until that set of people expands.


> Thanks to everyone for recommending the upgrade. I am very glad to have the 
> new version of Frescobaldi. The start-up issue is only a nuisance but I enjoy 
> this program so much, I worry a bit when there are odd problems like this. 
> 
> Would the system report/program-dump be of any use? I can send a zip file.


Is there even a system report? If so, yes, I'd be interested to see it, maybe
it'll confirm or disprove my conjecture about the cause.

Regards,
Jean



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Re: Lilypond Terminates on Start-Up

[Mats-Olof Liljegren]

Hello,

I am using Frescobaldi with success on several Mac with different OS.

I can confirm that I have to click on Frescobaldi in the Dock after first 
start. But after that it runs perfect.

I have also to confirm in security settings that it is ok to run several 
program that Frescobaldi needs to work eg. Lilypond.

I have downloaded the latest(?) 2.25.. version of Lilypond and in Frescobaldi I 
point to lilypond in the folder where I hav placed the folders. It’s easy to 
have several lilypond versions if you want. Just point it to the one you would 
like to run.

So for me it is easy to run Frescobaldi on Mac. The only thing is that I have 
to click on the Frescobaldi icon in dock when I start up the program.

Maybe there are other issues that I’m not aware of, but for me it works great.

Med vänlig hälsning / Kind regards
Mats-Olof Liljegren

e-pro
Oskarsvägen 11B
702 14 Örebro
Tel 070 360 19 19
e-post m...@e-pro.se
web: http://e-pro.se

> 19 sep. 2023 kl. 12:16 skrev Jean Abou Samra :
> 
> Le lundi 18 septembre 2023 à 18:13 +, Zone Dremik a écrit :
>> Hello,
>> 
>> This is a follow-up concerning Frescobaldi start-up problems on Mac Ventura 
>> 13.5 (I should clarify that this is an issue that only occurs when I first 
>> start Frescobaldi after having powered-on the computer). 
>> 
>> I upgraded to Frescobaldi 3.3.0 via MacPorts. That worked very well, but the 
>> anomalous behavior is the same. 
>> 
>> If I double-click a .ly file icon in the Mac Finder, I get the start-up 
>> animation and Frescobaldi splash screen. No menus appear and the file is not 
>> opened. 
>> 
>> Mac system show Frescobaldi not responding. 
>> 
>> If I go back and double-click the .ly file icon,(while Frescobaldi is 
>> running, but not responding) the file opens in the usual Frescobaldi 
>> window-set, along with the menus at the top of the screen. However, 
>> everything is inoperative, and still shows Not Responding in Mac system 
>> activity monitor. 
>> 
>> There is no response when clicking menus, and I can not select and edit the 
>> code. I must force quit. 
>> 
>> I tried waiting up to ten minutes, so see if it was just busy or slow.
>> 
>> At this point, I can start Frescobaldi from the app icon and then 
>> double-click a .ly file-icon, and everything runs properly. I can quit and 
>> start again without problems, until I power-off the computer. 
> 
> 
> 
> Not sure why I didn't think about it earlier, but this may be
> https://github.com/frescobaldi/frescobaldi/issues/428
> or a variant of it.
> 
> When Frescobaldi freezes, if you click its icon on the dock, does it come 
> back?
> 
> As you can see, that issue is an old problem that remained a mystery to 
> everyone until I was able to find (after lots of searching) a plausible cause 
> last May. I haven't been able to produce a fix yet (though there was some 
> progress  towards 
> simplifying the creation of app bundles, which could help).
> 
> Historically, macOS has been a pain to support for Frescobaldi (and LilyPond) 
> because of the peculiar user interface and distribution requirements imposed 
> by the platform, but also and most importantly the acute lack of contributors 
> to Frescobaldi on macOS. (This has been a problem for LilyPond itself too, by 
> the way.) Most contributors, including the original Frescobaldi author and 
> most of the currently active people (like myself) are running Linux. That 
> Frescobaldi kept working on macOS was basically a heroic effort by Davide 
> Liessi, who however has little time for it. Some people like Jacques Menu 
> kindly offered to help building installers, from detailed instructions, which 
> is how the latest release has an installer for Apple Silicon machines. But 
> the set of people with both Python / PyQt skills plus familiarity with 
> Frescobaldi's source code, and a working macOS environment, is basically 
> reduced to Davide, who doesn't have time. There is also a remote machine on 
> MacStadium that I can use, but the connection is horrendously slow and breaks 
> frequently and the system is old. That doesn't really scale. I know that 
> there are repeated complaints about (non-blocking) oddities like this on 
> macOS, but unfortunately it will remain hard to fix them until that set of 
> people expands.
> 
> 
>> Thanks to everyone for recommending the upgrade. I am very glad to have the 
>> new version of Frescobaldi. The start-up issue is only a nuisance but I 
>> enjoy this program so much, I worry a bit when there are odd problems like 
>> this. 
>> 
>> Would the system report/program-dump be of any use? I can send a zip file.
> 
> 
> Is there even a system report? If so, yes, I'd be interested to see it, maybe 
> it'll confirm or disprove my conjecture about the cause.
> 
> Regards,
> Jean
> 
> 

Re: Lilypond Terminates on Start-Up

[Jean Abou Samra]

> Maybe there are other issues that I’m not aware of,

The Frescobaldi issue tracker is here:

https://github.com/frescobaldi/frescobaldi/issues

and you can filter them by the macOS label:

https://github.com/frescobaldi/frescobaldi/issues?q=is%3Aopen+is%3Aissue+label%3AmacOS

That gives a good start for anyone wanting to improve Frescobaldi's macOS
support.

Probably the most significant ones are

https://github.com/frescobaldi/frescobaldi/issues/1244

namely the startup problem, and

https://github.com/frescobaldi/frescobaldi/issues/1244

which prevents the SVG view and the documentation browser from working when
using the app bundles (as opposed to MacPorts).




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Problems with tempo in 15/8 time

[Knute Snortum]

Hi everyone.

I am engraving a Scriabin prelude in 15/8 time.  I'm having two problems
both related to the tempo of the piece.  Scriabin used a metronome marking
of a dotted quarter note tied to a quarter note = 69 - 72.  I can use
markup and \rhythm to get the notes, but the two notes are too far apart.
I can use two \note keywords to get the two notes close to each other, but
no tie.  So the first question is how do I get the two notes closer.  I've
attached the LilyPond source and a screenshot of my attempts.

Secondly, what's the best way to get the MIDI to play at the correct
tempo?  I'd like to do something like \tempo 5*8 = 69 but of course that
doesn't work.  Right now I have \tempo 8 = 345, which is 69 times five but
is that the best way to do it?

Thanks as always for your input.

--
Knute Snortum
\version "2.24.2"

tempoMarkupA = 
\markup {
  \large
  "Presto"
  \hspace #0.4
  \teeny
  \rhythm { 4.~ 4 }
  \small 
  \normal-text
  "= 69-72"
}

tempoMarkupB = 
\markup {
  \large
  "Presto"
  \hspace #0.4
  \translate #'(0 . 0.4)
  \teeny { 
\note { 4. } #UP
\note { 4 } #UP
  } 
  \small 
  \normal-text
  "= 69-72"
}

{
  \tempo \tempoMarkupA
  c'1
}

{
  \tempo \tempoMarkupB
  c'1
}

Re: Problems with tempo in 15/8 time

[Jean Abou Samra]

> So the first question is how do I get the two notes closer.  I've attached the
> LilyPond source and a screenshot of my attempts.

You can do

\rhythm {
\override Score.SpacingSpanner.spacing-increment = 0.5
4.~ 4
}


> Secondly, what's the best way to get the MIDI to play at the correct tempo? 
> I'd like to do something like \tempo 5*8 = 69 but of course that doesn't
> work.  Right now I have \tempo 8 = 345, which is 69 times five but is that the
> best way to do it?

I actually don't see any technical reason why \tempo 8*5 = 69 should be
rejected. (I just tested the parser change and it didn't seem to cause trouble).

Anyway, this works:

  \tempo $#{ 8*5 #} = 70

Best,
Jean




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Re: Problems with tempo in 15/8 time

[Knute Snortum]

On Tue, Sep 19, 2023 at 8:06 AM Jean Abou Samra  wrote:

> So the first question is how do I get the two notes closer.  I've attached
> the LilyPond source and a screenshot of my attempts.
>
>
> You can do
>
> \rhythm {
> \override Score.SpacingSpanner.spacing-increment = 0.5
> 4.~ 4
> }
>
>
> Secondly, what's the best way to get the MIDI to play at the correct
> tempo?  I'd like to do something like \tempo 5*8 = 69 but of course that
> doesn't work.  Right now I have \tempo 8 = 345, which is 69 times five but
> is that the best way to do it?
>
>
> I actually don't see any technical reason why \tempo 8*5 = 69 should be
> rejected. (I just tested the parser change and it didn't seem to cause
> trouble).
>
> Anyway, this works:
>
>   \tempo $#{ 8*5 #} = 70
>

Thanks Jean,  those solutions work great.