Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Language names should be in the target language chars
Hi Eike, let me disagree with you. The points you mentioned are valid, but to me they look more like a bunch of selected edge cases than common real-life scenarios. 2014.04.14 15:03, Eike Rathke wrote: On Thursday, 2014-04-10 18:26:44 +0800, 锁琨珑 wrote: So far, the language names shown in "Tools - Options - Language Settings" are in the localed language name strings. I believe those language names should be changed to the target names chars for all UIs, like the language listed here: http://zh-cn.libreoffice.org/international-sites/ (see the second column) While having language names in their native language is fine for interfaces where a user only wants to pick his/her own language, it is not desirable for interfaces where several languages can be chosen for different purposes that are not native to the user. Let me explain some disadvantages: * a document containing language attribution the user doesn't know the native name of, s/he will see a meaningless entry in the language list If the user doesn't know the language in question, knowing the name of that particular language in their own language will hardly help. In other words, I doubt that actually knowing that the language is Whateverian (something you've never heard of) will help you understand the doc any better than knowing that the language is Gibberishian (the name you can't even read). * seeing the language list, a user will not know what languages are offered except those s/he can somehow deduce The user doesn't really care about "what languages are offered". What they care about is whether or not the language they need *at the moment* is offered. Assuming that they will know the native name of that language, it will often be much easier for them to find that name than guess it. Would you know or guess that German in Lithuanian is Vokiečių? I doubt that. * wanting to prepare a document with different locale settings (e.g. using different currencies or formatting) the user would have to know the native names I doubt one could prepare a document in any language they don't know to such extent. Setting metadata would be my least concern in such case... * a developer adding a language to the language listbox would have to know that name in the native language; yes, CLDR in the mean time provides native names of most frequently used languages, but not for the not so frequently used that now are occasionally requested; s/he'd have to take the word of the one requesting that language How's that a problem? If somebody makes a request, you can always ask the requester what the native language name is. * for developers this gets even more cumbersome for languages that can be written in different scripts, or scripts the developer doesn't know at all; would you know how to correctly write Arabic and enter it on your native keyboard? Or Mongolian in the Mongolian script? You'd have to rely on copy&paste and pray that your editor handles all Unicode characters, RTL writing direction and so forth. I agree that this might be a bit inconvenient for developers, but I'm pretty sure there must be an acceptable solution to that inconvenience. For example, non-latin language names could probably be stored in escaped fashion where appropriate (in the source code). I really don't think "X is inconvenient for developers" is a good excuse to keep something at a state less convenient for the end-user. I am thinking about this because of the following reason: * It's a waste of time for localizers to translate every foreign language names to their own locale. Even translated, it may not be correct. That's about 350 language names we currently have, of an overall of some hundred thousand words to translate (including help), doesn't really look significant to me. Plus, once translated the names almost never change. It's still useless and – most importantly – inconvenient to most users (=those who know the native name of language they want to pick). * In case the users are trying to switch between languages, there may be confusion (for example, if I want to test something in Franch UI, and after that I want to change back to Chinese UI it's really difficult to find the right one in the list box. There's an easy trick for that: assign the language to a portion of text and reload the document in the other UI language. I'm pretty sure that developers can find easy tricks to solve their inconveniences as well. E.g. copy-paste. And there is a corrensponding bug report here: Bug 59901 - UI: Name of each language in target language https://www.libreoffice.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=59901 I'll add the same comment there. I hope your stance is not too strict about this. Regards, Rimas -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting gu
[libreoffice-l10n] [pocheck][a-m][14-04-15] errors in 4.2 (errors causing runtime problems)
Hi *, translations are run through pocheck utility that discards translations for stuff that cause runtime-problems. Specifically, it checks whether * style names are unique * math symbol identifiers contain spaces * calc functions are unique * windows installer strings (where English ends with "|", translation must end with "|" too) The following languages have one or more of the above errors. If your language is not in the following list, feel free to ignore the rest of the mail. If you're listed, search for "# " to jump to the list of errors in your language (as of the export done earlier today) Langauges with errors: am as ast bn-IN bo br brx bs ca ca-valencia dgo dz es eu fa gl gu hi id ka km kmr-Latn kn ko kok ks mai mk ml mn mni mr my Pocheck error report for # am # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po ራስጌ Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. ሰአት ቀን Pocheck error report for # as # Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po noelement — উপাদান নাই identical — চিনাক্ত কৰিব পৰা perthousand — প্ৰতি হাজাৰ Pocheck error report for # ast # Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. DIST.WEIBULL Pocheck error report for # bn-IN # Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. AVERAGE COUNTIF IMCOS ISERROR ISNA SUMIF Pocheck error report for # bo # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po རེའུ་མིག་གི་ཁ་བྱང་། སྒྲིག་ཨང་མཇུག་སྒྲིལ། སྒྲིག་ཨང་མུ་མཐུད། སྒྲིག་ཨང་འགོ་འཛུགས། Pocheck error report for # br # Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. DASPARZHSKOUERIEK Pocheck error report for # brx # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po फारिलाइ फारिलाइ आयदाफोर फारिलाइ लिरबिदांनि बिमुं Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po element — गुदि मुवा noelement — जेबो गुदि मुवा गैया strictlylessthan — गोरायै एसेसिन strictlygreaterthan — गोरायै गेदेरसिन notequal — समान नङा tendto — थि बिथिंजों थां infinite — सिमा गोयै perthousand — रोजा फायाव Pocheck error report for # bs # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po Naslov Pocheck error report for # ca # Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. INV.KHIQUAD PROVA.KHIQUAD Pocheck error report for # ca-valencia # Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. INV.KHIQUAD PROVA.KHIQUAD Pocheck error report for # dgo # Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po alpha — अल्फा beta — बीटा delta — डेल्टा epsilon — एप्सीलान zeta — ज़ेटा eta — इटा theta — थीटा iota — आओटा kappa — कप्पा lambda — लांब्डा omicron — ओमिक्रॉन sigma — सिग्मा upsilon — अप्सीलान phi — फी chi — काई psi — सी omega — ओमेगा varepsilon — varepsilon noelement — कोई तत्व नेईं strictlylessthan — शा घट्ट पाबंदी कन्नै strictlygreaterthan — शा बद्ध पाबंदी कन्नै notequal — बरोबर नेईं identical — इक जनेहा tendto — च झुकाऽ infinite — अनंत perthousand — फी ज्हार Missing '|' character at the end of translated string. It causes runtime error in installer. in file instsetoo_native/inc_openoffice/windows/msi_languages.po Up one level| — इक स्तर उप्पर Up One Level| — उप्पर इक स्तर Pocheck error report for # dz # Missing '|' character at the end of translated string. It causes runtime error in installer. in file instsetoo_native/inc_openoffice/windows/msi_languages.po Create new folder| — སྣོད་འཛིན་གསརཔ་ གསར་བསྐྲུན་འབད། Up one level| — ཡར་གནས་རིམ་གཅིག Pocheck error report for # es # Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. DIST.WEIBULL Pocheck error report for # eu # Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po noelement — elementurik ez Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. ISERROR ISNA Pocheck error report for # fa # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po عنوان Math symbol names must not c
[libreoffice-l10n] [pocheck][n-z][14-04-15] errors in 4.2 (errors causing runtime problems)
Hi *, translations are run through pocheck utility that discards translations for stuff that cause runtime-problems. Specifically, it checks whether * style names are unique * math symbol identifiers contain spaces * calc functions are unique * windows installer strings (where English ends with "|", translation must end with "|" too) The following languages have one or more of the above errors. If your language is not in the following list, feel free to ignore the rest of the mail. If you're listed, search for "# " to jump to the list of errors in your language (as of the export done earlier today) Langauges with errors: nb ne nl nn nr nso oc om or pa-IN ro rw sa-IN sat sd si sid sq ss st sw-TZ ta te tg tn tr ts ug uk uz vi xh zu Pocheck error report for # nb # Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. BETAFORDELING BINOM.FORDELING EKSP.FORDELING HYPGEOM.FORDELING INV.KJIKVADRATFORDELING INVERS.BETAFORDELING KJIKVADRATFORDELING KONFIDENS STDAV STDAVP VARIANSP Pocheck error report for # ne # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po शीर्षक Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po noelement — तत्व छैन notequal — समान छैन Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. COUNTIF IMCOS IMSIN ISERROR ISNA SUMIF औसत Pocheck error report for # nl # Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. BETA.VERD BINOMIALE.VERD EXPON.VERD F.INVERSE F.VERDELING HYPERGEO.VERD VAR.P Pocheck error report for # nn # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po Overskrift Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. ABS BETAFORDELING BINOM.FORDELING EKSP.FORDELING ERFEIL HYPGEOM.FORDELING STDAVP VARIANSP Pocheck error report for # nr # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po Nambara Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLNUMRULE_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po Nambara Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po tendto — tjhidisela ku Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. UMPHUMELA Pocheck error report for # nso # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po Sehlogwana Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po noelement — ga go na elemente strictlygreaterthan — e tloga e le kgolwane go perthousand — ka sekete Pocheck error report for # oc # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po Títol Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. COMPTA.SE IMCOS IMSIN LEI.BINOMIALA LEI.EXPONENCIALA LEI.F LEI.IPERGEOMETRICA LEI.POISSON LEI.WEIBULL RECÈRCA SOMA.SE TÈST.F VAR.P Pocheck error report for # om # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po Dhuma tarree 3 Mataduree Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. IMCOS IMSIN Pocheck error report for # or # Style name translations must be unique — See STR_POOLCOLL_* Duplicated translations in file sw/source/ui/utlui.po ଶୀର୍ଷକ Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po upsilon — ଅପ୍ ସିଲନ୍ noelement — ଅଶଂ ନାହିଁ strictlylessthan — ୟଥାର୍ଥଭାବରେ ଠାରୁ କମ୍ strictlygreaterthan — ୟଥାର୍ଥଭାବରେ ଠାରୁ ବଡ notequal — ସମାନ ନୁହେଁ tendto — ର ତତ୍ତ୍ବନେବା perthousand — ହଜାର ପ୍ରତି Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. ଦିନ Pocheck error report for # pa-IN # Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po identical — ਇਕੋ ਜਿਹੇ Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. ISERROR ਗਿਣਤੀ Pocheck error report for # ro # Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po noelement — nici un element strictlylessthan — mai mic strict ca strictlygreaterthan — mai mare strict ca Spreadsheet function name translations must be unique. ISERROR Pocheck error report for # rw # Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po strictlygreaterthan — biruta ukobyagendakose Pocheck error report for # sa-IN # Math symbol names must not contain spaces in file starmath/source.po element — तत्वम् noelement — न किमपि तत्वम् strictlylessthan — अस्मात् निश्चितरूपेण् न्यूनम् strictlygreaterthan — अस्मात् निश्चितरूपेण् अ
[libreoffice-l10n] [ANN] LIbreOffice 4.1.6 RC1 available
Dear Community, The Document Foundation is pleased to announce the first release candidate of LibreOffice 4.1.6. The upcoming 4.1.6 will be the sixth and final in a sequence of frequent bugfix releases for our feature-packed 4.1 line. Feel free to give it a try instead of 4.1.5. The release is available for Windows, Linux and Mac OS X from our QA builds download page at http://www.libreoffice.org/download/pre-releases/ Developers and QA might also be interested in the symbol server for windows debug information (see the release notes linked below for details) Should you find bugs, please report them to the FreeDesktop Bugzilla: https://bugs.freedesktop.org A good way to assess the release candidate quality is to run some specific manual tests on it, our TCM wiki page has more details: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/QA/Testing/Regression_Tests#Full_Regression_Test For other ways to get involved with this exciting project - you can e.g. contribute code: http://www.libreoffice.org/community/developers/ translate LibreOffice to your language: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/LibreOffice_Localization_Guide or help with funding our operations: http://donate.libreoffice.org/ A list of known issues and fixed bugs with 4.1.6 RC1 is available from our wiki: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Releases/4.1.6/RC1 Let us close again with a BIG Thank You! to all of you having contributed to the LibreOffice project - this release would not have been possible without your help. On behalf of the Community, Christian -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
