Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
On Thu, 7 Feb 2019 at 00:54, wrote: > > We already looked at Hyperkitty, and found it fairly limited in > > functionality. Avoiding Hyperkitty is what led us to Discourse in the > > first place. > Can you link that discussion please? It was on IRC and in person discussions, and private emails between various people. > I'm interested what newcomers want > to do such that Hyperkitty doesn't let. Negatives of Discourse: loads > slower, broken without evergreen CSS and JS, huge blank margins. Fedora > uses Hyperkitty on its other, non-Silverblue lists. > We asked Fedora developers for their experiences, and they weren't overly impressed with it. Off the top of my head (and after using Hyperkitty to browse Fedora desktop and devel mailing lists for the last couple of years): - Hyperkitty's UX is confusing, cluttered to the point of being unhelpful - navigating through recent discussions never makes it clear which emails are newer, and the fake threading makes it visually harder to scan - searching is a disaster, with results returned without any sense of what's relevant or not - mobile access is pretty much not supported - it's all just a front to a mailman, instead of being a whole packaged software; this means: - harder to set up and upgrade - no moderation tools - no categories, sub-categories, or tagging to organise email - no integration with services or additional plugins In general, mailman3 + hyperkitty is a somewhat good upgrade on mailman2 (even though I still prefer the old archive pages compared to hyperkitty; I've been going through those *a lot* for my "History of GNOME" project), but it does not compare to other platforms like Discourse. Ciao, Emmanuele. -- https://www.bassi.io [@] ebassi [@gmail.com] ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
On Wed, 6 Feb 2019 at 12:19, Emmanuele Bassi wrote: > > The main differences are that you’d need a different subscription account > than the existing one, and that you wouldn’t have the weekly digests, as > far as I can see. > It turns out I was wrong: Discourse has "weekly summaries" as well. As for the subscription: Discourse supports multiple identity providers—Google, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Yahoo, and GitHub are all supported, and there's a plugin available for GitLab authentication as well, so we might be able to automatically authenticate existing GTK contributors with an account on gitlab.gnome.org. Ciao, Emmanuele. -- https://www.bassi.io [@] ebassi [@gmail.com] ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
On Fri, Feb 8, 2019 at 7:33 AM Emmanuele Bassi via gtk-devel-list < gtk-devel-list@gnome.org> wrote: > > As for the subscription: Discourse supports multiple identity > providers—Google, Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, Yahoo, and GitHub are all > supported, and there's a plugin available for GitLab authentication as > well, so we might be able to automatically authenticate existing GTK > contributors with an account on gitlab.gnome.org. > It took one of ardour's (amazing) devs not much more than several hours of work to use Discourse's SSO capabilities to integrate with Drupal authentication, so even if the plugin doesn't work as you want, making something that does will be simple for someone who understands this stuff. ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
> - Hyperkitty's UX is confusing, cluttered to the point of being unhelpful Would benefit from examples of clutter. Opened home page, saw lists. Opened list, saw threads. Opened thread, saw replies and a new reply link. And some buttons for permalink, rating, archive and stats. Basic features. If by cluttered you mean excessive borders and backgrounds, it's CSS and I'll gladly patch to reduce these if you'd like. > - navigating through recent discussions never makes it clear which emails > are newer, and the fake threading makes it visually harder to scan Just click "Show replies by date". > - searching is a disaster, with results returned without any sense of what's > relevant or not Good point, though I don't know whether Discourse is better at this, and general purpose web indexing tools should work fine with HyperKitty as it outputs HTML unlike Discourse. > - mobile access is pretty much not supported Fedora mailing lists have a great responsive version, I have them open on a phone right now and their scripts work even on old WebKit. Meanwhile Discourse in the next tab loads a blank screen. > - it's all just a front to a mailman, instead of being a whole packaged > software; this means: > - harder to set up and upgrade Please elaborate, what I see in docs about setup is easier than GitLab and other tools GNOME already deploys. > - no moderation tools Yes, lack of moderation tools is a valid issue. > - no categories, sub-categories, or tagging to organise email Why would a list of 100 monthly emails need sub-categories and tags? For newcomers that's even more fragmented nesting and thus confusion. > - no integration with services or additional plugins It's email, lots of software can send notifications. Additional plugins and integrations are a maintenance burden and thus invalidate your previous points about ease of setup and one single package. ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
> ardour LMMS moved handling of support requests and conversations from their mailing list to GitHub issues and it works. Using GNOME's GitLab as the single place for discussions can also be considered an alternative. One can respond to issues via email, and email is how I get my notifications of the issues and pull requests. It has moderation tools and tags, so Emmanuele might prefer it to HyperKitty. GitLab works on mobile, though it loads data with AJAX and annoys me with sidebars and its button kitchensink that I never use.___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
On 02/08/2019 12:45 PM, makep...@firemail.cc wrote: ardour LMMS moved handling of support requests and conversations from their mailing list to GitHub issues and it works. Using GNOME's GitLab as the single place for discussions can also be considered an alternative. One can respond to issues via email, and email is how I get my notifications of the issues and pull requests. It has moderation tools and tags, so Emmanuele might prefer it to HyperKitty. GitLab works on mobile, though it loads data with AJAX and annoys me with sidebars and its button kitchensink that I never use. So let me get this straight, GitLab has a feature where an ordinary user can setup his GitLab account to email him every time a new issue is created? I have responded to an issue via email that I originally discovered (and posted to) on the website, but I haven't figured out how to have new issues sent to my inbox. ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
On Fri, 2019-02-08 at 11:07 +, Emmanuele Bassi via gtk-devel-list wrote: > > > In general, mailman3 + hyperkitty is a somewhat good upgrade on > mailman2 (even though I still prefer the old archive pages compared > to hyperkitty; I've been going through those *a lot* for my "History > of GNOME" project), but it does not compare to other platforms like > Discourse. > I think we can safely end the chapter of mailman use. As a person who manages a number of lists, I find the tedious removal of spam to be annoying. The engagement team is following suit as well because it is much more newcomer friendly to our volunteers. Thanks for making this happen, Emmanuele - our team are excited to move too! Cheers, sri ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
So let me get this straight, GitLab has a feature where an ordinary user can setup his GitLab account to email him every time a new issue is created? It's on the repo page, behind the bell icon, to the left of the star. Visible after signing in. To be honest, I'd rather hide the stars and make this one more noticeable. Same feature as GitHub watch. ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
On 02/08/2019 04:37 PM, makep...@firemail.cc wrote: So let me get this straight, GitLab has a feature where an ordinary user can setup his GitLab account to email him every time a new issue is created? It's on the repo page, behind the bell icon, to the left of the star. Visible after signing in. To be honest, I'd rather hide the stars and make this one more noticeable. Same feature as GitHub watch. Thanks. But it probably isn't possible to open an issue for Gtk by emailing a specific email address on GitLab, or am I wrong? ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
On Pá, úno 8, 2019 at 11:53 PM, Reuben Rissler wrote: Thanks. But it probably isn't possible to open an issue for Gtk by emailing a specific email address on GitLab, or am I wrong? Only in Enterprise Edition Premium: https://gitlab.com/help/user/project/service_desk ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
Re: Moving from mailing lists to Discourse
open an issue for Gtk by emailing a specific email address on GitLab GNOME's instance seem to disallow creating issues by email. GitLab itself, if configured with sub-addressing, generates a private email address for issues when you sign in and visit a repository page: https://docs.gitlab.com/ce/user/project/issues/create_new_issue.html#new-issue-via-email Does Discourse let one email new threads, or only to respond? ___ gtk-devel-list mailing list gtk-devel-list@gnome.org https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gtk-devel-list
