Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not add BTC?

[Eric Coates via gnucash-user]

Hi

To (slightly) misquote John Ralls
"Bitcoin is neither a major nor a minor currency. It's not a currency at 
all:...[it is]  a speculation vehicle, not a currency."

but as shares are also "speculation vehicles" a possibility arises.

Starting from Dustin Henning's comment, some trivial experimentation 
shows that it is possible to set up a Bitcoin account in GnuCash by 
classifying it as a Stock (although Mutual Fund may be more appropriate 
as, I understand, fractional parts of Bitcoin are possible) and setting 
up Bitcoin as a security. And (somewhat to my surprise) it is possible 
to get on-line quotes by specifying the Symbol/abbreviation as BTC-GBP 
and using Yahoo as JSON as the source in the Single source drop-down. 
(BTC -USD is also available, others may be - I haven't checked).


So (probably after some experimentation) Bitcoin can already be handled 
within GnuCash!


"They knew not how well they built"

Take care

Eric

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Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not add BTC?

[john]

Of course it is, and it has been since v3.0.

But GnuCash permits only currencies for denominating Equity (which includes 
income and expense) and Liability accounts and some users want us to enable 
that for cryptocurrencies.

When the banking industry starts using cryptocurrencies they'll get added to 
ISO4217 and when that happens we'll do the same for GnuCash.

Regards,
John Ralls


> On Dec 7, 2021, at 4:42 AM, Eric Coates via gnucash-user 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi
> 
> To (slightly) misquote John Ralls
> "Bitcoin is neither a major nor a minor currency. It's not a currency at 
> all:...[it is]  a speculation vehicle, not a currency."
> but as shares are also "speculation vehicles" a possibility arises.
> 
> Starting from Dustin Henning's comment, some trivial experimentation shows 
> that it is possible to set up a Bitcoin account in GnuCash by classifying it 
> as a Stock (although Mutual Fund may be more appropriate as, I understand, 
> fractional parts of Bitcoin are possible) and setting up Bitcoin as a 
> security. And (somewhat to my surprise) it is possible to get on-line quotes 
> by specifying the Symbol/abbreviation as BTC-GBP and using Yahoo as JSON as 
> the source in the Single source drop-down. (BTC -USD is also available, 
> others may be - I haven't checked).
> 
> So (probably after some experimentation) Bitcoin can already be handled 
> within GnuCash!
> 
> "They knew not how well they built"
> 
> Take care
> 
> Eric
> 
> ___
> gnucash-user mailing list
> gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
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Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not

[Kalpesh Patel]

Why not to set this up as a true currency in GNC, instead of Stock or Mutual
Fund?

 

--

 

Message: 8

Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2021 12:42:21 +

From: Eric Coates mailto:twistedw...@talktalk.net> >

To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org  

Subject: Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not

add BTC?

Message-ID: <6bc32ed3-ac6b-5924-1990-f852c6829...@talktalk.net
 >

Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed

 

Hi

 

To (slightly) misquote John Ralls

"Bitcoin is neither a major nor a minor currency. It's not a currency at
all:...[it is]? a speculation vehicle, not a currency."

but as shares are also "speculation vehicles" a possibility arises.

 

Starting from Dustin Henning's comment, some trivial experimentation shows
that it is possible to set up a Bitcoin account in GnuCash by classifying it
as a Stock (although Mutual Fund may be more appropriate as, I understand,
fractional parts of Bitcoin are possible) and setting up Bitcoin as a
security. And (somewhat to my surprise) it is possible to get on-line quotes
by specifying the Symbol/abbreviation as BTC-GBP and using Yahoo as JSON as
the source in the Single source drop-down. 

(BTC -USD is also available, others may be - I haven't checked).

 

So (probably after some experimentation) Bitcoin can already be handled
within GnuCash!

 

"They knew not how well they built"

 

Take care

 

Eric

 

 

 

 

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Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not

[davidcousens49]

Kalpesh,

John's answer is pretty explicit. It is not, at least yet, a "true " currency
and as such does not obey the "rules" that financial regulation applies to true
currencies that allow their treatment as currencies. There needs to be a
regulated international system of financial exchange which does not yet exist
for bitcoin. At present it is regulated in only one or two countries not the
rest of the world. It is more appropriate to describe it as a stock or mutual
fund at this point in time.

David Cousens

On Tue, 2021-12-07 at 14:19 -0500, Kalpesh Patel wrote:
> Why not to set this up as a true currency in GNC, instead of Stock or Mutual
> Fund?
> 
>  
> 
> --
> 
>  
> 
> Message: 8
> 
> Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2021 12:42:21 +
> 
> From: Eric Coates   >
> 
> To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org  
> 
> Subject: Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not
> 
> add BTC?
> 
> Message-ID: <6bc32ed3-ac6b-5924-1990-f852c6829...@talktalk.net
>  >
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
> 
>  
> 
> Hi
> 
>  
> 
> To (slightly) misquote John Ralls
> 
> "Bitcoin is neither a major nor a minor currency. It's not a currency at
> all:...[it is]? a speculation vehicle, not a currency."
> 
> but as shares are also "speculation vehicles" a possibility arises.
> 
>  
> 
> Starting from Dustin Henning's comment, some trivial experimentation shows
> that it is possible to set up a Bitcoin account in GnuCash by classifying it
> as a Stock (although Mutual Fund may be more appropriate as, I understand,
> fractional parts of Bitcoin are possible) and setting up Bitcoin as a
> security. And (somewhat to my surprise) it is possible to get on-line quotes
> by specifying the Symbol/abbreviation as BTC-GBP and using Yahoo as JSON as
> the source in the Single source drop-down. 
> 
> (BTC -USD is also available, others may be - I haven't checked).
> 
>  
> 
> So (probably after some experimentation) Bitcoin can already be handled
> within GnuCash!
> 
>  
> 
> "They knew not how well they built"
> 
>  
> 
> Take care
> 
>  
> 
> Eric
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> ___
> gnucash-user mailing list
> gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
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> https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Mailing_Lists for more information.
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> Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
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Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not

[D. via gnucash-user]

Furthermore, the topic has been discussed at great length numerous times in the 
past on these lists. Searching on Google with "bitcoin site:lists.gnucash.org" 
will turn up many of these discussions, dating back a decade or so.


 Original Message 
From: davidcousen...@gmail.com
Sent: Tue Dec 07 15:15:54 EST 2021
To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org
Subject: Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not

Kalpesh,

John's answer is pretty explicit. It is not, at least yet, a "true " currency
and as such does not obey the "rules" that financial regulation applies to true
currencies that allow their treatment as currencies. There needs to be a
regulated international system of financial exchange which does not yet exist
for bitcoin. At present it is regulated in only one or two countries not the
rest of the world. It is more appropriate to describe it as a stock or mutual
fund at this point in time.

David Cousens

On Tue, 2021-12-07 at 14:19 -0500, Kalpesh Patel wrote:
> Why not to set this up as a true currency in GNC, instead of Stock or Mutual
> Fund?
> 
>  
> 
> --
> 
>  
> 
> Message: 8
> 
> Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2021 12:42:21 +
> 
> From: Eric Coates   >
> 
> To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org  
> 
> Subject: Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not
> 
> add BTC?
> 
> Message-ID: <6bc32ed3-ac6b-5924-1990-f852c6829...@talktalk.net
>  >
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
> 
>  
> 
> Hi
> 
>  
> 
> To (slightly) misquote John Ralls
> 
> "Bitcoin is neither a major nor a minor currency. It's not a currency at
> all:...[it is]? a speculation vehicle, not a currency."
> 
> but as shares are also "speculation vehicles" a possibility arises.
> 
>  
> 
> Starting from Dustin Henning's comment, some trivial experimentation shows
> that it is possible to set up a Bitcoin account in GnuCash by classifying it
> as a Stock (although Mutual Fund may be more appropriate as, I understand,
> fractional parts of Bitcoin are possible) and setting up Bitcoin as a
> security. And (somewhat to my surprise) it is possible to get on-line quotes
> by specifying the Symbol/abbreviation as BTC-GBP and using Yahoo as JSON as
> the source in the Single source drop-down. 
> 
> (BTC -USD is also available, others may be - I haven't checked).
> 
>  
> 
> So (probably after some experimentation) Bitcoin can already be handled
> within GnuCash!
> 
>  
> 
> "They knew not how well they built"
> 
>  
> 
> Take care
> 
>  
> 
> Eric
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> ___
> gnucash-user mailing list
> gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
> If you are using Nabble or Gmane, please see 
> https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Mailing_Lists for more information.
> -
> Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
> You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.

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[GNC] Suggestion to permit entry of EORI number

[Dr. David Kirkby]

To quote from Wikipedia

"An *Economic Operators Registration and Identification number* (*EORI
number)* is a European Union 
registration and identification number for businesses which undertake the
import or export of goods into or out of the EU."

Note this is neither a tax number, nor company registration number. In
fact, even individuals can need one, not just companies. It would seem
worthwhile allowing this information to be entered. I always shows it on my
company quotes, invoices etc.

Dave (from the UK, which was formally in the EU)
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Re: [GNC] Suggestion to permit entry of EORI number

[davidcousens49]

Dave,

The EORI is not accounting or financial information per se but business 
information and it is specific to a particular jurisdiction. It may be 
appropriate for it to appear on business reports in which case you could 
prepare custom reports for your business that include it.  GnuCash maintains 
its applicability in many jurisdictions by as far as possible restricting its 
scope to dealing with the core financial information as generically as 
possible. 
The facilities are provided in terms of the ability to program custom reports in
Scheme (https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Custom_Reports#Get_to_know_Scheme) or to
use the Python API interface https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Python_Bindings or
SQL if using the database backends for the user to extract information and
present it in any desired manner. Information which is specific to your business
or operation can be hard coded in the report

David Cousens


On Wed, 2021-12-08 at 01:11 +, Dr. David Kirkby wrote:
> To quote from Wikipedia
> 
> "An *Economic Operators Registration and Identification number* (*EORI
> number)* is a European Union 
> registration and identification number for businesses which undertake the
> import or export of goods into or out of the EU."
> 
> Note this is neither a tax number, nor company registration number. In
> fact, even individuals can need one, not just companies. It would seem
> worthwhile allowing this information to be entered. I always shows it on my
> company quotes, invoices etc.
> 
> Dave (from the UK, which was formally in the EU)
> ___
> gnucash-user mailing list
> gnucash-user@gnucash.org
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Re: [GNC] Suggestion to permit entry of EORI number

[Dr. David Kirkby]

On Wed, 8 Dec 2021 at 01:48,  wrote:

> Dave,
>
> The EORI is not accounting or financial information per se but business
> information and it is specific to a particular jurisdiction. It may be
> appropriate for it to appear on business reports in which case you could
> prepare custom reports for your business that include it.  GnuCash
> maintains its applicability in many jurisdictions by as far as possible
> restricting its scope to dealing with the core financial information as
> generically as possible.
> The facilities are provided in terms of the ability to program custom
> reports in
> Scheme (https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Custom_Reports#Get_to_know_Scheme)
> or to
> use the Python API interface https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Python_Bindings
> or
> SQL if using the database backends for the user to extract information and
> present it in any desired manner. Information which is specific to your
> business
> or operation can be hard coded in the report
>
> David Cousens
>

Thank you for the explanation.
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Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not

[davidcousens49]

Kalpesh

Another thing to be wary of. The scammers love bitcoin no regulation no 
protections: 
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-12-08/cryptocurrency-scams-targeting-australians-losing-millions/100678848
David

On Tue, 2021-12-07 at 14:19 -0500, Kalpesh Patel wrote:
> Why not to set this up as a true currency in GNC, instead of Stock or Mutual
> Fund?
> 
>  
> 
> --
> 
>  
> 
> Message: 8
> 
> Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2021 12:42:21 +
> 
> From: Eric Coates   >
> 
> To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org  
> 
> Subject: Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not
> 
> add BTC?
> 
> Message-ID: <6bc32ed3-ac6b-5924-1990-f852c6829...@talktalk.net
>  >
> 
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
> 
>  
> 
> Hi
> 
>  
> 
> To (slightly) misquote John Ralls
> 
> "Bitcoin is neither a major nor a minor currency. It's not a currency at
> all:...[it is]? a speculation vehicle, not a currency."
> 
> but as shares are also "speculation vehicles" a possibility arises.
> 
>  
> 
> Starting from Dustin Henning's comment, some trivial experimentation shows
> that it is possible to set up a Bitcoin account in GnuCash by classifying it
> as a Stock (although Mutual Fund may be more appropriate as, I understand,
> fractional parts of Bitcoin are possible) and setting up Bitcoin as a
> security. And (somewhat to my surprise) it is possible to get on-line quotes
> by specifying the Symbol/abbreviation as BTC-GBP and using Yahoo as JSON as
> the source in the Single source drop-down. 
> 
> (BTC -USD is also available, others may be - I haven't checked).
> 
>  
> 
> So (probably after some experimentation) Bitcoin can already be handled
> within GnuCash!
> 
>  
> 
> "They knew not how well they built"
> 
>  
> 
> Take care
> 
>  
> 
> Eric
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> ___
> gnucash-user mailing list
> gnucash-user@gnucash.org
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Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not

[Tim Hume via gnucash-user]

It is true that Bitcoin is loved by speculators and scammers. But it does have 
legitimate use as a currency too. Government regulators are slowly moving to 
treat Bitcoin transactions similarly to traditional currency transactions 
between countries because of money laundering and terrorism financing concerns.

Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email.

‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐

On Wednesday, December 8th, 2021 at 14:36,  wrote:

> Kalpesh
>
> Another thing to be wary of. The scammers love bitcoin no regulation no 
> protections: 
> https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-12-08/cryptocurrency-scams-targeting-australians-losing-millions/100678848
>
> David
>
> On Tue, 2021-12-07 at 14:19 -0500, Kalpesh Patel wrote:
>
> > Why not to set this up as a true currency in GNC, instead of Stock or Mutual
> >
> > Fund?
> >
> > Message: 8
> >
> > Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2021 12:42:21 +
> >
> > From: Eric Coates  >
> > mailto:twistedw...@talktalk.net >
> >
> > To: gnucash-user@gnucash.org mailto:gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> >
> > Subject: Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not
> >
> > add BTC?
> >
> >
> > Message-ID: <6bc32ed3-ac6b-5924-1990-f852c6829...@talktalk.net
> >
> > mailto:6bc32ed3-ac6b-5924-1990-f852c6829...@talktalk.net >
> >
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
> >
> > Hi
> >
> > To (slightly) misquote John Ralls
> >
> > "Bitcoin is neither a major nor a minor currency. It's not a currency at
> >
> > all:...[it is]? a speculation vehicle, not a currency."
> >
> > but as shares are also "speculation vehicles" a possibility arises.
> >
> > Starting from Dustin Henning's comment, some trivial experimentation shows
> >
> > that it is possible to set up a Bitcoin account in GnuCash by classifying it
> >
> > as a Stock (although Mutual Fund may be more appropriate as, I understand,
> >
> > fractional parts of Bitcoin are possible) and setting up Bitcoin as a
> >
> > security. And (somewhat to my surprise) it is possible to get on-line quotes
> >
> > by specifying the Symbol/abbreviation as BTC-GBP and using Yahoo as JSON as
> >
> > the source in the Single source drop-down.
> >
> > (BTC -USD is also available, others may be - I haven't checked).
> >
> > So (probably after some experimentation) Bitcoin can already be handled
> >
> > within GnuCash!
> >
> > "They knew not how well they built"
> >
> > Take care
> >
> > Eric
> >
> > gnucash-user mailing list
> >
> > gnucash-user@gnucash.org
> >
> > To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
> >
> > https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
> >
> > If you are using Nabble or Gmane, please see
> >
> > https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Mailing_Lists for more information.
> > -
> >
> > Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
> >
> > You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
>
> gnucash-user mailing list
>
> gnucash-user@gnucash.org
>
> To update your subscription preferences or to unsubscribe:
>
> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-user
>
> If you are using Nabble or Gmane, please see 
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> 
>
> Please remember to CC this list on all your replies.
>
> You can do this by using Reply-To-List or Reply-All.
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Re: [GNC] Suggestion to permit entry of EORI number

[Frank H. Ellenberger]

Hi,

just the official link:
https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/business/customs-procedures-import-and-export/customs-procedures/economic-operators-registration-and-identification-number-eori_en

Click on "en" and select your preferred EU language.

It is your "client ID" at the customs authorities.
It is not a totaly new thing. Already before you had either to pay in
cash at the border or register at your customs authorities and use it on
your customs documents.

Just in case someone has fun to create reports for
* Entry Summary Declaration (ENS) or
* Exit Summary Declaration (EXS)
the links are there, too.

Regards
Frank

Am 08.12.21 um 02:11 schrieb Dr. David Kirkby:
> To quote from Wikipedia
> 
> "An *Economic Operators Registration and Identification number* (*EORI
> number)* is a European Union 
> registration and identification number for businesses which undertake the
> import or export of goods into or out of the EU."
> 
> Note this is neither a tax number, nor company registration number. In
> fact, even individuals can need one, not just companies. It would seem
> worthwhile allowing this information to be entered. I always shows it on my
> company quotes, invoices etc.
> 
> Dave (from the UK, which was formally in the EU)

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Re: [GNC] Bitcoin is legal currency in El Salvador - why not

[Dr. David Kirkby]

On Wed, 8 Dec 2021 at 01:03, D. via gnucash-user 
wrote:

> Furthermore, the topic has been discussed at great length numerous times
> in the past on these lists. Searching on Google with "bitcoin site:
> lists.gnucash.org" will turn up many of these discussions, dating back a
> decade or so.


Things change quite quickly in the crypto currency scene.

1) The Royal National Lifeboat Institute (RNLI) was the first major charity
in the UK to accept donations by bitcoin

https://rnli.org/support-us/give-money/bitcoin-donations

2) Newegg, which is a pretty large company, accepts bitcoin

https://promotions.newegg.com/nepro/16-6277/index.html
I guess neither of these very large institutions are going to be using
GnuCash.

There’s a lot written about bitcoin on the website of the Sage accounting
package

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sage.com/en-gb/blog/what-is-cryptocurrency/amp/

I assume that means Sage does support bitcoin.

Dave.


-- 
Dr. David Kirkby,
Kirkby Microwave Ltd,
drkir...@kirkbymicrowave.co.uk
https://www.kirkbymicrowave.co.uk/
Telephone 01621-680100./ +44 1621 680100

Registered in England & Wales, company number 08914892.
Registered office:
Stokes Hall Lodge, Burnham Rd, Althorne, Chelmsford, Essex, CM3 6DT, United
Kingdom
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Re: [GNC] Adaptive learning reset of imports

[Jeff]

On 12/2/21 1:41 PM, David H wrote:
I'm using Flatpak on Ubuntu 21.04 and it is just like the usual 
Gnucash application.  It saves the backup and log files wherever you 
decide to save your data file so I'm guessing you saved your data file 
to your desktop and that's why you ended up with all the backup and 
log files there also ?  I keep my Gnucash data files in 
/home//Documents/GnuCash so that's where all the backup and 
log files are so they aren't cluttering up the desktop. So I would 
suggest you revisit Flatpak and save your datafile in an appropriate 
sub folder. Note that there is also a preference to never retain log 
files so perhaps you had that turned on for the normal desktop app ?


Cheers David H.


On Thu, 2 Dec 2021 at 21:34, Jeff > wrote:


On 12/2/21 4:21 AM, David H wrote:

What version of Gnucash are you running and what OS ? I could be
wrong but I think it's a fairly recent thing...

Cheers David H.


On Thu, 2 Dec 2021 at 19:10, Jeff mailto:beastmaster...@hotmail.com>> wrote:

On 12/2/21 2:50 AM, David H wrote:

Hi Jeff,

Are you looking for Tools >> Import Map Editor ?

Cheers David H.


On Thu, 2 Dec 2021 at 18:29, Jeff
mailto:beastmaster...@hotmail.com>> wrote:

I remember reading a post on resetting the adaptive
learning on OFX
imports but I can not find it now.

I am currently importing an OFX file from a business
checking account
and all income and, a few others that repeatedly show
up, that are not
recognized (this has been happening for several versions
of GNC, both
Windoze and Ubuntu versions 4.?).  I am having this
problem on every
import, whether it is one week or one month of records.

How can I reset the the learning process? IE. all
deposits are income,
not an unknown account?

-- 
--JEffrey Black M.B.A.


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If it is in there I cannot find it.

Perhaps I do not understand how to enter the filter.  All of
the transactions come from one bank.  All deposits are
income, and the OFX import does not recognize any of them as
income, just unknown.


-- 
--JEffrey Black M.B.A.



Ubuntu 20.04.3 LTS with

GNC Version: 4.2
Build ID: 4.2+(2020-09-26)
Finance::Quote: 1.49

*Note I would love to update to the latest stable version but I
have so far been unsuccessful in doing so, all of of my builds
have failed.  And Flatpak caused even more problems for me (copied
all backups to my desktop for some reason)*

It makes no sense to me.  It matches deposits from Square to the
income account but refuses to match checks or cash to the income
account.

--JEffrey Black M.B.A.

My data files are all saved on an external drive so I can take the drive 
anywhere I need to with my laptop instead of staying with my dedicated 
server.


--
--JEffrey Black M.B.A.

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