Re: Issues with Importing Invoices

[Mike Evans]

I'd like to see an example of your CSV file before I can look into this.

Can you post an (anonomised) example please. I assume you are using Windows 
since you mention Excel.

Mike E

On Tue, 23 May 2017 19:58:08 -0700
"Bruce Danielson"  wrote:


> 
> One issue is that if I leave the ID field blank, "import" does not self
> generate invoice ID's - but instead just ignores the lines.  OK - no
> worries, I can plug in invoice numbers in the excel table, that's not too
> much work.  The more serious issue is this, although the specific customers
> are C033 and C034 - when I import, both invoices generated are applied to
> one of the customers only (C033) and none to the other customer (C034).  I
> generate 2 invoices, but both for the same customer (C033).
> 

> Any feedback is appreciated.  I will be away from this email address for a
> couple of days, so no big emergency.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
>  
> 
> Buster
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
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Re: Issues with "Assets over time" report

[Jose Gómez]

Still, there is something I don't get. Why would weighted average not use
the value of USD stocks, and only use the initial value for EUR stocks?
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Re: How to close a financial year

[doncram]

The advice to Anita to close a year's books, with warning present in the
that doing so will destroy usability of reports henceforth, is quite
alarming!  What is meant by "closing" in GnuCash-jargon seems different
than what is meant more usually in accounting.

In an entirely manual accounting, closing the books at the end of year or
other period involves several steps:
1. Recognize accruals (non-cash entries) such as:
**depreciation
**allowance for bad debt (uncollectible accounts)
**accrue payroll liabilities (assuming payroll date was not at the end of
year, some liability of salaries and benefits needs to be accrued
**accrue tax liabilities
**other adjusting entries (to adjust assets and liabilities)
2. Make journal entries transferring expense and revenue account balances
to income statement summary accounts, i.e. generating an income statement
3. Close the income statement summary accounts to retained earnings
4. Freezing forever the accounts for the period (in software, this would be
done by putting a lock on any transactions before the new period)

I am guessing that GnuCash does not support #4.
I gather that in GnuCash, #2 and #3 don't need to be done, because the
income statement report already exists.  And if they are done anyhow then
usability of reports will be destroyed.  A user wants to be able to
generate reports from prior years, e.g. for making comparisons.
About #1, advising Anita how to proceed would require some more information
on what the current balance sheet shows and what assets and liabilities
need to be updated.

Anita, does this begin to help?  And could anyone else clarify?  I
personally am willing to help update the GnuCash documentation about
closing, as this is important!

cheers, Don


On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 4:41 PM, DaveC49  wrote:

> Anita
>
> The Wiki has a secion discussing it at
>
> https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Closing_Books
>
> and the documentation tells you how to use the built in routine for it at
>
> https://www.gnucash.org/docs/v2.6/C/gnucash-help/tool-close-book.html
>
> David Cousens
>
>
>
> --
> View this message in context: http://gnucash.1415818.n4.
> nabble.com/How-to-close-a-financial-year-tp4691662p4691794.html
> Sent from the GnuCash - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Hiding accounts

[Dianna Broughton]

Hi everyone,

 

I hope I can explain my question well enough for someone to be able to
answer. 

 

I know how to hide unused accounts, but when I go an asset or liability
account, and choose an account in the Transfer column, all accounts show up
(including the hidden accounts). 

 

It would speed up my book-keeping if hidden accounts stay hidden everywhere,
unless I choose to "unhide" them.  Is there a way to do this?

 

Thanks for any help or advice.

 

Dianna

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Re: Hiding accounts

[Colin Law]

On 24 May 2017 at 17:06, Dianna Broughton  wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
>
>
> I hope I can explain my question well enough for someone to be able to
> answer.
>
>
>
> I know how to hide unused accounts, but when I go an asset or liability
> account, and choose an account in the Transfer column, all accounts show up
> (including the hidden accounts).
>
>
>
> It would speed up my book-keeping if hidden accounts stay hidden everywhere,
> unless I choose to "unhide" them.  Is there a way to do this?

Also set the account as a Placeholder acct.

Colin
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Re: Hiding accounts

[Maf. King]

Hi Dianna,

I think you have to mark the hidden accounts as placeholder too, then the 
don't appear in the transfer list.

HTH,
Maf.


On Wednesday, 24 May 2017 17:06:55 BST Dianna Broughton wrote:
> Hi everyone,
> 
> 
> 
> I hope I can explain my question well enough for someone to be able to
> answer.
> 
> 
> 
> I know how to hide unused accounts, but when I go an asset or liability
> account, and choose an account in the Transfer column, all accounts show up
> (including the hidden accounts).
> 
> 
> 
> It would speed up my book-keeping if hidden accounts stay hidden everywhere,
> unless I choose to "unhide" them.  Is there a way to do this?
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for any help or advice.
> 
> 
> 
> Dianna
> 
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-- 
Maf. King
PGP Key fingerprint = 8D68 A91F 733B 2C1F 43B7  2B7C E591 E8E1 0DE7 C542



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RE: Hiding accounts

[Dianna Broughton]

Thank you - checking the placeholder box (in addition to the hidden box) worked!

I should've asked long before now!

Warmly,
Dianna


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Re: How to close a financial year

[David T. via gnucash-user]

Don,

As I mentioned originally, there is an annual discussion about the capabilities 
of GnuCash in regards to closing the books—and the philosophies behind each of 
the options that users might choose in that regard. Reading some of those past 
discussions will help you understand GnuCash’s approaches regarding closing 
books, and also the philosophy here regarding “freezing forever” anything. You 
might start with the wiki, which has a summary of the GnuCash perspective on 
closing books (http://lists.gnucash.org/wiki/Closing_Books 
). As for disabling editing, try 
the thread at 
http://lists.gnucash.org/pipermail/gnucash-user/2011-January/038264.html 
 for 
a particularly insightful discussion.

The Close Book feature is described, albeit briefly, in section 8.9 of the 
Help; it may be helpful to add something to the Guide; if you think so, submit 
a bug through Bugzilla, and we can begin the process.

David

> On May 24, 2017, at 7:46 PM, doncram  wrote:
> 
> The advice to Anita to close a year's books, with warning present in the
> that doing so will destroy usability of reports henceforth, is quite
> alarming!  What is meant by "closing" in GnuCash-jargon seems different
> than what is meant more usually in accounting.
> 
> In an entirely manual accounting, closing the books at the end of year or
> other period involves several steps:
> 1. Recognize accruals (non-cash entries) such as:
> **depreciation
> **allowance for bad debt (uncollectible accounts)
> **accrue payroll liabilities (assuming payroll date was not at the end of
> year, some liability of salaries and benefits needs to be accrued
> **accrue tax liabilities
> **other adjusting entries (to adjust assets and liabilities)
> 2. Make journal entries transferring expense and revenue account balances
> to income statement summary accounts, i.e. generating an income statement
> 3. Close the income statement summary accounts to retained earnings
> 4. Freezing forever the accounts for the period (in software, this would be
> done by putting a lock on any transactions before the new period)
> 
> I am guessing that GnuCash does not support #4.
> I gather that in GnuCash, #2 and #3 don't need to be done, because the
> income statement report already exists.  And if they are done anyhow then
> usability of reports will be destroyed.  A user wants to be able to
> generate reports from prior years, e.g. for making comparisons.
> About #1, advising Anita how to proceed would require some more information
> on what the current balance sheet shows and what assets and liabilities
> need to be updated.
> 
> Anita, does this begin to help?  And could anyone else clarify?  I
> personally am willing to help update the GnuCash documentation about
> closing, as this is important!
> 
> cheers, Don
> 
> 
> On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 4:41 PM, DaveC49  wrote:
> 
>> Anita
>> 
>> The Wiki has a secion discussing it at
>> 
>> https://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Closing_Books
>> 
>> and the documentation tells you how to use the built in routine for it at
>> 
>> https://www.gnucash.org/docs/v2.6/C/gnucash-help/tool-close-book.html
>> 
>> David Cousens
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> View this message in context: http://gnucash.1415818.n4.
>> nabble.com/How-to-close-a-financial-year-tp4691662p4691794.html
>> Sent from the GnuCash - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>> ___
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Re: Hiding accounts

[David T. via gnucash-user]

This is actually documented in the Help file at 5.4.1.

David

> On May 24, 2017, at 9:35 PM, Dianna Broughton  
> wrote:
> 
> Thank you - checking the placeholder box (in addition to the hidden box) 
> worked!
> 
> I should've asked long before now!
> 
> Warmly,
> Dianna
> 
> 
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Re: How to close a financial year

[Mike or Penny Novack]

On 5/24/2017 10:46 AM, doncram wrote:

  ...  What is meant by "closing" in GnuCash-jargon seems different
than what is meant more usually in accounting.
I
4. Freezing forever the accounts for the period (in software, this would be
done by putting a lock on any transactions before the new period)

I am guessing that GnuCash does not support #4.
I gather that in GnuCash, #2 and #3 don't need to be done, because the
income statement report already exists.
a) The intermediate steps once used in pen and ink on paper accounting 
are indeed redundant and can be skipped


b) No, #4 is EASY. Your confusion is in forgetting that in old fashioned 
pen and ink on paper accounting this was done by putting the old journal 
and ledger volumes away when the volumes for the new period began. You 
do the SAME THING with gnucash if you wish. I suspect that the reason 
you didn't "see it" is you were expecting a "button to push"? (within 
gnucash)
   1) To make a file unalterable, you make a copy of that file onto 
read only medium.
   2) Making copies of files is something you ordinarily do outside of 
applications. How are you now making backups? This is just a special 
sort of backup (one on medium that makes it read only).


When I am doing this for one of the organizations for which I keep 
books, I do a pre-close backup (after adjusting entries like 
depreciation but before closing income and expense accounts to equity) 
and a post close backup, burn copies to CDROM (or DVDROM) and among 
other things, make sure some other officer of the organization gets 
copies. You do the "Income Statement" (well "Statement of Revenues and 
Expenses" as my organizations are non-profits) in the pre-close and the 
"Balance Sheet" either.




Michael D Novack
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Re: Issues with "Assets over time" report

[Adrien Monteleone]

As for initial value concerns, if there is no other transactional value, that’s 
the only one used. If you only bought the EUR stocks once, there is only one 
value to average. If you made more than one purchase then there will be a 
calculation for GC to do. Weighted average only works on transactional data, 
not prices from the price editor. Nearest in time and Most recent use data from 
the price editor.

I’ll hazard a guess here that your USD stocks were purchased before your book 
was started. When you opened the book, you entered the initial value of the 
account against Equity:Opening Balances, but there are no purchase transactions 
using the stock features for the USD stocks, but you have purchased the EUR 
stocks after the book was opened, thus, there are only transactions on the EUR 
stocks which is why they are the only ones included in the weighted average.

-Adrien

> On May 24, 2017, at 3:40 AM, Jose Gómez  wrote:
> 
> Still, there is something I don't get. Why would weighted average not use the 
> value of USD stocks, and only use the initial value for EUR stocks?

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Re: Issues with "Assets over time" report

[Adrien Monteleone]

I’ve mine set to Most Recent since I was only concerned with current Balance 
Sheet and P&L statements, but I can see now using the bar charts and historical 
reports that Nearest In Time is much more entertaining. Thanks!


> On May 23, 2017, at 11:19 PM, Edward Doolittle  
> wrote:
> 
> My understanding is that Weighted Average is reasonable as a default for an 
> accounting program, where prices are determined by actual buys and sells. 
> "Nearest in time" is, as John Ralls has said, mainly for "entertainment 
> value" ... it is not accounting. On the other hand, most of my saved reports 
> use Nearest in time ... I appreciate the entertainment, what can I say.
> 
> On 23 May 2017 at 15:42, Adrien Monteleone  > wrote:
> 
> > On May 23, 2017, at 3:19 PM, Jose Gómez  > > wrote:
> >
> > Yes, I meant the the Assets Bar Chart, thanks.
> >
> > Changing the setting as you suggested has fixed the issue. Now stocks show
> > the same amount as in the list of accounts. Thanks! :)
> >
> > I don't understand is why the Assets bar chart report has by default the
> > weighted average option selected, whereas the Assets pie chart has as a
> > default nearest in time.
> 
> Not sure, but I recall other reports I’ve run the first time I had to switch 
> away from Weighted Average. That might be a system default for all reports. 
> But I usually am running saved configurations so I don’t usually notice this 
> any more.
> -Adrien
> 
> >
> > Regards,
> > Jose.
> >
> > I'm guessing you mean the Assets Bar Chart?
> >>
> >> Try the setting Options -> General -> Price Source, set it to "Nearest in
> >> Time"
> >>
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> 
> 
> -- 
> Edward Doolittle
> Associate Professor of Mathematics
> First Nations University of Canada 
> 1 First Nations Way, Regina SK S4S 7K2
> 
> « Toutes les fois que je donne une place vacante, je fais cent mécontents et 
> un ingrat. » 
> -- Louis XIV, dans Voltaire, Le Siècle de Louis XIV, Chap. XXVI

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Re: Issues with Importing Invoices

[Nelson Handcock]

Bruce,

I've attached a sample of an invoice import file that I recently prepared
and successfully loaded up.
If you change the "memberidn" to match your customer ID's and also change
the account names then it should work for you.

The key thing for me is sorting my source data by Member ID and then by
Date, before setting the ID column with the invoice number. Note how you
can have two lines with the same ID number one after the other - this
results in a multi-line invoice being imported.

I usually leave the header row in my source data - gnucash just spits it
out anyway. It only ever rejects data for me if the memberID does not match
an existing customer.

I'm pretty sure I've imported data like this without setting the ID column
at all, and Gnucash sets the ID number based on the number range set up in
the settings - Menu path File - Properties - Counters.


Hope this helps,..


Thanks & Regards,

Nelson

On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 12:58 PM, Bruce Danielson 
wrote:

> Greetings - I am a new user, and I am trying out GnuCash on a rather odd
> application - I manage a couple of employee water clubs at work (for
> Sparkletts bottled water - since our employer won't spring for the water -
> pardon the pun).  I have it setup as a business type of accounting.  I'm
> trying this on the smaller & newer of the clubs I manage.  Weird I know,
> but
> I want to make this work.  I am also treasurer of a non-profit, I wish I'd
> known about GnuCash before I went & bought QB.  But OK, for the water club
> -
>
>
>
> I was able to import a bunch of customers (club members) via a csv file I
> made from an Excel roster.  So far, so good.  I have an asset account
> called
> Cash On Hand which monthly dues will pay into, and water bills will be paid
> out of.  And I have only one Vendor (Sparkletts) and one applicable expense
> account (bottled water).
>
>
>
> Since I don't really want to produce 36 separate invoices each month for
> member dues, one at a time, I am hoping to find a way to sort of batch
> generate invoices.  I have tried numerous times making a small 2 line csv
> file from an excel table to import, and have run into several issues.  It
> is
> only 2 lines now because I have 2 customers that are late paying for May,
> so
> I thought I'd try this out on them.
>
>
>
> One issue is that if I leave the ID field blank, "import" does not self
> generate invoice ID's - but instead just ignores the lines.  OK - no
> worries, I can plug in invoice numbers in the excel table, that's not too
> much work.  The more serious issue is this, although the specific customers
> are C033 and C034 - when I import, both invoices generated are applied to
> one of the customers only (C033) and none to the other customer (C034).  I
> generate 2 invoices, but both for the same customer (C033).
>
>
>
> Import Invoices is not reading the customer (Owner ID) in the table and
> applying to the correct customer.  This I do not know how to work around.
> I'm looking for ideas or anything I may be doing wrong.  I have upgraded to
> the latest version 2.6.16 (rev 509ce16+) BTW.
>
>
>
> Really, if I cannot batch-make invoices, I can't make use of GnuCash.
> Trying to generate 36 (or so) individual invoices on the 1st of each month
> is not going to work for me.
>
>
>
> I know this is probably a better application for just using Excel, but I
> wanted to give this a try.  Actually if I could figure a way to batch email
> my batch prepared invoices, this would be totally awesome.
>
>
>
> Any feedback is appreciated.  I will be away from this email address for a
> couple of days, so no big emergency.
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
> Buster
>
>
>
>
>
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>
id,date_opened,owner_id,billing_id,notes,date,description,action,account,quantity,price, disc_type, disc_how, discount, taxable, taxincluded, tax_table,date_posted,due_date, account_posted,memo_posted,accu_splits
2016-1755,10/01/2017,memberid1,,,10/01/2017,GST Free Stock Purchases,,Income:Membership Fees,1,50Y,Y,GST Inclusive Sales,10/01/2017,17/01/2017,Assets:Accounts Receivable,,Y
2016-1756,10/01/2017,memberid2,,,10/01/2017,GST Free Stock Purchases,,Income:Sales,1,11.8,,,10/01/2017,17/01/2017,Assets:Accounts Receivable,,Y
2016-1757,17/01/2017,memberid3,,,17/01/2017,GST Applicable Stock Purchases,,Income:Sales,1,7.19Y,Y,GST Inclusive Sales,17/01/2017,24/01/2017,Assets:Accounts Receivable,,Y
2016-1757,17/01/2017,memberid3,,,17/01/2017,GST Free Stock Purchases,,Income:Sales,1,121.02,,,17/01/2017,24/01/2017,Assets:Accounts Receivable,,Y
2016-1758,17/01/2017,memberid4,,,17/01/2017,GST Free Stock Purchases,,Income:Sales,1,70.64,,,17/01/2017,24/01/2017,Assets:Accounts Receivable,,Y
2016-1759,17/01/2017,memberid5,,,17/01/201

RE: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 170, Issue 49

[Chris Good]

> Message: 8
> Date: Tue, 23 May 2017 17:50:34 -0500
> From: John Griessen 
> To: Gnucash 
> Subject: gnucash debian packages
> Message-ID:  86de4eae5...@industromatic.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
> 
> gnucash (1:2.6.16-1) is in experimental.
> 
> Is this good to try?  I've been staying back on 2.6.14 because 2.6.15 does
not
> work on debian stretch.

Hi John,

2.6.15 from Debian stretch archive works fine for me.
See http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Debian#Using_the_Debian_Archive

Regards, Chris Good


smime.p7s
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RE: gnucash debian packages

[Chris Good]

> -Original Message-
> From: Chris Good [mailto:chris.g...@ozemail.com.au]
> Sent: Thursday, 25 May 2017 8:17 AM
> To: 'gnucash-user@gnucash.org' 
> Subject: RE: gnucash-user Digest, Vol 170, Issue 49
> 
> > Message: 8
> > Date: Tue, 23 May 2017 17:50:34 -0500
> > From: John Griessen 
> > To: Gnucash 
> > Subject: gnucash debian packages
> > Message-ID:  > 86de4eae5...@industromatic.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
> >
> > gnucash (1:2.6.16-1) is in experimental.
> >
> > Is this good to try?  I've been staying back on 2.6.14 because 2.6.15
does
> not
> > work on debian stretch.
> 
> Hi John,
> 
> 2.6.15 from Debian stretch archive works fine for me.
> See http://wiki.gnucash.org/wiki/Debian#Using_the_Debian_Archive
> 
> Regards, Chris Good

Oops, forgot to copy you and change the subject. :-(

Regards, Chris Good


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RE: gnucash debian packages

[Chris Good]

> Message: 10
> Date: Tue, 23 May 2017 21:50:18 -0500
> From: David Carlson 
> To: John Griessen 
> Cc: Gnucash 
> Subject: Re: gnucash debian packages
> Message-ID:
>mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> I am using Debian Jessie and the latest version I can find is 2.6.11.  Is 
> there
> any way to use a newer version without rolling my own?
>
> David C
>
> On Tue, May 23, 2017 at 5:50 PM, John Griessen 
> wrote:
>
> > gnucash (1:2.6.16-1) is in experimental.
> >
> > Is this good to try?  I've been staying back on 2.6.14 because 2.6.15
> > does not work on debian stretch.

Hi David,

The 2.6.11 available from jessie backports seems to be the latest usable
without building yourself unless you upgrade to stretch.

Regards, Chris Good


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Re: How to close a financial year

[doncram]

Thank you to David T. and to Michael D Novack and others for observations
on closing.  Ideas from these and other comments that I can look for in
past ("annual") discussions oughta be incorporated into documentation.
Some notes while this is fresh:

*Annual discussions, true "frequently asked questions" --> opportunity to
improve documentation

*The Tutorial and Concept Guide does not address closing at all, if I am
not mistaken...it should be covered in Chapter 13 about businesses and it
also should be covered in closing for personal finances

*The Wiki coverage (http://lists.gnucash.org/wiki/Closing_Books) is
alarming to me in the difference of its terminology from that of
introductory accounting textbook treatment of the topic...it suggests the
purpose of closing is to zero out account balances or to "zero
transactions". I need to review textbook treatment myself, but what's
needed in explanation to regular users is a discussion of all the usual
aspects, starting with making adjusting entries -- a huge theme in chapter
after chapter of textbooks (e.g. recognize accrued interest in mortgages,
loan & bond liabilities and assets, for one i didn't mention yet).  Provide
example journal entries of each type.

*Then go through discussion of all the logical steps of closing in a manual
system or in big commercial accounting software, and how you can
approximate that in GnuCash (e.g., as suggested, make a point of backing up
the data and securely storing/distributing it).

*Note freezing is not the same...the prior years data stays in your system,
and if it is not frozen then errors can be introduced, you might
accidentally add or change a prior year transaction.  In commercial
standard accounting, the past data is locked by password at least, and
prior year info is only changed in exceptional circumstances (explain
those...and how even for public restatements of financials, the past info
is likely not changed).

*I still am gathering that password-locking the past period data is not
possible.

*Both the Wiki and the Help coverage use incorrect-to-my-ears language
about the Chart of Accounts, both saying that the Chart of Accounts will
show amounts of some kind.  GnuCash usage should be brought into conformity
with accounting usage where the Chart of Accounts is a list of the account
names and account numbers and account types only;  it does not have any
dollar amounts.  The GnuCash usage is referring to what I would call Trial
Balances i think.

*What is the goal in closing?  I think it is about bringing the state of
financial reporting into a "good state", e.g. where the Balance Sheet and
the Income Statement/Statement of Revenues and Expenses are accurate in
accordance with your organization's or your personal accounting standards,
perhaps U.S. Generally Accepted Accounting Principles perhaps with
modifications, or perhaps compliance with Tax filing (or both).  Perhaps it
is cash basis.  What your nonprofit's board or independent accountant will
likely accept.  An individual may want their accounting to match tax filing
(close but not same as cash basis), e.g. use depreciation per tax standards
rather than GAAP, which is a choice.   The goal could be to accurately
state your income as will match on tax forms.  A number of adjusting
entries are needed, and once a year perhaps is good for considering
revaluations of property, etc.  Side note: for U.S. personal taxes if you
deduct car usage for personal business usage according to mileage at
allowable rate, that means that you need to make an accrual, an adjustment,
relating to difference between that vs. your "actual" car expenses.  The
Tutorial and Concept Guide treatment should start with the goal(s) you can
have.

I gather I should submit a bug through Bugzilla to address changes for the
Manual and changes for the Tutorial and Concept Guide. Presumably I could
just edit the Wiki section directly.  I don't yet understand how the Wiki
is supposed to relate to the other documentation. Maybe the Wiki is to
cover stuff not yet in the "formal" documentation (the Manual and the
Guide, which are harder to change)?  --cheers, Don



On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 3:01 PM, Mike or Penny Novack <
stepbystepf...@dialup4less.com> wrote:

> On 5/24/2017 10:46 AM, doncram wrote:
>
>>   ...  What is meant by "closing" in GnuCash-jargon seems different
>> than what is meant more usually in accounting.
>> I
>> 4. Freezing forever the accounts for the period (in software, this would
>> be
>> done by putting a lock on any transactions before the new period)
>>
>> I am guessing that GnuCash does not support #4.
>> I gather that in GnuCash, #2 and #3 don't need to be done, because the
>> income statement report already exists.
>>
> a) The intermediate steps once used in pen and ink on paper accounting are
> indeed redundant and can be skipped
>
> b) No, #4 is EASY. Your confusion is in forgetting that in old fashioned
> pen and ink on paper accounting this was done by p

Re: How to close a financial year

[Adrien Monteleone]

> On May 24, 2017, at 9:56 PM, doncram  wrote:
> 
> Thank you to David T. and to Michael D Novack and others for observations
> on closing.  Ideas from these and other comments that I can look for in
> past ("annual") discussions oughta be incorporated into documentation.
> Some notes while this is fresh:
> 
> *Annual discussions, true "frequently asked questions" --> opportunity to
> improve documentation
> 
> *The Tutorial and Concept Guide does not address closing at all, if I am
> not mistaken...it should be covered in Chapter 13 about businesses and it
> also should be covered in closing for personal finances
> 
> *The Wiki coverage (http://lists.gnucash.org/wiki/Closing_Books) is
> alarming to me in the difference of its terminology from that of
> introductory accounting textbook treatment of the topic...it suggests the
> purpose of closing is to zero out account balances or to "zero
> transactions". I need to review textbook treatment myself, but what's
> needed in explanation to regular users is a discussion of all the usual
> aspects, starting with making adjusting entries -- a huge theme in chapter
> after chapter of textbooks (e.g. recognize accrued interest in mortgages,
> loan & bond liabilities and assets, for one i didn't mention yet).  Provide
> example journal entries of each type.
> 
> *Then go through discussion of all the logical steps of closing in a manual
> system or in big commercial accounting software, and how you can
> approximate that in GnuCash (e.g., as suggested, make a point of backing up
> the data and securely storing/distributing it).
> 
> *Note freezing is not the same...the prior years data stays in your system,
> and if it is not frozen then errors can be introduced, you might
> accidentally add or change a prior year transaction.  In commercial
> standard accounting, the past data is locked by password at least, and
> prior year info is only changed in exceptional circumstances (explain
> those...and how even for public restatements of financials, the past info
> is likely not changed).
> 
> *I still am gathering that password-locking the past period data is not
> possible.
> 
> *Both the Wiki and the Help coverage use incorrect-to-my-ears language
> about the Chart of Accounts, both saying that the Chart of Accounts will
> show amounts of some kind.  GnuCash usage should be brought into conformity
> with accounting usage where the Chart of Accounts is a list of the account
> names and account numbers and account types only;  it does not have any
> dollar amounts.  The GnuCash usage is referring to what I would call Trial
> Balances i think.

I think the way the Chart of Accounts is currently presented could be very 
useful. It is helpful to see at a glance what the current balance of any 
particular account is without opening its register. This has no direct paper 
analogy, nor does it need to. If the idea is to live within the limitations of 
paper books, then just use paper books.

The CoA could be MORE useful if the expense and income accounts had the option 
to be set as ‘current accounting period’ or something similar. Having them set 
to whatever arbitrary (or not) opening date in history is certainly less 
meaningful, at least for me. Now for assets and liabilities, a current balance 
from the beginning of the book IS useful as a trial balance sheet would be.

I use another application for a business that takes the approach you described 
for its chart of accounts. Pretty pointless and much less functional in my 
opinion. It was a set once and forget it sort of thing. The GnuCash approach 
has much more utility.

The way I think of it, the Accounts tab serves the function of a Chart of 
Accounts, but it was intended and is so much more. Is there really a need to 
have a separate, otherwise information only, non-functioning list of accounts? 
How is that an improvement or a benefit?

Just my 2¢,

Adrien

> 
> *What is the goal in closing?  I think it is about bringing the state of
> financial reporting into a "good state", e.g. where the Balance Sheet and
> the Income Statement/Statement of Revenues and Expenses are accurate in
> accordance with your organization's or your personal accounting standards,
> perhaps U.S. Generally Accepted Accounting Principles perhaps with
> modifications, or perhaps compliance with Tax filing (or both).  Perhaps it
> is cash basis.  What your nonprofit's board or independent accountant will
> likely accept.  An individual may want their accounting to match tax filing
> (close but not same as cash basis), e.g. use depreciation per tax standards
> rather than GAAP, which is a choice.   The goal could be to accurately
> state your income as will match on tax forms.  A number of adjusting
> entries are needed, and once a year perhaps is good for considering
> revaluations of property, etc.  Side note: for U.S. personal taxes if you
> deduct car usage for personal business usage according to mileage at
> allowable rate, that means t

Re: How to close a financial year

[David T. via gnucash-user]

Don, 
Your contributions will be welcome. As I do not close my books, and also do not 
use the business features, I can only offer you editorial guidance and general 
help in the process. 
As for the term "Chart of Accounts", Gnucash uses this term for the page that 
displays all accounts in a hierarchical tree, i.e., the first summary page when 
you open a file. This page in Gnucash includes balances, although it is 
configurable. This is noted in the glossary, although the definition might be 
improved to explain Gnucash's spin on the term. 

As stated elsewhere, the wiki is not the same as the documentation, and this is 
intentional. The docs are more formal, whereas the wiki is more immediate. In 
the past, information has tended to gravitate in one place or the other, and 
once there, stays there. If your goal is to improve the docs (which I endorse), 
I think you should file a bug and work through that mechanism, rather than put 
stuff into the wiki that you intend to place in the docs. 
David
 
 
  On Thu, May 25, 2017 at 7:57, doncram wrote:   Thank you 
to David T. and to Michael D Novack and others for observations
on closing.  Ideas from these and other comments that I can look for in
past ("annual") discussions oughta be incorporated into documentation.
Some notes while this is fresh:

*Annual discussions, true "frequently asked questions" --> opportunity to
improve documentation

*The Tutorial and Concept Guide does not address closing at all, if I am
not mistaken...it should be covered in Chapter 13 about businesses and it
also should be covered in closing for personal finances

*The Wiki coverage (http://lists.gnucash.org/wiki/Closing_Books) is
alarming to me in the difference of its terminology from that of
introductory accounting textbook treatment of the topic...it suggests the
purpose of closing is to zero out account balances or to "zero
transactions". I need to review textbook treatment myself, but what's
needed in explanation to regular users is a discussion of all the usual
aspects, starting with making adjusting entries -- a huge theme in chapter
after chapter of textbooks (e.g. recognize accrued interest in mortgages,
loan & bond liabilities and assets, for one i didn't mention yet).  Provide
example journal entries of each type.

*Then go through discussion of all the logical steps of closing in a manual
system or in big commercial accounting software, and how you can
approximate that in GnuCash (e.g., as suggested, make a point of backing up
the data and securely storing/distributing it).

*Note freezing is not the same...the prior years data stays in your system,
and if it is not frozen then errors can be introduced, you might
accidentally add or change a prior year transaction.  In commercial
standard accounting, the past data is locked by password at least, and
prior year info is only changed in exceptional circumstances (explain
those...and how even for public restatements of financials, the past info
is likely not changed).

*I still am gathering that password-locking the past period data is not
possible.

*Both the Wiki and the Help coverage use incorrect-to-my-ears language
about the Chart of Accounts, both saying that the Chart of Accounts will
show amounts of some kind.  GnuCash usage should be brought into conformity
with accounting usage where the Chart of Accounts is a list of the account
names and account numbers and account types only;  it does not have any
dollar amounts.  The GnuCash usage is referring to what I would call Trial
Balances i think.

*What is the goal in closing?  I think it is about bringing the state of
financial reporting into a "good state", e.g. where the Balance Sheet and
the Income Statement/Statement of Revenues and Expenses are accurate in
accordance with your organization's or your personal accounting standards,
perhaps U.S. Generally Accepted Accounting Principles perhaps with
modifications, or perhaps compliance with Tax filing (or both).  Perhaps it
is cash basis.  What your nonprofit's board or independent accountant will
likely accept.  An individual may want their accounting to match tax filing
(close but not same as cash basis), e.g. use depreciation per tax standards
rather than GAAP, which is a choice.  The goal could be to accurately
state your income as will match on tax forms.  A number of adjusting
entries are needed, and once a year perhaps is good for considering
revaluations of property, etc.  Side note: for U.S. personal taxes if you
deduct car usage for personal business usage according to mileage at
allowable rate, that means that you need to make an accrual, an adjustment,
relating to difference between that vs. your "actual" car expenses.  The
Tutorial and Concept Guide treatment should start with the goal(s) you can
have.

I gather I should submit a bug through Bugzilla to address changes for the
Manual and changes for the Tutorial and Concept Guide. Presumably I could
just edit the Wiki section directly.  I don't yet