Re: FCP-0101: Deprecating most 10/100 Ethernet drivers
04.10.2018 0:05, Brooks Davis пишет: Please direct replies to freebsd-arch <<< FCP-01010 (https://github.com/freebsd/fcp/blob/master/fcp-0101.md) outlines a plan to deprecate most 10/100 Ethernet drivers in FreeBSD 12 and remove them in FreeBSD 13 to reduce the burden of maintaining and improving the network stack. We have discussed this within the core team and intend to move forward as proposed. We are solictiting feedback on the list of drivers to be excepted from removal. The current list of drivers slated for REMOVAL is: ae, bfe, bm, cs, dme, ed, ep, ex, fe, pcn, rl, sf, smc, sn, ste, tl, tx, txp, vx, wb, xe The current list of drivers that will STAY in the tree is: dc, ffec, fxpl, hme, le, sis, vr, xl The criteria for exception are: - Popular in applications where it is likely to be deployed beyond the support lifetime of FreeBSD 12 (late 2023). - 5 reports of uses in the wild on machines running FreeBSD 12 will be deemed satisfy the "popular" requirement. - Required to make a well supported embedded or emulation platform usable. - Ported to use iflib (reducing future maintenance cost.) Please reply to this message with nominations to the exception list. The full FCP-0101 is included below. -- Brooks --- authors: Brooks Davis state: feedback --- # FCP 101: Deprecation and removal of 10/100 Ethernet drivers Deprecate most 10 and 10/100Mbps Ethernet drivers and remove them before FreeBSD 13. ## Problem Statement Each network driver creates drag for the project as we attempt to improve the network stack or provide new features such as expanded 32-bit compatibility. For example, the author has edited every single NIC driver more than once in the past year to update management (`ioctl`) interfaces. We could improve this situation by converting drivers to iflib, but each additional driver takes work. 10 and 100 megabit Ethernet drivers are largely irrelevant today and we have a significant number of them in the tree. The ones that are no longer used and/or are not known to be working need to be removed due to the significant ongoing 'tax' on new development. For at least a decade, most systems (including small embedded systems) have shipped with gigabit Ethernet devices and virtual machines commonly emulate popular gigabit devices. We wish to retain support for popular physical and virtual devices while removing support for uncommon ones. With a few exceptions these drivers are unlikely to be used by our user base by the time FreeBSD 12 is obsolete (approximately 2024). ## Proposed Solution We propose to deprecate devices which are not sufficiently popular. This will entail: - (October 2018) Send this list to freebsd-net and freebsd-stable. - (Before FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE - October 2018) Update the manpages and attach routines for each device to be removed and merge those changes to FreeBSD 12. - (One month after FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE - January 2018) Remind freebsd-net and freebsd-stable users of pending deletion. - (Two months after FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE - February 2019) Delete deprecated devices. Through out this process, solicit feedback on additions to the exception list and update this document as required. For a device to be placed on the exception list the device must meet one of the following criteria: - Popular in applications where it is likely to be deployed beyond the support lifetime of FreeBSD 12 (late 2023). - 5 reports of uses in the wild on machines running FreeBSD 12 will be deemed satisfy the "popular" requirement. - Required to make a well supported embedded or emulation platform usable. - Ported to use iflib (reducing future maintenance cost.) ### Exceptions to removal Device | Reason ---|- ffec | Onboard Ethernet for Vybrid arm7 boards fxp| Popular device long recommended by the project. dc | Popular device for CardBus card. hme| Built in interface on many supported sparc64 platforms. le | Emulated by QEMU, alternatives don't yet work for mips64. sis| Soekris Engineering net45xx, net48xx, lan1621, and lan1641. vr | Soekris Engineering net5501, some Asus motherboards. xl | Popular device for CardBus card. Note: USB devices have been excluded from consideration in this round. ### Device to be removed ae, bfe, bm, cs, dme, ed, ep, ex, fe, pcn, rl, sf, smc, sn, ste, tl, tx, txp, vx, wb, xe ## Final Disposition TBD Hello! My servers use rl and bfe devices from deprecated list. Also I have some ed devices for replacement failed adapters. Also I can try do convertion to iflib for bfe, rl and ed devices, but still no one not showed good example driver that has already been converted... P.S. So late, because I was away and just returned. ___ freebsd-stable@freebsd.org mailing list https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-stable To unsubscr
Re: Latest update to ATI driver broke in same way as using DRM-next did
On 10/16/18 6:16 PM, Pete French wrote: I am using drm-next, but actually I ended up getting this to work by stripping off all packges from the machine yesterday, deleting all of /usr/local and starting adding things from scratch. Am now running fine with drm-next and all works as expected. When I was having the issues, however, xrandr only showed one outout on the card, which puzzled me (there are 4 outputs). Good that you got it working. I don't know exactly what changed. One guess might be the updated versions of xf86-video-ati or xf86-video-radeon, if you are using them. Regards -- Niclas Zeising ___ freebsd-stable@freebsd.org mailing list https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-stable To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-stable-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
Re: FCP-0101: Deprecating most 10/100 Ethernet drivers
On Wed, 3 Oct 2018 21:05:16 + Brooks Davis wrote: > >>> Please direct replies to freebsd-arch <<< > > FCP-01010 (https://github.com/freebsd/fcp/blob/master/fcp-0101.md) > outlines a plan to deprecate most 10/100 Ethernet drivers in FreeBSD 12 > and remove them in FreeBSD 13 to reduce the burden of maintaining and > improving the network stack. We have discussed this within the > core team and intend to move forward as proposed. We are solictiting > feedback on the list of drivers to be excepted from removal. > > The current list of drivers slated for REMOVAL is: > > ae, bfe, bm, cs, dme, ed, ep, ex, fe, pcn, rl, sf, smc, sn, > ste, tl, tx, txp, vx, wb, xe > > The current list of drivers that will STAY in the tree is: > > dc, ffec, fxpl, hme, le, sis, vr, xl > > The criteria for exception are: > - Popular in applications where it is likely to be deployed beyond the >support lifetime of FreeBSD 12 (late 2023). >- 5 reports of uses in the wild on machines running FreeBSD 12 will be > deemed satisfy the "popular" > requirement. > - Required to make a well supported embedded or emulation platform usable. > - Ported to use iflib (reducing future maintenance cost.) > > Please reply to this message with nominations to the exception list. > > The full FCP-0101 is included below. > > -- Brooks > > --- > authors: Brooks Davis > state: feedback > --- > > # FCP 101: Deprecation and removal of 10/100 Ethernet drivers > > Deprecate most 10 and 10/100Mbps Ethernet drivers and remove them before > FreeBSD 13. > > ## Problem Statement > > Each network driver creates drag for the project as we attempt to > improve the network stack or provide new features such as expanded > 32-bit compatibility. For example, the author has edited every single > NIC driver more than once in the past year to update management (`ioctl`) > interfaces. We could improve this situation by converting drivers to > iflib, but each additional driver takes work. > > 10 and 100 megabit Ethernet drivers are largely irrelevant today > and we have a significant number of them in the tree. The ones that > are no longer used and/or are not known to be working need to be > removed due to the significant ongoing 'tax' on new development. > > For at least a decade, most systems (including small embedded > systems) have shipped with gigabit Ethernet devices and virtual > machines commonly emulate popular gigabit devices. We wish to > retain support for popular physical and virtual devices while > removing support for uncommon ones. With a few exceptions these > drivers are unlikely to be used by our user base by the time FreeBSD > 12 is obsolete (approximately 2024). > > ## Proposed Solution > > We propose to deprecate devices which are not sufficiently popular. This > will entail: > - (October 2018) Send this list to freebsd-net and freebsd-stable. > - (Before FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE - October 2018) Update the manpages and >attach routines for each device to be removed and merge those changes >to FreeBSD 12. > - (One month after FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE - January 2018) Remind >freebsd-net and freebsd-stable users of pending deletion. > - (Two months after FreeBSD 12.0-RELEASE - February 2019) Delete deprecated >devices. > > Through out this process, solicit feedback on additions to the exception > list and update this document as required. For a device to be placed on > the exception list the device must meet one of the following criteria: > - Popular in applications where it is likely to be deployed beyond the >support lifetime of FreeBSD 12 (late 2023). >- 5 reports of uses in the wild on machines running FreeBSD 12 will be > deemed satisfy the "popular" > requirement. > - Required to make a well supported embedded or emulation platform usable. > - Ported to use iflib (reducing future maintenance cost.) > > ### Exceptions to removal > > Device | Reason > ---|- > ffec | Onboard Ethernet for Vybrid arm7 boards > fxp| Popular device long recommended by the project. > dc | Popular device for CardBus card. > hme| Built in interface on many supported sparc64 platforms. > le | Emulated by QEMU, alternatives don't yet work for mips64. > sis| Soekris Engineering net45xx, net48xx, lan1621, and lan1641. > vr | Soekris Engineering net5501, some Asus motherboards. > xl | Popular device for CardBus card. > > Note: USB devices have been excluded from consideration in this round. > > ### Device to be removed > > ae, bfe, bm, cs, dme, ed, ep, ex, fe, pcn, rl, sf, smc, sn, > ste, tl, tx, txp, vx, wb, xe > > ## Final Disposition > > TBD Would it be possible to set a wiki page/section in 12 that display the current status of removal of those devices? That might be easier for people to look at their hardware actual state rather than try to trace every answer to this thread... Thanks a lot! pgpK0
Re: FCP-0101: Deprecating most 10/100 Ethernet drivers
On Wed, Oct 17, 2018 at 11:52 AM Matthieu Volat wrote: > Would it be possible to set a wiki page/section in 12 that display the > current status of removal of those devices? That might be easier for people > to look at their hardware actual state rather than try to trace every > answer to this thread... > The FCP is being updated and will be uploaded when that's done. At this point, it seems that we have all the data to make the right decisions, at least to tag the drivers deprecated for the 12.0 release when I'm sure will get us additional data. Warner ___ freebsd-stable@freebsd.org mailing list https://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-stable To unsubscribe, send any mail to "freebsd-stable-unsubscr...@freebsd.org"
Re: FCP-0101: Deprecating most 10/100 Ethernet drivers
On Wed, 17 Oct 2018 12:27:48 -0600 Warner Losh wrote: > On Wed, Oct 17, 2018 at 11:52 AM Matthieu Volat wrote: > > > Would it be possible to set a wiki page/section in 12 that display the > > current status of removal of those devices? That might be easier for people > > to look at their hardware actual state rather than try to trace every > > answer to this thread... > > > > The FCP is being updated and will be uploaded when that's done. At > this point, it seems that we have all the data to make the right decisions, > at least to tag the drivers deprecated for the 12.0 release when I'm sure > will get us additional data. > > Warner Thanks for the info! pgp4M_S5QLJi5.pgp Description: OpenPGP digital signature