[DNG] adblocking using /etc/hosts
I don't know, if it is the right place here to ask such trivial questions, if not please tell me, no problem at all. I wanted to suggest, for the future, may be for a better user experience, if it is possible and reasonable to create a small script, which would configure /etc/hosts in a way that ad servers and that like were redirected to 0.0.0.0 ? May be this could be done in a way that the user will be prompted, if (s)he would like to install ad-blocking systemwide and also there should be an option to uninstall the created list from /etc/hosts . In my thinking that is a very elegant and easy way to keep the browsers itself small and efficient. But very likely, i'm missing some cons ... (?) ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] adblocking using /etc/hosts
Hi there emnin...@riseup.net wrote: I don't know, if it is the right place here to ask such trivial questions, if not please tell me, no problem at all. I wanted to suggest, for the future, may be for a better user experience, if it is possible and reasonable to create a small script, which would configure /etc/hosts in a way that ad servers and that like were redirected to 0.0.0.0 ? May be this could be done in a way that the user will be prompted, if (s)he would like to install ad-blocking systemwide and also there should be an option to uninstall the created list from /etc/hosts . In my thinking that is a very elegant and easy way to keep the browsers itself small and efficient. But very likely, i'm missing some cons ... (?) The webbrowser wants an object. So the thing to do is to replace the ad with your own content. A small transparent gif is often used. Regards, Rob ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] adblocking using /etc/hosts
On Sun, Jun 05, 2016 at 09:01:49AM +0200, emnin...@riseup.net wrote: > I wanted to suggest, for the future, may be for a better user > experience, if it is possible and reasonable to create a small script, > which would configure /etc/hosts in a way that ad servers and that like > were redirected to 0.0.0.0 ? May be this could be done in a way that the > user will be prompted, if (s)he would like to install ad-blocking > systemwide and also there should be an option to uninstall the created > list from /etc/hosts . /etc/hosts allows redirecting only individual hostnames, you'd want to block whole domains. Also, big /etc/hosts is really slow: the whole list needs to be loaded from disk, parsed and searched linearly every time you do a lookup, while a proper nameserver can store the data in an efficient structure. A long time ago I made a package to feed such lists to bind: https://angband.pl/debian/pool/main/d/dnscruft/ The lists shipped in the package haven't been maintained since 2008, but the rest should work. Included script accepts a variety of formats, including "hosts files". I haven't used this for a long time, relying on in-browser extensions: lists maintained by other people, and RequestPolicy which allows third-party requests on an opt-in rather than opt-out basis, but if you want something systemwide or networkwide, this might be useful. Meow! -- An imaginary friend squared is a real enemy. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] adblocking using /etc/hosts
Date: Sun, 5 Jun 2016 09:01:49 +0200 From: To:dng@lists.dyne.org Subject: [DNG] adblocking using /etc/hosts I don't know, if it is the right place here to ask such trivial questions, if not please tell me, no problem at all. I wanted to suggest, for the future, may be for a better user experience, if it is possible and reasonable to create a small script, which would configure /etc/hosts in a way that ad servers and that like were redirected to 0.0.0.0 ? May be this could be done in a way that the user will be prompted, if (s)he would like to install ad-blocking systemwide and also there should be an option to uninstall the created list from /etc/hosts . In my thinking that is a very elegant and easy way to keep the browsers itself small and efficient. But very likely, i'm missing some cons ... (?) I mentioned before on this list Pi-hole https://pi-hole.net/ which does do something like that and is well maintained. At the moment it is just a script and it will have to be packaged and such but it works well on all kinds of De*an versions. I have it running on RPi 2 with Devuan beta and i like it. Grtz Nick ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] use zram for /tmp - how?
On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 06:50:11 +0200 wrote: > Thanks Florian! That might be an idea - if it is not working the other > way around: like parazyd suggested. May be raise the space of zram > swap and set then tmpfs (which should then, if i understand it > correctly, should use the mem including the virtual mem/swap) ... Hallo Emninger, yes, I'd also go with tmpfs, just wasn't aware that this exists. It indeed seems to make sense to nest it with a swap memdisk - why else have swap space at all if "the problem" is "too much memory". I found that it is even possible to have multiple swap partitions and define their priority, so you can create a swap-the-swap space on disk: http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Partition/setting_up_swap.html libre Grüße, Florian ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] use zram for /tmp - how?
Le 04/06/2016 21:44, emnin...@riseup.net a écrit : Anyone of you knows a way how to use zram for /tmp ? (I inherited a sony_vaio with 16 gb of ram - which i never ever will/could use, so i thought to use the excessive ram configuring zram). I have a laptop with 16GB of ram. I configured it like this with the primary goal of not using swap at all. And my /tmp is a tmpfs with a 4G limit. This allows me to use an SSD as hard disk drive. I didn't want to swap to an SSD. I have never been short of ram in 3 years. I have compiled kernels, GCC, and many other things on this laptop, runing make with multiple threads; I sometimes got stuck by lack of cpu, never by lack of ram. I understand that you want to go further and increase the size of your /tmp by compressing it. It seems pretty complicated and probably not worth the burden. Didier ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Devuan Top100 on DistroWatch
On 06/03/2016 04:58 AM, Jim Murphy wrote: > > Just out of curiosity does anyone know where > DW gets the package lists they post? > Jesse explained that the package list is taken from `dpkg -l` running on the default installation medium (when there are multiple versions, they choose, e.g., the DVD, which is supposed to be more complete). So the package list reflects what's available by default, not necessarily what's available at all. == hk -- _ _ We are free to share code and we code to share freedom (_X_)yne Foundation, Free Culture Foundry * https://www.dyne.org/donate/ ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On 06/03/2016 10:42 PM, Florian Zieboll wrote: > > That said, I wonder, what information any > arbitrary init system would need, that can not be delivered e.g. in a > simple XML file, packaged with the daemon. > An XML file, however simple it may be, is probably the last thing you want to add to an arbitrary init system. == hk -- _ _ We are free to share code and we code to share freedom (_X_)yne Foundation, Free Culture Foundry * https://www.dyne.org/donate/ ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 10:58:37 + hellekin wrote: > On 06/03/2016 10:42 PM, Florian Zieboll wrote: > > > > That said, I wonder, what information any > > arbitrary init system would need, that can not be delivered e.g. in > > a simple XML file, packaged with the daemon. > > > > An XML file, however simple it may be, is probably the last thing you > want to add to an arbitrary init system. Hola Hellekin, still: The idea is a "meta configuration file", parsed during the installation of a daemon, from which the conventional init scripts for each individual init system can be derived. Hence a daemon's package maintainer wouldn't have to provide 27 different configurations, one for each init system that comes with the distro - instead, the each init system maintainer (and, in the best case, some day in the future "upstream") would provide this parser/converter script. Also, i wasn't aware that XML is such a powerful trigger word, you probably noticed the "e.g." in front of it. I only worked with it in an Adobe CS context where it is really great, once you have unravelled the horrible tag overlapping produced by Indesign. If I ever mention XML again on this list, you'll know that I'm trolling^^ libre Grüße, Florian ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, Jun 05, 2016 at 02:08:02PM +0200, Florian Zieboll wrote: > On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 10:58:37 + > hellekin wrote: > > On 06/03/2016 10:42 PM, Florian Zieboll wrote: > > > That said, I wonder, what information any > > > arbitrary init system would need, that can not be delivered e.g. in > > > a simple XML file, packaged with the daemon. > > > > An XML file, however simple it may be, is probably the last thing you > > want to add to an arbitrary init system. > > Also, i wasn't aware that XML is such a powerful trigger word You'd need to go really, really far out of your way to design such an epic fail as XML. What it does is stringifying a simple tree data structure. Most of us here can design such a format that it's both human and machine readable, with a parser that fits in a single line of Perl. Enter XML. Definitely not human readable. Not (easily) machine readable either. And as to complexity... take a glance at https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/source-package/libxml2 59! Fifty-fucking-nine security holes! In just a single implementation of such a format. You'd need to be really pants-on-the-head retarded to use XML anywhere near an init system. Especially in PID 1. Obviously, as you can expect, "someone" does this. In a standard-breaking, buggy way. -- An imaginary friend squared is a real enemy. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 10:58:37 + hellekin wrote: > On 06/03/2016 10:42 PM, Florian Zieboll wrote: > > > > That said, I wonder, what information any > > arbitrary init system would need, that can not be delivered e.g. in > > a simple XML file, packaged with the daemon. > > > > An XML file, however simple it may be, is probably the last thing you > want to add to an arbitrary init system. Hi hellekin, That was my reaction, before realizing that his idea was to, just once per config change, modify the XML and then run a user level program to update the rc files or whatever. It's a little like web pages. Some web pages are static HTML and some are dynamic. Static web pages are usually faster, less resource intensive, and more secure. If you're not displaying interactive stuff, static is usually the way to go (I know this isn't a hip way to think of things, but I've found it to be the truth). So look at this page: http://www.troubleshooters.com/linux/ The preceding link is to a page containing a hierarchical list of links, and in fact the page is not authored, but is created by a python program. I could have made this page dynamically by running the python program every time a user browsed to that page, but instead I ran the Python program once and used its output as that web page. Which is pretty much what Florian was suggesting: Change and convert the XML only when something about the boot changes, and put the output file into an rc file or something like that. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, 05 Jun 2016, Steve Litt wrote: > Which is pretty much what Florian was suggesting: Change and convert > the XML only when something about the boot changes, and put the output > file into an rc file or something like that. OK but can we avoid polarization and use "markup (language definition)" instead of XML here? I share and understand well everyone's concerns about XML here and think it won't help mutual understanding of what you point out if we keep the unfortunate example Florian did. True that his suggestion is interesting. FTR I think YAML is a very interesting tree structured markup language very easy to read for humans and parse for machines. ciao ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, Jun 05, 2016 at 10:58:37AM +, hellekin wrote: > On 06/03/2016 10:42 PM, Florian Zieboll wrote: > > > > That said, I wonder, what information any > > arbitrary init system would need, that can not be delivered e.g. in a > > simple XML file, packaged with the daemon. > > > > An XML file, however simple it may be, is probably the last thing you > want to add to an arbitrary init system. > Amen -- [ ~.,_ Enzo Nicosia aka KatolaZ - GLUGCT -- Freaknet Medialab ] [ "+. katolaz [at] freaknet.org --- katolaz [at] yahoo.it ] [ @) http://kalos.mine.nu --- Devuan GNU + Linux User ] [ @@) http://maths.qmul.ac.uk/~vnicosia -- GPG: 0B5F062F ] [ (@@@) Twitter: @KatolaZ - skype: katolaz -- github: KatolaZ ] ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, Jun 05, 2016 at 10:38:33AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 10:58:37 + > hellekin wrote: > > > On 06/03/2016 10:42 PM, Florian Zieboll wrote: > > > > > > That said, I wonder, what information any > > > arbitrary init system would need, that can not be delivered e.g. in > > > a simple XML file, packaged with the daemon. > > > > > > > An XML file, however simple it may be, is probably the last thing you > > want to add to an arbitrary init system. > > Hi hellekin, > > That was my reaction, before realizing that his idea was to, just once > per config change, modify the XML and then run a user level program to > update the rc files or whatever. > Unfortunately, there is no such thing as "just...modify the XML and run a user level program to update the rc file" which has ever worked flawlessly. "Just... modifying" an existing XML is a nightmare for a human, which is why you usually leave it to tools, which unavoidably become complex and unmaintanable. I am absolutely sure that there is an easier and more maintainable solution than XML. We probably have to think harder. HND KatolaZ -- [ ~.,_ Enzo Nicosia aka KatolaZ - GLUGCT -- Freaknet Medialab ] [ "+. katolaz [at] freaknet.org --- katolaz [at] yahoo.it ] [ @) http://kalos.mine.nu --- Devuan GNU + Linux User ] [ @@) http://maths.qmul.ac.uk/~vnicosia -- GPG: 0B5F062F ] [ (@@@) Twitter: @KatolaZ - skype: katolaz -- github: KatolaZ ] ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] use zram for /tmp - how?
Am Sun, 05 Jun 2016 12:00:01 + schrieb Didier Kryn : > I have a laptop with 16GB of ram. I configured it like this with > the primary goal of not using swap at all. And my /tmp is a tmpfs > with a 4G limit. This allows me to use an SSD as hard disk drive. I > didn't want to swap to an SSD. > > I have never been short of ram in 3 years. I have compiled > kernels, GCC, and many other things on this laptop, runing make with > multiple threads; I sometimes got stuck by lack of cpu, never by lack > of ram. > > I understand that you want to go further and increase the size > of your /tmp by compressing it. It seems pretty complicated and > probably not worth the burden. Thank you Didier! Would you mind to put your exact configuration here? Anyway, i went a bit further and around the compressed ram theme. Given, that i probably will keep the harddrive swap partition (as i said: for hibernation/s2disk) would it be more useful to use zswap instead (zswap needs a physical swap device)? And to set the percentage of ram given to zswap pretty high? (Activate zswap would be some lines in the bootloader). So, using tmpfs as parazyd pointed out, would go to be swapped early into the compressed swap in ram, when there is no more uncompressed ram available. Or is it ingenuous thinking? If i understand correctly, zswap will, when it really comes to the limits swap out the oldest swap pages to the "pysical" swap device, zram would kill them (?). Cheers. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] adblocking using /etc/hosts
... I mentioned before on this list Pi-hole https://pi-hole.net/ which does do something like that and is well maintained. At the moment it is just a script and it will have to be packaged and such but it works well on all kinds of De*an versions. I have it running on RPi 2 with Devuan beta and i like it. Looks cool, I want one of those does pi-hole work on devuan? Any info on hardware working best with devuan raspbian? Will definitely buy and try Grtz Nick ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
Florian Zieboll writes:
> Simon Hobson wrote:
>> Florian Zieboll wrote:
>>
>> > Seriously, what else besides dependencies on other daemons that
>> > have to be running and some testing for the existence of certain
>> > (everything is) files would be necessary to pass to a parser
>> > script, which could be packaged with the respective init system?
>>
>> Are we in danger of removing one of the great benefits of the shell
>> scripts used by sysvinit - the ability to code pretty well anything
>> that's needed. I realise that this also means the scripts can tend to
>> "sprawl", but it gives great flexibility - including for local
>> modifications.
>
> hallo simon,
>
> i was not talking about replacing sysvinit's shellscripts, but suggest
> to implement a routine that creates them "on the fly" on installation
> of a new daemon, from /one/ init-independent "meta" configuration file,
> packaged with the daemon.
What's "a daemon"? Eg, certain machines I'm dealing with do all of
their internal communication over a set of ssh-based VPNs. Example
start command:
starting "quicksand VPN" \
daemon -n chdir / monitor -n qvpn ssh-vpn mes-pgsql 5000 quicksand
quicksand4
This already involves running 5 different program. ssh-vpn is a shell
script whose final command looks like this:
exec multi-cmd \
monitor -n "${vtun}-t" chids -u "$user" ssh -n -N -L
$lport:127.0.0.1:$rport "$host" \; \
monitor -n "${vtun}-v" vtund -f "$cfg" -n "$vtun" 127.0.0.1
[In my experience, this combination works reliably while ssh alone
doesn't]
There are 4 more program here. None of them 'is' the server/ daemon, all
9 work in concert to provide a service in a certain way. With the
exception of ssh and vtund, these are all program written by me but
that's not necessarily so. And no 'package' not specifically created for
this use case could provide the meta-information needed here.
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Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, Jun 05, 2016 at 03:58:45PM +0100, KatolaZ wrote: > On Sun, Jun 05, 2016 at 10:38:33AM -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > > On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 10:58:37 + > > hellekin wrote: > > > > > On 06/03/2016 10:42 PM, Florian Zieboll wrote: > > > > > > > > That said, I wonder, what information any > > > > arbitrary init system would need, that can not be delivered e.g. in > > > > a simple XML file, packaged with the daemon. > > > > > > > > > > An XML file, however simple it may be, is probably the last thing you > > > want to add to an arbitrary init system. > > > > Hi hellekin, > > > > That was my reaction, before realizing that his idea was to, just once > > per config change, modify the XML and then run a user level program to > > update the rc files or whatever. > > > > Unfortunately, there is no such thing as "just...modify the XML and > run a user level program to update the rc file" which has ever worked > flawlessly. "Just... modifying" an existing XML is a nightmare for a > human, which is why you usually leave it to tools, which unavoidably > become complex and unmaintanable. > > I am absolutely sure that there is an easier and more maintainable > solution than XML. We probably have to think harder. S-expressions? CSV? > > HND > > KatolaZ > > -- > [ ~.,_ Enzo Nicosia aka KatolaZ - GLUGCT -- Freaknet Medialab ] > [ "+. katolaz [at] freaknet.org --- katolaz [at] yahoo.it ] > [ @) http://kalos.mine.nu --- Devuan GNU + Linux User ] > [ @@) http://maths.qmul.ac.uk/~vnicosia -- GPG: 0B5F062F ] > [ (@@@) Twitter: @KatolaZ - skype: katolaz -- github: KatolaZ ] > ___ > Dng mailing list > Dng@lists.dyne.org > https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 16:41:22 +0200 Jaromil wrote: > OK but can we avoid polarization and use "markup (language > definition)" instead of XML here? I share and understand well > everyone's concerns about XML here and think it won't help mutual > understanding of what you point out if we keep the unfortunate example > Florian did. True that his suggestion is interesting. > > FTR I think YAML is a very interesting tree structured markup language > very easy to read for humans and parse for machines. YAML is good. Python has an excellent YAML parser. YAML would be an excellent choice for Florian's idea. YAML has no end tags, which means it gets cumbersome when data becomes longer than an easily viewed line. So it's possible that instead of *containing* scripts, the YAML would *point to* scripts. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility (was: SoylentNews discussion)
Florian Zieboll wrote: > i was not talking about replacing sysvinit's shellscripts, but suggest > to implement a routine that creates them "on the fly" on installation > of a new daemon, from /one/ init-independent "meta" configuration file, > packaged with the daemon. OK, my experience in this is limited, but whenever I've seen a "conversion routine from language A to language B" setup - the restrictions on language A (to avoid the parser being chronically complicated) are severe and the output in language B is "not user readable". I wonder if it would actually be easier to write the different init scrips/definitions manually - thus using the best features of each system without the compromises of shoehorning it al into one common meta script. I can see a case for doing automated conversions on "simple" and generic cases, but I can't help thinking that many would be better done by hand. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, 05 Jun 2016 18:54:12 +0100 Rainer Weikusat wrote: > What's "a daemon"? > > (...) > > And no 'package' not specifically created for this use case could > provide the meta-information needed here. Hallo Rainer, this sounds much like a rhetoric question. I think for any attempt to unify things, you'll find corner cases that won't work out-of-the-box and I bet that you had to create the init scripts for your use case manually as well. Do you think my (naive!) suggestion would make that any more difficult? I have not the necessary knowledge to realize this thing, but surely enough to get things done, once this idea should prove good and start rolling. My strength is definitely not coding (probably because I never really dived into it), but unfocusedly (?) watching things and ask questions. Sometimes I can even answer one - and if the answer / suggestion is BS, I am honestly happy to be told so. How else would I learn? In this case I read a lot about init freedom and the troubles of maintaining scripts/config for numerous init systems multiplied with a quite huge number of daemons (or say, "stuff continously running in the background" if you prefer). Devuan has started with great ambitions towards "init freedom", not for the ego but for the idea of free(*) and modular software. If this idea should prove realistic and find support, it could easily be adopted by "upstream". On the other hand, if this idea should turn out to be nonsense, it surely won't be the reason for me to jump out of the window. A much more serious reason could be the amount of opportunists on this planet, who are not able to express their opinion or feelings or questions straight in my face - and I have the impression, that you understand what I mean. libre Grüße and best regards, Florian NB: I live on the ground floor^^ ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
Hi, I would like to suggest as a text template format for the automatic generation of init scripts to use a format similar to the one used in package control files. This uses sections that can easily be parsed without using complex parsers. I would go like this: Requires: Requires_Running: Start_Parameters: Stop_Parameters: Edward On 05/06/2016, Steve Litt wrote: > On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 16:41:22 +0200 > Jaromil wrote: > > >> OK but can we avoid polarization and use "markup (language >> definition)" instead of XML here? I share and understand well >> everyone's concerns about XML here and think it won't help mutual >> understanding of what you point out if we keep the unfortunate example >> Florian did. True that his suggestion is interesting. >> >> FTR I think YAML is a very interesting tree structured markup language >> very easy to read for humans and parse for machines. > > YAML is good. Python has an excellent YAML parser. YAML would be an > excellent choice for Florian's idea. > > YAML has no end tags, which means it gets cumbersome when data becomes > longer than an easily viewed line. So it's possible that instead of > *containing* scripts, the YAML would *point to* scripts. > > > SteveT > > Steve Litt > June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? > http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb > ___ > Dng mailing list > Dng@lists.dyne.org > https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng > ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] use zram for /tmp - how?
Le 05/06/2016 17:24, emnin...@riseup.net a écrit : Am Sun, 05 Jun 2016 12:00:01 + schrieb Didier Kryn : I have a laptop with 16GB of ram. I configured it like this with the primary goal of not using swap at all. And my /tmp is a tmpfs with a 4G limit. This allows me to use an SSD as hard disk drive. I didn't want to swap to an SSD. I have never been short of ram in 3 years. I have compiled kernels, GCC, and many other things on this laptop, runing make with multiple threads; I sometimes got stuck by lack of cpu, never by lack of ram. I understand that you want to go further and increase the size of your /tmp by compressing it. It seems pretty complicated and probably not worth the burden. Thank you Didier! Would you mind to put your exact configuration here? - Begin of configuration HP EliteBook 4 cores Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-3687U CPU @ 2.10GHz 16GB RAM SSD disk 256GB fstab: # # / was on /dev/sda5 during installation UUID=d91acaa3-5fdc-49e9-9f2b-ba7f3efb33f9 / btrfs noatime 0 1 # /home was on /dev/sda10 during installation UUID=4709a8c2-825d-43fc-83bb-3b7404feb4aa /home btrfs noatime 0 2 # /usr was on /dev/sda6 during installation UUID=05f9f811-b8b1-445f-ac8c-9537a202a9f9 /usr btrfs noatime 0 2 # /var was on /dev/sda7 during installation UUID=905a0998-c7fc-4544-a73e-44d8d803602c /var reiserfs notail,noatime,nosuid 0 2 tmp /tmp tmpfs size=4G 0 0 My fstab is a mess. I used several partitions not mentionned above as chroots. I know it's an error to dispatch the OS into several partitions when using btrfs; won't do it next time. --- End of configuration Anyway, i went a bit further and around the compressed ram theme. Given, that i probably will keep the harddrive swap partition (as i said: for hibernation/s2disk) would it be more useful to use zswap instead (zswap needs a physical swap device)? And to set the percentage of ram given to zswap pretty high? (Activate zswap would be some lines in the bootloader). I haven't any partition formatted as swap, and, nevertheless, hibernation works. I realize this just when writing this email and I now wonder where the hell the kernel saves the system image! So, using tmpfs as parazyd pointed out, would go to be swapped early into the compressed swap in ram, when there is no more uncompressed ram available. Or is it ingenuous thinking? If i understand correctly, zswap will, when it really comes to the limits swap out the oldest swap pages to the "pysical" swap device, zram would kill them (?). I guess you can swap to both zram and disk. swapon allows you to give priorities, meaning swap could go to disk only when zram is full. I would first try to estimate the real need for swap. The common practice, for years, was to use a swap partition twice the size of the RAM. Since today a typical RAM is around 4GB, this puts a limit of 12GB total. But you've got 16! Without swap, you have more than a typical laptop with swap. Didier ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
[DNG] how to make xterm window not close automatically after executing a command?
If i do 'xterm -T Htop -e htop' the terminal window rests open, if i do 'xterm -T Sysinfo -e inxi -F' the window closes. In some way it's logical, to me, since htop has not finished its job until i do not do F10. Inxi, otoh, has finished. But how can i make, that also the windows with the -inxi -F command rests open? Thanks a lot in advance! ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 21:22:04 +0200 Florian Zieboll wrote: > On Sun, 05 Jun 2016 18:54:12 +0100 > Rainer Weikusat wrote: > > > What's "a daemon"? > > > > (...) > > > > And no 'package' not specifically created for this use case could > > provide the meta-information needed here. > > > Hallo Rainer, > > this sounds much like a rhetoric question. Not really. Ask this question to 100 people, and you'll get a wide range of answers similar to the range you'd get with "what is the cloud?" or "what does semantic mean?" I've met people who say a background process is a daemon only if it *put itself* in the background. Others say it's a daemon only if managed by a respawning supervision suite like s6, runit or daemontools. Me, I try not to use the word for that reason. I'd be very careful of discussions that pivot around the definition of "daemon." SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
Ahh, but you're forgetting that sysvinit thang I wish never happened: runlevels. And of course that 5 function thing with start, stop, restart, and the other two, whatever they are. But yeah, Edward, your requires, requires_running, start_parameters and stop_parameters are a good start. And you also need provides so that the process is given a name which others can be dependent upon. SteveT On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 21:31:26 +0200 Edward Bartolo wrote: > Hi, > > I would like to suggest as a text template format for the automatic > generation of init scripts to use a format similar to the one used in > package control files. This uses sections that can easily be parsed > without using complex parsers. > > I would go like this: > > Requires: > Requires_Running: > Start_Parameters: > Stop_Parameters: > > Edward > > On 05/06/2016, Steve Litt wrote: > > On Sun, 5 Jun 2016 16:41:22 +0200 > > Jaromil wrote: > > > > > >> OK but can we avoid polarization and use "markup (language > >> definition)" instead of XML here? I share and understand well > >> everyone's concerns about XML here and think it won't help mutual > >> understanding of what you point out if we keep the unfortunate > >> example Florian did. True that his suggestion is interesting. > >> > >> FTR I think YAML is a very interesting tree structured markup > >> language very easy to read for humans and parse for machines. > > > > YAML is good. Python has an excellent YAML parser. YAML would be an > > excellent choice for Florian's idea. > > > > YAML has no end tags, which means it gets cumbersome when data > > becomes longer than an easily viewed line. So it's possible that > > instead of *containing* scripts, the YAML would *point to* scripts. > > > > > > SteveT > > > > Steve Litt > > June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? > > http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb > > ___ > > Dng mailing list > > Dng@lists.dyne.org > > https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng > > ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] how to make xterm window not close automatically after executing a command?
On Mon, Jun 06, 2016 at 12:46:39AM +0200, emnin...@riseup.net wrote: > If i do 'xterm -T Htop -e htop' the terminal window rests open, if i do > 'xterm -T Sysinfo -e inxi -F' the window closes. > > In some way it's logical, to me, since htop has not finished its job > until i do not do F10. Inxi, otoh, has finished. But how can i make, > that also the windows with the -inxi -F command rests open? > > Thanks a lot in advance! You should try ' -e "inxi | less" HND KatolaZ -- [ ~.,_ Enzo Nicosia aka KatolaZ - GLUGCT -- Freaknet Medialab ] [ "+. katolaz [at] freaknet.org --- katolaz [at] yahoo.it ] [ @) http://kalos.mine.nu --- Devuan GNU + Linux User ] [ @@) http://maths.qmul.ac.uk/~vnicosia -- GPG: 0B5F062F ] [ (@@@) Twitter: @KatolaZ - skype: katolaz -- github: KatolaZ ] ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Sun, Jun 05, 2016 at 07:01:39PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > Ahh, but you're forgetting that sysvinit thang I wish never happened: > runlevels. And of course that 5 function thing with start, stop, > restart, and the other two, whatever they are. > > But yeah, Edward, your requires, requires_running, start_parameters and > stop_parameters are a good start. And you also need provides so that > the process is given a name which others can be dependent upon. > and you ended up with LSB-compatible init scripts :) HND KatolaZ -- [ ~.,_ Enzo Nicosia aka KatolaZ - GLUGCT -- Freaknet Medialab ] [ "+. katolaz [at] freaknet.org --- katolaz [at] yahoo.it ] [ @) http://kalos.mine.nu --- Devuan GNU + Linux User ] [ @@) http://maths.qmul.ac.uk/~vnicosia -- GPG: 0B5F062F ] [ (@@@) Twitter: @KatolaZ - skype: katolaz -- github: KatolaZ ] ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
[DNG] I'm on the list
Hi all, I'd like to ask you a favor. When replying to my post on the list, please just send your reply to the list, no copy direct to me necessary or desired. I'm on the list. When people reply to me on the list only, their reply goes right in my dng mailbox, in its thread. A copy to me personally is just redundant email, and when people email me and copy the list (say wht?), sometimes the reply gets in the right mailbox, and sometimes it goes to my inbox, in which I'm VERY quick with the delete key and might never read what you say. Occasionally someone sends a reply directly to me without a reply to the list. This, of course, is the right way to do it when the intent is to advise me of netiquette or further pursue some business private between the two of us. But other than that, I'd prefer the reply go to the list, because I certainly don't have time to teach people one at a time, and when I'm the one being taught, you don't have the time to teach one person at a time. Add that to the fact that the whole purpose of a mailing list is to provide a mind-meld where the whole is greater than the sum, and it makes no sense to reply to me directly with anything other than personal business. The reason I bring this up at this time is that in spite of continually refining my .procmailrc, I need to do more and more moving emails between directories, and more and more remembering to include the mailing list as a recipient. Thanks, SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] Init compatibility
On Mon, 6 Jun 2016 00:06:11 +0100 KatolaZ wrote: > On Sun, Jun 05, 2016 at 07:01:39PM -0400, Steve Litt wrote: > > Ahh, but you're forgetting that sysvinit thang I wish never > > happened: runlevels. And of course that 5 function thing with > > start, stop, restart, and the other two, whatever they are. > > > > But yeah, Edward, your requires, requires_running, start_parameters > > and stop_parameters are a good start. And you also need provides so > > that the process is given a name which others can be dependent upon. > > > > and you ended up with LSB-compatible init scripts :) > Yeah. I would shed no tears if we forever got rid of "runlevels". There are enough other ways to accomplish similar things. And if we really need restart to be anything but stop;start, we can write a shellscript. But provides and requires (to be running before starting this process) are an excellent and maleable way to specify *a route to* start order. I mean, I could almost do it in Python right now. I'm just not sure that would do anyone any good at this stage. SteveT Steve Litt June 2016 featured book: Troubleshooting: Why Bother? http://www.troubleshooters.com/twb ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] I'm on the list
Full agreement, Steve. As I use Mutt, the L command ensures replies are sent only to the list, just like this one. - Nate -- "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds. The pessimist fears this is true." Ham radio, Linux, bikes, and more: http://www.n0nb.us ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] man init
On 06/04/2016 09:39 PM, Didier Kryn wrote: Le 04/06/2016 14:00, Nate Bargmann a écrit : * On 2016 04 Jun 04:52 -0500, Jaromil wrote: On Fri, 03 Jun 2016, Joel Roth wrote: My system is devuan/jessie, upgraded from debian. It's interesting that 'man init' brings up the systemd man page. strange! I don't have that on my laptop (installed from devuan directly) but will check on other systems. curious why this occurs. well spotted On this desktop upgraded from Debian Jessie to Devuan Jessie about a month ago, 'man init' gives me the page for sysvinit. Only libsystemd0 is installed. Any other search for systemd shows uninstalled packages. - Nate Same as Nate on a fresh install of Beta two weeks ago. No problems here: #uname -a Linux i7 3.16.0-4-amd64 #1 SMP Debian 3.16.7-ckt25-2 (2016-04-08) x86_64 GNU/Linux #cat /etc/devuan_version jessie Didier ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] ifconfig vs ip
On 06/05/2016 12:16 AM, Rainer Weikusat wrote: Simon Walter writes: [...] I am adding containers (LXC) and virtual network to the box, I think I will add an tap and bridge interface to an /etc/network/interface.d/ file. If I use something like: auto br0 iface br0 inet static pre-up ip tuntap add dev tap0 mode tap pre-up ip link set tap0 up post-down ip link set tap0 down post-down ip tuntap del dev tap0 mode tap bridge_ports tap0 address 10.1.1.1 netmask 255.255.255.0 broadcast 10.1.1.255 And make sure there is the source /etc/network/interface.d/* line in the interfaces file. Then route with iptables between the a physical NIC (eth0 for example) and the virtual NIC (tap0) and have all the containers connected to br0. Are there any glaring problems with this setup? This will create a bridge with one virtual network interface bridged to a character device an application could use to talk 'ethernet' to the network stack. That's certainly not inherently related to/ useful for anything-lxc. I will route the packets to the physical device using iptables, thereby creating a firewalled private network. I have only tried it out and not done much research and testing on whether this is actually secure or not. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] how to make xterm window not close automatically
Buon dì, KatolaZ Am Mon, 06 Jun 2016 00:16:43 + schrieb KatolaZ : > You should try ' -e "inxi | less" Thx for the hint! But unfortunately,that does *NOT* work in any terminal program (sakura, lxterminal & cie) within X. Using the command with xterm though, produces a nearly unreadable output: any single result line is "decorated" by an ESC or something like that. Cheers. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] how to make xterm window not close automatically
On Mon, Jun 06, 2016 at 07:07:54AM +0200, emnin...@riseup.net wrote: > Am Mon, 06 Jun 2016 00:16:43 + > schrieb KatolaZ : > > > You should try ' -e "inxi | less" > > Thx for the hint! But unfortunately,that does *NOT* work in any > terminal program (sakura, lxterminal & cie) within X. > > Using the command with xterm though, produces a nearly unreadable > output: any single result line is "decorated" by an ESC or something > like that. less -R -- An imaginary friend squared is a real enemy. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
Re: [DNG] how to make xterm window not close automatically after executing a command?
xterm -T Sysinfo -e inxi -F -hold enjoy :-) Nik Am Montag, 6. Juni 2016 schrieb emnin...@riseup.net: > If i do 'xterm -T Htop -e htop' the terminal window rests open, if i do > 'xterm -T Sysinfo -e inxi -F' the window closes. > > In some way it's logical, to me, since htop has not finished its job > until i do not do F10. Inxi, otoh, has finished. But how can i make, > that also the windows with the -inxi -F command rests open? > > Thanks a lot in advance! > ___ > Dng mailing list > Dng@lists.dyne.org > https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng > -- Please do not email me anything that you are not comfortable also sharing with the NSA. ___ Dng mailing list Dng@lists.dyne.org https://mailinglists.dyne.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/dng
