Re: Re: Mozilla enabled ads in Firefox and they're active in Fedora

[Benjamin Kerensa]

Hello Free Software Friends,


I want to encourage the Fedora Community to think carefully about making 
a switch
to another browser as the default in Fedora. I would not get hung up on 
these tiles
(Ads) too much and remember they are necessary in order for Mozilla to 
continue
building Firefox, Thunderbird, Seamonkey, Firefox OS and supporting the 
very literally

hundreds of movements and thousands of events it does each year.

But that all aside I hope you will weigh whether the alternatives will 
provider your users
any better of an experience in terms of Stability, Performance, Privacy 
or Trust.


I think it will be difficult to find an alternative that offers what 
Firefox does to your
users and frankly I think you will have a fair amount of users that will 
be upset that
you switched the default on them. Sure they can still install Firefox 
but the fact is
Fedora users come to expect Firefox to be the default much like they 
expect Gnome
to be the default. (Also remember there are very likely thousands of 
Mozilla Contributors that use Fedora)


Whatever your decision have a good release cycle and keep on building that
awesome free software!



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Re: Mozilla enabled ads in Firefox and they're active in Fedora

[Nikos Roussos]

On 11/19/2014 12:34 AM, Lars Seipel wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 18, 2014 at 11:15:33AM +0200, Nikos Roussos wrote:
>>> No, actually we don't. We promote websites because we honestly think
>>> they're useful, not because we're paid to do so.
>>
>> That's irrelevant. Paid or not, promoting websites through tiles or
>> gnome-shell is the same form of advertisement.
> 
> I disagree. Think about it: imagine I told you as a friend how I was at
> some pub yesterday and enthusiastically rave about how it was totally
> awesome and that you should go there, too. Now, in the one case I told
> you this because I'm honestly convinced that it would be fun for you to
> go there and that you'd like it. In the other case I did it because the
> owner paid me for it. Really no difference? I don't think so.

From Fedora perspective there is no difference. What if an upstream
doesn't have public financial records. How we would we know if it gets
paid for promoting 3rd parties? Investigate? This is paranoid and
ridiculous.



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Re: ca-certificates 2014.2.1 will remove several still valid CA certificates with weak keys

[Florian Weimer]

On 11/18/2014 05:44 PM, Reindl Harald wrote:


Am 18.11.2014 um 16:12 schrieb Michael Catanzaro:

On Tue, 2014-11-18 at 12:11 +0100, Florian Weimer wrote:

Firefox also builds a repository of intermediate certificates over
time
and uses them automatically to fill gaps in certificate chains for
completely unrelated sites.  This leads to somewhat non-predictable
behavior regarding the set of sites to which Firefox can connect
reliably.  This is difficult to emulate in one-shot command line
tools
such as wget which do not keep any local state by default.


And that's arguably the biggest problem of all. The goal is to reduce
certificate validation failures for users who have seen a particular
intermediate cert before, but the effect is that web developers get
false positives when testing whether their sites are set up properly or
not. This just makes things worse in the long run.


true - *but* anybody responsible for a https site should at leat once
per month run https://www.ssllabs.com/ssltest/ against it


https://victi.ms/ receives an “A+” rating, even though it lacks an 
intermediate certificate and connections from non-browser clients fail. 
 You have to read the results carefully to discover that the site is 
misconfigured in a significant way.


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Review swap

[Lorenzo Dalrio]

Hello,
I have this trivial package ready to be reviewed

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1165584

I'd be happy to review one in exchange.

Bye,
Lorenzo
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No Env-and-Stacks WG meeting today (2014-11-19)

[Honza Horak]

There is no agenda proposed for this week so let's skip today and have a 
meeting the next week.


Honza
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Re: Enable tapping by default

[Lukas Zapletal]

> What can we do to make this happen?

I am not interested in tapping at all (I actually hate random clicks and
I always disable this), but if you really want to see this, why don't
you start a new screen in Gnome to present a selection during the first
boot. Maybe Gnome folks will like the idea, maybe not.

For myself, one another configuration screen would not be a problem. I'd
always go with disable option. Anyway this pretty much answers your
question I guess.

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Re: Mozilla enabled ads in Firefox and they're active in Fedora

[Lukas Zapletal]

> What does the community think of it? Is it okay for our flagship
> applications to carry ads and report tracking data?

Can't we let the user to decide during the firstboot or Firefox first
startup?

Since browsers already do the opt-out, we could do the same. This global
OS setting would then apply on all apps. I believe there will be more
than just the Firefox case soon.

I will always vote to opt-out, but there are maybe users who do not
care. It's even worse. I know people who *want* to see advertisments. To
us this sounds like extreme, but let's admit it - we are biased a bit.

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rawhide report: 20141119 changes

[Fedora Rawhide Report]

Compose started at Wed Nov 19 05:15:02 UTC 2014
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F-21 Branched report: 20141119 changes

[Fedora Branched Report]

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Re: Can you help with making fonts awesome in Fedora 21?

[pravin....@gmail.com]

On 16 October 2014 15:14, Richard Hughes  wrote:

> If you maintain a font in Fedora, or are a provenpackager, I could
> really need your help this weekend. Basically, we want to implement
> AppStream metadata[1] for all the fonts we want to show in the
> software center. I've already made a good start, and now other people
> are starting to help as well, so I'm pretty sure we can get the
> majority finished for next week when we can submit a mega-update of
> updated fonts.
>
> I've started a shared spreadsheet here:
>
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1o2sPWF7PEe6BKnBeZUI23m51nfFHUMx61IRsdNDozig/edit#gid=0
> with what needs doing -- if you can help, please put your FAS name in
> the second column and get building. If any fonts are missing that you
> think belong in the software center please feel free to add them.
>


Fedora i18n team was tracking this task. In todays meeting [1] we analyzed
status, more than 99% task completed and remaining are on the way.  Closed
the ticket [2].
Do comment/update if anything missing or further improvement needed.

Best Regards,
Pravin Satpute


1.https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/I18N/Meetings/2014-11-19
2. https://fedorahosted.org/i18n/ticket/38#comment:2
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Re: Can you help with making fonts awesome in Fedora 21?

[Richard Hughes]

On 19 November 2014 14:27, pravin@gmail.com  wrote:
> Do comment/update if anything missing or further improvement needed.

You've all done a brilliant job, thanks!

Richard
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Separate issues raised by Firefox ads [was Re: Mozilla enabled ads in Firefox and they're active in Fedora]

[Matthew Miller]

On Wed, Nov 19, 2014 at 12:11:04AM -0800, Benjamin Kerensa wrote:
> I want to encourage the Fedora Community to think carefully about
> making a switch to another browser as the default in Fedora. I would
> not get hung up on these tiles (Ads) too much and remember they are
> necessary in order for Mozilla to continue building Firefox,
> Thunderbird, Seamonkey, Firefox OS and supporting the very literally
> hundreds of movements and thousands of events it does each year.

Hi Benjamin. This seems like as good a place as any to jump in on this
topic. I think that there are three separate concerns here:

1. Privacy and Tracking
===

This is a big concern of many of our contributors and users, and
it's something that we don't have a clear policy on. I've seen some
degree of speculation over Mozilla's practices here; people should
read , which will 
hopefully clear up some of the concerns. (I'm unsure, though, of
the significance of "tile ID and destination" vs "URL" from a user
point of view. Also, use of the jargon word "frecency" does not help
clarity.)

On the one hand, though, we live in a world of the Web. _Especially_
for a web browser, I do not see much difference between the
"enhanced" new tab page, which happens to be local with remote
content, and having that page be , which
runs Google Analytics and Optimizely beacons and could presumably
start running advertising at any time.

On the other hand, I do not like the idea of Fedora having a jumble
of privacy options one must track down and opt out of in various
applications. This doesn't seem in line with our vision statement,
which includes "people control their content and devices". Mozilla
seems to have thought this through considerably and the practices
seem much better than _most_, but I'm not sure we want to get Fedora
into the business of reviewing and approving these for every case.
   
  

2. Implication of Endorsement of Fedora or by Fedora
===

When someone downloads Firefox independently from the operating
system, and discovers that it is ad-supported software, the
relationship is fairly clear. However, Firefox is, as you note, our
default and centerpiece web browser. Although Firefox obviously has
a strong brand of its own, the details of the relationship isn't
necessarily clear.
   
A reasonable person could see the tiles marked "sponsored" and
assume that Fedora is involved in the sponsorhip relationship in
some way — that we endorse the links, products, or services; or that
we are receiving some amount of funding from them.
   
This is particularly problematic for a project like Fedora, where
our mission has a significant component of cultural impact. We don't
want to be seen as endorsing viewpoints which do not align with our
foundations. (And yes, this is also a potential problem with the
various links to websites contained in GNOME Software appstream from
.)
   
   
3. Dislike of Advertising in General


When a company's source of revenue is advertising, its users
inevitably become its _product_, rather than the people the company
serves. I appreciate that Mozilla is making these moves in order to
reduce dependency on a company where advertising and tracking _is_
the primary income stream. It's a complicated issue and I know
Mozilla has struggled with it and will continue to.
   
I guess I don't have much more to say about this aspect except:
there it is, and that it is separate from the other two.
   
   
   
-- 
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Re: Mozilla enabled ads in Firefox and they're active in Fedora

[Matthew Miller]

On Wed, Nov 19, 2014 at 12:19:21PM +0100, Lukas Zapletal wrote:
> Can't we let the user to decide during the firstboot or Firefox first
> startup?

Being bombarded with questions when you just want to get to using
something isn't the best user experience, and I think in general
something we've been trying to reduce.


> Since browsers already do the opt-out, we could do the same. This global
> OS setting would then apply on all apps. I believe there will be more
> than just the Firefox case soon.

How would that be implemented? What would it apply to?


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Re: Mozilla enabled ads in Firefox and they're active in Fedora

[Steven Rosenberg]

If there is an opt-out in the browser for receiving the advertising,
Mozilla should educate users on that choice while making a case for
why it needs the revenue from showing the ads.

"Accepting" the ads could be a good way for users to support Mozilla
while not making an actual financial contribution. We all assume that
the Google-search money collected by Mozilla makes other financial
support unnecessary, and if that isn't true, Mozilla should lay that
out.

Particularly after the recent CEO debacle, Mozilla needs to go the
extra mile to consider its users and community.
--
Steven Rosenberg
http://stevenrosenberg.net/blog
http://blogs.dailynews.com/click
stevenhrosenb...@gmail.com
ste...@stevenrosenberg.net


On Wed, Nov 19, 2014 at 8:28 AM, Matthew Miller
 wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 19, 2014 at 12:19:21PM +0100, Lukas Zapletal wrote:
>> Can't we let the user to decide during the firstboot or Firefox first
>> startup?
>
> Being bombarded with questions when you just want to get to using
> something isn't the best user experience, and I think in general
> something we've been trying to reduce.
>
>
>> Since browsers already do the opt-out, we could do the same. This global
>> OS setting would then apply on all apps. I believe there will be more
>> than just the Firefox case soon.
>
> How would that be implemented? What would it apply to?
>
>
> --
> Matthew Miller
> 
> Fedora Project Leader
> --
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Re: Review swap

[Michael Schwendt]

On Wed, 19 Nov 2014 11:47:30 +0100, Lorenzo Dalrio wrote:

> Hello,
> I have this trivial package ready to be reviewed
> 
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1165584
> 
> I'd be happy to review one in exchange.

We may need to redefine "trivial" for this one. ;-)
Look:

 | Version:20141118git%{shortcommit}
 | Release:1%{?dist}

You would be better off if you followed Fedora's versioning guidelines
for snapshots,

  https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:Guidelines#Version_and_Release
  https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:NamingGuidelines#Release_Tag

where you include the date of the checkout in the "Release" tag instead
of the "Version" tag. If there hasn't been an official _version_ yet,
choose "Version: 0". This gives you much more flexibility when dealing
with future updates (not limited to upgrades/downgrades).
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Summary/Minutes from today's FESCo Meeting (2014-11-19)

[Tomas Mraz]

===
#fedora-meeting: FESCO (2014-11-19)
===

Meeting started by t8m at 18:08:14 UTC. The full logs are available at
http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2014-11-19/fesco.2014-11-19-18.08.log.html
.

Meeting summary
---
* init process  (t8m, 18:08:27)

* #1273 Policy interpretation on proprietary products in gnome-software,
  gnome overview search results  (t8m, 18:11:53)
  * The web apps are clearly marked we can close the ticket  (t8m,
18:13:49)

* #1265 Fedora Plasma Product  (t8m, 18:15:03)
  * Closing the ticket as the new product proposals should be presented
to Fedora Council  (t8m, 18:20:41)

* #1326 change to fesco replacement process?  (t8m, 18:21:37)
  * we will revisit this after F21 is released  (t8m, 18:27:26)

* #1359 Automatic OpenH264 download by Firefox  (t8m, 18:28:36)
  * LINK: https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/1359#comment:26 looks
like a possible long term solution  (kalev, 18:30:24)
  * AGREED: Close the ticket and ask interested parties to work with
legal on more user friendly solution (+7, -0, 0:0)  (t8m, 18:47:07)

* #1367 Please define package manager expectations  (t8m, 18:48:27)
  * AGREED: post to devel list asking for interested parties to improve
http://dnf.readthedocs.org/en/latest/cli_vs_yum.html and revisit
change in the f22 cycle to see if there's any critical gaps (+6, -0,
0:0)  (t8m, 19:07:09)
  * ACTION: nirik will post to the devel list  (t8m, 19:08:20)

* #1368 How to deal with F21 broken dependencies  (t8m, 19:08:56)
  * AGREED: FESCo agrees to dropping the packages with broken
dependencies listed in #1368 from both F21 and rawhide (+7, -0, 0:0)
(t8m, 19:25:56)
  * AGREED: We will do the broken deps cleanup on Final Freeze from now
on in the future Fedora releases (+8, -0, 0:0)  (t8m, 19:30:41)
  * There will be warning sent to the affected maintainers at least 3
weeks in advance  (t8m, 19:31:36)

* #1369 packages should disable internal crash handlers and depend on
  ABRT  (t8m, 19:32:44)
  * Decision postponed to next week  (t8m, 19:57:36)

* Next week chair  (t8m, 19:57:40)
  * ACTION: nirik will chair the next week meeting  (t8m, 19:59:10)

* Open floor  (t8m, 19:59:18)

Meeting ended at 20:01:44 UTC.


Action Items

* nirik will post to the devel list
* nirik will chair the next week meeting


Action Items, by person
---
* nirik
  * nirik will post to the devel list
  * nirik will chair the next week meeting
* **UNASSIGNED**
  * (none)


People Present (lines said)
---
* t8m (100)
* nirik (73)
* mitr (58)
* kalev (50)
* dgilmore (33)
* thozza (32)
* mattdm (31)
* jwb (31)
* sgallagh (27)
* zodbot (15)
* randomuser (13)
* cschalle_ (13)
* sharkcz (12)
* jzeleny (8)
* oddshocks (4)
* kushal (3)
* scollier (2)
* mjg59 (1)
* mmaslano (0)
* stickster (0)


---
18:08:14  #startmeeting FESCO (2014-11-19)
18:08:15  Meeting started Wed Nov 19 18:08:14 2014 UTC.  The chair is 
t8m. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
18:08:15  Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link 
#topic.
18:08:19  #meetingname fesco
18:08:19  The meeting name has been set to 'fesco'
18:08:22  #chair dgilmore jwb kalev mattdm mitr mmaslano nirik sgallagh 
stickster t8m thozza
18:08:23  Current chairs: dgilmore jwb kalev mattdm mitr mmaslano nirik 
sgallagh stickster t8m thozza
18:08:27  #topic init process
18:08:27  .hello kevin
18:08:28  nirik: kevin 'Kevin Fenzi' 
18:08:31  .hello sgallagh
18:08:32  sgallagh: sgallagh 'Stephen Gallagher' 
18:08:38  Hi all I apologize again
18:09:00  .hello thozza
18:09:01  thozza: thozza 'Tomas Hozza' 
18:09:04  t8m we'll just have to talk fast to make up for it :)
18:09:07 * mattdm is here
18:09:16  hi
18:09:33  hi
18:09:34  mattdm: lts jst skp vwls fr spd
18:10:37  hi
18:11:30  OK, so let's finally start
18:11:53  #topic #1273 Policy interpretation on proprietary products in 
gnome-software, gnome overview search results
18:12:04  .fesco 1273
18:12:09  t8m: #1273 (Policy interpretation on proprietary products in 
gnome-software, gnome overview search results) – FESCo - 
https://fedorahosted.org/fesco/ticket/1273
18:13:07  I think this is done and can be closed.
18:13:08  So it seems we can close this ticket because the marking of Web 
apps was accepted upstream and is in Fedora if I understand this correctly
18:13:16  the "apps" are marked pretty clearly now.
18:13:21  yeah, exactly.
18:13:26  OK
18:13:35  there are some other issues but I don't think they are fesco 
issues
18:13:49  #info The web apps are clearly marked we can close the ticket
18:13:53  next topic
18:13:55  I'm generally in agreement, but I don't like the concept 
of 'this was accepted upstream therefore we are okay with it'
18:14:11  ...just an observation, carry on
18:14:18  randomuser, I think it is in Fedora already, isn't it?
18:14:31  I think it's more like 

Re: Review swap

[Lorenzo Dalrio]

In my hurry I have swapped Version and Release following exactly the
guidelines you have linked. :-/
Thank you Michael for pointing it out, sorry for the inconvenience...


2014-11-19 19:46 GMT+01:00 Michael Schwendt :
> On Wed, 19 Nov 2014 11:47:30 +0100, Lorenzo Dalrio wrote:
>
>> Hello,
>> I have this trivial package ready to be reviewed
>>
>> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1165584
>>
>> I'd be happy to review one in exchange.
>
> We may need to redefine "trivial" for this one. ;-)
> Look:
>
>  | Version:20141118git%{shortcommit}
>  | Release:1%{?dist}
>
> You would be better off if you followed Fedora's versioning guidelines
> for snapshots,
>
>   https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:Guidelines#Version_and_Release
>   https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Packaging:NamingGuidelines#Release_Tag
>
> where you include the date of the checkout in the "Release" tag instead
> of the "Version" tag. If there hasn't been an official _version_ yet,
> choose "Version: 0". This gives you much more flexibility when dealing
> with future updates (not limited to upgrades/downgrades).
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Schedule for Thursday's FPC Meeting (2014-11-20 17:00 UTC)

[James Antill]

 Following is the list of topics that will be discussed in the FPC
meeting Thursday at 2014-11-20 17:00 UTC in #fedora-meeting-1 on
irc.freenode.net.

 Local time information (via. rktime):

2014-11-20 09:00 Thu US/Pacific PST
2014-11-20 12:00 Thu US/Eastern EST
2014-11-20 17:00 Thu UTC <-
2014-11-20 17:00 Thu Europe/London <-
2014-11-20 18:00 Thu Europe/Paris   CET
2014-11-20 18:00 Thu Europe/Berlin  CET
2014-11-20 22:30 Thu Asia/Calcutta  IST
--new day--
2014-11-21 01:00 Fri Asia/Singapore SGT
2014-11-21 01:00 Fri Asia/Hong_Kong HKT
2014-11-21 02:00 Fri Asia/Tokyo JST
2014-11-21 03:00 Fri Australia/Brisbane EST

 Links to all tickets below can be found at: 

https://fedorahosted.org/fpc/report/12

= Followups =

#topic #382 Go Packaging Guidelines Draft
.fpc 382
https://fedorahosted.org/fpc/ticket/382

(more info. needed)
#topic #454 Bundling exception for php-phpoffice-phpexcel
.fpc 454
https://fedorahosted.org/fpc/ticket/454

(needed policy, feature not accepted yet)
#topic #466 recommend Privatedevices and PrivateNetwork in systemd
guidelines
.fpc 466
https://fedorahosted.org/fpc/ticket/466

(needinfo, just package dep?)
#topic #468 Temporary modernizr packing exception for kimchi
.fpc 468
https://fedorahosted.org/fpc/ticket/468

= New business =

#topic #469 Unified bootstrapping
.fpc 469
https://fedorahosted.org/fpc/ticket/469

= Open Floor = 

 For more complete details, please visit each individual ticket.  The
report of the agenda items can be found at:

https://fedorahosted.org/fpc/report/12


 If you would like to add something to this agenda, you can reply to
this e-mail, file a new ticket at https://fedorahosted.org/fpc,
e-mail me directly, or bring it up at the end of the meeting, during
the open floor topic. Note that added topics may be deferred until
the following meeting.
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5tFTW: Vote now for Council, F21 final freeze, screenshots needed, Fedora Atomic, and Mozilla/Firefox ads (2014-11-19)

[Matthew Miller]

Reposted from .

Fedora is a big project, and it’s hard to keep up with everything that
goes on. This series highlights interesting happenings in five
different areas every week. It isn’t comprehensive news coverage — just
quick summaries with links to each. Here are the five things for
November 19th, 2014:


Vote now in the first-ever Fedora Council elections!


The election for the two representative seats on the new Fedora
Council is in progress! Fedora Magazine has email-based interviews
with the five candidates to help you make an informed decision:

- Rex Dieter
- Haïkel Guémar
- Michael Scherer
- Pete Travis
- Langdon White

Voting is open to all Fedora Contributors, and closes promptly at 00:00
UTC on November 26th. That’s the afternoon or evening of the 25th in
timezones to the west of the Prime Meridian, so don’t delay — read the
interviews, and then vote now.

  * https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Council
  * 
http://fedoramagazine.org/council-elections-interview-with-rex-dieter-rdieter/
  * 
http://fedoramagazine.org/council-elections-interview-with-haikel-guemar-number80/
  * 
http://fedoramagazine.org/council-elections-interview-with-michael-scherer-misc/
  * 
http://fedoramagazine.org/council-elections-interview-with-pete-travis-randomuser/
  * 
http://fedoramagazine.org/council-elections-interview-with-langdon-white-langdon/
  * https://admin.fedoraproject.org/voting


We’re frozen for F21 final
--

We are now in the “Final Freeze” for Fedora, the last polishing period
before the release. This means that packages updates are only allowed
via a special exception process, as we work to deliver a solid, stable
release to our users on December 9th.

If you’re curious, you can read more on the wiki, or even better, as
*release candidates* come out, help the Fedora Quality Assurance
team take them through the validation process. You could be one of
Fedora 20’s Heroes of QA!

Or if not, that’s cool — just a few more weeks and we’ll release what
I’m confident will be the best Fedora yet.

  * http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Milestone_freezes
  * http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:SOP_compose_request#Release_candidates
  * http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/SOP_Release_Validation_Test_Event
  * 
https://kparal.wordpress.com/2013/07/03/the-heroes-of-fedora-19-final-testing/


Atomic Test Day
---

Speaking of testing… Fedora 21 will feature an experimental new cloud
image called Fedora Atomic, based on the Project Atomic patterns.
Tomorrow (Thursday — possibly *today* by the time you’re reading this!),
the Fedora Cloud SIG is running a test day for Fedora 21 Atomic,
looking specifically to get this into best possible shape for the
release.

  * http://www.projectatomic.io/
  * http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Cloud_SIG
  * http://fedoramagazine.org/fedora-21-atomic-test-day-this-thursday/


Screenshots needed!
---

Another easy way to help is to contribute to the Fedora 21 Screenshots
Library. Everything is pretty well explained at the link — install
the beta (or a release candidate), update it, and take some
screenshots.

> We’d particularly like screenshots that show new features in Fedora 21
> and that have an interesting composition. We need screenshots of
> Fedora 21 Workstation as well as each spin (KDE, Xfce, LXDE, etc.).

(And if you can figure out a good way to take a screenshot of Fedora
Cloud… awesome.)

  * https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F21_screenshots_library
  * http://fedoraproject.org/get-prerelease


Fedora and Mozilla advertising
--

In an effort to reduce funding reliance on search engine companies
(check it out — after 10 years, they just switched their default search
provider from Google to Yahoo), Mozilla just introduced a new thing
into Firefox which they call “enhanced tiles“, and this includes paid
advertisements by default. Compared to most web advertising, Mozilla is
certainly making efforts to be minimal about data collection — read
technical details, and Mozilla’s blog post about trust, transparency,
and control in advertising.

Nonetheless, many Fedora users and contributors have expressed concerns
about this, to varying degrees, in a long thread on the devel list. (As
always with monster threads, there’s really no need at this point to
add more unless you’ve definitely got something new and unique to say,
but new insights and constructive discussion are always welcome.) This
resulted in a few media reports suggesting that we’re going to drop
Firefox. The concerns are real — privacy, the implication of
endorsement *by Fedora*, and a dislike and distrust of advertising in
general. It seems likely that we’ll need to work on new policies, not
least so upstream project know what we expect — as ads seem to rule the
world today, this won’t be the last such situation. But we’re a long
way off from making any drastic

[Test-Announce] Fedora Atomic Test Day

[Mike Ruckman]

Greetings, all!

Tomorrow (or today for those of you not in North America) will be the first
Atomic Testday! The Fedora Atomic host is a new image designed to securely and
easily run Docker containers - all based on Project Atomic [0]. Because it's
new ground, testing is required for a successful release.

The Atomic image utilizes rpm-ostree [1] to allow you to update and revert your
installed package set just like a Git repo. This allows for easy upgrades and
an easy method of reverting back to a known good state should something go
wrong after an update.

Come join us for a day of testing and exploration into all Atomic offers for
running your containerized applications. Information on the testday can be
found on the Wiki [2] or drop by the #fedora-test-day channel on Freenode if
you have any questions.

See you tomorrow (or later today)!

[0] http://projectatomic.io
[1] https://github.com/projectatomic/rpm-ostree
[2] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2014-11-20_Atomic

-- 
// Mike 
--
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freenode: roshi
http://roshi.fedorapeople.org
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Re: Summary/Minutes from today's FESCo Meeting (2014-11-19)

[Till Maas]

On Wed, Nov 19, 2014 at 03:06:11PM -0500, Tomas Mraz wrote:

> * #1368 How to deal with F21 broken dependencies  (t8m, 19:08:56)
>   * AGREED: FESCo agrees to dropping the packages with broken
> dependencies listed in #1368 from both F21 and rawhide (+7, -0, 0:0)
> (t8m, 19:25:56)

I retired the packages now. To make sure the final repo does not
contain any packages with broken dependencies, the Freeze Exception
process needs to be used to get packages from updates-testing that do
not contain broken dependencies into the stable repo:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA:SOP_freeze_exception_bug_process

>   * AGREED: We will do the broken deps cleanup on Final Freeze from now
> on in the future Fedora releases (+8, -0, 0:0)  (t8m, 19:30:41)
>   * There will be warning sent to the affected maintainers at least 3
> weeks in advance  (t8m, 19:31:36)

What happens with packages that get broken after the warning but before
the Final Freeze?

Regards
Till
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