Re: Re: ACPI BIOS ERROR

[steve]

Le 07-12-2018, à 17:34:20 -0500, Tyler McLean a écrit :


  Having this same exact series of error messages on boot and the first time
  i press a key after boot. fresh debian install, latest BIOS. super
  annoying. did you ever resolve this?


No, I guess it's a firmware bug, so only chance is that the manufacturer
corrects it.

Sorry

after Stretch VLC is ugly

[Felmon Davis]

Greets!

I decided to upgrade from Jessie to Stretch last night. it seems to 
have worked though there are some oddities.


now VLC has grotesquely large control buttons ("Play," "Pause", etc.); 
the interface in general seems to run on a different 'theme' than 
before. the font size is ok.


I have tried the "forced window style" option under "preferences" but 
none of the various options affect the size of the control buttons. 
also looked at various 'skins' (awful!), no luck.


I have purged and re-installed VLC also to no avail. (used synaptic to 
catch various debris, VLC sprays all over the place.)


the only other application I've found which has undergone similar 
changes is Pan - the menu icons have a more 'pastel' look which I 
don't appreciate but otherwise it's ok. (I use a very limited set of 
'apps' so there may be surprises lurking.)


tried finding an older version. they seem geared to Ubuntu; tried 
compiling, got an error about not finding 'debus-1'; figured I didn't 
want to obsess my way into another rabbit-hole. however I'm happy to 
compile if that's the ticket.


note a complication: I had Devuan installed and just did the Stretch 
update on top of it. not sure of the relevance (thus I mention it).


I don't recall the version of VLC on Jessie; it's "3.0.3 Vetinari" 
here.


I am using Trinity Desktop which maintains a version of KDE3.

f.

--
Felmon Davis

[OT] Howto use an environment that doesn't make use of GL for basic tasks

[riveravaldez]

Hi,

I'm having random freezes on my debian-testing box (normal install,
fully updated, only fluxbox, no desktop environment) and asking on
Nouveau's mailing-list they recommended me this:

> Use an environment that doesn't make use of GL for basic tasks.

Any hint on how to do this on Debian? I'm not sure what they mean...

Thanks a lot!

* I guess I sent a previous mail by mistake (no subject), sorry

Re: after Stretch VLC is ugly

[Andrew McGlashan]

On 8/12/18 8:24 pm, Felmon Davis wrote:
> Greets!
> 
> I decided to upgrade from Jessie to Stretch last night. it seems to have
> worked though there are some oddities.

High DPI changes perhaps?

A.

Re: Non-GUI Arduino IDE ?

[Dan Purgert]

Jason wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 07, 2018 at 05:05:30PM -, Dan Purgert wrote:
>> Jason wrote:
>> > Does anyone know if there is a console based Arduino IDE available for 
>> > Debian? I am interested in making a portable programmer that could be 
>> > taken out on a job to edit and upload Arduino programs on site, without 
>> > messing with a mouse.
>> 
>> Don't know of any IDEs for the commandline, but you can always use
>> avrdude straight from the commandline to handle writing the compiled hex
>> to the thing.
>
> And what could I use to create the compiled hex?

Arduino IDE elsewhere -- I understood it as "I need to patch devices in
the field, after we made an enhancement in the office".


-- 
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5  4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281

Re: issues with stretch, part 1 of many

[Stefan Krusche]

Good day, Ionel,

Am Dienstag, 27. November 2018 schrieb Ionel Mugurel Ciobîcă:
> The first question I want to ask relates to ssh, ssh-ask and
> ssh-agent. When I ssh to another computer I am asked "Allow use of key
> id_rsa? Key fingerprint ..." If I uninstall all ssh-ask programs I
> simply can't use the ssh-agent anymore and I am prompted for password.
> I try ssh-ask, ssh-ask-fullscreen, ssh-ask-gnome and the similar from
> kde. I check the /etc/ssh/ssh_config and /etc/ssh/sshd_config for
> anything that may relate to this. The only think coming close are:
> UsePAM yes
> ChallengeResponseAuthentication no
>
> Is there something I overlook?
>
> To be clear, I do not want to be asked if I allow the use of a key, I
> just want this to be assumed yes, as it was the case in the past.

This is just a guess.  Maybe you are looking for this option 
in /etc/ssh/ssh_config:

#   StrictHostKeyChecking ask

The default is to ask, see above, copied from the (unchanged) file on my 
system.

man ssh_config(5):

StrictHostKeyChecking
 If this flag is set to yes, ssh(1) will never automatically add
 host keys to the ~/.ssh/known_hosts file, and refuses to connect
 to hosts whose host key has changed.  This provides maximum
 protection against trojan horse attacks, though it can be
 annoying when the /etc/ssh/ssh_known_hosts file is poorly
 maintained or when connections to new hosts are frequently made.
 This option forces the user to manually add all new hosts.  If
 this flag is set to no, ssh will automatically add new host keys
 to the user known hosts files.  If this flag is set to ask (the
 default), new host keys will be added to the user known host
 files only after the user has confirmed that is what they really
 want to do, and ssh will refuse to connect to hosts whose host
 key has changed.  The host keys of known hosts will be verified
 automatically in all cases.

If you configure ssh to ask, then, after you confirmed for one particular 
connection/key, this choice will be saved in ~/.ssh/known_hosts and you 
will not be asked again (until the key on the same server is changed).

Speculating again: when you installed your system, the file 
~/.ssh/known_hosts didn't contain the entries for the servers you usually 
connect to.  If that's the case, you can import/copy the ssh configuration 
from your old system to avoid being asked.

Hope this helps,
regards,
Stefan

Re: librecad

[John Hasler]

Gene writes:
> LinuxCNC depends on a low latency IRQ response.
> ...

We understand all that, and I understand and agree with the "If it aint
broke don't fix it" philosophy that leads to running "obsolete"
computers and software in machine controls.  What does it have to do
with the machine you run your CAD software on?
-- 
John Hasler 
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA

sending display to other monitor

[mick crane]

I can ssh into a debian PC from windows PC with putty and start a 
program to be displayed on monitor plugged into windows PC with Xming. 
Is possible ssh to debian PC and start program displayed on monitor 
plugged into debian PC ?


mick

--
Key ID4BFEBB31

Re: Setting up a chroot on a Jessie system to compile a program using sid

[rhkramer]

On Saturday, December 08, 2018 02:59:15 AM Alexander V. Makartsev wrote:
> You are over-complicating things. 

I can believe that ;-)

> You can build chroot in just a
> separate folder using debootstrap.

Ahh, ok, then that is almost surely what I'll try at least at first.

Looking ahead, if I later want to experiment with real VMs, do they need to be 
on separate partitions or can they also just be in separate folders?

And if they can be in separate folders, would there be any reason to consider 
putting them on separate partitions?

> chroot is not fully fledged VM in meaning of hardware abstraction. It is
> just a way to make files (executables, libraries, settings) inside a
> folder "/opt/chroot-sid-amd64/" *believe* they are in "/".
> So if you change some settings inside chroot "/etc/" they will actually
> be changed in "/opt/chroot-sid-amd64/etc/". This is why chroot is
> convenient to try things, install tons of -dev and dependency packages
> without cluttering or breaking actual working system.
> I recommend to read manuals for "debootstrap" and also "schroot" can
> make creating multiple chroot-ed environments more straight forward,
> eliminating the need to setup some settings manually, such as bind mount
> system partitions like "/sys" into chroot.

Re: sending display to other monitor

[Roberto C . Sánchez]

On Sat, Dec 08, 2018 at 01:38:21PM +, mick crane wrote:
> I can ssh into a debian PC from windows PC with putty and start a program to
> be displayed on monitor plugged into windows PC with Xming. Is possible ssh
> to debian PC and start program displayed on monitor plugged into debian PC ?
> 
Yes.

You have to use xming in Windows because Windows does not natively
support the X11 protocol.  However, any graphical environment you use on
Debian will natively support the X11 protocol.  So, all you need to do
is use a command like 'ssh -X ...' or 'ssh -Y ...'.  In most cases the
-X option is what you need, but -Y may be needed depending on the
server-side security settings.

Regards,

-Roberto

-- 
Roberto C. Sánchez

Re: Setting up a chroot on a Jessie system to compile a program using sid

[Roberto C . Sánchez]

On Sat, Dec 08, 2018 at 09:21:33AM -0500, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> Looking ahead, if I later want to experiment with real VMs, do they need to 
> be 
> on separate partitions or can they also just be in separate folders?
> 
Every VM solution that I can think of supports using disk image files.
In that case you would select a directory where you would place the disk
image files.  They also support using partitions for each VM.  However,
in my experience the best approach for using partitions is actually to
use LVM and create one or more logical volumes for each VM.  That is
what I do for my production systems.

> And if they can be in separate folders, would there be any reason to consider 
> putting them on separate partitions?
> 

In my experience, performance tends to be better with partitions than
with disk images.  However, with solid state disks, the performance
benefit is less noticeable.  So, it comes down which one is easier for
you to manage given how you manage the rest of your systems.

Regards,

-Roberto

-- 
Roberto C. Sánchez

Re: Setting up a chroot on a Jessie system to compile a program using sid

[Alexander V. Makartsev]

On 08.12.2018 19:21, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:
> Ahh, ok, then that is almost surely what I'll try at least at first.
>
> Looking ahead, if I later want to experiment with real VMs, do they need to 
> be 
> on separate partitions or can they also just be in separate folders?
>
> And if they can be in separate folders, would there be any reason to consider 
> putting them on separate partitions?
>
When you will be creating a real VM, let's assume by using KVM and GUI
program called "virt-manager", among the other settings, you will be
offered to choose a location folder and a file that will be used as
virtualized hard drive inside VM. Size of that file is also
customizable, so for an example you can create 4 such files 10Gb in size
each and inside running VM they will be seen as 4 separate physical 10Gb
HDDs.
Any real VM is basically consists of a hardware configuration profile
and a virtual hard drive image(s).

I can think of a few reasons when separating virtual hard drive images
on different physical disks could be useful, but in case of simple
experimentation with VMs there is no reason to do that. You can even
pile them up in one folder with different names and use them as is, as
long as you have free space on physical partition for them to expand.

-- 
With kindest regards, Alexander.

⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀ 
⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁ Debian - The universal operating system
⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋⠀ https://www.debian.org
⠈⠳⣄ 

Re: sending display to other monitor

[Jason]

On Sat, Dec 08, 2018 at 01:38:21PM +, mick crane wrote:
> I can ssh into a debian PC from windows PC with putty and start a program to
> be displayed on monitor plugged into windows PC with Xming. Is possible ssh
> to debian PC and start program displayed on monitor plugged into debian PC ?

I think this might do what you want: Before starting the program you 
want to display on the target device, run

DISPLAY=:0.0

Then run the program. It should display on the machine you ssh'ed into 
if I'm not mistaken.

-- 
Jason

Re: Setting up a chroot on a Jessie system to compile a program using sid

[Carl Fink]

On 12/8/18 9:21 AM, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:

On Saturday, December 08, 2018 02:59:15 AM Alexander V. Makartsev wrote:

You are over-complicating things.

I can believe that ;-)


You can build chroot in just a
separate folder using debootstrap.

Ahh, ok, then that is almost surely what I'll try at least at first.

Looking ahead, if I later want to experiment with real VMs, do they need to be
on separate partitions or can they also just be in separate folders?

And if they can be in separate folders, would there be any reason to consider
putting them on separate partitions?


chroot is not fully fledged VM in meaning of hardware abstraction. It is
just a way to make files (executables, libraries, settings) inside a
folder "/opt/chroot-sid-amd64/" *believe* they are in "/".
So if you change some settings inside chroot "/etc/" they will actually
be changed in "/opt/chroot-sid-amd64/etc/". This is why chroot is
convenient to try things, install tons of -dev and dependency packages
without cluttering or breaking actual working system.
I recommend to read manuals for "debootstrap" and also "schroot" can
make creating multiple chroot-ed environments more straight forward,
eliminating the need to setup some settings manually, such as bind mount
system partitions like "/sys" into chroot.

Most userland VMs are just (collections of) files, neither folders
nor partitions.

--
Carl Fink  c...@finknetwork.com
Thinking and logic and stuff at Reasonably Literate
http://reasonablyliterate.com

Re: Non-GUI Arduino IDE ?

[Jason]

On Sat, Dec 08, 2018 at 01:33:42PM +1100, Erik Christiansen wrote:
> On 07.12.18 16:42, Jason wrote:
> > On Fri, Dec 07, 2018 at 05:05:30PM -, Dan Purgert wrote:
> > > Jason wrote:
> > > > Does anyone know if there is a console based Arduino IDE available for 
> > > > Debian? I am interested in making a portable programmer that could be 
> > > > taken out on a job to edit and upload Arduino programs on site, without 
> > > > messing with a mouse.
> > > 
> > > Don't know of any IDEs for the commandline, but you can always use
> > > avrdude straight from the commandline to handle writing the compiled hex
> > > to the thing.
> > 
> > And what could I use to create the compiled hex?
> 
> The Arduino IDE uses the GNU toolchain behind the scenes. There are
> people who use the toolchain on the commandline, eschewing the GUI.
> Since the AVR crosscompiler and binutils will already be installed with
> the IDE, it is just a matter of editing sourcefiles with your favourite
> text editor, then running "make". If the IDE doesn't produce a makefile,
> instead using something nonstandard, you could look at the upthread
> link to Arduino-Makefile.
> 
> As I program AVRs directly (without bootloader), using avrdude, I had to
> check the manpage to see if it is compatible with the Arduino
> bootloader:
> 
> » The Arduino (which is very similar to the STK500 1.x) is supported via
>its own programmer type specification ``arduino''.
> «
> 
> That would presumably merely use a laptop USB port to interface to the
> Arduino target board.
> 
> It looks pretty straightforward, but reading a few of the hits for a google
> of "arduino gnu toolchain", it seems that after editing the source with
> e.g. vim or emacs, the Arduino IDE itself can be commandline invoked
> without any GUI:
> 
> » Alternatively, if any of the following command line options is given,
>   no graphical interface will be shown and instead a one-off verify
>   (compile) or upload will be done.
> «
> 
> https://github.com/arduino/Arduino/blob/master/build/shared/manpage.adoc
> 
> (I think that link has already been cited upthread.)

Indeed, it has been, and this looks to be the simplest option, using the 
Arduino IDE with command line options.

Thank you Joe, John Conover, Dan Purgert, deloptes, Linux-Fan, Cindy-Sue 
Causey, Erik Christiansen for your helpful ideas.

-- 
Jason

Re: [OT] Howto use an environment that doesn't make use of GL for basic tasks

[Dan Ritter]

riveravaldez wrote: 
> Hi,
> 
> I'm having random freezes on my debian-testing box (normal install,
> fully updated, only fluxbox, no desktop environment) and asking on
> Nouveau's mailing-list they recommended me this:
> 
> > Use an environment that doesn't make use of GL for basic tasks.
> 
> Any hint on how to do this on Debian? I'm not sure what they mean...

You're already doing that. GL isn't the problem unless you're
having non-random freezes when you fire up 3D applications.

Anything visible in your logs? Does it happen more often when
your machine has been on for a longer time?

What kind of hardware do you have?

-dsr-

Re: Setting up a chroot on a Jessie system to compile a program using sid

[David Christensen]

On 12/7/18 7:36 PM, rhkra...@gmail.com wrote:

This is sort of a continuation of the thread started with the post
"Recommendation for Virtual Machine and Instructions to set it up?"

(https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2018/12/msg00144.html)

Aside: the programmer has been able to send me a binary which does work on my
Jessie system, but, never-the-less, I plan to start experimenting with either
a chroot or VM environment to run either sid or a recent Ubuntu release so
that I can compile / build the binary myself.

The machine I want to do this on does not have any unallocated partitions /
disk space.  There are two partitions, currently used for other purposes, that
I could free up to use for the chroot (or, later, VM) by moving files around.

The Question:

One of the partitions I could free up is 16 GB, the other is 54 GB -- I'd
rather free up and use the smaller one, but I'm wondering if that will be big
enough?


To obtain consistent results when compiling software by multiple people 
on multiple computers with multiple operating system distributions/ 
flavors/ variants, I would suggest starting with a platform 
configuration management tool:


https://www.upguard.com/articles/the-7-configuration-management-tools-you-need-to-know


And then put your build system on top of that.


I would suggest putting your development jails, containers, VM's, 
bootable images, whatever, on a separate disk.



David

Re: after Stretch VLC is ugly

[Felmon Davis]

On Sat, 8 Dec 2018, Andrew McGlashan wrote:




On 8/12/18 8:24 pm, Felmon Davis wrote:

Greets!

I decided to upgrade from Jessie to Stretch last night. it seems to have
worked though there are some oddities.


High DPI changes perhaps?


DPI is set to 96.

f.

--
Felmon Davis

Re: librecad

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 December 2018 08:38:15 John Hasler wrote:

> Gene writes:
> > LinuxCNC depends on a low latency IRQ response.
> > ...
>
> We understand all that, and I understand and agree with the "If it
> aint broke don't fix it" philosophy that leads to running "obsolete"
> computers and software in machine controls.  What does it have to do
> with the machine you run your CAD software on?

Nothing John, except the vertical, even seemingly leaning toward the 
beginner, learning curve to really put that software to productive use. 
I've started to do something in freecad several times, I don't have it 
here anymore, but the lack of a plainly marked, multiple step undo gets 
me into a dead end box that results in a quit w/o save every time. Maybe 
its there, but I've not found it. If I build a tool changer for the 
biggest mill I have, I expect that I'll need to use its facility to 
couple moving parts to see if there's any interference between stuff 
just to remove the mistakes I'll no doubt make if I just write the gcode 
to generate the thing one part at a time.

Unfortunately, even the src.zip has disappeared from github.
But poking around I did find FreeCAD-master.zip, and its copying to ~/src 
right now. Looks like a pretty long list of dependencies from the wiki 
on building it. Couple pages if printed.  So we'll see if its still 
buildable on wheezy. And this is probably going to be a long process. So 
I'll send this and advise success/fail later.

Thanks John.

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: sending display to other monitor

[mick crane]

On 2018-12-08 16:10, Jason wrote:

On Sat, Dec 08, 2018 at 01:38:21PM +, mick crane wrote:
I can ssh into a debian PC from windows PC with putty and start a 
program to
be displayed on monitor plugged into windows PC with Xming. Is 
possible ssh
to debian PC and start program displayed on monitor plugged into 
debian PC ?


I think this might do what you want: Before starting the program you
want to display on the target device, run

DISPLAY=:0.0

Then run the program. It should display on the machine you ssh'ed into
if I'm not mistaken.


works
cheers
--
Key ID4BFEBB31

Re: librecad

[John Hasler]

Gene writes:
> I've started to do something in freecad several times, I don't have it
> here anymore, but the lack of a plainly marked, multiple step undo
> gets me into a dead end box that results in a quit w/o save every
> time.

I find that undoing one action at a time almost always suffices.  To
save myself when I get hopelessly befuddled I do checkpoint saves from
time to time.

Older releases of Freecad are here:

https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/releases

But why not build from source?

https://www.freecadweb.org/wiki/CompileOnUnix

I've found in the past that it builds quite easily on Debian.
-- 
John Hasler 
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA

Re: librecad

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 December 2018 14:42:06 John Hasler wrote:

> Gene writes:
> > I've started to do something in freecad several times, I don't have
> > it here anymore, but the lack of a plainly marked, multiple step
> > undo gets me into a dead end box that results in a quit w/o save
> > every time.
>
> I find that undoing one action at a time almost always suffices.  To
> save myself when I get hopelessly befuddled I do checkpoint saves from
> time to time.
>
> Older releases of Freecad are here:
>
> https://github.com/FreeCAD/FreeCAD/releases
>
> But why not build from source?
>
> https://www.freecadweb.org/wiki/CompileOnUnix
>
> I've found in the past that it builds quite easily on Debian.

Thats what I'm embarking on doing, building master from src. but the zip 
seems to be a problem, mc is unpacking it and copying to ~/src, doubling 
the 180 some megs of the zip, but with mc piping both, its watch paint 
dry slow, about 40 kilobytes/sec of 360+ megs of src. So its not yet 
done creating a source tree from the zip.  About 85% done when I last 
took a peek a minute ago.

Thanks John.

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: librecad

[John Hasler]

Gene writes:
> Thats what I'm embarking on doing, building master from src. but the
> zip seems to be a problem

That's doing it the hard way.  Use git as suggested here:

https://www.freecadweb.org/wiki/CompileOnUnix#Getting_the_source

It works.

-- 
John Hasler 
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA

Re: librecad

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 December 2018 15:22:36 John Hasler wrote:

> Gene writes:
> > Thats what I'm embarking on doing, building master from src. but the
> > zip seems to be a problem
>
> That's doing it the hard way.  Use git as suggested here:
>
> https://www.freecadweb.org/wiki/CompileOnUnix#Getting_the_source
>
> It works.

But its list of requires includes a bunch of 64 bit stuff. The wiki has 
an apt command to install all the dependencies, and I can't get that 
to work on a 32 bit install. It first can't find libvtk6.dev, remove 
that from the list and still get this bailout:

The following packages have unmet dependencies:
 libsimage-dev : Depends: libsndfile1-dev but it is not going to be installed
 libxerces-c-dev : Depends: libxerces-c3.1 (= 3.1.1-3+deb7u2) but 
3.1.1-3+deb7u5 is to be installed
 qt4-dev-tools : Depends: libqt4-declarative (= 4:4.8.2+dfsg-11) but 
4:4.8.6+git64-g5dc8b2b+dfsg-3~bpo70+1 is to be installed
 Depends: libqt4-help (= 4:4.8.2+dfsg-11) but 
4:4.8.6+git64-g5dc8b2b+dfsg-3~bpo70+1 is to be installed
 Depends: libqt4-network (= 4:4.8.2+dfsg-11) but 
4:4.8.6+git64-g5dc8b2b+dfsg-3~bpo70+1 is to be installed
 Depends: libqt4-sql (= 4:4.8.2+dfsg-11) but 
4:4.8.6+git64-g5dc8b2b+dfsg-3~bpo70+1 is to be installed
 Depends: libqt4-xml (= 4:4.8.2+dfsg-11) but 
4:4.8.6+git64-g5dc8b2b+dfsg-3~bpo70+1 is to be installed
 Depends: libqt4-xmlpatterns (= 4:4.8.2+dfsg-11) but 
4:4.8.6+git64-g5dc8b2b+dfsg-3~bpo70+1 is to be installed
 Depends: libqtcore4 (= 4:4.8.2+dfsg-11) but 
4:4.8.6+git64-g5dc8b2b+dfsg-3~bpo70+1 is to be installed
 Depends: libqtdbus4 (= 4:4.8.2+dfsg-11) but 
4:4.8.6+git64-g5dc8b2b+dfsg-3~bpo70+1 is to be installed
 Depends: libqtgui4 (= 4:4.8.2+dfsg-11) but 
4:4.8.6+git64-g5dc8b2b+dfsg-3~bpo70+1 is to be installed
 qtchooser : Breaks: qt4-dev-tools (<= 4:4.8.4+dfsg-1~) but 4:4.8.2+dfsg-11 is 
to be installed
E: Error, pkgProblemResolver::Resolve generated breaks, this may be caused by 
held packages.

It will take a bit of effort to resolve all that. Some of which may not be 
resolvable.


-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: librecad

[Jeremy Nicoll]

On Sat, 8 Dec 2018, at 18:59, Gene Heskett wrote:

> ... but the lack of a plainly marked, multiple step undo gets 
> me into a dead end box that results in a quit w/o save every time. 

I had a similar problem with a music-typesetting package under
Windows.

I guess a versioning file system (as discussed here fairly recently)
would help, but I don't have one.

Eventually I solved it with a script which examines a set of files 
(I specify a pattern for those) in the folder I'm working in.   When 
it starts and every few seconds (eg 10 secs) afterwards, it looks at
the files whose name matches that pattern.

For every file it finds for which there is not a corresponding backup
copy, it makes one.  A backup copy of a file has

(svd@mmdd-hhmmss)

appended to its extensionless leafname, where the date & time 
correspond to the time the backed-up file was last saved (not 
the time that this script saved the backup). 

So as soon as the script starts it makes a copy of each matching 
file (assuming none of those had prior backup copies) then 
whenever such a file changes and is written to disk again, another
backup is made.So eg 

Some song or other.pqr   could yield:
 
Some song or other (svd@20120716-184500).pqr 
Some song or other (svd@20120716-190723).pqr   etc   


I experimented with the monitor delay, and found (on a modern 
PC) when not using a filename pattern that matched huge numbers
of files, that there was no performance hit at all whether I looked at
the files every second or two or a good deal less often.  I made the
script pop-up a message box though when it had successfully made
a copy, and got into the habit of waiting for that confirmation every
time I'd just saved a file.

Rather than writing the script, what took longest to do was getting 
used to remembering to save the file(s) I was working on so often.
I used to keep detailed notes about I was doing to the musical score, 
as well, and stored the incrementally changing backup filenames in
the notes so it was easy to go back to previous points.

Not only was this useful for undoing my mistakes, it proved useful
for finding bugs in the typesetter AND being able to send the author
of that test files and 'what to do to recreate the problem' notes.  It
was quite often a day or two after I made some change to a file that
I found repercussions of that change, so notes (to help me find the
key files) were really important.


The script itself would run until stopped.  I controlled that by 
having each script generate a carefully-named flagfile and as soon
as that was deleted the corresponding script would stop.I could 
have multiple instances of the script running at once, and both the 
flagfiles and the typesetter (or whatever else) files were kept in folders 
visible from other machines/userids (all me though).  So flagfiles had 
in them

   - a representation of the monitored filename pattern
   - the monitor time interval
   - the machine name
   - the userid name
   - the time the script started
   - the pid under it was running

The pid was there so that when writing and testing the script
I could tell which was which in taskmanager, which saw them 
all as the same thing - an instance of the script language's 
interpreter being run.


The script is written in ooREXX; anyone who wants it can have
a copy.  I expect somethig similar could be written in loads of 
other langages, but it's the one I know best.

-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Unpacking a large zipfile, was Re: librecad

[David Wright]

On Sat 08 Dec 2018 at 15:01:11 (-0500), Gene Heskett wrote:
> Thats what I'm embarking on doing, building master from src. but the zip 
> seems to be a problem, mc is unpacking it and copying to ~/src, doubling 
> the 180 some megs of the zip, but with mc piping both, its watch paint 
> dry slow, about 40 kilobytes/sec of 360+ megs of src. So its not yet 
> done creating a source tree from the zip.  About 85% done when I last 
> took a peek a minute ago.

Unpacking a zipfile containing a large number of files with mc is a
really bad idea. For example, a 5245 file zip with 199 subdirectories
took unzip about 34 seconds to unpack. mc took over 16 minutes.
Why? Because it ran over 5245 uzip processes, one after the other.
Stick to using it to inspect zipfiles and perhaps unzipping just the
odd file or two.

Cheers,
David.

Re: librecad

[John Hasler]

The latest Freecad version claims to have a robust undo-redo stack.  I
haven't really put it to the test yet, though.

Even infinite undo does not always suffice.  You may not remember
exactly when and how you went off the rails, or you may have other
reasons to want to look back.  version control is the answer, and I just
discovered that there is an add-on for exactly that:

https://www.freecadweb.org/wiki/Arch_Git
-- 
John Hasler 
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA

Re: automating reactions to file system changes

[David Christensen]

On 12/8/18 3:55 PM, Roberto C. Sánchez wrote:

On Sat, Dec 08, 2018 at 03:48:56PM -0800, David Christensen wrote:

On Linux, the inotify(7) is an alternative to polling:

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inotify


Specifically, I have had very good success with incron.


Yes, incrond(8) and incrontab(5) look very appealing -- all you need is 
a shell script that accomplishes your goal; the C systems programming is 
taken care of for you.



David

Re: automating reactions to file system changes

[Jeremy Nicoll]

On Sat, 8 Dec 2018, at 23:49, David Christensen wrote:

> On Linux, the inotify(7) is an alternative to polling:
> 
>  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inotify

Windows has event-driven ways to do this too, (one can]
google for, for example, WMI and PowerShell event-based
scripts)... but I'd have had to learn a whole lot more to do 
it that way.

What I wanted was an immediate solution to get me 
through a nightmare in music typesetting, not an excuse
to learn another programming language and more 
about Windows internals.

If the simple approach had been horrendously 
inefficient, I might have looked for a better method, 
but the overhead of doing it the way I did was negligible.

-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Re: Non-GUI Arduino IDE ?

[Ryan Nowakowski]

I'm a big fan of platform IO
https://platformio.org/

It's not really an IDE, but instead a bunch of command line tools that replace 
the functions of the Arduino IDE.

On December 7, 2018 10:28:48 AM CST, Jason  wrote:
>Does anyone know if there is a console based Arduino IDE available for 
>Debian? I am interested in making a portable programmer that could be 
>taken out on a job to edit and upload Arduino programs on site, without
>
>messing with a mouse.
>
>Thanks,
>-- 
>Jason

Re: after Stretch VLC is ugly

[Liam O'Toole]

On 2018-12-08, Felmon Davis  wrote:
> Greets!
>
> I decided to upgrade from Jessie to Stretch last night. it seems to 
> have worked though there are some oddities.
>
> now VLC has grotesquely large control buttons ("Play," "Pause", etc.); 
> the interface in general seems to run on a different 'theme' than 
> before. the font size is ok.
>

[...]

> note a complication: I had Devuan installed and just did the Stretch 
> update on top of it. not sure of the relevance (thus I mention it).

Me neither, but it does muddy the waters somewhat.

>
> I don't recall the version of VLC on Jessie; it's "3.0.3 Vetinari" 
> here.

You have upgraded from vlc2 to vlc3, and from qt4 to qt5.

>
> I am using Trinity Desktop which maintains a version of KDE3.

Meanwhile, kde3 uses qt3. It may be that qt4 had better backward
compatibility than qt5. Have you tried running vlc3 in another desktop
environment?

Re: librecad

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 December 2018 17:53:01 Jeremy Nicoll wrote:
[...]
> The pid was there so that when writing and testing the script
> I could tell which was which in taskmanager, which saw them
> all as the same thing - an instance of the script language's
> interpreter being run.
>
I can see where that could, if you "got your head" around it, be pretty 
handy. But half or more of my gcode mistakes are typu's. And the rs274D 
interpretor is very VERY good at recommending you learn to type. ;-)

> The script is written in ooREXX; anyone who wants it can have
> a copy.  I expect somethig similar could be written in loads of
> other langages, but it's the one I know best.

Back when we did most of our scripting on amiga's, ARexx was the language 
to top all the rest, but then when we got tired of the instability, and 
I went to linux, where I found that neither Rexx nor Regina could get 
past line 2 of any of my utilities without barfing all over itself as 
neither of the "next gen" rexx's weren't anything like ARexx, which Bill 
Hawes never got a damned dime from commode door for writing it, but it 
had calls into every facility amigados had, so there weren't any fences 
between what you wanted it to do, and what you could do. So I fell back 
to bash. And while the bash docs are at least 250 pages, its not ARexx. 
But it handles the coupling between fetchmail/procmail and kmail, so I 
have virtually nothing to but reply and send, and hit the plus key to 
read the next message. Computers are to reduce one's work, not multiply 
it times 15. Call me lazy, but it "works for me".. 

-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: librecad

[John Hasler]

If you want to move on from REXX look at Tcl.
-- 
John Hasler 
jhas...@newsguy.com
Elmwood, WI USA

Re: librecad

[Jeremy Nicoll]

On Sun, 9 Dec 2018, at 01:47, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Saturday 08 December 2018 17:53:01 Jeremy Nicoll wrote:
> [...]
> > The pid was there so that when writing and testing the script
> > I could tell which was which in taskmanager, which saw them
> > all as the same thing - an instance of the script language's
> > interpreter being run.
> >
> I can see where that could, if you "got your head" around it, be pretty 
> handy. But half or more of my gcode mistakes are typu's. And the rs274D 
> interpretor is very VERY good at recommending you learn to type. ;-)

In the music typesetting thing, one of the BIG problems was that a
sequence of things done via its GUI (obviously) changed the file, but
apart from my errors, bugs in the software meant that a session 
reloaded from a previously-saved file didn't always behave as the 
edit session where one had made the changes behaved.

I haven't used it for a while but I'm sorely tempted to learn how to use
another system [Philip Hazel (of Exim & PCRE)'s PMW], where plain text
files are interpreted to create PostScript scores.   I think that the non-
GUI approach suits me better.


> > The script is written in ooREXX

> Back when we did most of our scripting on amiga's, ARexx was the language 
> to top all the rest...

Most of my REXX was written on MVS (now z/OS) systems and was what's 
commonly called 'Classic REXX', somewhat predating even ANSI REXX.  On
a PC, I use ooREXX but nearly none of its oo capabilities - one can write 
code that's very similar to Classic non-oo REXX.

> Computers are to reduce one's work, not multiply  it times 15. Call me 
> lazy, but it "works for me"..

I'm no longer wholly enthusiastic about learning completely new things
(because of chronic illness) but I keep meaning to try to get to grips with 
Linux... which is why I lurk here.   If and when I do, I expect to keep using 
ooREXX.

-- 
Jeremy Nicoll - my opinions are my own.

Re: librecad

[Gene Heskett]

On Saturday 08 December 2018 21:10:13 John Hasler wrote:

> If you want to move on from REXX look at Tcl.

Linuxcnc uses a bunch of that in its gui's, which it has several flavors 
of,



-- 
Cheers, Gene Heskett
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
Genes Web page 

Re: after Stretch VLC is ugly [SOLVED]

[Felmon Davis]

On Sun, 9 Dec 2018, Liam O'Toole wrote:


On 2018-12-08, Felmon Davis  wrote:

Greets!

I decided to upgrade from Jessie to Stretch last night. it seems to
have worked though there are some oddities.

now VLC has grotesquely large control buttons ("Play," "Pause", etc.);
the interface in general seems to run on a different 'theme' than
before. the font size is ok.



[...]


note a complication: I had Devuan installed and just did the Stretch
update on top of it. not sure of the relevance (thus I mention it).


Me neither, but it does muddy the waters somewhat.



I don't recall the version of VLC on Jessie; it's "3.0.3 Vetinari"
here.


You have upgraded from vlc2 to vlc3, and from qt4 to qt5.



I am using Trinity Desktop which maintains a version of KDE3.


Meanwhile, kde3 uses qt3. It may be that qt4 had better backward
compatibility than qt5. Have you tried running vlc3 in another desktop
environment?


I think you are right about qt problems and you propose a nice test 
but, happily, it is now somewhat moot.


I did a smarter google search and found a solution; the following 
environment string does it:


export QT_AUTO_SCREEN_SCALE_FACTOR=0

for persistence across boots it's advised to put this in:

/etc/profile.d/gnome-qt.sh

I haven't tested this yet.

I want to thank all contributors to this thread! it helps to have the 
support with trouble-shooting and solving.


I have a problem with the menu items in OpenOffice being invisible 
unless the mouse crosses over them but may open a different thread. 
wonder if it is a related issue.


f.

--
Felmon Davis

automating reactions to file system changes

[David Christensen]

On 12/8/18 2:53 PM, Jeremy Nicoll wrote:> On Sat, 8 Dec 2018, at 18:59,
Gene Heskett wrote:



... but the lack of a plainly marked, multiple step undo gets me
into a dead end box that results in a quit w/o save every time.


I had a similar problem with a music-typesetting package under 
Windows.


I guess a versioning file system (as discussed here fairly recently) 
would help, but I don't have one.


Eventually I solved it with a script which examines a set of files (I
specify a pattern for those) in the folder I'm working in.   When it
starts and every few seconds (eg 10 secs) afterwards, it looks at the
files whose name matches that pattern.

For every file it finds for which there is not a corresponding
backup copy, it makes one.

On Linux, the inotify(7) is an alternative to polling:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inotify


David

Re: automating reactions to file system changes

[Roberto C . Sánchez]

On Sat, Dec 08, 2018 at 03:48:56PM -0800, David Christensen wrote:
> On Linux, the inotify(7) is an alternative to polling:
> 
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inotify

Specifically, I have had very good success with incron.

Regards,

-Roberto

-- 
Roberto C. Sánchez