proposal: upload to the collab-maint repo orphaned packages
Hi, maybe I'm proposing something obvious or already attempted in the past here, ... but let's try anyway! In order to spread the adagio that ``every DD is Debian QA'', what about uploading to the collab-maint subversion repository on alioth [1] all the orphaned packages which lack a collaborative maintenance repository of their own? (of course then advertising the fact via the appropriate Vcs-* fields) This way every DD would be able to commit to the package giving some help, no matter how small it will be. Comments? If there are no objections, what would be the appropriate place to document this QA best practice? (So yes, it is possible that it is already this way, but I haven't found the relevant docs ...) Cheers. [1] http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/collab-maint/ -- Stefano Zacchiroli -*- PhD in Computer Science ... now what? [EMAIL PROTECTED],debian.org,bononia.it} -%- http://www.bononia.it/zack/ (15:56:48) Zack: e la demo dema ?/\All one has to do is hit the (15:57:15) Bac: no, la demo scema\/right keys at the right time signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: proposal: upload to the collab-maint repo orphaned packages
Stefano Zacchiroli wrote: Hi, maybe I'm proposing something obvious or already attempted in the past here, ... but let's try anyway! In order to spread the adagio that ``every DD is Debian QA'', what about uploading to the collab-maint subversion repository on alioth [1] all the orphaned packages which lack a collaborative maintenance repository of their own? (of course then advertising the fact via the appropriate Vcs-* fields) This way every DD would be able to commit to the package giving some help, no matter how small it will be. Comments? It's in my opinion not a good idea to promote orphaned packages. If an orphaned package is worth keeping, it should find a maintainer easily. Else it should be marked for removal, not added to the collab-maint svn repository IMHO. What you propose is more or less adoption of all orphaned packages by everyone and no one in particular... My view on orphaned packages is not that everyone is co-maintainer of an orphaned package, but that there is at the moment no person wanting to maintain it... Every DD is Debian QA by fixing bugs (especially RC ones) ;-) Cheers Luk -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: proposal: upload to the collab-maint repo orphaned packages
On Fri, Aug 17, 2007 at 04:45:51PM +0200, Luk Claes wrote: > It's in my opinion not a good idea to promote orphaned packages. If an > orphaned package is worth keeping, it should find a maintainer easily. Else > it should be marked for removal, not added to the collab-maint svn > repository IMHO. Agreed. But ... it happened to me in the past that I was willing to fix a couple of bugs in an orphaned package but not to take over its maintenance. I guess it's a pretty common scenario. In those cases having it already in collab-maint would have eased my work. What's harmful in that? Besides, the proposal is not against your proposed course of actions: - if we find a maintainer she will have already the package in a repository, it would be enough to change the Maintainer name in debian/control and start working - if we don't, we can request the package removal, in such a case would it be a big deal to have package sources left over in collab-maint? I don't think so > What you propose is more or less adoption of all orphaned packages by > everyone and no one in particular... My view on orphaned packages is not Well, no. I'm just proposing a technical solution to ease working on orphaned packages, I'm not affecting (or at least it's not my intention, nor the foreseeable future I imagine) in any way how long a package would remain in the orphaned status, not what are the consequences of being in that status. Cheers. -- Stefano Zacchiroli -*- PhD in Computer Science ... now what? [EMAIL PROTECTED],debian.org,bononia.it} -%- http://www.bononia.it/zack/ (15:56:48) Zack: e la demo dema ?/\All one has to do is hit the (15:57:15) Bac: no, la demo scema\/right keys at the right time signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: proposal: upload to the collab-maint repo orphaned packages
On Fri, Aug 17, 2007 at 07:12:50PM +0200, Raphael Hertzog wrote: > The typical QA scenario is "apt-get source", hack, debuild, dput. > Precisely because the usual QA worker doesn't care enough about the > package, it's a one-shot work. So the reference is the archive itself and > the SVN in the middle is of very few help. > > I already proposed what your describe 2 years ago at the QA meeting (with > adn and sukria): > Slide: > http://meetings-archive.debian.net/pub/debian-meetings/2005/qa-meeting-darmstadt/slides/2005-09-11_Collaborative-maintenance-by-external-contributors_Alexis-Sukrieh+Raphael-Hertzog+Mohammed-Adnene-Trojette/collab-maint.pdf For the moment I've only had the time to read the slide, I'll postpone the .ogg. But indeed my proposal is exactly the same as yours ... and actually your slides contradict what you're claiming above. I guess that's because the discussion after the talk made you change your mind, right? Anyhow, before following the past live discussion I'm still convinced it's a good idea for precisely the reasons you mentioned (playground for contributors, ability to commit for non-DDs, VCS support [e.g. history]) and also for others like the ability to easily work in a batch manner on a set of orphaned packages. I'll come back to this after having watched the discussion. > I'd rather not pollute the collab-maint repo too much with old crap. If we > really want this, we can have a dedicated qa-packages repository. Regarding this. It seems to me that the 2 subdirs in collab-maint orphaned/ and ext-maint/ actually contain packages, so I deduce that the idea is being used in practice. Or is it just old stuff no longer used nor encouraged? Can I check in there orphaned packages I want to work on or is this discouraged? > Using a SCM is not easing our QA work because precisely there's very few > coordination to do... I don't remember any conflict of work on orphaned > packages. See the comment above, a VCS can do a lot more for us than simply helping with coordination. Cheers. -- Stefano Zacchiroli -*- PhD in Computer Science ... now what? [EMAIL PROTECTED],debian.org,bononia.it} -%- http://www.bononia.it/zack/ (15:56:48) Zack: e la demo dema ?/\All one has to do is hit the (15:57:15) Bac: no, la demo scema\/right keys at the right time signature.asc Description: Digital signature
Re: proposal: upload to the collab-maint repo orphaned packages
On Fri, 17 Aug 2007, Stefano Zacchiroli wrote: > But ... it happened to me in the past that I was willing to fix a couple > of bugs in an orphaned package but not to take over its maintenance. I > guess it's a pretty common scenario. In those cases having it already in > collab-maint would have eased my work. What's harmful in that? The typical QA scenario is "apt-get source", hack, debuild, dput. Precisely because the usual QA worker doesn't care enough about the package, it's a one-shot work. So the reference is the archive itself and the SVN in the middle is of very few help. I already proposed what your describe 2 years ago at the QA meeting (with adn and sukria): Slide: http://meetings-archive.debian.net/pub/debian-meetings/2005/qa-meeting-darmstadt/slides/2005-09-11_Collaborative-maintenance-by-external-contributors_Alexis-Sukrieh+Raphael-Hertzog+Mohammed-Adnene-Trojette/collab-maint.pdf Video: http://meetings-archive.debian.net/pub/debian-meetings/2005/qa-meeting-darmstadt/good-quality/ogg_theora/2005-09-11_Collaborative-maintenance-by-external-contributors_Alexis-Sukrieh+Raphael-Hertzog+Mohammed-Adnene-Trojette.ogg You can see by yourself the discussions. :) > - if we don't, we can request the package removal, in such a case would > it be a big deal to have package sources left over in collab-maint? I > don't think so I'd rather not pollute the collab-maint repo too much with old crap. If we really want this, we can have a dedicated qa-packages repository. > Well, no. I'm just proposing a technical solution to ease working on > orphaned packages, I'm not affecting (or at least it's not my intention, > nor the foreseeable future I imagine) in any way how long a package > would remain in the orphaned status, not what are the consequences of > being in that status. Using a SCM is not easing our QA work because precisely there's very few coordination to do... I don't remember any conflict of work on orphaned packages. Cheers, -- Raphaël Hertzog Premier livre français sur Debian GNU/Linux : http://www.ouaza.com/livre/admin-debian/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: proposal: upload to the collab-maint repo orphaned packages
On Fri, 17 Aug 2007, Stefano Zacchiroli wrote: > For the moment I've only had the time to read the slide, I'll postpone > the .ogg. But indeed my proposal is exactly the same as yours ... and > actually your slides contradict what you're claiming above. I guess > that's because the discussion after the talk made you change your mind, > right? Yes. > Anyhow, before following the past live discussion I'm still convinced > it's a good idea for precisely the reasons you mentioned (playground for > contributors, ability to commit for non-DDs, VCS support [e.g. > history]) and also for others like the ability to easily work in a batch > manner on a set of orphaned packages. But where are the non-DD contributors that work on orphaned packages? There are very few of them and in the case when we have someone, I'd rather make them DM of those packages over time instead of using such an infrastructure. > > I'd rather not pollute the collab-maint repo too much with old crap. If we > > really want this, we can have a dedicated qa-packages repository. > > Regarding this. It seems to me that the 2 subdirs in collab-maint > orphaned/ and ext-maint/ actually contain packages, so I deduce that the > idea is being used in practice. Or is it just old stuff no longer used > nor encouraged? Can I check in there orphaned packages I want to work on > or is this discouraged? ext-maint is used by non-DD packagers right. But those packages are not orphaned. For those in the oprhaned directory I have no idea what they are. I haven't checked. Cheers, -- Raphaël Hertzog Premier livre français sur Debian GNU/Linux : http://www.ouaza.com/livre/admin-debian/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
