Re: unsubscribe
___ / Duane Cone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: | I have done this 10 times >>> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] Maybe you can try to send the mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] insteed of [EMAIL PROTECTED] ! Have a nice day, -- Arnaud Vandyck - OpenPGP: 0xEEB6B4C2 -- «Les eurodéputés veulent durcir les lois sur les prothèses mammaires.» (entendu sur France-Info) pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: pgp 2.6.3i vs pgp5i vs gnupgp
Kevin Rosenberg (2003-03-20 12:40:17 -0700) : > Roland Mas wrote: >> It works flawlessly, and it allows me to have my GnuPG private >> key on exactly zero machine, only on this USB key thing (don't >> worry, I also have backups). I have recently added SSH to the same >> scheme. Protects me from thieves, although not from trojaning. I >> assessed the risks :-) > > I do the same. Additionally, I use the Debian cryptoapi and > cryptoloop kernel modules to encrypt the USB drive. I think the > chance of losing such a portable, small device is significant. With > encryption, I feel better about the possibility. I'm wondering whether this brings any additional security. Isn't the GPG private key stored in an encrypted form already? Or do the cryptoloop and cryptoapi modules offer more than 128-bit encryption? Roland. -- Roland Mas Au royaume des aveugles, les borgnes sont mal vus. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Thursday 20 March 2003 21:30, Barry deFreese wrote: > > Thank you for the advice it is much appreciated. I should have gone a > little futher in my background. I have done quite a bit of > "programming". I learned FORTRAN/77, Basic on VMS, and Cobol on VMS in > college. I have written in VB, VBScript, JavaScript. In fact part of > my "job" today is writing Active Server Pages. So I have some of the > "concepts" down to a degree. I will definetely check into the books and > such you have suggested. However, two of my fundamental problems are > thus: I don't learn a great deal from reading unfortunately. I am > pretty much a hands on guy with a background in networking and > infrastructure stuff. Two ( too Chad's point ) the problem is, is that > when I have an enlightenment, I guess I get intimidated because the > things that I want to do are well above my skillsets. I want to write > kernel level stuff when I'm lucky to write my name!! :-) (Somewhat of a > chicken before the egg type of syndrome I suppose). I don't want to > walk into flying, I want to fly into flying!! :-) > in my experience as a programmer each time I truly learned something and reached that next plateau it was because something in work or hobby forced me to stretch that extra mile. Sometimes it is like having your bones broken so they can reset properly -- it always hurts and scares you. Then suddenly -- WHAMO -- the next time you are confronted with a big problem it does not seem as big. programming is like growing up. You crawl, then stumble, then walk and finally you run. Sometimes you learn to swim or mountain climb and these seem unrelated. Then the extra muscle / tone / fitness you gain helps you out in other ways. In physical engineering if you mess up you may destroy precious materials or otherwise impact the world. With a computer the only real cost is time. Remember, we learn more from our mistakes than our triumphs. Skin a knee, scrape your knuckles, break a bone. You'll be a better programmer for it. Finally I would like to comment on the book recommendations. These are spot on. If you look at the collections of people who have programmed for a while and take it seriously they tend to have books about thought processes, the act of programming and the like. These often outnumber the language specific texts 2 or 3 to 1. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Thu, Mar 20, 2003 at 09:30:49PM -0800, Barry deFreese wrote: > Thank you for the advice it is much appreciated. I should have gone a > little futher in my background. I have done quite a bit of > "programming". I learned FORTRAN/77, Basic on VMS, and Cobol on VMS in > college. I have written in VB, VBScript, JavaScript. In fact part of > my "job" today is writing Active Server Pages. So I have some of the > "concepts" down to a degree. I will definetely check into the books and You should try a functional language for a change :))) (but then, this is biased advice, i am the ocaml maintainer after all). Friendly, Sven Luther -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On 20030320T214958-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > I highly recommend putting aside the IP-address-configuration stuff for > the moment and consider becoming a better programmer computer-science > wise. Get your principles down; that's more important. If you want to > move beyond simple stuff you have to learn these things. Programming is a skill and an art. The most important thing is to practice it with as much vigor as one can. Theory is important, sure, but one should not study it instead of practical work, it has to supplement it. If you restrict yourself to the teory, you are not a programmer. -- %%% Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho % [EMAIL PROTECTED] % http://www.iki.fi/gaia/ %%% Taiteellisen ohjelmoinnin ystävien seura Toys - Ohjelmointi on myös taidetta http://www.cc.jyu.fi/yhd/toys/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
| >The first is looking to other people for problems to be solved. You'll | >never find the inspiration in solving problems that don't affect you. | >Since you don't feel the itch, you don't get much satisfaction from the | >scratch. Greetings, I agree whole-heartedly. Find a program/package that you actually use that doesn't work quite the way you want it too. This can be a messy configuration or from function overload or you think that you just plain do it better. For example, I've somewhat recently been working on a fetchmail/getmail replacement. I think that fetchmail suffers from function overload; and getmail, written in python, can be slow. I wanted a quick and simple POP3 tool. I have written a tool called gathermail to be just that. It's, IMHO, 621 lines of straightforward, well(?) documented C code that does just what RFC 1939 says to do. I'm not entirely happy with it, but I'm getting there. In short, find something that doesn't work and fix it. HTH, Brooks -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
May I temporarily move away a conffile of a conflicting package?
Hello, For a complete discusssion see http://bugs.debian.org/183357 Currently the exim4-packages cannot provide /usr/sbin/exim (only /usr/sbin/exim4) because exim v3's init script up to version 3.36-4 uses something aequivalent to this to check whether it should do anything: [ -x /usr/sbin/exim ] || exit. If you had exim v3 uninstalled (but not purged) and installed exim v4 and it contained /usr/sbin/exim both init-scripts would try to run a daemon. THe ame applies to the cron-snippets. The exim3 init script in sid has already been changed to use another test that recognizes exim v3 properly but this doesn't help the users who will upgrade from woody to sarge (when it is stable), switching directly to exim v4 without installing eximv3 from sarge first. This leaves me with these possibilties: * don't ship /usr/sbin/exim in sarge, wait for sarge+1. I'd rather not do that because it'll take imho at least another two and a half years. * do something unclean. See below. Idea: * postinst configure 1 When eximv4 is installed check whether eximv3 conffiles using the bad test are installed, otherwise goto end 2 move the respective file to $file.exim4disabled and generate a new $file that says "This file has been temporarily renamed, see $file.exim4disabled." * postrm uninstall: if [ -e $file.exim4disabled ] && md5sum shows it is not changed if [ -e $file ] # exim v3 has still not been purged mv $file.exim4disabled $file else # exim v3 has been purged rm $file.exim4disabled fi else do nothing. Is this allowed? Yes[ ]No[ ] Is this too fragile Yes[ ]No[ ] Better ideas? I won't add a debconf question "May I temporarily move" because imho _either_ my proposal is good enough anyway and there is no use asking *another* useless question _or_ if it not allowed I would have to use priority high and default to no. thanks for reading, cu andreas -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Thu, Mar 20, 2003 at 09:30:49PM -0800, Barry deFreese wrote: > > I will definetely check into the books and such you have suggested. > However, two of my fundamental problems are thus: I don't learn a great > deal from reading unfortunately. I am pretty much a hands on guy with a > background in networking and infrastructure stuff. I am of a similar temperment. I never read a non-fiction book if I can avoid it (with the exception of ancient historians and philosophers). I get by quite well just picking up a little at a time, and what I do pick up I really understand. > Two ( too Chad's point ) the problem is, is that when I have an > enlightenment, I guess I get intimidated because the things that I want > to do are well above my skillsets. I want to write kernel level stuff > when I'm lucky to write my name!! :-) (Somewhat of a chicken before the > egg type of syndrome I suppose). I don't want to walk into flying, I > want to fly into flying!! :-) As the angel Gabriel said: Fear not! First of all, you mustn't be afraid of throwing away code. Write it, and if it sucks, rewrite it. Again and again. Every time you do this, you'll learn something, at least, if you pay attention to what you're doing. And don't worry about This doesn't mean you shouldn't think before you code (you should), but that you shouldn't _not_ code because you aren't sure that you're doing it right. Rewriting something is almost always easier than writing it the first time was (says I, who just rewrote the card display code in my bridge game twice in the last week--maybe two weeks). Secondly don't worry about wasting time on a project that you drop later. You will have learned from it. I spent three or four months a couple years back working on a recipe database program, which I later decided was crud (it really was, although I did use it for a few months to print out my shopping lists). This wasn't a waste of time, as I gained an understanding of writing GUIs and learned a bit of SQL, and more importantly learned more about databases. Thirdly, don't be afraid to start a project that you don't know enough to finish. Learn as you go. The best way to learn to do anything (well, almost anything--don't try this with airplane piloting), is to do it. With most of the projects I've worked on, I started out by learning either a language or a GUI library (or something else equally complicated) just for that project. Finally, I want to reiterate what someone else said, which is that you need to work on a project that you want to use. -- David Roundy http://www.abridgegame.org -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
out-of-date-standards-version 3.5.6
I'm not Debian developer but I maintain few packages outside. Main package is rox (ROX-Filer). Some time ago new version (3.5.9) of Debian policy came out and version 3.5.6 is marked as 'out of date'. After checking upgrading-checklist.txt I don't know clearly if I can bump it or not - can someone get a look at this package? APT: deb http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/sarge/ deb http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/sid/ deb-src http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/src/ Package name: rox Version : 1.3.7 License : GNU Public Licence Upstream Author : Thomas Leonard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Upstream URL: http://rox.sf.net/ Package APT : http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/sid/ Package APT/SRC : http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/src/ NM status : none GPG key ID : ED1F 99E1 45B0 ABE9 17E9 0ED1 B31F F326 F0E6 5735 Description : a simple graphical file manager for X11 Long description: ROX-Filer is a simple and easy to use graphical file manager for X11, the windowing system used on Unix and Unix-like operating systems. It is also the core component of the ROX Desktop: http://rox.sourceforge.net Invoking rox opens each directory or file listed, or the current working directory if no arguments are given. -- WWW: http://www.hrw.one.pl/ APT: deb http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/sid/ Vi has two modes: the one in which it beeps, and the one in which it doesn't. -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 03:21:35PM +0200, Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho wrote: > On 20030320T214958-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > > I highly recommend putting aside the IP-address-configuration stuff for > > the moment and consider becoming a better programmer computer-science > > wise. Get your principles down; that's more important. If you want to > > move beyond simple stuff you have to learn these things. > > Programming is a skill and an art. The most important thing is to > practice it with as much vigor as one can. Theory is important, sure, > but one should not study it instead of practical work, it has to > supplement it. If you restrict yourself to the teory, you are not a > programmer. Neither of the programming books I recommended restrict themselves to the theory. -- ; Matthew Danish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; OpenPGP public key: C24B6010 on keyring.debian.org ; Signed or encrypted mail welcome. ; "There is no dark side of the moon really; matter of fact, it's all dark." -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On 20030321T123756-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > Neither of the programming books I recommended restrict themselves to > the theory. Reading books is theory, regardless of what they cover. -- %%% Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho % [EMAIL PROTECTED] % http://www.iki.fi/gaia/ %%% Taiteellisen ohjelmoinnin ystävien seura Toys - Ohjelmointi on myös taidetta http://www.cc.jyu.fi/yhd/toys/ -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
> -Original Message- > From: Sven Luther [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 1:18 AM > To: Barry deFreese > Cc: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]' > Subject: Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration > > > On Thu, Mar 20, 2003 at 09:30:49PM -0800, Barry deFreese wrote: > > Thank you for the advice it is much appreciated. I should > have gone a > > little futher in my background. I have done quite a bit of > > "programming". I learned FORTRAN/77, Basic on VMS, and > Cobol on VMS in > > college. I have written in VB, VBScript, JavaScript. In > fact part of > > my "job" today is writing Active Server Pages. So I have > some of the > > "concepts" down to a degree. I will definetely check into > the books and > > You should try a functional language for a change :))) > > (but then, this is biased advice, i am the ocaml maintainer > after all). > > Friendly, > > Sven Luther > I'm certainly not opposed to learning anything, unfortunately I was "raised" in the M$ world and it currently pays my bills. Though I have actually written a few RPG programs on the AS/400 also - Yuck!!! :-) Barry deFreese Technology Services Manager Nike Team Sports (949)-616-4005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Technology doesn't make you less stupid; it just makes you stupid faster." Jerry Gregoire - Former CIO at Dell -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho wrote: > On 20030321T123756-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > >>Neither of the programming books I recommended restrict themselves to >>the theory. > Reading books is theory, regardless of what they cover. Reading man pages, too, unless you want to practice using man. In my limited experience, most people that fail or perform poorly at programming tasks do so due to lack of theoretical understanding. I fully agree that only reading doesn't gain you much, but the same can be said about the most theoretical aspects of mathematics, too. (Well at least for regular users.) After one does understand, implement and trace trough all algorithms in Knuth's TAOCP, one is bound to have some experience, too. That said, experience certainly is invaluable, too, but that's a second step. Cheers T. pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
RE: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
> -Original Message- > From: Thomas Viehmann [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 11:06 AM > To: Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho > Cc: debian-mentors > Subject: Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration > > In my limited experience, most people that fail or perform > poorly at programming > tasks do so due to lack of theoretical understanding. > I fully agree that only reading doesn't gain you much, but > the same can be said > about the most theoretical aspects of mathematics, too. (Well > at least for > regular users.) After one does understand, implement and > trace trough all > algorithms in Knuth's TAOCP, one is bound to have some > experience, too. > > That said, experience certainly is invaluable, too, but > that's a second step. > > Cheers > > T. > I notice that many of you have mentioned Knuth. Are all of you talking specifically about "The Art of Computer Programming" volumes? Thanks again!! Barry deFreese Technology Services Manager Nike Team Sports (949)-616-4005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Technology doesn't make you less stupid; it just makes you stupid faster." Jerry Gregoire - Former CIO at Dell -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 08:14:26PM +0200, Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho wrote: > On 20030321T123756-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > > Neither of the programming books I recommended restrict themselves to > > the theory. > > Reading books is theory, regardless of what they cover. Indeed, I am recommending learning some theory. Do you consider exercises in programming to be merely theory, as well, though? Your statement, as is, is absolute nonsense. I am assuming the existence of initiative in the reader. PAIP teaches you good solid programming practice through example. The examples are interesting programs, not some obscure mathematical formulae. (Othello player, Scheme compiler, Eliza, line diagram labelling, to name a few). If you don't learn, you're going to make the same mistakes that were made before. These books guide you through exercises which allow you to learn important principles and will help to catch your mistakes. If you read them all the way through without actually doing some actual programming yourself, you've lost half their value. -- ; Matthew Danish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; OpenPGP public key: C24B6010 on keyring.debian.org ; Signed or encrypted mail welcome. ; "There is no dark side of the moon really; matter of fact, it's all dark." -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: General programming questions list?
On Mon, Mar 17, 2003 at 03:41:11PM -0600, Drew Scott Daniels wrote: > Where should I post general programming questions? What are some good > (interactive) resources? I'm still reading the required and suggested new > maintainer's documentation, so forgive me if it's pointed out somewhere. I apologize for not answering your actual question, but the C++ FAQ-lite is excellent. http://www.parashift.com/c++-faq-lite/ There is a section on operator overloading. -- - mdz -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
> I notice that many of you have mentioned Knuth. Are all of you talking > specifically about "The Art of Computer Programming" volumes? Yes. It's the classic on algorithms. However, recall Mark Twain's definition of a classic: A classic is something that everyone wants to have read and nobody wants to read. -- Mark Twain, "The Disappearance of Literature" Specifically TAOCP has an extremely condensed style and a lot of stuff (e.g. most of volume two) makes very interesting reading, but probably is not considered compulsory by most people. Also, I disagree that his MIX is optimal choice of a language to express algorithms in. (To quote my favorite c.s. professor "pure would have been better".) In summary, TAOCP is a book for people who like math and theory. If you want a book about algorithms, and I strongly believe that anyone should have read something, you're probably better off with [CLR] or [S]. IMHO the first provides more insight, but the latter might be easier to read. (Usually, I recommend Sedgewick's book to high-school students, also because it has a German translation, and the other if I get asked at university. But then the language barrier isn't a problem for you.) If you prefer a book on programming more specifically, then you might try something like the open book "How To Think Like A Computer Scientist" (found for various languages at google), or if that is too basic, Bruce Eckel's online books [E]. (Only browsed them, though.) Depending on what you're looking for, I can happily recommend other books on my shelf, but knowledge, I'd start talking about computer algebra or statiscal learning theory next, and that might be somewhat off the point unless you have specific interests. Though with the recent use of baysian spam classification, anyone should have read... never mind. Cheers T. CLR: Cormen, Leiserson, Rivest: Introduction to Algorithms, MIT Press S: Sedgewick, Algorithms, Addison-Wesley, also as Algorithms in You-Name-It E: http://www.mindview.net/Books pgp0.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 02:23:30PM -0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 08:14:26PM +0200, Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho wrote: > > On 20030321T123756-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > > > Neither of the programming books I recommended restrict themselves to > > > the theory. > > > > Reading books is theory, regardless of what they cover. > > Indeed, I am recommending learning some theory. Do you consider > exercises in programming to be merely theory, as well, though? Your > statement, as is, is absolute nonsense. I am assuming the existence of > initiative in the reader. > This reminds me of a very good book that is now out of print "Etudes for Programmers" by Charles Wetherell. I can't find it online. And, as the only copy I ever saw was a oversize trade paperback, it may be hard to get a copy of. A good academic library might have it, though. Jim Penny -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: joining Debian / packaging buildd
Jeremy Lainé <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > You might be interested in > > http://www.whinlatter.uklinux.net/buildd/ > > Definitely, I'm looking through it right now. > > > You should probably subscribe to buildd-discuss at nocrew.org. > > Done, and browsing through the archives I see I'm going pretty much > the same way as you as I also rely on autoconf/automake and have moved > to debhelper. I've uploaded (or will upload shortly) a new version to the above URL. This includes a number of changes, and removes andrea and rbuilder, and updates sbuild to the apt-patched version in common use. I've not yet included the debconf patch you sent, since I'm not at all knowledeable about it, and I'm also going to alter the conffiles in the future, which would break it. I was also not happy about generating the .global conffiles--these are not supposed to be changed by the user (the .local or non-suffixed version should be used instead; buildd uses a per-user conffile). Regards, Roger -- Roger Leigh Printing on GNU/Linux? http://gimp-print.sourceforge.net/ GPG Public Key: 0x25BFB848 available on public keyservers -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Question about ITP and where to go first
Hello, I have been working on packaging libgdsl (the general data structures library), and am almost finished packaging it, and I have permission from its author. I'm unsure exactly what to do next, however, because it is unclear. Am I supposed to file an ITP bug against WNPP? Or should I find a sponsor first? (it seems that I should have one before applying to be a new maintainer). The documentation is a little unclear as to the order of things, what am I supposed to do next? Morgon -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
> -Original Message- > From: Thomas Viehmann [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 12:16 PM > To: deFreese, Barry > Cc: debian-mentors > Subject: Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration > > > > I notice that many of you have mentioned Knuth. Are all of > you talking > > specifically about "The Art of Computer Programming" volumes? > Yes. It's the classic on algorithms. > > However, recall Mark Twain's definition of a classic: > A classic is something that everyone wants to have read > and nobody wants to read. > -- Mark Twain, "The Disappearance of Literature" > > Specifically TAOCP has an extremely condensed style and a lot > of stuff (e.g. > most of volume two) makes very interesting reading, but > probably is not > considered compulsory by most people. Also, I disagree that > his MIX is optimal > choice of a language to express algorithms in. (To quote my > favorite c.s. > professor "pure would have been better".) In summary, TAOCP > is a book for people > who like math and theory. > > > > Cheers > > T. > > CLR: Cormen, Leiserson, Rivest: Introduction to Algorithms, MIT Press > S: Sedgewick, Algorithms, Addison-Wesley, also as Algorithms > in You-Name-It > E: http://www.mindview.net/Books > Hehe, I got the company to buy all three volumes!! Suckers!! :-) Barry deFreese Technology Services Manager Nike Team Sports (949)-616-4005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Technology doesn't make you less stupid; it just makes you stupid faster." Jerry Gregoire - Former CIO at Dell -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: unsubscribe
___ / Duane Cone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: | I have done this 10 times >>> To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>> with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] Maybe you can try to send the mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] insteed of [EMAIL PROTECTED] ! Have a nice day, -- Arnaud Vandyck - OpenPGP: 0xEEB6B4C2 -- «Les eurodéputés veulent durcir les lois sur les prothèses mammaires.» (entendu sur France-Info) pgpJMn2NCEORT.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: pgp 2.6.3i vs pgp5i vs gnupgp
Kevin Rosenberg (2003-03-20 12:40:17 -0700) : > Roland Mas wrote: >> It works flawlessly, and it allows me to have my GnuPG private >> key on exactly zero machine, only on this USB key thing (don't >> worry, I also have backups). I have recently added SSH to the same >> scheme. Protects me from thieves, although not from trojaning. I >> assessed the risks :-) > > I do the same. Additionally, I use the Debian cryptoapi and > cryptoloop kernel modules to encrypt the USB drive. I think the > chance of losing such a portable, small device is significant. With > encryption, I feel better about the possibility. I'm wondering whether this brings any additional security. Isn't the GPG private key stored in an encrypted form already? Or do the cryptoloop and cryptoapi modules offer more than 128-bit encryption? Roland. -- Roland Mas Au royaume des aveugles, les borgnes sont mal vus.
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Thursday 20 March 2003 21:30, Barry deFreese wrote: > > Thank you for the advice it is much appreciated. I should have gone a > little futher in my background. I have done quite a bit of > "programming". I learned FORTRAN/77, Basic on VMS, and Cobol on VMS in > college. I have written in VB, VBScript, JavaScript. In fact part of > my "job" today is writing Active Server Pages. So I have some of the > "concepts" down to a degree. I will definetely check into the books and > such you have suggested. However, two of my fundamental problems are > thus: I don't learn a great deal from reading unfortunately. I am > pretty much a hands on guy with a background in networking and > infrastructure stuff. Two ( too Chad's point ) the problem is, is that > when I have an enlightenment, I guess I get intimidated because the > things that I want to do are well above my skillsets. I want to write > kernel level stuff when I'm lucky to write my name!! :-) (Somewhat of a > chicken before the egg type of syndrome I suppose). I don't want to > walk into flying, I want to fly into flying!! :-) > in my experience as a programmer each time I truly learned something and reached that next plateau it was because something in work or hobby forced me to stretch that extra mile. Sometimes it is like having your bones broken so they can reset properly -- it always hurts and scares you. Then suddenly -- WHAMO -- the next time you are confronted with a big problem it does not seem as big. programming is like growing up. You crawl, then stumble, then walk and finally you run. Sometimes you learn to swim or mountain climb and these seem unrelated. Then the extra muscle / tone / fitness you gain helps you out in other ways. In physical engineering if you mess up you may destroy precious materials or otherwise impact the world. With a computer the only real cost is time. Remember, we learn more from our mistakes than our triumphs. Skin a knee, scrape your knuckles, break a bone. You'll be a better programmer for it. Finally I would like to comment on the book recommendations. These are spot on. If you look at the collections of people who have programmed for a while and take it seriously they tend to have books about thought processes, the act of programming and the like. These often outnumber the language specific texts 2 or 3 to 1.
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Thu, Mar 20, 2003 at 09:30:49PM -0800, Barry deFreese wrote: > Thank you for the advice it is much appreciated. I should have gone a > little futher in my background. I have done quite a bit of > "programming". I learned FORTRAN/77, Basic on VMS, and Cobol on VMS in > college. I have written in VB, VBScript, JavaScript. In fact part of > my "job" today is writing Active Server Pages. So I have some of the > "concepts" down to a degree. I will definetely check into the books and You should try a functional language for a change :))) (but then, this is biased advice, i am the ocaml maintainer after all). Friendly, Sven Luther
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On 20030320T214958-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > I highly recommend putting aside the IP-address-configuration stuff for > the moment and consider becoming a better programmer computer-science > wise. Get your principles down; that's more important. If you want to > move beyond simple stuff you have to learn these things. Programming is a skill and an art. The most important thing is to practice it with as much vigor as one can. Theory is important, sure, but one should not study it instead of practical work, it has to supplement it. If you restrict yourself to the teory, you are not a programmer. -- %%% Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho % [EMAIL PROTECTED] % http://www.iki.fi/gaia/ %%% Taiteellisen ohjelmoinnin ystävien seura Toys - Ohjelmointi on myös taidetta http://www.cc.jyu.fi/yhd/toys/
RE: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
| >The first is looking to other people for problems to be solved. You'll | >never find the inspiration in solving problems that don't affect you. | >Since you don't feel the itch, you don't get much satisfaction from the | >scratch. Greetings, I agree whole-heartedly. Find a program/package that you actually use that doesn't work quite the way you want it too. This can be a messy configuration or from function overload or you think that you just plain do it better. For example, I've somewhat recently been working on a fetchmail/getmail replacement. I think that fetchmail suffers from function overload; and getmail, written in python, can be slow. I wanted a quick and simple POP3 tool. I have written a tool called gathermail to be just that. It's, IMHO, 621 lines of straightforward, well(?) documented C code that does just what RFC 1939 says to do. I'm not entirely happy with it, but I'm getting there. In short, find something that doesn't work and fix it. HTH, Brooks
May I temporarily move away a conffile of a conflicting package?
Hello, For a complete discusssion see http://bugs.debian.org/183357 Currently the exim4-packages cannot provide /usr/sbin/exim (only /usr/sbin/exim4) because exim v3's init script up to version 3.36-4 uses something aequivalent to this to check whether it should do anything: [ -x /usr/sbin/exim ] || exit. If you had exim v3 uninstalled (but not purged) and installed exim v4 and it contained /usr/sbin/exim both init-scripts would try to run a daemon. THe ame applies to the cron-snippets. The exim3 init script in sid has already been changed to use another test that recognizes exim v3 properly but this doesn't help the users who will upgrade from woody to sarge (when it is stable), switching directly to exim v4 without installing eximv3 from sarge first. This leaves me with these possibilties: * don't ship /usr/sbin/exim in sarge, wait for sarge+1. I'd rather not do that because it'll take imho at least another two and a half years. * do something unclean. See below. Idea: * postinst configure 1 When eximv4 is installed check whether eximv3 conffiles using the bad test are installed, otherwise goto end 2 move the respective file to $file.exim4disabled and generate a new $file that says "This file has been temporarily renamed, see $file.exim4disabled." * postrm uninstall: if [ -e $file.exim4disabled ] && md5sum shows it is not changed if [ -e $file ] # exim v3 has still not been purged mv $file.exim4disabled $file else # exim v3 has been purged rm $file.exim4disabled fi else do nothing. Is this allowed? Yes[ ]No[ ] Is this too fragile Yes[ ]No[ ] Better ideas? I won't add a debconf question "May I temporarily move" because imho _either_ my proposal is good enough anyway and there is no use asking *another* useless question _or_ if it not allowed I would have to use priority high and default to no. thanks for reading, cu andreas
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Thu, Mar 20, 2003 at 09:30:49PM -0800, Barry deFreese wrote: > > I will definetely check into the books and such you have suggested. > However, two of my fundamental problems are thus: I don't learn a great > deal from reading unfortunately. I am pretty much a hands on guy with a > background in networking and infrastructure stuff. I am of a similar temperment. I never read a non-fiction book if I can avoid it (with the exception of ancient historians and philosophers). I get by quite well just picking up a little at a time, and what I do pick up I really understand. > Two ( too Chad's point ) the problem is, is that when I have an > enlightenment, I guess I get intimidated because the things that I want > to do are well above my skillsets. I want to write kernel level stuff > when I'm lucky to write my name!! :-) (Somewhat of a chicken before the > egg type of syndrome I suppose). I don't want to walk into flying, I > want to fly into flying!! :-) As the angel Gabriel said: Fear not! First of all, you mustn't be afraid of throwing away code. Write it, and if it sucks, rewrite it. Again and again. Every time you do this, you'll learn something, at least, if you pay attention to what you're doing. And don't worry about This doesn't mean you shouldn't think before you code (you should), but that you shouldn't _not_ code because you aren't sure that you're doing it right. Rewriting something is almost always easier than writing it the first time was (says I, who just rewrote the card display code in my bridge game twice in the last week--maybe two weeks). Secondly don't worry about wasting time on a project that you drop later. You will have learned from it. I spent three or four months a couple years back working on a recipe database program, which I later decided was crud (it really was, although I did use it for a few months to print out my shopping lists). This wasn't a waste of time, as I gained an understanding of writing GUIs and learned a bit of SQL, and more importantly learned more about databases. Thirdly, don't be afraid to start a project that you don't know enough to finish. Learn as you go. The best way to learn to do anything (well, almost anything--don't try this with airplane piloting), is to do it. With most of the projects I've worked on, I started out by learning either a language or a GUI library (or something else equally complicated) just for that project. Finally, I want to reiterate what someone else said, which is that you need to work on a project that you want to use. -- David Roundy http://www.abridgegame.org
out-of-date-standards-version 3.5.6
I'm not Debian developer but I maintain few packages outside. Main package is rox (ROX-Filer). Some time ago new version (3.5.9) of Debian policy came out and version 3.5.6 is marked as 'out of date'. After checking upgrading-checklist.txt I don't know clearly if I can bump it or not - can someone get a look at this package? APT: deb http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/sarge/ deb http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/sid/ deb-src http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/src/ Package name: rox Version : 1.3.7 License : GNU Public Licence Upstream Author : Thomas Leonard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Upstream URL: http://rox.sf.net/ Package APT : http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/sid/ Package APT/SRC : http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/src/ NM status : none GPG key ID : ED1F 99E1 45B0 ABE9 17E9 0ED1 B31F F326 F0E6 5735 Description : a simple graphical file manager for X11 Long description: ROX-Filer is a simple and easy to use graphical file manager for X11, the windowing system used on Unix and Unix-like operating systems. It is also the core component of the ROX Desktop: http://rox.sourceforge.net Invoking rox opens each directory or file listed, or the current working directory if no arguments are given. -- WWW: http://www.hrw.one.pl/ APT: deb http://www.hrw.one.pl/ apt/sid/ Vi has two modes: the one in which it beeps, and the one in which it doesn't.
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 03:21:35PM +0200, Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho wrote: > On 20030320T214958-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > > I highly recommend putting aside the IP-address-configuration stuff for > > the moment and consider becoming a better programmer computer-science > > wise. Get your principles down; that's more important. If you want to > > move beyond simple stuff you have to learn these things. > > Programming is a skill and an art. The most important thing is to > practice it with as much vigor as one can. Theory is important, sure, > but one should not study it instead of practical work, it has to > supplement it. If you restrict yourself to the teory, you are not a > programmer. Neither of the programming books I recommended restrict themselves to the theory. -- ; Matthew Danish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; OpenPGP public key: C24B6010 on keyring.debian.org ; Signed or encrypted mail welcome. ; "There is no dark side of the moon really; matter of fact, it's all dark."
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On 20030321T123756-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > Neither of the programming books I recommended restrict themselves to > the theory. Reading books is theory, regardless of what they cover. -- %%% Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho % [EMAIL PROTECTED] % http://www.iki.fi/gaia/ %%% Taiteellisen ohjelmoinnin ystävien seura Toys - Ohjelmointi on myös taidetta http://www.cc.jyu.fi/yhd/toys/
RE: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
> -Original Message- > From: Sven Luther [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 1:18 AM > To: Barry deFreese > Cc: 'debian-mentors@lists.debian.org' > Subject: Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration > > > On Thu, Mar 20, 2003 at 09:30:49PM -0800, Barry deFreese wrote: > > Thank you for the advice it is much appreciated. I should > have gone a > > little futher in my background. I have done quite a bit of > > "programming". I learned FORTRAN/77, Basic on VMS, and > Cobol on VMS in > > college. I have written in VB, VBScript, JavaScript. In > fact part of > > my "job" today is writing Active Server Pages. So I have > some of the > > "concepts" down to a degree. I will definetely check into > the books and > > You should try a functional language for a change :))) > > (but then, this is biased advice, i am the ocaml maintainer > after all). > > Friendly, > > Sven Luther > I'm certainly not opposed to learning anything, unfortunately I was "raised" in the M$ world and it currently pays my bills. Though I have actually written a few RPG programs on the AS/400 also - Yuck!!! :-) Barry deFreese Technology Services Manager Nike Team Sports (949)-616-4005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Technology doesn't make you less stupid; it just makes you stupid faster." Jerry Gregoire - Former CIO at Dell
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho wrote: > On 20030321T123756-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > >>Neither of the programming books I recommended restrict themselves to >>the theory. > Reading books is theory, regardless of what they cover. Reading man pages, too, unless you want to practice using man. In my limited experience, most people that fail or perform poorly at programming tasks do so due to lack of theoretical understanding. I fully agree that only reading doesn't gain you much, but the same can be said about the most theoretical aspects of mathematics, too. (Well at least for regular users.) After one does understand, implement and trace trough all algorithms in Knuth's TAOCP, one is bound to have some experience, too. That said, experience certainly is invaluable, too, but that's a second step. Cheers T. pgpZnvBlXagBU.pgp Description: PGP signature
RE: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
> -Original Message- > From: Thomas Viehmann [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 11:06 AM > To: Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho > Cc: debian-mentors > Subject: Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration > > In my limited experience, most people that fail or perform > poorly at programming > tasks do so due to lack of theoretical understanding. > I fully agree that only reading doesn't gain you much, but > the same can be said > about the most theoretical aspects of mathematics, too. (Well > at least for > regular users.) After one does understand, implement and > trace trough all > algorithms in Knuth's TAOCP, one is bound to have some > experience, too. > > That said, experience certainly is invaluable, too, but > that's a second step. > > Cheers > > T. > I notice that many of you have mentioned Knuth. Are all of you talking specifically about "The Art of Computer Programming" volumes? Thanks again!! Barry deFreese Technology Services Manager Nike Team Sports (949)-616-4005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Technology doesn't make you less stupid; it just makes you stupid faster." Jerry Gregoire - Former CIO at Dell
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 08:14:26PM +0200, Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho wrote: > On 20030321T123756-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > > Neither of the programming books I recommended restrict themselves to > > the theory. > > Reading books is theory, regardless of what they cover. Indeed, I am recommending learning some theory. Do you consider exercises in programming to be merely theory, as well, though? Your statement, as is, is absolute nonsense. I am assuming the existence of initiative in the reader. PAIP teaches you good solid programming practice through example. The examples are interesting programs, not some obscure mathematical formulae. (Othello player, Scheme compiler, Eliza, line diagram labelling, to name a few). If you don't learn, you're going to make the same mistakes that were made before. These books guide you through exercises which allow you to learn important principles and will help to catch your mistakes. If you read them all the way through without actually doing some actual programming yourself, you've lost half their value. -- ; Matthew Danish <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ; OpenPGP public key: C24B6010 on keyring.debian.org ; Signed or encrypted mail welcome. ; "There is no dark side of the moon really; matter of fact, it's all dark."
Re: General programming questions list?
On Mon, Mar 17, 2003 at 03:41:11PM -0600, Drew Scott Daniels wrote: > Where should I post general programming questions? What are some good > (interactive) resources? I'm still reading the required and suggested new > maintainer's documentation, so forgive me if it's pointed out somewhere. I apologize for not answering your actual question, but the C++ FAQ-lite is excellent. http://www.parashift.com/c++-faq-lite/ There is a section on operator overloading. -- - mdz
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
> I notice that many of you have mentioned Knuth. Are all of you talking > specifically about "The Art of Computer Programming" volumes? Yes. It's the classic on algorithms. However, recall Mark Twain's definition of a classic: A classic is something that everyone wants to have read and nobody wants to read. -- Mark Twain, "The Disappearance of Literature" Specifically TAOCP has an extremely condensed style and a lot of stuff (e.g. most of volume two) makes very interesting reading, but probably is not considered compulsory by most people. Also, I disagree that his MIX is optimal choice of a language to express algorithms in. (To quote my favorite c.s. professor "pure would have been better".) In summary, TAOCP is a book for people who like math and theory. If you want a book about algorithms, and I strongly believe that anyone should have read something, you're probably better off with [CLR] or [S]. IMHO the first provides more insight, but the latter might be easier to read. (Usually, I recommend Sedgewick's book to high-school students, also because it has a German translation, and the other if I get asked at university. But then the language barrier isn't a problem for you.) If you prefer a book on programming more specifically, then you might try something like the open book "How To Think Like A Computer Scientist" (found for various languages at google), or if that is too basic, Bruce Eckel's online books [E]. (Only browsed them, though.) Depending on what you're looking for, I can happily recommend other books on my shelf, but knowledge, I'd start talking about computer algebra or statiscal learning theory next, and that might be somewhat off the point unless you have specific interests. Though with the recent use of baysian spam classification, anyone should have read... never mind. Cheers T. CLR: Cormen, Leiserson, Rivest: Introduction to Algorithms, MIT Press S: Sedgewick, Algorithms, Addison-Wesley, also as Algorithms in You-Name-It E: http://www.mindview.net/Books pgpCp55HUd9vu.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 02:23:30PM -0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > On Fri, Mar 21, 2003 at 08:14:26PM +0200, Antti-Juhani Kaijanaho wrote: > > On 20030321T123756-0500, Matthew Danish wrote: > > > Neither of the programming books I recommended restrict themselves to > > > the theory. > > > > Reading books is theory, regardless of what they cover. > > Indeed, I am recommending learning some theory. Do you consider > exercises in programming to be merely theory, as well, though? Your > statement, as is, is absolute nonsense. I am assuming the existence of > initiative in the reader. > This reminds me of a very good book that is now out of print "Etudes for Programmers" by Charles Wetherell. I can't find it online. And, as the only copy I ever saw was a oversize trade paperback, it may be hard to get a copy of. A good academic library might have it, though. Jim Penny
Re: joining Debian / packaging buildd
Jeremy Lainé <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > > You might be interested in > > http://www.whinlatter.uklinux.net/buildd/ > > Definitely, I'm looking through it right now. > > > You should probably subscribe to buildd-discuss at nocrew.org. > > Done, and browsing through the archives I see I'm going pretty much > the same way as you as I also rely on autoconf/automake and have moved > to debhelper. I've uploaded (or will upload shortly) a new version to the above URL. This includes a number of changes, and removes andrea and rbuilder, and updates sbuild to the apt-patched version in common use. I've not yet included the debconf patch you sent, since I'm not at all knowledeable about it, and I'm also going to alter the conffiles in the future, which would break it. I was also not happy about generating the .global conffiles--these are not supposed to be changed by the user (the .local or non-suffixed version should be used instead; buildd uses a per-user conffile). Regards, Roger -- Roger Leigh Printing on GNU/Linux? http://gimp-print.sourceforge.net/ GPG Public Key: 0x25BFB848 available on public keyservers
Question about ITP and where to go first
Hello, I have been working on packaging libgdsl (the general data structures library), and am almost finished packaging it, and I have permission from its author. I'm unsure exactly what to do next, however, because it is unclear. Am I supposed to file an ITP bug against WNPP? Or should I find a sponsor first? (it seems that I should have one before applying to be a new maintainer). The documentation is a little unclear as to the order of things, what am I supposed to do next? Morgon
RE: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration
> -Original Message- > From: Thomas Viehmann [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, March 21, 2003 12:16 PM > To: deFreese, Barry > Cc: debian-mentors > Subject: Re: [OT] A question for programmers - Inspiration > > > > I notice that many of you have mentioned Knuth. Are all of > you talking > > specifically about "The Art of Computer Programming" volumes? > Yes. It's the classic on algorithms. > > However, recall Mark Twain's definition of a classic: > A classic is something that everyone wants to have read > and nobody wants to read. > -- Mark Twain, "The Disappearance of Literature" > > Specifically TAOCP has an extremely condensed style and a lot > of stuff (e.g. > most of volume two) makes very interesting reading, but > probably is not > considered compulsory by most people. Also, I disagree that > his MIX is optimal > choice of a language to express algorithms in. (To quote my > favorite c.s. > professor "pure would have been better".) In summary, TAOCP > is a book for people > who like math and theory. > > > > Cheers > > T. > > CLR: Cormen, Leiserson, Rivest: Introduction to Algorithms, MIT Press > S: Sedgewick, Algorithms, Addison-Wesley, also as Algorithms > in You-Name-It > E: http://www.mindview.net/Books > Hehe, I got the company to buy all three volumes!! Suckers!! :-) Barry deFreese Technology Services Manager Nike Team Sports (949)-616-4005 [EMAIL PROTECTED] "Technology doesn't make you less stupid; it just makes you stupid faster." Jerry Gregoire - Former CIO at Dell
