Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers
If you skip the part where I wasted a lot of time and effort when I tried to remove the old transducer with a hammer, and go straight to the holesaw method, it is a 5 minute job and really not that hard. I would not bother trying to use the very old transducer. Bill Bina On 11/25/2015 10:27 PM, Eric Frank via CnC-List wrote: I am replacing depth, speed and wind instruments on Cat’s Paw with i50 and i60 Raymarine instruments. As noted in an ongoing thread, it is difficult to remove the old depth transducer, so is it possible to use the old one with the new Raymarine display? The old transducer is for a Signet Scientific MK172 instrument, which is probably more than 12 years old but still works fine. In the manual, it states that “The transmitter produces six pulses per second at an amplitude of 450 volts peak·to·peak with 63 watts of power output per pulse. The high power output is obtained by charging a large capacitor to build a large current flow without heavy drain from the external power source. The frequency is adjustable from 160 to 200 kHz but is set at the factory for 200 kHz nominal.” The transducer that came with the Raymarine instruments is an Airmar P319, listed on the tag on its cable as 50/200 KHz. That transducer also measures temperature, but I would be happy to forgo that if I didn’t have to change the transducer. Is there a way of testing if the old transducer works with the new display while the boat is on the hard (for the winter)? What happens if you test a transducer when it is completely out of water? Would it harm the Raymarine instrument to be connected to the old transducer? Eric Frank Cat's Paw C&C 35 Mk II Mattapoisett, MA ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers
I will second that. Last year I installed i50/i60 to replace the old B&G 1000 system on the boat. It was difficult but not impossible and really not all that long a time to remove the old transducers. There is usually a flange on the exterior which I cut under with a sharp knife and then I slowly pried them out. Along with the prying from outside I also placed a block of wood over the edge of transducer inside and tapped (rather hard tapping) with a hammer. They came out without damage to either transducer or the boat. After removal I subsequently found out that the transducers themselves were only 2 or three years old despite the instruments being antiques. Oh well. The holes on the old transducers were smaller than those for the new ones. I screwed a block of thin plywood in place on the interior to act as a guide for the drill bit on hole saw and then drilled out the larger hole. Had I left the old transducers in place then likely the transducer itself could have been used for the drill bit of the hole saw Note that the hull is a whole lot tougher than the transducers. Also note that you tend not to change engine oil and leave in old filter so why would you add nice new instruments and use old transducers that may be prone to failure other than as a way to avoid hauling a boat to do the work? BTW. Old and especially old and non functioning instruments on a boat are a pet peeve of mine. The original owners of these boats spent a lot of time and money to outfit the boats properly and it is the least we can do when buying a nice boat for a fraction of its actual worth to treat the old gals properly. Same goes for 30 year old sails. Mike Persistence 1987 Frers 33 Halifax, NS -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Bill Bina via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2015 7:47 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Bill Bina Subject: Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers If you skip the part where I wasted a lot of time and effort when I tried to remove the old transducer with a hammer, and go straight to the holesaw method, it is a 5 minute job and really not that hard. I would not bother trying to use the very old transducer. Bill Bina ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers
NMEA units or combo speed depth and temp units aside, a basic 200 KHz transducer is pretty good for a wide variety of depth finders. My transducer dates back to the 1970s and I think I am on about the 5th depthfinder since then. It still works fine. Joe Della Barba j...@dellabarba.com Coquina HAPPY THANKSGIVING -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2015 8:24 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Hoyt, Mike Subject: Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers I will second that. Last year I installed i50/i60 to replace the old B&G 1000 system on the boat. It was difficult but not impossible and really not all that long a time to remove the old transducers. There is usually a flange on the exterior which I cut under with a sharp knife and then I slowly pried them out. Along with the prying from outside I also placed a block of wood over the edge of transducer inside and tapped (rather hard tapping) with a hammer. They came out without damage to either transducer or the boat. After removal I subsequently found out that the transducers themselves were only 2 or three years old despite the instruments being antiques. Oh well. The holes on the old transducers were smaller than those for the new ones. I screwed a block of thin plywood in place on the interior to act as a guide for the drill bit on hole saw and then drilled out the larger hole. Had I left the old transducers in place then likely the transducer itself could have been used for the drill bit of the hole saw Note that the hull is a whole lot tougher than the transducers. Also note that you tend not to change engine oil and leave in old filter so why would you add nice new instruments and use old transducers that may be prone to failure other than as a way to avoid hauling a boat to do the work? BTW. Old and especially old and non functioning instruments on a boat are a pet peeve of mine. The original owners of these boats spent a lot of time and money to outfit the boats properly and it is the least we can do when buying a nice boat for a fraction of its actual worth to treat the old gals properly. Same goes for 30 year old sails. Mike Persistence 1987 Frers 33 Halifax, NS -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Bill Bina via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2015 7:47 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Bill Bina Subject: Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers If you skip the part where I wasted a lot of time and effort when I tried to remove the old transducer with a hammer, and go straight to the holesaw method, it is a 5 minute job and really not that hard. I would not bother trying to use the very old transducer. Bill Bina ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers
New head unit will probably be NMEA 2000. You would need to splice the wires. Joel On Thursday, November 26, 2015, Joe Della Barba via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > NMEA units or combo speed depth and temp units aside, a basic 200 KHz > transducer is pretty good for a wide variety of depth finders. My > transducer > dates back to the 1970s and I think I am on about the 5th depthfinder since > then. It still works fine. > > Joe Della Barba > j...@dellabarba.com > > Coquina > > HAPPY THANKSGIVING > > -Original Message- > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com ] On > Behalf Of Hoyt, > Mike via CnC-List > Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2015 8:24 AM > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Cc: Hoyt, Mike > > Subject: Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers > > I will second that. Last year I installed i50/i60 to replace the old B&G > 1000 system on the boat. It was difficult but not impossible and really > not > all that long a time to remove the old transducers. There is usually a > flange on the exterior which I cut under with a sharp knife and then I > slowly pried them out. Along with the prying from outside I also placed a > block of wood over the edge of transducer inside and tapped (rather hard > tapping) with a hammer. They came out without damage to either transducer > or > the boat. After removal I subsequently found out that the transducers > themselves were only 2 or three years old despite the instruments being > antiques. Oh well. > > The holes on the old transducers were smaller than those for the new ones. > I screwed a block of thin plywood in place on the interior to act as a > guide > for the drill bit on hole saw and then drilled out the larger hole. Had I > left the old transducers in place then likely the transducer itself could > have been used for the drill bit of the hole saw > > Note that the hull is a whole lot tougher than the transducers. > > Also note that you tend not to change engine oil and leave in old filter so > why would you add nice new instruments and use old transducers that may be > prone to failure other than as a way to avoid hauling a boat to do the > work? > > BTW. Old and especially old and non functioning instruments on a boat are > a > pet peeve of mine. The original owners of these boats spent a lot of time > and money to outfit the boats properly and it is the least we can do when > buying a nice boat for a fraction of its actual worth to treat the old gals > properly. Same goes for 30 year old sails. > > Mike > Persistence > 1987 Frers 33 > Halifax, NS > > -Original Message- > From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com ] On > Behalf Of Bill Bina > via CnC-List > Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2015 7:47 AM > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Cc: Bill Bina > Subject: Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers > > If you skip the part where I wasted a lot of time and effort when I tried > to > remove the old transducer with a hammer, and go straight to the holesaw > method, it is a 5 minute job and really not that hard. I would not bother > trying to use the very old transducer. > > Bill Bina > > ___ > > Email address: > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the > bottom > of page at: > http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com > > > ___ > > Email address: > CnC-List@cnc-list.com > To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the > bottom of page at: > http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com > > -- Joel 301 541 8551 ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers
Eric — the old transducer may very well work with the new head; you may lose readings at depths beyond 150 feet if your older transducer won’t do 50 kHz. But as another lister pointed out, why not just have a nice new transducer to go along with your shiny new i50/i60 instruments? Once you get the old transducer out, unless there’s any hull work to do, installing a new one doesn’t take that long. And if you ever decide to take Cat’s Paw out into the Gulf Stream, you’ll be glad you have the temp transducer. Happy Thanksgiving, all! — Fred Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 C&C Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( > On Nov 25, 2015, at 9:27 PM, Eric Frank via CnC-List > wrote: > > I am replacing depth, speed and wind instruments on Cat’s Paw with i50 and > i60 Raymarine instruments. As noted in an ongoing thread, it is difficult to > remove the old depth transducer, so is it possible to use the old one with > the new Raymarine display? The old transducer is for a Signet Scientific > MK172 instrument, which is probably more than 12 years old but still works > fine. In the manual, it states that “The transmitter produces six pulses per > second at an amplitude of 450 volts peak·to·peak with 63 watts of power > output per pulse. The high power output is obtained by charging a large > capacitor to build a large current flow without heavy drain from the external > power source. The frequency is adjustable from 160 to 200 kHz but is set at > the factory for 200 kHz nominal.” The transducer that came with the > Raymarine instruments is an Airmar P319, listed on the tag on its cable as > 50/200 KHz. That transducer also measures temperature, but I would be happy > to forgo that if I didn’t have to change the transducer. Is there a way of > testing if the old transducer works with the new display while the boat is on > the hard (for the winter)? What happens if you test a transducer when it is > completely out of water? Would it harm the Raymarine instrument to be > connected to the old transducer? > > Eric Frank > Cat's Paw > C&C 35 Mk II > Mattapoisett, MA ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers
If anyone needs one, I have a S-H 200 KHz transducer. I bought it when I got a new depthfinder in case the issue was the old transducer, but it wasn't. Joe Della Barba j...@dellabarba.com -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Joe Della Barba via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2015 9:29 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Joe Della Barba Subject: Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers NMEA units or combo speed depth and temp units aside, a basic 200 KHz transducer is pretty good for a wide variety of depth finders. My transducer dates back to the 1970s and I think I am on about the 5th depthfinder since then. It still works fine. Joe Della Barba j...@dellabarba.com Coquina HAPPY THANKSGIVING -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2015 8:24 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Hoyt, Mike Subject: Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers I will second that. Last year I installed i50/i60 to replace the old B&G 1000 system on the boat. It was difficult but not impossible and really not all that long a time to remove the old transducers. There is usually a flange on the exterior which I cut under with a sharp knife and then I slowly pried them out. Along with the prying from outside I also placed a block of wood over the edge of transducer inside and tapped (rather hard tapping) with a hammer. They came out without damage to either transducer or the boat. After removal I subsequently found out that the transducers themselves were only 2 or three years old despite the instruments being antiques. Oh well. The holes on the old transducers were smaller than those for the new ones. I screwed a block of thin plywood in place on the interior to act as a guide for the drill bit on hole saw and then drilled out the larger hole. Had I left the old transducers in place then likely the transducer itself could have been used for the drill bit of the hole saw Note that the hull is a whole lot tougher than the transducers. Also note that you tend not to change engine oil and leave in old filter so why would you add nice new instruments and use old transducers that may be prone to failure other than as a way to avoid hauling a boat to do the work? BTW. Old and especially old and non functioning instruments on a boat are a pet peeve of mine. The original owners of these boats spent a lot of time and money to outfit the boats properly and it is the least we can do when buying a nice boat for a fraction of its actual worth to treat the old gals properly. Same goes for 30 year old sails. Mike Persistence 1987 Frers 33 Halifax, NS -Original Message- From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Bill Bina via CnC-List Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2015 7:47 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Bill Bina Subject: Re: Stus-List substitution of depth transducers If you skip the part where I wasted a lot of time and effort when I tried to remove the old transducer with a hammer, and go straight to the holesaw method, it is a 5 minute job and really not that hard. I would not bother trying to use the very old transducer. Bill Bina ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
Stus-List Subject: Re: substitution of depth transducers
You can remove a transducer with an angle grinder and zip disc, or better yet a Fein type oscillating multi tool. The grinder is not for the faint of heart, but it is Amazing how precise you can be with either tool. Dave Sent from my iPhone ___ Email address: CnC-List@cnc-list.com To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom of page at: http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
