Re: [CentOS] kABI-tracking kmod-xfs for CentOS-4 (Was: Preventing hour-long fsck on ext3-filesystem)
On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 8:24 AM, Akemi Yagi wrote: > On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 1:51 PM, Tru Huynh wrote: >> On Tue, May 26, 2009 at 08:16:42AM -0700, Akemi Yagi wrote: >>> Here is the updated version: >>> >>> http://centos.toracat.org/kmods/CentOS-4/xfs/SRPMS/ >>> >>> Please discard the obsoleted ones (I did not bump the version/release >>> number). Let me know when your binaries are ready for testing. >>> >> rebuilds and uploaded. > > * Downloaded from http://people.centos.org/tru/kABI/4/RPMS/ and did > some test installs. > > First, installed the kernel version specific > kmod-xfs-0.4-1.el4.2.6.9_78.0.22 to the test box and then installed > the current kABI-tracking kmod-xfs-0.4-2.el4. It successfully > replaced the xfs.ko installed by the former and created symlinks to > other installed kernels correctly. > > Second, installed the current kmod-xfs to an older kernel and then > updated the kernel. Upon reboot, a new symlink was created for the > newly installed kernel successfully. > > Third, confirmed that the kABI-tracking kmod-xfs recognized centosplus > kernels as expected (even -vm kernels). One example of such symlinks: Tru, I vaguely remember that you were planning on releasing this on or around June 15 (?). Maybe it's time? I don't think we are getting any more response here. Akemi ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Rudi Ahlers wrote: > Hi, > > I would like to spend some time learning a new coding language, but > specifically for server side admin stuff, i.e. setting up users / > databases / FTP accounts / virtual domains on Apache, etc. > > I already know PHP, but realize it's not quite suited for this kind of > admin, and I suppose I need to look @ PERL / Python / C++ / Ruby? / > others? > > Can someone give me some pointers on this? > Python has become quite common for sysadmin stuff. Indeed, a lot of RedHat/Fedora (e.g. anaconda, the installer) and Ubuntu tools are really Python scripts. The code is quite readable and usually, there are Python bindings for almost every popular C library. GUI can quickly be made with PyGTK or WxPython. Programming language runtime performance is usually not an issue for sysadmin tasks, since most of the time you r program will have to wait for some disk I/O, a backup tape, etc. > I basically need to write a control panel, with web access for admins > to manage servers, similar to what cPanel / WebMin / Plesk / etc does > right now, but something more customized for our needs. > > -- > Kind Regards > Rudi Ahlers > CEO, SoftDux Hosting > Web: http://www.SoftDux.com > Office: 087 805 9573 > Cell: 082 554 7532 > Peter > > > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > -- Dott. Peter Hopfgartner R3 GIS Srl - GmbH Via Johann Kravogl-Str. 2 I-39012 Meran/Merano (BZ) Email: peter.hopfgart...@r3-gis.com Tel. : +39 0473 494949 Fax : +39 0473 069902 www : http://www.r3-gis.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Rudi Ahlers wrote on Sun, 14 Jun 2009 20:54:00 +0200: > I can do most of this in PHP, but I do think PHP is a bit slow for this, > being a scripting language, and not a compiled language. It's not slow at all. I have written such an interface 5 or more years ago for our needs and it's split in two parts. I first wrote a lot of small scripts that do only a specific task and are controlled by command-line arguments. This backend was done in Perl, because I felt familiar with it for shell tasks at that time. I could have used PHP or Python (if I knew that better). Then I wrote the frontend for it in PHP. > Ideally I need something which could > interact with the OS layer directly In my eyes this is a bad idea. There is no direct interfacing between the two. The backend takes the commands from a text file that the frontend writes. One could also interface via database. There is no way to smuggle any system commands in because system commands are never carried out directly. Instead of writing it all yourself, have you looked at ISPConfig? I have switched to ISPConfig (2) for our newer virtual machines last year and it's working really well. Although it's not as custom as my own interface I decided to go with that for our reseller customers because it's closer to what other interfaces look/do/provide and it would have needed a lot of extra coding to add this all to my own. Kai -- Kai Schätzl, Berlin, Germany Get your web at Conactive Internet Services: http://www.conactive.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Trouble (?) reformatting flash drive to include former U3 partition
From: MHR > I just got a new SanDisk 8GB flash drive, and, as usual, it came with > the U3 software (for Windoze) on a "CD" partition and considerably > less than 8GB on the disk partition. I put it into my WinXP portable > and told U3 to delete itself, but I still can't get at the old U3 part > of the drive. I've tried WinXP's format command, disk management and > CentOS's fdisk, and nothing will give me more than 7,872,512 bytes per > cylinder, times 1019 cylinders yields 8,022,089,728 bytes. Is that > right, or should there be more? fdisk also reports that the drive has > 8029 "MB", or 8029470208 bytes, which is 7,380,480 bytes difference > (until it gets allocated into the 8,022,089,728 bytes of the > partition) - I'm thinking this is a standard formatting loss. Maybe there is some reserved "good sectors" space in order to handle (take the place of) bad sectors? I don't really know how bad-sectors handling works... JD ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
[CentOS] scsi_id doesn't returns any result
Hi all,
I need to assign persistent names to some scsi disks on one host
(CentOS 5.3 fully patched), but I can't because scsi_id doesn't returns
any results. For example:
[r...@c5srv01 etc]# scsi_id -u -g -s /block/sda
[r...@c5srv01 etc]# scsi_id -u -g -s /block/sdb
[r...@c5srv01 etc]# scsi_id -u -g -s /block/sdc
[r...@c5srv01 etc]# scsi_id -u -g -s /block/sdd
Somebody knows what can it be wrong??
Many thanks.
--
CL Martinez
carlopmart {at} gmail {d0t} com
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[CentOS] Fonts missing in KDE/vnc
Hi all, sorry if this question gets duplicated, I can't seem to get e-mails to the list. I've installed vnc-server and kde-desktop but there appear to be no fonts available. All the text is little boxes. What else do I need to install to get the fonts? thanks ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] re-install over internet
> I just got back from a datacenter where I installed a new server running > CentOS 5.3. I set up a software raid with md0 being /. (Only one mount, > didn't split anything up.) > > I just discovered that instead of raid 1, it did raid 0... Not exactly what I > wanted! Probably missed that little check when installing. So now, I need to > change this. But since the whole OS is on this raided partition that I want > to change, I'm a bit stuck. > > Is there a way to launch an installer while in the OS that I can re-install > the whole thing over the internet, without having to physically go to the box? > Speed of installation is not that much of an issue. It would obviously need > to keep up some sort of shell with my current eth0 settings during the > install. > > install a small boot kernel that drops straight to anaconda and in that have ip= gateway= ks=http:///foo.ks have you install tree available and providing there are no mistakes in your ks, test it first!, then a reinstall should happen this time with the software raid ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 09:16 +0200, Peter Hopfgartner wrote: > Python has become quite common for sysadmin stuff. Indeed, a lot of > RedHat/Fedora (e.g. anaconda, the installer) and Ubuntu tools are really > Python scripts. The code is quite readable and usually, there are Python > bindings for almost every popular C library. Python will let you develop programs very quickly, the first time. The problem is that you'll have to go back and redo the code when a different version of python is released. There are major incompatibilities between 2.5 and 3.0. If you have a lot of code and/or use the low level C bindings, it can be a major effort to make your code run under a new release. Take a look at the poor folks at zope.org. They've been beaten half to death with almost every release. Also, there are several engineers at Red Hat that are very unhappy with the impact that the 3.0 release is going to have on them. > GUI can quickly be made with PyGTK or WxPython. And, of course, there's glade to help. The bottom line is that you can probably get your project done faster in python. But if you have a lot of code that you're going to need to maintain, you're much better off with java, which actually has a lot of input from the user community, and respects their user base. Dave ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
David G. Mackay wrote: > On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 09:16 +0200, Peter Hopfgartner wrote: >> Python has become quite common for sysadmin stuff. Indeed, a lot of >> RedHat/Fedora (e.g. anaconda, the installer) and Ubuntu tools are really >> Python scripts. The code is quite readable and usually, there are Python >> bindings for almost every popular C library. > > Python will let you develop programs very quickly, the first time. The > problem is that you'll have to go back and redo the code when a > different version of python is released. There are major > incompatibilities between 2.5 and 3.0. If you have a lot of code and/or > use the low level C bindings, it can be a major effort to make your code > run under a new release. Take a look at the poor folks at zope.org. > They've been beaten half to death with almost every release. > > Also, there are several engineers at Red Hat that are very unhappy with > the impact that the 3.0 release is going to have on them. Yes but it has been obvious for a long time that python does not consider backwards compatibility to be important. This shouldn't have come as a surprise. By comparison, perl has been around longer and through more changes and yet about the only thing you might have to check on a program written for perl 1.x to run under 5.x would be whether you have @ in double-quoted strings that you wanted to remain literal. >> GUI can quickly be made with PyGTK or WxPython. > > And, of course, there's glade to help. > > The bottom line is that you can probably get your project done faster in > python. But if you have a lot of code that you're going to need to > maintain, you're much better off with java, which actually has a lot of > input from the user community, and respects their user base. One other consideration is that perl probably has the current advantage in terms of available code library modules. Pretty much anything you can imagine doing has already been done and contributed to CPAN so often the code you have to write yourself is trivial with the modules doing the bulk of the work. Java may be catching up in this regard but I don't think there is a central place to find available code. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On 06/15/2009 03:22 PM, David G. Mackay wrote: > Python will let you develop programs very quickly, the first time. The > problem is that you'll have to go back and redo the code when a > different version of python is released. There are major > incompatibilities between 2.5 and 3.0. afaik, this is the first time there is such a major change coming down the python line - even then, I feel its been well documented and there are atleast a couple of automated harness to help along the process. I agree its not ideal, far from it - for anyone on any language. But then if you look at it py3 isnt going to be around for c5 or c6, who knows what other tooling might be available further into the future. > Also, there are several engineers at Red Hat that are very unhappy with > the impact that the 3.0 release is going to have on them. But the changes have been known for a while right ? and are'nt most people already making changes that allows their code to migrate well over to 3.0 when its around ? > The bottom line is that you can probably get your project done faster in > python. But if you have a lot of code that you're going to need to > maintain, you're much better off with java, which actually has a lot of > input from the user community, and respects their user base. Given that large numbers of java people are jumping ship into the ruby camp, I dont know how much of that is really true anymore. More and more of the companies that I know about ( specially the really smart ones ) are either already on ruby for a significant portion of their work, or are in the process of moving. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On 06/14/2009 07:00 PM, Rudi Ahlers wrote: > I would like to spend some time learning a new coding language, but > specifically for server side admin stuff, i.e. setting up users / > databases / FTP accounts / virtual domains on Apache, etc. If you are targetting CentOS and/or Linux only - doing this in anything other than python just does not make sense to me. Ruby, perhaps - but you will need to redo or atleast work with a lot of the underlaying systems. -KB PS: you still dont really seem to trim your replies, having bad mailing list etiquette after having been on the list for so long is odd. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Trouble (?) reformatting flash drive to include former U3 partition
Robert wrote:
Robert Nichols wrote:
The first thing I do with every USB flash drive I buy is figure
out a geometry that uses all of the sectors reported by fdisk
(I have a shell script that does that in a pretty much brute force
way.) and then repartition and re-format the drive using that
geometry. I've never experienced any problem with that.
That's interesting. Would you consider sharing your script?
Sure. I'll try it as a small attachment here. It that doesn't
work, and I suspect it won't, I'll have to find some spot where
I can upload it. I don't have anything like that set up just now.
--
Bob Nichols "NOSPAM" is really part of my email address.
Do NOT delete it.
#!/bin/bash
#Brute force searches for the CHS geometry that can best utilize a
#device with a given total sector count. For each cylinder count,
#starting with the minimum possible and continuing until the
#cylinder size is reduced to just 8 sectors, it finds the best H
#and S count. A line is written st stdout each time a geometry is
#found that is at least as good as the best one seen so far.
#(Sometimes a later geometry that yields the same sector count is
#in some way "nicer".)
#
#The "-d" option adjusts the calculation to account for the track
#that is wasted for the MBR in DOS compatibility mode. Sometimes a
#smaller track size that wastes fewer sectors will be slightly
#better, though the maximum savings is minimal (55 sectors).
#
#For a large device, you will probably want to interrupt this
#before it runs to completion. Evaluating geometries with millions
#of tiny cylinders can take hours, and those are not likely to be
#considered desirable.
#
#Released to the public domain 15 June 2009 by Robert Nichols
# AT comcast.net I am rnicholsNOSPAM
# (Yes, NOSPAM really is part of my email address.)
restrk=0
if [ "$1" = -d ]; then
restrk=1
echo "Loss due to DOS compatibility mode considered"
shift
fi
if [ -z "$1" -o "$1" = "-h" -o "$1" = "--help" ]; then
echo "Usage: ${0##*/} [-d] total_sectors" >&2
echo " (Integer expression allowed for total_sectors)" >&2
exit 1
fi
tsec=$(( ($1) + 0 ))# Evaluate the input expression
maxspcyl=$((63*255))# Max possible sectors per cylinder
mincyl=$(($tsec/$maxspcyl))
[ $mincyl -lt 1 ] && mincyl = 1
best_cap=0
cyl=$mincyl
full=
trap "echo \"Interrupted at cyl count = \$cyl\"; exit" 2
echo " H * S * C for $tsec total sectors:"
while [ $cyl -le $(($tsec/8)) ]; do
cylsize_p=$(($tsec/$cyl))
minspt=$(($cylsize_p/255))
[ $minspt -gt 63 ] && minspt=63
[ $minspt -lt 1 ] && minspt=1
spt=$minspt
while [ $spt -le 63 ]; do
hd=$(($cylsize_p/$spt))
[ $hd -gt 255 ] && hd=255
cap=$(($spt*$hd*$cyl))
pcap=$(($spt*($hd*$cyl - $restrk)))
if [ $pcap -ge $best_cap ]; then
best_cap=$pcap
[ $best_cap = $tsec ] && full=" 100%"
echo "$hd * $spt * $cyl = $pcap ($(($pcap*512)))$full"
fi
spt=$(($spt+1))
done
cyl=$((cyl+1))
done
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Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
I currently use ruby for a lot of my sysadmin tasks. I think python and ruby are the best choices now - I've tried both languages and found them both easy to work with. I chose ruby because it felt more comfortable to be somehow. For most people, the choice between the 2 languages will come down to personal taste, IMHO. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
[CentOS] CentOS-announce Digest, Vol 52, Issue 7
Send CentOS-announce mailing list submissions to centos-annou...@centos.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos-announce or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to centos-announce-requ...@centos.org You can reach the person managing the list at centos-announce-ow...@centos.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of CentOS-announce digest..." Today's Topics: 1. CESA-2009:1096 Critical CentOS 3 ia64 seamonkey - security update (Pasi Pirhonen) 2. CESA-2009:1096 Critical CentOS 3 s390(x) seamonkey - security update (Pasi Pirhonen) -- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 14:42:54 +0300 From: Pasi Pirhonen Subject: [CentOS-announce] CESA-2009:1096 Critical CentOS 3 ia64 seamonkey - security update To: centos-annou...@centos.org Message-ID: <20090614114254.ge7...@centos.fi> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" CentOS Errata and Security Advisory 2009:1096 https://rhn.redhat.com/errata/RHSA-2009-1096.html The following updated files have been uploaded and are currently syncing to the mirrors: ia64: updates/ia64/RPMS/seamonkey-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.ia64.rpm updates/ia64/RPMS/seamonkey-chat-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.ia64.rpm updates/ia64/RPMS/seamonkey-devel-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.ia64.rpm updates/ia64/RPMS/seamonkey-dom-inspector-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.ia64.rpm updates/ia64/RPMS/seamonkey-js-debugger-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.ia64.rpm updates/ia64/RPMS/seamonkey-mail-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.ia64.rpm updates/ia64/RPMS/seamonkey-nspr-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.ia64.rpm updates/ia64/RPMS/seamonkey-nspr-devel-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.ia64.rpm updates/ia64/RPMS/seamonkey-nss-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.ia64.rpm updates/ia64/RPMS/seamonkey-nss-devel-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.ia64.rpm -- Pasi Pirhonen - u...@iki.fi - http://pasi.pirhonen.eu/ Top-postings silently ignored -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos-announce/attachments/20090614/102c71c1/attachment-0001.bin -- Message: 2 Date: Sun, 14 Jun 2009 14:49:46 +0300 From: Pasi Pirhonen Subject: [CentOS-announce] CESA-2009:1096 Critical CentOS 3 s390(x) seamonkey - security update To: centos-annou...@centos.org Message-ID: <20090614114946.gf7...@centos.fi> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" CentOS Errata and Security Advisory 2009:1096 https://rhn.redhat.com/errata/RHSA-2009-1096.html The following updated files have been uploaded and are currently syncing to the mirrors: s390: updates/s390/RPMS/seamonkey-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390.rpm updates/s390/RPMS/seamonkey-chat-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390.rpm updates/s390/RPMS/seamonkey-devel-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390.rpm updates/s390/RPMS/seamonkey-dom-inspector-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390.rpm updates/s390/RPMS/seamonkey-js-debugger-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390.rpm updates/s390/RPMS/seamonkey-mail-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390.rpm updates/s390/RPMS/seamonkey-nspr-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390.rpm updates/s390/RPMS/seamonkey-nspr-devel-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390.rpm updates/s390/RPMS/seamonkey-nss-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390.rpm updates/s390/RPMS/seamonkey-nss-devel-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390.rpm s390x: updates/s390x/RPMS/seamonkey-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390x.rpm updates/s390x/RPMS/seamonkey-chat-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390x.rpm updates/s390x/RPMS/seamonkey-devel-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390x.rpm updates/s390x/RPMS/seamonkey-dom-inspector-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390x.rpm updates/s390x/RPMS/seamonkey-js-debugger-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390x.rpm updates/s390x/RPMS/seamonkey-mail-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390x.rpm updates/s390x/RPMS/seamonkey-nspr-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390x.rpm updates/s390x/RPMS/seamonkey-nspr-devel-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390x.rpm updates/s390x/RPMS/seamonkey-nss-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390x.rpm updates/s390x/RPMS/seamonkey-nss-devel-1.0.9-0.38.el3.centos3.s390x.rpm -- Pasi Pirhonen - u...@iki.fi - http://pasi.pirhonen.eu/ Top-postings silently ignored -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Digital signature Url : http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos-announce/attachments/20090614/93cea468/attachment-0001.bin -- ___ CentOS-announce mailing list centos-annou...@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos-announce End of CentOS-announce Digest, Vol 52, Issue 7 ** ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Sun, Jun 14, 2009 at 9:19 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > > > Hi Les, while I understand where you're coming from, I don't quite agree > > with you. A programming language doesn't make security mistakes, the > coder > > does :) > > I didn't mean the language is going to cause the problem. I meant that > coding mistakes are inevitable when you start from scratch and take > years to find and fix - a headstart those other frameworks already have. > > > What I'm looking for, is which programming language will be best, > > i.e. fastest. My OS of choice would be CentOS, but even then that won't > make > > a difference either. > > That's all almost irrelevant. Unless you make horrible coding mistakes, > nothing you do within the programming language will take significant > time compared to reading/writing the config files and database activity. > > > I can do most of this in PHP, but I do think PHP is a bit slow for this, > > being a scripting language, and not a compiled language. > > Measure what's really happening. > > > LDAP can / would but be one component of the whole thing, and I'm not > very > > fond of JAVA, since it's rather slow. Ideally I need something which > could > > interact with the OS layer directly > > Java is only slow when you have to start a new JVM. I'd expect this to > be run under tomcat or similar web container where the JVM would always > be running. Again, measure a few things to get the idea. A tomcat app > is easy enough to test - there are a few packaged ones to get the idea. > As far as talking to the OS goes, all languages have ways to do that. > Perl is probably the closest-to-native for most things - and has > modules with embedded C-library access for anything else you might > need. But java has built-in remote execution if you want to make this > work on more than one machine. > > -- >Les Mikesell >lesmikes...@gmail.com > > > ___ > Well, my experience with JAVA, JS & JSP (I know they're all different) has been that it's slow on the user's end of view. I have some clients with JBOSS / Tomcat, and while it's powerful, it also takes up a lot of resources. Ideally, whatever I use needs to be quick, and low on resources. cPanel, for one, needs a minimum of 512MB RAM to function properly. And while hardware is cheap these days, 512MB is still a lot. Other control panels will work hapily with 256, or perhaps even 128MB RAM. -- Kind Regards Rudi Ahlers CEO, SoftDux Hosting Web: http://www.SoftDux.com Office: 087 805 9573 Cell: 082 554 7532 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Sun, Jun 14, 2009 at 9:55 PM, JohnS wrote:
>
> On Sun, 2009-06-14 at 20:54 +0200, Rudi Ahlers wrote:
> >
> >
>
> >
> > Hi Les, while I understand where you're coming from, I don't quite
> > agree with you. A programming language doesn't make security mistakes,
> > the coder does :) What I'm looking for, is which programming language
> > will be best, i.e. fastest. My OS of choice would be CentOS, but even
> > then that won't make a difference either.
> >
> > I can do most of this in PHP, but I do think PHP is a bit slow for
> > this, being a scripting language, and not a compiled language.
>
> How now, do you figure PHP is all that slow? Since you have a background
> in PHP why not use it? Maybe your not skinning the cat right? PHP is
> already
> used in admin apps and it works. Create a Three Tier Web Application to run
> on the one admin server. Calls can be made via rpc or xml web services to
> the clients. May take a while to think it out in your brain but it will
> work.
> I do it with .Net.
>
> ___
>
Hi John,
Well, it's my understanding that compiled languages perform much better than
scripting languages for this kind of operating, due to the fact that the
script runs on top of the scripting engine, which in turn runs on top of the
web server.
I know a lot of control panels run either PERL, C{+/++/#}, Python.
--
Kind Regards
Rudi Ahlers
CEO, SoftDux Hosting
Web: http://www.SoftDux.com
Office: 087 805 9573
Cell: 082 554 7532
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Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 10:31 AM, Kai Schaetzl wrote: > Rudi Ahlers wrote on Sun, 14 Jun 2009 20:54:00 +0200: > > > I can do most of this in PHP, but I do think PHP is a bit slow for this, > > being a scripting language, and not a compiled language. > > It's not slow at all. I have written such an interface 5 or more years ago > for our needs and it's split in two parts. I first wrote a lot of small > scripts that do only a specific task and are controlled by command-line > arguments. This backend was done in Perl, because I felt familiar with it > for shell tasks at that time. I could have used PHP or Python (if I knew > that better). Then I wrote the frontend for it in PHP. > > > Ideally I need something which could > > interact with the OS layer directly > > In my eyes this is a bad idea. There is no direct interfacing between the > two. The backend takes the commands from a text file that the frontend > writes. One could also interface via database. There is no way to smuggle > any system commands in because system commands are never carried out > directly. > What I meant was, PHP talks to PHP script engine, which talks to Apache, which then talks to system commands. - is there a quicker way of doing it? > > Instead of writing it all yourself, have you looked at ISPConfig? I have > switched to ISPConfig (2) for our newer virtual machines last year and > it's working really well. Although it's not as custom as my own interface > I decided to go with that for our reseller customers because it's closer > to what other interfaces look/do/provide and it would have needed a lot of > extra coding to add this all to my own. > I had a look at it, and other control panels as well, but really don't like it, and don't really want to "interfere" with the GNU stuff. The CP I have in mind will most probably be for in-house use, but also for client's use. > > Kai > > -- > Kai Schätzl, Berlin, Germany > Get your web at Conactive Internet Services: http://www.conactive.com > > > > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > -- Kind Regards Rudi Ahlers CEO, SoftDux Hosting Web: http://www.SoftDux.com Office: 087 805 9573 Cell: 082 554 7532 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Rudi Ahlers wrote: > What I meant was, PHP talks to PHP script engine, which talks to > Apache, which then talks to system commands. - is there a quicker way > of doing it? um, thats somewhat mixed up. user -> browser -> apache -> php that interprets your script -> OS function with a native compiled language like C++, its user -> browser -> apache -> compiled C++ binary -> OS function not really -that- different, as theres far more overhead in all the rest of the process than in the actual script or program,unless its doing something very computationally intensive. also note, PHP is a preloaded module, while your C++ program probably gets forked on every webpage, unless you write it as an apache module... ooops. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Pat and Lori Boyer wrote: > I currently use ruby for a lot of my sysadmin tasks. I think python and > ruby are the best choices now - I've tried both languages and found them > both easy to work with. I chose ruby because it felt more comfortable to > be somehow. For most people, the choice between the 2 languages will > come down to personal taste, IMHO. > Would you expect ruby to be able to scale up to projects like OpenNMS, Alfresco, or what Pentaho does? -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
From: centos-boun...@centos.org [mailto:centos-boun...@centos.org] On Behalf Of Rudi Ahlers Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2009 11:54 AM To: CentOS mailing list Subject: Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks On Sun, Jun 14, 2009 at 8:31 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: Rudi Ahlers wrote: > Hi, > > I would like to spend some time learning a new coding language, but > specifically for server side admin stuff, i.e. setting up users / databases > / FTP accounts / virtual domains on Apache, etc. > > I already know PHP, but realize it's not quite suited for this kind of > admin, and I suppose I need to look @ PERL / Python / C++ / Ruby? / others? > > Can someone give me some pointers on this? > > I basically need to write a control panel, with web access for admins to > manage servers, similar to what cPanel / WebMin / Plesk / etc does right > now, but something more customized for our needs. I can't help thinking that you are just about to repeat all the security mistakes those other tools have spent years correcting and that you'd be much better off using one of the existing tools or making minor mods. Having said that, it's really about time for someone to tackle this in java - perhaps with most of the details in a backend LDAP database. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ Hi Les, while I understand where you're coming from, I don't quite agree with you. A programming language doesn't make security mistakes, the coder does :) What I'm looking for, is which programming language will be best, i.e. fastest. My OS of choice would be CentOS, but even then that won't make a difference either. I can do most of this in PHP, but I do think PHP is a bit slow for this, being a scripting language, and not a compiled language. LDAP can / would but be one component of the whole thing, and I'm not very fond of JAVA, since it's rather slow. Ideally I need something which could interact with the OS layer directly -- Kind Regards Rudi Ahlers CEO, SoftDux Hosting Web: http://www.SoftDux.com Office: 087 805 9573 Cell: 082 554 7532 If you're looking for shear speed, C++. However if you're looking for ease of programming paradigm with OO ideas, etc, then Ruby or Python. If however you want a middle ground, go Perl. It is fairly fast (faster than Python and Ruby), and is fairly extensible for talking to the OS. Note however Perl's object framework leaves much to be desired from OO purists. -- Gary L. Greene, Jr. IT Operations Minerva Networks, Inc. Cell: (650) 704-6633 Phone: (408) 240-1239 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Karanbir Singh wrote: > > Given that large numbers of java people are jumping ship into the ruby > camp, I dont know how much of that is really true anymore. With Red Hat's history of shipping 'something like java' that doesn't really execute java code, that doesn't seem too surprising. And maybe it is too late to fix now. > More and more > of the companies that I know about ( specially the really smart ones ) > are either already on ruby for a significant portion of their work, or > are in the process of moving. A guy using it here seems to have some version dependencies that take code changes after ruby updates, but maybe that's a learning curve instead of language instability. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Rudi Ahlers wrote on Mon, 15 Jun 2009 18:23:42 +0200: > Well, it's my understanding that compiled languages perform much better than > scripting languages for this kind of operating, due to the fact that the > script runs on top of the scripting engine, which in turn runs on top of the > web server. The time it takes is marginal, we are not talking about a word processor or painting program. A shopping cart needs more ressources than a webhosting control panel and guess what most of them are coded in? Scripted languages. Kai -- Kai Schätzl, Berlin, Germany Get your web at Conactive Internet Services: http://www.conactive.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 5:13 PM, Karanbir Singh wrote: > On 06/14/2009 07:00 PM, Rudi Ahlers wrote: >> I would like to spend some time learning a new coding language, but >> specifically for server side admin stuff, i.e. setting up users / >> databases / FTP accounts / virtual domains on Apache, etc. > > If you are targetting CentOS and/or Linux only - doing this in anything > other than python just does not make sense to me. Ruby, perhaps - but > you will need to redo or atleast work with a lot of the underlaying systems. > > -KB > > PS: you still dont really seem to trim your replies, having bad mailing > list etiquette after having been on the list for so long is odd. > ___ CentOS would be my primary OS of choice, but I suppose it would be good to make the code more portable, and accommodate other Linux distro's, and probably OS's (probably only limited to the *nix family) as well. Some of my friends prefer Debian. Apart from the packaging, different paths to programs (Apache, MySQL, Exim, etc), and init scripts, I don't think this would be too difficult to accomplish. There are other differences I obviously need to look out for as well, since configuration files on different systems could be in different places,and sometimes even have different layouts, but even this should be as simple as keeping a list of options per distro being used. -- Kind Regards Rudi Ahlers CEO, SoftDux Hosting Web: http://www.SoftDux.com Office: 087 805 9573 Cell: 082 554 7532 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 7:09 PM, Gary Greene wrote: > If you're looking for shear speed, C++. However if you're looking for ease > of programming paradigm with OO ideas, etc, then Ruby or Python. If however > you want a middle ground, go Perl. It is fairly fast (faster than Python and > Ruby), and is fairly extensible for talking to the OS. Note however Perl's > object framework leaves much to be desired from OO purists. > > > -- > Gary L. Greene, Jr. > IT Operations > Minerva Networks, Inc. > Cell: (650) 704-6633 > Phone: (408) 240-1239 > > > > ___ Thanx Gary, this is a quick analasys of what I'm looking for, and helps a lot :) I have done some PERL coding on websites before, but very little, yet it was very easy to pickup with my PHP skills. As a front-end, I would consider Ruby, and / or AJAX. Could these inteface well with PERL? -- Kind Regards Rudi Ahlers CEO, SoftDux Hosting Web: http://www.SoftDux.com Office: 087 805 9573 Cell: 082 554 7532 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 6:48 PM, John R Pierce wrote: > Rudi Ahlers wrote: >> What I meant was, PHP talks to PHP script engine, which talks to >> Apache, which then talks to system commands. - is there a quicker way >> of doing it? > > um, thats somewhat mixed up. user -> browser -> apache -> php that > interprets your script -> OS function > > with a native compiled language like C++, its user -> browser -> apache > -> compiled C++ binary -> OS function > > not really -that- different, as theres far more overhead in all the rest > of the process than in the actual script or program,unless its doing > something very computationally intensive. > > also note, PHP is a preloaded module, while your C++ program probably > gets forked on every webpage, unless you write it as an apache > module... ooops. > > ___ Thanx John, I didn't think about it this way :) But would PHP be able to perform all tasks that PERL / C++ can? -- Kind Regards Rudi Ahlers CEO, SoftDux Hosting Web: http://www.SoftDux.com Office: 087 805 9573 Cell: 082 554 7532 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
[CentOS] hostname changes
Howdy, How do I change the hostname? In particular, what is the difference between /etc/hosts and /etc/sysconfig/network files? Where should I make the changes? Thanks, CS. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] hostname changes
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 7:51 PM, Carlos Santana wrote: > Howdy, > > How do I change the hostname? > In particular, what is the difference between /etc/hosts and > /etc/sysconfig/network files? Where should I make the changes? > > Thanks, > CS. > > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > > You should change it in both places, and then run /etc/init.d/network restart to make it effective. /etc/hosts basically tells your own machine on which IP a certain domain resolves to. It's a "scaled down DNS server", and normally only used if you only need to maintain a few hosts on a network. /etc/sysconfig/network tells your machine what it's actual hostname is. -- Kind Regards Rudi Ahlers CEO, SoftDux Hosting Web: http://www.SoftDux.com Office: 087 805 9573 Cell: 082 554 7532 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 19:45 +0200, Rudi Ahlers wrote: > On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 6:48 PM, John R Pierce wrote: > > Rudi Ahlers wrote: > >> What I meant was, PHP talks to PHP script engine, which talks to > >> Apache, which then talks to system commands. - is there a quicker way > >> of doing it? > > > > um, thats somewhat mixed up. user -> browser -> apache -> php that > > interprets your script -> OS function > > > > with a native compiled language like C++, its user -> browser -> apache > > -> compiled C++ binary -> OS function > > > > not really -that- different, as theres far more overhead in all the rest > > of the process than in the actual script or program,unless its doing > > something very computationally intensive. > > > > also note, PHP is a preloaded module, while your C++ program probably > > gets forked on every webpage, unless you write it as an apache > > module... ooops. > > > > ___ > > > Thanx John, I didn't think about it this way :) But do keep in mind that only the data space and certain system-related structures must be duplicated, all in memory, when this fork occurs. Text and instruction space is not duplicated (it's shared by all instances) and the same is true for underlying librariy code, like glib*. The possibility of multiple threads also exists to affect that. So the hit on performance will be very small. I don't know how this compares to things like PHP, having never had the interest, opportunity, ... to become familiar with it. > -- Bill ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Rudi Ahlers wrote: > But would PHP be able to perform all tasks that PERL / C++ can? > I don't see why not.Many of the existing control panels are written in PHP. PHP can manipulate files, execute system commands, and so forth. PEAR http://pear.php.net/packages.php includes a vast number of libraries for specific tasks. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Rudi Ahlers wrote: > > > Thanx Gary, this is a quick analasys of what I'm looking for, and helps a lot > :) > > I have done some PERL coding on websites before, but very little, yet > it was very easy to pickup with my PHP skills. > > As a front-end, I would consider Ruby, and / or AJAX. Could these > inteface well with PERL? Apples and oranges... Ajax is mostly javascript running on the browser side and can work with any interactive web server, where ruby and perl are scripting languages that work on the server side. If you want speed, you'd use mod_perl under apache or a standalone mongrel running ruby. However, it is probably a lot easier if you want ajax to use one of the server libraries that integrate things (Google Web Toolkit for java, Yahoo! UI Library for php, Ruby-on-Rails) or at least a library like jquery. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] hostname changes
All right.. So the /etc/sysconfig/network is the right place for changing hostname. The change in /etc/hosts is to map new hostname with IP address. Thanks, CS. On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 12:57 PM, Rudi Ahlers wrote: > On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 7:51 PM, Carlos Santana wrote: > > Howdy, > > > > How do I change the hostname? > > In particular, what is the difference between /etc/hosts and > > /etc/sysconfig/network files? Where should I make the changes? > > > > Thanks, > > CS. > > > > ___ > > CentOS mailing list > > CentOS@centos.org > > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > > > > > > You should change it in both places, and then run /etc/init.d/network > restart to make it effective. > > /etc/hosts basically tells your own machine on which IP a certain > domain resolves to. It's a "scaled down DNS server", and normally only > used if you only need to maintain a few hosts on a network. > > /etc/sysconfig/network tells your machine what it's actual hostname is. > > -- > Kind Regards > Rudi Ahlers > CEO, SoftDux Hosting > Web: http://www.SoftDux.com > Office: 087 805 9573 > Cell: 082 554 7532 > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
[CentOS] kickstart not install evolution
I wish to NOT install evolution during my kickstart process... In the %packages section I put a line -evolution but it still installed evolution. How can I keep evolution from being installed in the kickstart process? jerry -- snippit of kickstart --- %packages @base-x @dialup @gnome-desktop @base @development-libs @core @x-software-development @development-tools @web-server @graphical-internet @sound-and-video @legacy-software-development @editors @smb-server @ftp-server sendmail sendmail-cf mesa-libGLU-devel device-mapper-multipath -evolution mod_ssl openssl ImageMagick ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] hostname changes
> > > How do I change the hostname? > In particular, what is the difference between /etc/hosts and > /etc/sysconfig/network files? Where should I make the changes? > /etc/hosts has nothing to do with the hostname this is just a way to resolve a name to an IP where DNS is not available or some other badness is going on hostname is set in /etc/sysconfig/network but if you want to change it on the fly you can also echo it into /proc/sys/kernel/hostname ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On 06/15/2009 06:16 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: >> More and more >> of the companies that I know about ( specially the really smart ones ) >> are either already on ruby for a significant portion of their work, or >> are in the process of moving. > > A guy using it here seems to have some version dependencies that take > code changes after ruby updates, but maybe that's a learning curve > instead of language instability. I wont be surprised, also rubygems is just cpan done even worse than cpan ever was. Its surprising that amongst such smart people, they all still foot pedal something that is just so broken by design ( look at it this way, they didnt realise there could be something like 'arch' for a long time, even now - by design gem is completely arch blind ) -- Karanbir Singh : http://www.karan.org/ : 2522...@icq ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On 06/15/2009 06:09 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > Would you expect ruby to be able to scale up to projects like OpenNMS, > Alfresco, or what Pentaho does? I would, easily. It all depends on what sort of resources you have at hand and what its going to cost you. atleast 4 of the top 10 most-traffic websites out there right now rely quite heavily on ruby. -- Karanbir Singh : http://www.karan.org/ : 2522...@icq ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] kickstart not install evolution
> I wish to NOT install evolution during my kickstart process... > In the %packages section I put a line > > -evolution > > but it still installed evolution. > How can I keep evolution from being installed in the kickstart process? > > find out what package is requiring it and remove that also - ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 8:14 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > > Apples and oranges... Ajax is mostly javascript running on the browser > side and can work with any interactive web server, where ruby and perl > are scripting languages that work on the server side. If you want > speed, you'd use mod_perl under apache or a standalone mongrel running ruby. > > However, it is probably a lot easier if you want ajax to use one of the > server libraries that integrate things (Google Web Toolkit for java, > Yahoo! UI Library for php, Ruby-on-Rails) or at least a library like jquery. > > -- > Les Mikesell > lesmikes...@gmail.com > ___ Fair enough, but AFAIK AJAX is quicker to the end user than Ruby,although Ruby could use AJAX as well. So, from what I've gathered here, it could be a good idea to work with PERL + Ruby, and then add AJAX for the interface. -- Kind Regards Rudi Ahlers CEO, SoftDux Hosting Web: http://www.SoftDux.com Office: 087 805 9573 Cell: 082 554 7532 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Karanbir Singh wrote: > On 06/15/2009 06:16 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: >>> More and more >>> of the companies that I know about ( specially the really smart ones ) >>> are either already on ruby for a significant portion of their work, or >>> are in the process of moving. >> A guy using it here seems to have some version dependencies that take >> code changes after ruby updates, but maybe that's a learning curve >> instead of language instability. > > I wont be surprised, also rubygems is just cpan done even worse than > cpan ever was. Its surprising that amongst such smart people, they all > still foot pedal something that is just so broken by design ( look at it > this way, they didnt realise there could be something like 'arch' for a > long time, even now - by design gem is completely arch blind ) Which is a big part of the beauty of java. The people writing it understood that it would run on more than one kind of CPU and under more than one OS from day one. There are still some version differences, but few are because of bad design or not understanding the requirements. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Karanbir Singh wrote: > On 06/15/2009 06:09 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: >> Would you expect ruby to be able to scale up to projects like OpenNMS, >> Alfresco, or what Pentaho does? > > I would, easily. It all depends on what sort of resources you have at > hand and what its going to cost you. atleast 4 of the top 10 > most-traffic websites out there right now rely quite heavily on ruby. I meant scale in terms of program size and complexity. You can hook a web interface to a database in about any language and crank things through as fast as the database can respond - especially if you load-balance across a bunch of servers. But how complicated can you make something before you hit a wall with multiple developers clobbering each other or becoming so version-dependent that you are afraid to update anything? -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 10:04 -0500, Les Mikesell wrote: > > Also, there are several engineers at Red Hat that are very unhappy with > > the impact that the 3.0 release is going to have on them. > > Yes but it has been obvious for a long time that python does not > consider backwards compatibility to be important. This shouldn't have > come as a surprise. By comparison, perl has been around longer and Judging by some of the comments on the fedora-devel list, it did anyway. > through more changes and yet about the only thing you might have to > check on a program written for perl 1.x to run under 5.x would be > whether you have @ in double-quoted strings that you wanted to remain > literal. I used to do a lot of coding in perl, but I found that I liked python better. I still like python for quick and dirty one-offs, but I'm not going to use it for large and persistent projects. > One other consideration is that perl probably has the current advantage > in terms of available code library modules. Pretty much anything you > can imagine doing has already been done and contributed to CPAN so often > the code you have to write yourself is trivial with the modules doing > the bulk of the work. Java may be catching up in this regard but I > don't think there is a central place to find available code. Google? ;) I guess the real question is how well java is going to prosper under Oracle's ownership. Then again, with openjdk, it might not matter too much. Dave ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 16:12 +0100, Karanbir Singh wrote: > On 06/15/2009 03:22 PM, David G. Mackay wrote: > > Python will let you develop programs very quickly, the first time. The > > problem is that you'll have to go back and redo the code when a > > different version of python is released. There are major > > incompatibilities between 2.5 and 3.0. > > afaik, this is the first time there is such a major change coming down > the python line - even then, I feel its been well documented and there > are atleast a couple of automated harness to help along the process. That's correct, if you stick to pure python coding. Once again, if you look at zope, which makes extensive use of the C api, they've had fits with just about every release. > I agree its not ideal, far from it - for anyone on any language. But > then if you look at it py3 isnt going to be around for c5 or c6, who > knows what other tooling might be available further into the future. > > > Also, there are several engineers at Red Hat that are very unhappy with > > the impact that the 3.0 release is going to have on them. > > But the changes have been known for a while right ? and are'nt most > people already making changes that allows their code to migrate well > over to 3.0 when its around ? Probably. However, most developers would rather spend their resources on adding new features to their product rather than making changes just to stay compatible with the current language version. I believe that, even with the migration tools, people are still going to have to manually convert portions of their code. I haven't really followed it that closely since I won't be converting more than a few short scriptlets. > > The bottom line is that you can probably get your project done faster in > > python. But if you have a lot of code that you're going to need to > > maintain, you're much better off with java, which actually has a lot of > > input from the user community, and respects their user base. > > Given that large numbers of java people are jumping ship into the ruby > camp, I dont know how much of that is really true anymore. More and more > of the companies that I know about ( specially the really smart ones ) > are either already on ruby for a significant portion of their work, or > are in the process of moving. Sigh. Yet another language. I guess that I'll have to take a look at ruby. Dave ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
David G. Mackay wrote: > >>> Also, there are several engineers at Red Hat that are very unhappy with >>> the impact that the 3.0 release is going to have on them. >> Yes but it has been obvious for a long time that python does not >> consider backwards compatibility to be important. This shouldn't have >> come as a surprise. By comparison, perl has been around longer and > > Judging by some of the comments on the fedora-devel list, it did anyway. Maybe some of those developers are young enough to not understand the history. Or to have learned from experience that it matters. >> One other consideration is that perl probably has the current advantage >> in terms of available code library modules. Pretty much anything you >> can imagine doing has already been done and contributed to CPAN so often >> the code you have to write yourself is trivial with the modules doing >> the bulk of the work. Java may be catching up in this regard but I >> don't think there is a central place to find available code. > > Google? ;) How do you tell google to _not_ give you text matches that are really not about downloadable code modules in the language you want this week? > I guess the real question is how well java is going to prosper under > Oracle's ownership. Then again, with openjdk, it might not matter too > much. I don't think that can become much of an issue. On the other hand, some of the other interesting projects (glassfish, opengrok, etc.) might be more likely to go away or change. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Just curious, why not just use C/C++? thanks in advance ! Lincong --- On Mon, 6/15/09, David G. Mackay wrote: > From: David G. Mackay > Subject: Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks > To: "CentOS mailing list" > Date: Monday, June 15, 2009, 3:16 PM > > On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 10:04 -0500, Les Mikesell wrote: > > > Also, there are several engineers at Red Hat that > are very unhappy with > > > the impact that the 3.0 release is going to have > on them. > > > > Yes but it has been obvious for a long time that > python does not > > consider backwards compatibility to be > important. This shouldn't have > > come as a surprise. By comparison, perl has been > around longer and > > Judging by some of the comments on the fedora-devel list, > it did anyway. > > > through more changes and yet about the only thing you > might have to > > check on a program written for perl 1.x to run under > 5.x would be > > whether you have @ in double-quoted strings that you > wanted to remain > > literal. > > I used to do a lot of coding in perl, but I found that I > liked python > better. I still like python for quick and dirty > one-offs, but I'm not > going to use it for large and persistent projects. > > > One other consideration is that perl probably has the > current advantage > > in terms of available code library modules. > Pretty much anything you > > can imagine doing has already been done and > contributed to CPAN so often > > the code you have to write yourself is trivial with > the modules doing > > the bulk of the work. Java may be catching up in > this regard but I > > don't think there is a central place to find available > code. > > Google? ;) > > I guess the real question is how well java is going to > prosper under > Oracle's ownership. Then again, with openjdk, it > might not matter too > much. > > Dave > > > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
lincohn john wrote: > Just curious, why not just use C/C++? thanks in advance ! > for server-side administration web console development ?? ouch. writing clean portable C++ is very painful and requires extensive testing on each targetted platform. writing multithreaded C++ programs requires extreme care and a high level of expertise. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 14:30 -0500, Les Mikesell wrote: > David G. Mackay wrote: > > > >>> Also, there are several engineers at Red Hat that are very unhappy with > >>> the impact that the 3.0 release is going to have on them. > >> Yes but it has been obvious for a long time that python does not > >> consider backwards compatibility to be important. This shouldn't have > >> come as a surprise. By comparison, perl has been around longer and > > > > Judging by some of the comments on the fedora-devel list, it did anyway. > > Maybe some of those developers are young enough to not understand the > history. Or to have learned from experience that it matters. The ones that I'm thinking about were from the RHEL engineering staff. That doesn't preclude them from being young, but they were surprised by the extent of the incompatibilities. Maybe the young ones are all that will be left after the ones that are charged with making some of the Fedora 11 stuff acceptable to a professional user base have committed ritual sepuku. > > Google? ;) > > How do you tell google to _not_ give you text matches that are really > not about downloadable code modules in the language you want this week? Well, I try to make my searches specific to what I'm looking for. The more key words that I can throw at it, the less extraneous cruft comes up. > > I guess the real question is how well java is going to prosper under > > Oracle's ownership. Then again, with openjdk, it might not matter too > > much. > > I don't think that can become much of an issue. On the other hand, some > of the other interesting projects (glassfish, opengrok, etc.) might be > more likely to go away or change. Yeah, I've been tracking the Wonderland project. So far I haven't heard much from the development team one way or the other. Dave ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 12:35 -0700, lincohn john wrote: > Just curious, why not just use C/C++? thanks in advance ! > Lincong This is a personal opinion, but C++ seems to be an exercise in masochism. C is basically a high level assembly language. Neither are all that portable. Granted, for sheer speed, C is probably as good as you'll get. Speed just isn't as big a factor these days. Who knows, if they'd had the processing power available today back in the 80's, maybe we'd all be using pascal p-code systems. Dave ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
David G. Mackay wrote: > On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 12:35 -0700, lincohn john wrote: > >> Just curious, why not just use C/C++? thanks in advance ! >> Lincong >> > > This is a personal opinion, but C++ seems to be an exercise in > masochism. C is basically a high level assembly language. Neither are > all that portable. Granted, for sheer speed, C is probably as good as > you'll get. Speed just isn't as big a factor these days. Who knows, if > they'd had the processing power available today back in the 80's, maybe > we'd all be using pascal p-code systems. > operating systems, servers like Apache, Sendmail, Postfix, things like Java JVM innards, those are written in C/C++ ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 3:14 PM, David G. Mackay wrote: > On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 12:35 -0700, lincohn john wrote: >> Just curious, why not just use C/C++? thanks in advance ! >> Lincong > > This is a personal opinion, but C++ seems to be an exercise in > masochism. C is basically a high level assembly language. Neither are > all that portable. Granted, for sheer speed, C is probably as good as > you'll get. Speed just isn't as big a factor these days. Who knows, if > they'd had the processing power available today back in the 80's, maybe > we'd all be using pascal p-code systems. If we had the processing power (and all the incredibly cheap HW that exists today), in the 80's, I wouldn't have had to write such efficient assembly language code... Much easier today, with cheap RAM, etc. C++ for an old timer, takes awhile to get an understanding of, because of the OO, but as a book I have says, before OO, approximately 50% of the projects ended in failure. I believe that is on the low side. Never used Pascal (wasn't that a teaching language?, but I did use PL/M-86. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
David G. Mackay wrote: > >>> Google? ;) >> How do you tell google to _not_ give you text matches that are really >> not about downloadable code modules in the language you want this week? > > Well, I try to make my searches specific to what I'm looking for. The > more key words that I can throw at it, the less extraneous cruft comes > up. That doesn't mesh very well with finding stuff that you don't know exists yet. For example there is a nice pure-java clone of rrdtool called jrobin that opennms uses to store and graph time-series values. But if you didn't already know that, how would you find it? Even the bigger things like cifs-in-java don't seem to be very well exposed. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Rudi Ahlers wrote: > On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 8:14 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: >> Apples and oranges... Ajax is mostly javascript running on the browser >> side and can work with any interactive web server, where ruby and perl >> are scripting languages that work on the server side. If you want >> speed, you'd use mod_perl under apache or a standalone mongrel running ruby. >> >> However, it is probably a lot easier if you want ajax to use one of the >> server libraries that integrate things (Google Web Toolkit for java, >> Yahoo! UI Library for php, Ruby-on-Rails) or at least a library like jquery. >> > Fair enough, but AFAIK AJAX is quicker to the end user than > Ruby,although Ruby could use AJAX as well. > > So, from what I've gathered here, it could be a good idea to work with > PERL + Ruby, and then add AJAX for the interface. I'd investigate perl and ruby, then pick one or the other before going very far. The only reason to mix them would be that you want a spiffy new user interface made from ruby-on-rails but you already have, or have found existing, perl code to do the grunge work on the server side. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Trouble (?) reformatting flash drive to include former U3 partition
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 8:14 AM, Robert Nichols wrote: > > Sure. I'll try it as a small attachment here. It that doesn't > work, and I suspect it won't, I'll have to find some spot where > I can upload it. I don't have anything like that set up just now. > Got it - thanks. One thing I noticed when I formatted the drive with the 31/31/99212 format was that it was REALLY REALLY SLOW! I don't really know enough about the driver for USB flash drives, but I would bet it has something to do with the high cylinder count, and I noticed the Sandisk's format, though short by 77+MB seems to be optimized for real disk drive timings - maximum sectors per track, maximum heads per cylinder, minimum cylinders. In a real disk drive, this is wise because the inter-cylinder seek time is the longest (switching sectors is usually trivial, and switching heads is not much more). If that's true, the the "most" optimum format for this drive would be 124/31/24803. Of course, that "loses" 124 sectors for the MBR, but that a whale of a lot less than 77MB. I could be totally wrong about this - haven't tested it yet. One last question, which I believe I did ask originally but didn't see any answer - anyone know why the Kingston is larger than the Sandisk (probably just designed that way - bravo, Kingston!)? Thanks to all! mhr ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On 06/15/2009 08:15 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > I meant scale in terms of program size and complexity. You can hook a > web interface to a database in about any language and crank things > through as fast as the database can respond - especially if you > load-balance across a bunch of servers. But how complicated can you > make something before you hit a wall with multiple developers clobbering > each other or becoming so version-dependent that you are afraid to > update anything? you should look at ruby, it fix's most of the issues that people have with java code growing too large to manage :) its one of the key issues cited by people moving from java to things like ruby. Specially people who work with tdd and agile tools. -- Karanbir Singh : http://www.karan.org/ : 2522...@icq ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Centos 5.3 -> Apache - Under Attack ? Oh hell....
> B .Can i conclude that the attacker came through the horde framework ( > cmdshell.php) > ? The horde framework was installed from the centos repo.!!! > I don't think the horde set on CentOS is very current. I just used the tarball from the horde website, and I keep it current. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] re-install over internet
on 6-13-2009 7:56 AM Bob Puff spake the following: > Hello, > > I just got back from a datacenter where I installed a new server running > CentOS 5.3. I set up a software raid with md0 being /. (Only one mount, > didn't split anything up.) > > I just discovered that instead of raid 1, it did raid 0... Not exactly what I > wanted! Probably missed that little check when installing. So now, I need to > change this. But since the whole OS is on this raided partition that I want > to change, I'm a bit stuck. > > Is there a way to launch an installer while in the OS that I can re-install > the whole thing over the internet, without having to physically go to the box? > Speed of installation is not that much of an issue. It would obviously need > to keep up some sort of shell with my current eth0 settings during the > install. > > Thanks for any ideas! > > Bob If you can manage to free a small amount of space in a non raid 0 boot partition you can do a remote install. You can also do one with the netboot cd if your colo is willing to place a cd and reboot for you. You can do a vnc remote install and pull everything from the internet if the box has access. If you don't have any space that WON'T need to be formatted during the install, you might just be out of luck unless you can get a boot cd to them. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] re-install over internet
> I was going to suggest that you just have them burn a CD with CentOS 5.3 > on it...all you really need is CD1 if you do a bare bones install using > a KVM over IP. We do it for our colos if they ask. Cant see why your > hosting provider wouldnt, all they are out is the cost of the CD, and > heck, who cant find a good use for a CentOS install CD? Had a whole > wall of the AOL free trial CDs adorning my old cubiclesaid cubicle > being @ a AOL support center. > So you are the jerk who wouldn't let me cancel my AOL account! ;-P Just kidding... signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] re-install over internet
on 6-13-2009 8:30 AM Bob Puff spake the following: >> you'd need a remote console of some sort on that box. many brand name >> servers have these, HP calls it iLO, Dell calls it DRAC, etc. these >> have their own ethernet port, which has to be connected to the network >> and configured. you'd also need a PXE server on the same network >> segment to do a jumpstart install from, or use a virtual CD with that >> remote console (slow if you're not onsite) > >> Barring that, I think you are SOL. > Thanks for the reply. > > I some more details: I have the following HD config: > sda1 - 100 megs, /boot > sda2 - 1gb, swap > sda3 - 70gb, raid > -- > sdb1 - 100 megs, empty > sdb2 - 1gb swap > sbb3 - 70gb raid > > Would it be possible to use /boot to hold something? or perhaps turning off > the swap and using the two gigs there? I could probably trim down the OS to > under 2gb total. > > Bob With that non-raided storage you should be able to do it. Just set up a test system or VM and experiment where you have physical reach first. You can use the PXE boot images and add enough lines to get a remote vnc connection back to you. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Trouble (?) reformatting flash drive to include former U3 partition
Robert Nichols wrote: > Robert wrote: >> >> Robert Nichols wrote: >>> The first thing I do with every USB flash drive I buy is figure >>> out a geometry that uses all of the sectors reported by fdisk >>> (I have a shell script that does that in a pretty much brute force >>> way.) and then repartition and re-format the drive using that >>> geometry. I've never experienced any problem with that. >>> >>> >> That's interesting. Would you consider sharing your script? > > Sure. I'll try it as a small attachment here. It that doesn't > work, and I suspect it won't, I'll have to find some spot where > I can upload it. I don't have anything like that set up just now. I'll try it later but I can see none of the usual damage (truncated and/or wrapped lines or dropped spl chars). Thanks! ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
[CentOS] nvidia dual monitor setup centos howto
I had some trouble setting up dual monitors on centos with an nvidia card. I managed to track stuff down, so I thought I'd make it public on the list. I have an nvidia quadro nvs 290 in a Dell, recently installed centos5. Same stuff should apply for other nvidia cards. I needed nvidia-x11-drv.x86_64. It is available from rpmforge. Installing rpmforge is described on this page(http://wiki.centos.org/AdditionalResources/Repositories/RPMForge). If you just open the display panel and choose dual monitor settings and restart X, X can't get started and gives error messages. When I restore the old /etc/X112/xorg.conf, it comes back to life, without dual monitors of course. Here are the actual commands I entered as root: yum install yum-priorities echo 'priority=1' >> /etc/yum.repos.d/CentOS-Base.repo echo 'priority=1' >> /etc/yum.repos.d/CentOS-Media.repo echo 'priority=2' >> /etc/yum.repos.d/epel.repo echo 'priority=2' >> /etc/yum.repos.d/epel-testing.repo echo 'priority=3' >> /etc/yum.repos.d/adobe-linux-i386.repo echo 'priority=3' >> /etc/yum.repos.d/rpmfusion-free-updates.repo echo 'priority=3' >> /etc/yum.repos.d/rpmfusion-free-updates-testing.repo echo 'priority=3' >> /etc/yum.repos.d/rpmfusion-nonfree-updates-testing.repo echo 'priority=3' >> /etc/yum.repos.d/rpmfusion-nonfree-updates.repo wget http://apt.sw.be/redhat/el5/en/x86_64/RPMS.dag/rpmforge-release-0.3.6-1.el5.rf.x86_64.rpm rpm --import http://dag.wieers.com/rpm/packages/RPM-GPG-KEY.dag.txt rpm -K rpmforge-release-0.3.6-1.el5.rf.x86_64.rpm yum --localinstall rpmforge-release-0.3.6-1.el5.rf.x86_64.rpm yum localinstall rpmforge-release-0.3.6-1.el5.rf.x86_64.rpm yum check-update yum search nvidia yum install nvidia-x11-drv.x86_64 I originally googled around for a howto, it took me much more effort than it should to find http://wiki.centos.org. Wonder if there is a way to get google to give better results? Found someone with similar problems, someone suggested installing the right thing but neglected to point out where it comes from. So I was getting this: sudo yum search *nvidia* Loaded plugins: fastestmirror, security Loading mirror speeds from cached hostfile * rpmfusion-nonfree-updates-testing: mirrors.cat.pdx.edu * epel: mirror.its.uidaho.edu * rpmfusion-free-updates-testing: mirrors.cat.pdx.edu * rpmfusion-nonfree-updates: mirrors.cat.pdx.edu * extras: mirrors.cat.pdx.edu * rpmfusion-free-updates: mirrors.cat.pdx.edu * updates: repos.lax-noc.com * base: mirrors.xmission.com * addons: repos.lax-noc.com Warning: No matches found for: *nvidia* No Matches found Which versions of RH or FC correspond reasonably well to my version of centos? uname -a Linux 2.6.18-128.1.10.el5 #1 SMP Thu May 7 10:35:59 EDT 2009 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux thanks, Dave ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
[CentOS] CentOS security advisories
I have been looking at the security advisories provided here: http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/centos-announce/ It appears that there is not a 1:1 correlation between advisories listed here and advisories listed by Red Hat: https://rhn.redhat.com/errata Is there a specific reason for this? Also, is there an alternate location to find all Errata information for CentOS? Joshua Bahnsen ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] nvidia dual monitor setup centos howto
p.s. I logged out after installing the nvidia drivers, and used applications>System tools>nvidia X server settings to get dual monitor working. The panel autodetectedd my monitors fine. I clicke 'x server display configuration' and then 'configure'. choices are 'disabled', 'separate x screen', and 'twinview'. I at first thought I wanted 'separate x screen', but that's wrong, I'm still not sure what it was doing. Anyhow, I could not move anything between monitors in that mode. So I tried twinview, and now the two monitors are acting like one big monitor and I can move stuff back and forth. I would never have chosen the name 'twinview' for that, since they are not twins at all. Dave ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] FYI: solution Re: mock %post(pam) failure
Farkas' solution is exactly right. I have been banging my head against this problem for a while now and it wasn't until I finally paced myself and read carefully through the entire thread that I found this solution. Here is the procedure spelled out a bit more precisely. Get the CentOS 5.2 rpms of popt, rpm, rpm-libs, rpm-python and rpm-build. Obviously you can use most any mirror and if you are using i386 you should replace x86_64 with i386. I prefer to use RIT since its my Alma Mater and they seem to have good bandwidth and keep older versions. # wget http://mirrors.rit.edu/centos/5.2/os/x86_64/CentOS/popt-1.10.2-48.el5.x8 6_64.rpm # wget http://mirrors.rit.edu/centos/5.2/os/x86_64/CentOS/rpm-4.4.2-48.el5.x86_ 64.rpm # wget http://mirrors.rit.edu/centos/5.2/os/x86_64/CentOS/rpm-build-4.4.2-48.el 5.x86_64.rpm # wget http://mirrors.rit.edu/centos/5.2/os/x86_64/CentOS/rpm-libs-4.4.2-48.el5 .i386.rpm # wget http://mirrors.rit.edu/centos/5.2/os/x86_64/CentOS/rpm-python-4.4.2-48.e l5.x86_64.rpm It took some testing but because we are rolling back several packages RPM handled the dependencies a little weird but here's the rpm command that does all the magic. # rpm -Uvh --oldpackage --nodeps popt-1.10.2-48.el5.x86_64.rpm rpm-4.4.2-48.el5.x86_64.rpm rpm-libs-4.4.2-48.el5.i386.rpm rpm-python-4.4.2-48.el5.x86_64.rpm --nodeps is required because rpm complains about needing to fill some dependencies for 4.4.2-48 but we are in fact trying to install those very dependencies so we have to tell rpm not to bother. If you are concerned throw in a --test switch to make sure everything goes well. I never like using rpm to roll back rpm, just seems dangerous, like crossing the streams. After rolling back to the CentOS 5.2 versions of popt, rpm, rpm-libs and rpm-python I am able to successfully init the epel-5-i386 mock root. I tested several times and made sure to clear the build root and yum caches in my tests. Farkas' suggested this might be a bug in rpm or popt which seems to hold true. Clearly between point releases something changed that caused rpm to behave slightly differently when it comes to ordering transactions. I am comfortable now using the slightly outdated RPMs but I wonder what will happen in CentOS 5.4/5.5 and so on. Regards, -Alan KEYWORDS: mock 0.9.14, CentOS 5.3, coreutils 5.97, pam 0.99.6.2 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Welcome to the "CentOS" mailing list
My apologies for posting an already solved problem, but dont know if its my ignorance that is not getting me to my desired results.trying to mount an external usb hard drive(ntfs) in my system. In my CentOS box, I tried to install dkms, dkms-fuse, fuse and fuse-ntfs-3g as follows(including what happened) [r...@production mnt]# yum install dkms dkms-fuse fuse fuse-ntfs-3g Setting up Install Process Setting up repositories Reading repository metadata in from local files Parsing package install arguments Resolving Dependencies --> Populating transaction set with selected packages. Please wait. ---> Package dkms.noarch 0:2.0.20.4-1.el4.rf set to be updated ---> Package fuse-ntfs-3g.x86_64 0:2009.4.4-2.el4.rf set to be updated ---> Package fuse.x86_64 0:2.7.4-1.el4.rf set to be updated ---> Package dkms-fuse.noarch 0:2.7.4-1.nodist.rf set to be updated --> Running transaction check Dependencies Resolved = Package Arch Version RepositorySize = Installing: dkmsnoarch 2.0.20.4-1.el4.rf rpmforge 60 k dkms-fuse noarch 2.7.4-1.nodist.rf rpmforge 70 k fusex86_64 2.7.4-1.el4.rf rpmforge 254 k fuse-ntfs-3gx86_64 2009.4.4-2.el4.rf rpmforge 368 k Transaction Summary = Install 4 Package(s) Update 0 Package(s) Remove 0 Package(s) Total download size: 752 k Is this ok [y/N]: y Downloading Packages: Running Transaction Test Finished Transaction Test Transaction Test Succeeded Running Transaction Installing: fuse # [1/4] Installing: dkms # [2/4] Installing: fuse-ntfs-3g # [3/4] Installing: dkms-fuse# [4/4] Installed: dkms.noarch 0:2.0.20.4-1.el4.rf dkms-fuse.noarch 0:2.7.4-1.nodist.rf fuse.x86_64 0:2.7.4-1.el4.rf fuse-ntfs-3g.x86_64 0:2009.4.4-2.el4.rf Complete! [r...@production mnt]# The hard drive shows in GUI, but doesn't open or mount as I expected. The output of uname -a and rpm -qa|grep kernel|sort kernel-2.6.9-34.0.1.EL are: [r...@production mnt]# uname -a Linux Production 2.6.9-34.0.1.ELsmp #1 SMP Wed May 24 05:28:30 CDT 2006 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux [r...@production mnt]# rpm -qa|grep kernel|sort kernel-2.6.9-34.0.1.EL kernel-2.6.9-34.EL kernel-devel-2.6.9-78.0.22.EL kernel-smp-2.6.9-34.0.1.EL kernel-smp-2.6.9-34.EL kernel-smp-devel-2.6.9-78.0.22.EL kernel-utils-2.4-13.1.80 [r...@production mnt]# I am guessing that I am using mismatched versions of kernels but just not getting there... Tried looking all over the place for a solution, haven't had any luck yet! Thanks. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Welcome to the "CentOS" mailing list
On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 7:52 PM, Sagar Koirala wrote: > My apologies for posting an already solved problem, but dont know if its my > ignorance that is not getting me to my desired results.trying to mount > an external usb hard drive(ntfs) in my system. As far as I know you just run the following command as root: # mount -t ntfs-3g /dev/sda1 /mnt/windows Where /dev/sda1 is the location of your USB media and /mnt/windows is where you want your mountpoint to be. > The hard drive shows in GUI, but doesn't open or mount as I expected. I didn't see you run the above mount command, what did you do to mount the device? -- Best Regards, Justin Bull http://www.sohipitmhz.com/pubkey.txt (Public Key) ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Welcome to the "CentOS" mailing list
Thank you for your reply. I tried to give the mount command but got back some errors, here is the detail [r...@production mnt]# mount -t ntfs-3g /dev/sdb1 /mnt/usbdrive FATAL: Module fuse not found. Error reading bootsector: Input/output error Failed to mount '/dev/sdb1': Input/output error NTFS is either inconsistent, or there is a hardware fault, or it's a SoftRAID/FakeRAID hardware. In the first case run chkdsk /f on Windows then reboot into Windows twice. The usage of the /f parameter is very important! If the device is a SoftRAID/FakeRAID then first activate it and mount a different device under the /dev/mapper/ directory, (e.g. /dev/mapper/nvidia_eahaabcc1). Please see the 'dmraid' documentation for more details. Thanks. On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 1:01 PM, Justin Bull wrote: > On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 7:52 PM, Sagar Koirala > wrote: > > My apologies for posting an already solved problem, but dont know if its > my > > ignorance that is not getting me to my desired results.trying to > mount > > an external usb hard drive(ntfs) in my system. > > As far as I know you just run the following command as root: > > # mount -t ntfs-3g /dev/sda1 /mnt/windows > > Where /dev/sda1 is the location of your USB media and /mnt/windows is > where you want your mountpoint to be. > > > The hard drive shows in GUI, but doesn't open or mount as I expected. > > I didn't see you run the above mount command, what did you do to mount > the device? > > -- > Best Regards, > > Justin Bull > http://www.sohipitmhz.com/pubkey.txt (Public Key) > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Welcome to the "CentOS" mailing list
And yes, this is the line from /etc/fstab file: /dev/sdb1 /media/Expansion_Drive ntfs pamconsole,fscontext=system_u:object_r:removable_t,exec,noauto,managed 0 0 On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 1:06 PM, Sagar Koirala wrote: > Thank you for your reply. I tried to give the mount command but got back > some errors, here is the detail > > [r...@production mnt]# mount -t ntfs-3g /dev/sdb1 /mnt/usbdrive > > FATAL: Module fuse not found. > Error reading bootsector: Input/output error > Failed to mount '/dev/sdb1': Input/output error > NTFS is either inconsistent, or there is a hardware fault, or it's a > SoftRAID/FakeRAID hardware. In the first case run chkdsk /f on Windows > then reboot into Windows twice. The usage of the /f parameter is very > important! If the device is a SoftRAID/FakeRAID then first activate > it and mount a different device under the /dev/mapper/ directory, (e.g. > /dev/mapper/nvidia_eahaabcc1). Please see the 'dmraid' documentation > for more details. > > Thanks. > > > On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 1:01 PM, Justin Bull > wrote: > >> On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 7:52 PM, Sagar Koirala >> wrote: >> > My apologies for posting an already solved problem, but dont know if its >> my >> > ignorance that is not getting me to my desired results.trying to >> mount >> > an external usb hard drive(ntfs) in my system. >> >> As far as I know you just run the following command as root: >> >> # mount -t ntfs-3g /dev/sda1 /mnt/windows >> >> Where /dev/sda1 is the location of your USB media and /mnt/windows is >> where you want your mountpoint to be. >> >> > The hard drive shows in GUI, but doesn't open or mount as I expected. >> >> I didn't see you run the above mount command, what did you do to mount >> the device? >> >> -- >> Best Regards, >> >> Justin Bull >> http://www.sohipitmhz.com/pubkey.txt (Public Key) >> ___ >> CentOS mailing list >> CentOS@centos.org >> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos >> > > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Welcome to the "CentOS" mailing list
Hi, On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 22:52, Sagar Koirala wrote: > [r...@production mnt]# rpm -qa|grep kernel|sort kernel-2.6.9-34.0.1.EL > kernel-2.6.9-34.EL > kernel-devel-2.6.9-78.0.22.EL > kernel-smp-2.6.9-34.0.1.EL > kernel-smp-2.6.9-34.EL > kernel-smp-devel-2.6.9-78.0.22.EL > kernel-utils-2.4-13.1.80 > [r...@production mnt]# > > I am guessing that I am using mismatched versions of kernels but just not > getting there... > Tried looking all over the place for a solution, haven't had any luck yet! I guess you need a kernel-devel package that matches your running kernel. For instance, you need either a kernel-smp-devel-2.6.9-34.0.1.EL, or (better solution) install kernel-smp-2.6.9-78.0.22.EL and boot the machine with it. If you run an "yum update" or "yum update kernel-smp" it should do that, unless you messed yum.conf with excludes or changed /etc/sysconfig/kernel... By the way, next time please use a subject that describes your issue and not just 'Welcome to the "CentOS" mailing list'. HTH, Filipe ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Welcome to the "CentOS" mailing list
Now, I am getting the error messages as follows: FATAL: Module fuse not found. ntfs-3g-mount: fuse device is missing, try 'modprobe fuse' as root Thanks for any help. On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 1:09 PM, Sagar Koirala wrote: > And yes, this is the line from /etc/fstab file: > > /dev/sdb1 /media/Expansion_Drive ntfs > pamconsole,fscontext=system_u:object_r:removable_t,exec,noauto,managed 0 0 > > > > > On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 1:06 PM, Sagar Koirala wrote: > >> Thank you for your reply. I tried to give the mount command but got back >> some errors, here is the detail >> >> [r...@production mnt]# mount -t ntfs-3g /dev/sdb1 /mnt/usbdrive >> >> FATAL: Module fuse not found. >> Error reading bootsector: Input/output error >> Failed to mount '/dev/sdb1': Input/output error >> NTFS is either inconsistent, or there is a hardware fault, or it's a >> SoftRAID/FakeRAID hardware. In the first case run chkdsk /f on Windows >> then reboot into Windows twice. The usage of the /f parameter is very >> important! If the device is a SoftRAID/FakeRAID then first activate >> it and mount a different device under the /dev/mapper/ directory, (e.g. >> /dev/mapper/nvidia_eahaabcc1). Please see the 'dmraid' documentation >> for more details. >> >> Thanks. >> >> >> On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 1:01 PM, Justin Bull >> wrote: >> >>> On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 7:52 PM, Sagar Koirala >>> wrote: >>> > My apologies for posting an already solved problem, but dont know if >>> its my >>> > ignorance that is not getting me to my desired results.trying to >>> mount >>> > an external usb hard drive(ntfs) in my system. >>> >>> As far as I know you just run the following command as root: >>> >>> # mount -t ntfs-3g /dev/sda1 /mnt/windows >>> >>> Where /dev/sda1 is the location of your USB media and /mnt/windows is >>> where you want your mountpoint to be. >>> >>> > The hard drive shows in GUI, but doesn't open or mount as I expected. >>> >>> I didn't see you run the above mount command, what did you do to mount >>> the device? >>> >>> -- >>> Best Regards, >>> >>> Justin Bull >>> http://www.sohipitmhz.com/pubkey.txt (Public Key) >>> ___ >>> CentOS mailing list >>> CentOS@centos.org >>> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos >>> >> >> > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Welcome to the "CentOS" mailing list
Hi, On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 23:20, Sagar Koirala wrote: > ntfs-3g-mount: fuse device is missing, try 'modprobe fuse' as root Well, did you try running that? What are the results? Please do not top post, and trim your replies to the list. See "Guidelines for CentOS Mailing List posts" on this page: http://www.centos.org/modules/tinycontent/index.php?id=16 HTH, Filipe ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Centos 5.3 update do RHEL 5.3
On Sun, Jun 7, 2009 at 10:58 AM, Albert wrote: > Hi, > > If I now installed centos 5.3 and for 6 month I buying support from RHEL > I can change 5.3 to rhel 5.3? It's possible? > > f...@ll > > Yes. If you get the release rpm files correct and fix your repositories, it will be OK. The Centos versions may be newer at first, but the redhat versions eventually become newer and replace them. I have done this, it is not a big problem. Most of the packages installed will be the same, one a few differences will emerge. Instead of listening to people tell you they don't think it can be done, you should just try to make it work and see! If you have trouble, you can always reformat the / partition and re-install. As long as you use a simple partitioning system that keeps /home on a separate partition, it is easy to wipe & reinstall without killing your /home stuff. pj -- Paul E. Johnson Professor, Political Science 1541 Lilac Lane, Room 504 University of Kansas ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] problem mounting ntfs device in centos
I did yum update kernel-smp and rebooted the machine, and blops.the drive opened! Thanks for your help! On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 1:24 PM, Filipe Brandenburger wrote: > Hi, > > On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 23:20, Sagar Koirala > wrote: > > ntfs-3g-mount: fuse device is missing, try 'modprobe fuse' as root > > Well, did you try running that? What are the results? > > Please do not top post, and trim your replies to the list. See > "Guidelines for CentOS Mailing List posts" on this page: > http://www.centos.org/modules/tinycontent/index.php?id=16 > > HTH, > Filipe > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] authentication loosely tied to active directory?
On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 5:29 PM, Ross Walker wrote: > On Jun 5, 2009, at 1:00 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > >> What's the best authentication scheme when you are dealing with an >> active directory that someone else controls? I've been using pam >> configured for smb and local passwords where a local account is needed >> for real logins (but either the domain or local password will work) >> and >> web services don't require a local account. That's most of the >> functionality I want and it doesn't take pre-arrangement with the AD >> administrator, but I have to glue mod_auth_pam into httpd and I'm not >> sure how to duplicate it for java web services. >> >> Is there a way to use an LDAP proxy in a similar way so I can add >> accounts of my own but also accept anything from one or more AD's? Or >> some better approach entirely? > > We use winbind with rid mapping for user/group ids and kerberos for > authentication where I am and it works well and provides SSO for the > whole windows domain, even LDAP which we use as an address book. > > You can map ranges of user/group ids to particular domains and it > doesn't require any local accounts or manual setting of user ids. > > You can map those winbind accounts to unix groups globally through NIS. > > If your network is large setup a couple of rid mapping servers with > winbind that then re-export those maps through NIS to keep things > consistent. Just make sure your NIS make maps uses getent and winbind > is set to enumerate user/groups. Make sure no passwords are in there, > only kerberos accounts. > > -Ross > Hey, Ross: How do you do this without cooperation from the administrator of the AD servers? I can't make any progress at all as long as the administrators tell me to go to hell. pam_smb is the only way I can make this work without administrator intervention -- Paul E. Johnson Professor, Political Science 1541 Lilac Lane, Room 504 University of Kansas ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] problem mounting ntfs device in centos
I don't believe there are people like me :), doing things first and then reading "pre-requirements" later. Sincere thanks for your help that came through all the top-posted replies !! :) Cheers! ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 13:27 -0700, John R Pierce wrote: > operating systems, servers like Apache, Sendmail, Postfix, things like > Java JVM innards, those are written in C/C++ Mostly, yes. There is some assembly in most OSs. And, they're mostly in C. If you have to sink to C++ to get your programmers to code properly, you need new programmers. Dave ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
At the risk of adding more wood to this fire... On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 11:04, Les Mikesell wrote: > Yes but it has been obvious for a long time that python does not > consider backwards compatibility to be important. Not true. There is a 2to3 program bundled with Python 3 that will take care of most issues in the migration of Python 2 to Python 3. It's true that some changes will affect scripts in a way that 2to3 can't help, but those are mainly issues with the introduction of the distinctions of "bytes" and "characters" in Python 3, which IMO are a much needed feature. Python 1 to 2 also introduced many changes, but AFAIR there were only new (more OO-like) ways to do things, the old ones (not so OO) became "deprecated" but scripts continued to work. But this was ages ago and I don't think it's that relevant to this discussion... > By comparison, perl has been around longer and > through more changes and yet about the only thing you might have to > check on a program written for perl 1.x to run under 5.x would be > whether you have @ in double-quoted strings that you wanted to remain > literal. Excuse me? Have you heard about Perl 6? It's a complete rewrite of the grammar of the language. They even want to change "." as the concatenation operator. If not by the fact that they started working on it about 7 or 8 years ago and it is complete vaporware, it would be have been a *major* compatibility breaking change. Now, talking about Java, that's a nightmare... I, as a sysadmin, have to maintain three or four JVM versions around in my machines, because each developer needs a different one of them. Some say their code must run in 1.5 and is not compatible with 1.6, some use GWT and need a 32-bit JVM, I also need another 32-bit 1.6 JRE for Firefox which is more stable, now there is OpenJDK (which does not have browser plug-in) to complete the mess. One of the developers said he needed jdk_1.5.0_06 and he would not use jdk_1.5.0_15jpp because he was not sure that the results would be the same. Not to mention that they have very specific constraints on the versions of Tomcat and all the other components... And while it is possible (though I doubt it) that a Java program written in JDK 1.0.2 would still run in OpenJDK 1.6, the language is completely changed, most methods were deprecated, there are new ways to do *everything* from strings to basic I/O (Input/Output Streams -> Readers/Writers) to Class Templates (whatever they call them) to Graphic UI (AWT -> Swing -> whatever they're using today) to Databases and threading/networking. I learned Java 10 years ago and did not keep up... my knowledge of it is worth almost zero today. I won't say one is better than the other. Each one has its advantages and its own problems. You should choose one based on your personal choice, and learn how to switch to another one for a specific project if it seems it could be the right tool for the job. On different e-mails, Rudi Ahlers wrote: > I can do most of this in PHP, but I do think PHP is a bit slow for this, > being a scripting language, and not a compiled language. > [...] > I'm not very fond of JAVA, since it's rather slow. > [...] > Well, it's my understanding that compiled languages perform much > better than scripting languages for this kind of operating > [...] > I had a look at it, and other control panels as well, but really don't > like it, and don't really want to "interfere" with the GNU stuff. The > CP I have in mind will most probably be for in-house use, but also > for client's use. > [...] > CentOS would be my primary OS of choice, but I suppose it would be > good to make the code more portable, and accommodate other Linux > distro's, and probably OS's > [...] > But would PHP be able to perform all tasks that PERL / C++ can? > [...] > I have done some PERL coding on websites before, but very little, yet > it was very easy to pickup with my PHP skills. > As a front-end, I would consider Ruby, and / or AJAX. Could these > inteface well with PERL? > [...] > AJAX is quicker to the end user than Ruby > [...] > So, from what I've gathered here, it could be a good idea to work with > PERL + Ruby, and then add AJAX for the interface. Rudy, It's clear by now that you don't know what you want. Worse, you want something that is flexible and portable enough, and yet you want to use 4 or 5 different languages (that you haven't learned yet!) to build it and handle the complex interactions between them. And yet you believe you won't fall into the security pitfalls of writing not only a web application, but one that interacts with the core components of the OS. Do yourself (and us all!) a favor and just "hack" one of the existing control panels to do what you need on your setup. And if you'll do extensive programming (meaning more than one line fixes) on it, choose one written in PHP which is the language you already know and master. On the other hand, if what you want is to learn new languages, choose one and
Re: [CentOS] problem mounting ntfs device in centos
Hi, On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 23:49, Sagar Koirala wrote: > I don't believe there are people like me :), doing things first and then > reading "pre-requirements" later. Don't worry, you are not the first, and sadly will not be the last... :-) > Sincere thanks for your help that came through all the top-posted replies !! > :) Glad to help! Happy to see your problem is fixed. Cheers, Filipe ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 15:31 -0500, Lanny Marcus wrote: > If we had the processing power (and all the incredibly cheap HW that > exists today), in the 80's, I wouldn't have had to write such > efficient assembly language code... Much easier today, with cheap RAM, > etc. C++ for an old timer, takes awhile to get an understanding of, > because of the OO, but as a book I have says, before OO, approximately > 50% of the projects ended in failure. I believe that is on the low > side. Never used Pascal (wasn't that a teaching language?, but I did > use PL/M-86. OO is fine. Today, at least, there are much better implementations of in java, python, etc. C++ is just tortuous. The pascal p-code implementation was, IIRC, implemented by UCSD. Pascal was then popularized by Borland. Ahh for the good old days, when men were men, and memory upgrades involved fork lifts. Dave ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Centos 5.3 update do RHEL 5.3
Hi, On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 23:27, Paul Johnson wrote: > Yes. If you get the release rpm files correct and fix your > repositories, it will be OK. [...] > > Instead of listening to people tell you they don't think it can be > done, you should just try to make it work and see! You really miss the point... The whole reason of using RHEL instead of CentOS is Red Hat's support. If you don't need or have their support, using RHEL is actually *worse* than using CentOS, as you won't have updates. On the other hand, if you call Red Hat to ask for help to fix an issue and it turns out they find out you "upgraded" a CentOS into a Red Hat server, they will certainly refuse to help you (and would be right to do it). If you really need Red Hat, you should do a clean install. Period. Upgrading from any other existing Linux install would be the same as aiming the shotgun towards your own foot... HTH, Filipe ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
On Mon, 2009-06-15 at 15:33 -0500, Les Mikesell wrote: > David G. Mackay wrote: > > Well, I try to make my searches specific to what I'm looking for. The > > more key words that I can throw at it, the less extraneous cruft comes > > up. > > That doesn't mesh very well with finding stuff that you don't know > exists yet. For example there is a nice pure-java clone of rrdtool > called jrobin that opennms uses to store and graph time-series values. > But if you didn't already know that, how would you find it? Even the > bigger things like cifs-in-java don't seem to be very well exposed. True, but if I don't know that it exists, I'm probably not trying to find it. To find out about the items that are, to me, unknown, I do things like subscribing to technical mailing lists, etc. Then, there are sites like java.net that specialize in java. Dave ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Centos 5.3 update do RHEL 5.3
Just in case you want the steps:- Steps to convert a CentOS5 system to RHEL5 SYSTEM= ARCH=i386|x86_64 ssh $SYSTEM rpm -e --nodeps centos-release rpm --import RPM-GPG-KEY-redhat-release rpm -ivh rhn-setup-0.4.19-17.el5.noarch.rpm rhn-client-tools-0.4.19-17.el5.noarch.rpm rhnsd-4.6.1-1.el5.$ARCH.rpm \ rhn-check-0.4.19-17.el5.noarch.rpm yum-rhn-plugin-0.5.3-30.el5.noarch.rpm rhnlib-2.2.6-2.el5.noarch.rpm \ pyOpenSSL-0.6-1.p24.7.2.2.$ARCH.rpm \ redhat-release-5Server-5.3.0.3.$ARCH.rpm rhn_register Follow the prompts, after registering the system with redhat:- yum -y update Regards Phil. Filipe Brandenburger wrote: > Hi, > > On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 23:27, Paul Johnson wrote: > >> Yes. If you get the release rpm files correct and fix your >> repositories, it will be OK. [...] >> >> Instead of listening to people tell you they don't think it can be >> done, you should just try to make it work and see! >> > > You really miss the point... The whole reason of using RHEL instead of > CentOS is Red Hat's support. If you don't need or have their support, > using RHEL is actually *worse* than using CentOS, as you won't have > updates. > > On the other hand, if you call Red Hat to ask for help to fix an issue > and it turns out they find out you "upgraded" a CentOS into a Red Hat > server, they will certainly refuse to help you (and would be right to > do it). > > If you really need Red Hat, you should do a clean install. Period. > Upgrading from any other existing Linux install would be the same as > aiming the shotgun towards your own foot... > > HTH, > Filipe > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Centos 5.3 update do RHEL 5.3
Filipe Brandenburger wrote: > > If you really need Red Hat, you should do a clean install. Period. ++ ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] which programming language for server-side admin tasks
Filipe Brandenburger wrote: > At the risk of adding more wood to this fire... > > On Mon, Jun 15, 2009 at 11:04, Les Mikesell wrote: >> Yes but it has been obvious for a long time that python does not >> consider backwards compatibility to be important. > > Not true. There is a 2to3 program bundled with Python 3 that will take > care of most issues in the migration of Python 2 to Python 3. It's > true that some changes will affect scripts in a way that 2to3 can't > help, but those are mainly issues with the introduction of the > distinctions of "bytes" and "characters" in Python 3, which IMO are a > much needed feature. So there are parts that will change in mysterious ways that not even a pre-planned translator can fix predictably... And you'd like me to let something like that have administrative control of my machines? No, thanks. > Python 1 to 2 also introduced many changes, but AFAIR there were only > new (more OO-like) ways to do things, the old ones (not so OO) became > "deprecated" but scripts continued to work. But this was ages ago and > I don't think it's that relevant to this discussion... The scripts did not continue to work. I remember updating a Red Hat machine probably in the 6.x era and having mailman just stop working because of a gratuitous syntax change. >> By comparison, perl has been around longer and >> through more changes and yet about the only thing you might have to >> check on a program written for perl 1.x to run under 5.x would be >> whether you have @ in double-quoted strings that you wanted to remain >> literal. > > Excuse me? Have you heard about Perl 6? It's a complete rewrite of the > grammar of the language. They even want to change "." as the > concatenation operator. If not by the fact that they started working > on it about 7 or 8 years ago and it is complete vaporware, it would be > have been a *major* compatibility breaking change. Yes, I know about perl 6 and the fact that the developers have been responsible enough not to release it in a form that will break perl <6 programs. And I expect it to stay that way. Plus, perl has always been designed to support multiple concurrent installations although RPM packaging doesn't deal with it well. > Now, talking about Java, that's a nightmare... I, as a sysadmin, have > to maintain three or four JVM versions around in my machines, because > each developer needs a different one of them. Blame Red Hat for most of that. If they had shipped a working version or worked together with Sun to provide an easy third party RPM install that landed in the expected place, nobody would have used anything else. > Some say their code must > run in 1.5 and is not compatible with 1.6, 1.6 has some bugs, depending on the version. > some use GWT and need a > 32-bit JVM, That's a quirk of their hosted mode for debugging and should eventually have a workaround. I don't think it matters where the production runtime runs - I'm fairly sure OpenNMS uses gwt and I have both 32 and 64 bit JVMs running it unchanged. They package all the compiled java as noarch rpms. > I also need another 32-bit 1.6 JRE for Firefox which is > more stable, now there is OpenJDK (which does not have browser > plug-in) to complete the mess. Again, blame Red Hat packaging. > One of the developers said he needed > jdk_1.5.0_06 and he would not use jdk_1.5.0_15jpp because he was not > sure that the results would be the same. Too lazy to try and see? That seems very unlikely to break. > Not to mention that they have > very specific constraints on the versions of Tomcat and all the other > components... And while it is possible (though I doubt it) that a Java > program written in JDK 1.0.2 would still run in OpenJDK 1.6, the > language is completely changed, most methods were deprecated, there > are new ways to do *everything* from strings to basic I/O > (Input/Output Streams -> Readers/Writers) to Class Templates (whatever > they call them) to Graphic UI (AWT -> Swing -> whatever they're using > today) to Databases and threading/networking. I learned Java 10 years > ago and did not keep up... my knowledge of it is worth almost zero > today. Agreed on that point, but the changes are big improvements and I think you are judging the language comparing a decade old version to next year's python which seems a bit unfair. And as you obviously know, it it fairly self-contained and easy to run multiple versions concurrently although again, rpm packaging and the alternatives system don't really understand this concept very well. > I won't say one is better than the other. Each one has its advantages > and its own problems. You should choose one based on your personal > choice, and learn how to switch to another one for a specific project > if it seems it could be the right tool for the job. The unfortunate thing is that as projects evolve, you end up finding parts of what you want in one language and other parts in different ones so you
Re: [CentOS] authentication loosely tied to active directory?
Paul Johnson wrote: > On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 5:29 PM, Ross Walker wrote: >> On Jun 5, 2009, at 1:00 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: >> >>> What's the best authentication scheme when you are dealing with an >>> active directory that someone else controls? I've been using pam >>> configured for smb and local passwords where a local account is needed >>> for real logins (but either the domain or local password will work) >>> and >>> web services don't require a local account. That's most of the >>> functionality I want and it doesn't take pre-arrangement with the AD >>> administrator, but I have to glue mod_auth_pam into httpd and I'm not >>> sure how to duplicate it for java web services. >>> >>> Is there a way to use an LDAP proxy in a similar way so I can add >>> accounts of my own but also accept anything from one or more AD's? Or >>> some better approach entirely? >> We use winbind with rid mapping for user/group ids and kerberos for >> authentication where I am and it works well and provides SSO for the >> whole windows domain, even LDAP which we use as an address book. >> >> You can map ranges of user/group ids to particular domains and it >> doesn't require any local accounts or manual setting of user ids. >> >> You can map those winbind accounts to unix groups globally through NIS. >> >> If your network is large setup a couple of rid mapping servers with >> winbind that then re-export those maps through NIS to keep things >> consistent. Just make sure your NIS make maps uses getent and winbind >> is set to enumerate user/groups. Make sure no passwords are in there, >> only kerberos accounts. >> >> -Ross >> > > > Hey, Ross: > > How do you do this without cooperation from the administrator of the > AD servers? I can't make any progress at all as long as the > administrators tell me to go to hell. pam_smb is the only way I can > make this work without administrator intervention Same here - which is why I raised the question. Although I probably could get permission to join the domain I want to be able to add users on the Linux side that don't exist in AD. Pam_smb works but I think something that used LDAP would be better if the ldap server could have local entries and proxy for the AD. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] nvidia dual monitor setup centos howto
>-Original Message- >From: centos-boun...@centos.org [mailto:centos-boun...@centos.org] On Behalf >Of Dave >Sent: Tuesday, June 16, 2009 2:23 AM >To: centOS mailing list >Subject: [CentOS] nvidia dual monitor setup centos howto > >[...] >yum install nvidia-x11-drv.x86_64 > >[...] >Which versions of RH or FC correspond reasonably well to >my version of centos? >uname -a >Linux 2.6.18-128.1.10.el5 #1 SMP Thu May 7 10:35:59 EDT 2009 x86_64 >x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux I use CentOS 5.3 i386/x86_64 flavours If I were you I'd look more into dkms and the dkms-nvidia-packages. Those are more current, than the driver package in nvidia-x11*. Or if all else fails, why not get the proprietary Nvidia drivers? -- /Sorin smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
