Re: [Ayatana] Is it time we killed "minimize to tray" ?
On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 3:38 PM, Luke Benstead wrote: > > It's because of this shortage of space that I believe "minimize to > tray" exists. Minimize to tray is essentially "I don't need this > window cluttering up my taskbar, but I need to leave it running" and > the only reason I can think that normal bog-standard minimize isn't > suitable here is because the window-switcher is cluttered and the > window gets in the way. > > I haven't used DockbarX and I have no idea what form a good solution might take, but I agree completely with your take on the 'purpose' of minimize to tray. You hit it right on the nail. A better functioning taskbar would eliminate the need for yet another desktop metaphor. There are too many on the desktop at the moment (double click icons, oh-no, that's a toolbar shortcut, single click that one, single click menu entries and web-links - oh, sorry forgot to mention, that feature is in the right click menu - got all that?!) These are all concepts that work fine individually, but collectively, they are a barrier to achieving fluency and productivity on the desktop for new and experienced (but confused) users. Even experienced users have never mastered these, but rather learned to live 'in the mystery'. I've seen this in large corporate environments where the computer was a means to the end and not a part of the actual business' product or service portfolio. Get rid of minimize to tray? Yes. But not by adding another desktop metaphor. Let's improve on an existing one, or eliminate a few with a superior one. Jarlath ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Is it time we killed "minimize to tray" ?
On Wed, May 5, 2010 at 10:57 PM, Gavin Langdon wrote: > I don't think a standard shouldn't be adopted just because of the chance > that an application won't use it properly. > I agree with you. I mostly mean that the form of the standard may need to be assertive in some areas, for example as the current indicator area does by not providing the applications tooltips. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Ayatana] Progress dialogs & minimising applications
I had an operation running on an open document today. During the operation, further use of the application is not possible: http://images.jarlath.multiply.com/image/1/photos/17/600x600/1/progress.png?et=pMgx3nnyrF6eyBHZJlGqXw&nmid=339355362 So I minimized the application to get on with something else in the mean time. But of course, I can't see the progress then. I was fantasising at how great it would be to have something like this for a minimized app: http://images.jarlath.multiply.com/image/1/photos/17/600x600/2/p-desktop.png?et=lztbS%2BxwhD9LOUNQSMavBA&nmid=339355362 These are time consuming operations because they are processor intensive and lock you out of the GUI while being performed. I'm thinking that maybe the casual user will not encounter this situation with the default apps though, except for example when Evolution does a large IMAP or POP download, or when updates are being installed. But I think it could be interesting... ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] What do to about right-clicking on the indicator-applet?
When I'm teaching people how to use computers - I tell them to think of the right button as the 'menu button' (the word *context* is off-putting to many). This drastically improves their ability to interact with the desktop and predict what behaviour is expected of them. It makes sense to them and it's consistent; left button to 'activate' things, right to 'operate'. They generally learn faster then as operations like copy / paste become discoverable. *(The only thing that catches them out is when to single-click and when to double-click, but explaining the difference between the file-manager, desktop, web-browser and toolbars etc comes later. )* Having a different menu for each button seems to fall between two lines of thinking and personally, I get caught out all the time by the current setup - I can't remember which button to click to get the menu I want because to me there is no sense to it. I can't make a distinction between the two menus without getting very anal and that's not a good thing for users in general I believe, assuming I'm not very alone of course. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] GNOME Main Menu and the Distribution Logo
Aesthetically speaking, I can only imagine the logo looking respectable in a corner. Or at least, I'm having a hard time imagining it anywhere else and look credible. I think it's fine as it is, but it's an interesting idea. The systems mentioned ( Mac and Windows ), they are positioned in the most interactive or important location. So in these terms, Ubuntu has it right - but I take the point about the logo and applications not being synonymous. Some options that come to mind: 1) Don't have the logo highlighted with the Applications text when the menu is displayed. This would disassociate the logo, but look a bit disjointed and over-involved in my opinion. 2) As suggested, make the logo the System menu. I prefer having the system menu labelled however. The first thing I say when showing someone Gnome is how the "Start" button has lots of different functions pureed into one crowded area, but here it's thought out a bit better. It gives them a lot of confidence in the system and they usually react by saying how the never realized how confused they were by the windows menu until they saw it done better (go Gnome!!) 3) Replace the power button on the right with the brand. Not exactly a proud place to put your brand - on the back-door mat. 4) I like the number four, but I can't think of and idea to put here. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Start Menu Concept
On Sun, Jun 20, 2010 at 6:10 PM, David Hamm wrote: > http://i.imgur.com/0bC6I.jpg > > This is what I imagine purgatory to be. A vortex of eternal clicking. Personally, I abhorr scrollbars and tabs in a menu - especially one accessed as frequently as a launcher. I think it will be a real challenge to improve upon the current Gnome offering. Whatever happens, I hope that the 'two click rule' isn't let slide and that scrolling and tabbing aren't introduced. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Start Menu Concept
On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 2:18 AM, David Hamm wrote: > I'll match your quote, "This is what I imagine purgatory to be. A vortex of > eternal clicking." > > with a quote, "imo, id have just applications and recent with a side arrow > to expand either, knocking out the places when expanded." > Expansion could be good. Detecting when the mouse is near the menu edge and adding more offerings. For speedy usage, I usually like those kind of things to be mundane and predictable though. > > so in essence it would by default look like the windows start menu, with a > (new recent tab), and an expand tab like gshell. There is no way to show all > applications without a scroll bar, or more then one click... > Gnome is doing it at the moment. One click to launch the menu, and one more to choose the program. You can even scroll large menus just by putting your mouse arrow at the bottom of the list. You can try this by reducing your monitor resolution to say 800x600 and using the System->Preferences menu. > thanks for reading guys > Thanks for the creative idea. I was also thinking that if the "Devices" and "Places" in your mockup were labelled, like they are now in Gnome, it would look more organized. What do you think? ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Do you want to delete the applet from your configuration?
On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 10:13 AM, Luke Benstead wrote: > Hi all, > > Here's this week's bug bear of mine: > http://img258.imageshack.us/img258/6311/as7ob3.png > > ... > 2. happens. And 90% of the time, a killall gnome-panel gets it working > again. Surely Gnome panel should attempt to reload it again at least once > before producing the delete/don't delete ultimatum? If it really won't load, > we should have a slightly better dialog box with a "Report this bug" type > feature (how exactly do you report an applet bug?) > > Thoughts? > > Luke. > I agree with you 100%. I didn't even know how do properly communicate this problem so I never brought it up. Are there any bug reports on this already in upstream gnome? Jarlath ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Ayatana] Redundant information on window "bar"?
After using Unity for the last week or so, the cleanliness and focus of the desktop makes an eyesore of anything unnecessary or out of place. Subjective, I know - but in the screenshot below, should the window bar not be textless? Natty.desktop Description: application/desktop ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Redundant information on window "bar"?
On Mon, Mar 14, 2011 at 2:19 PM, Marco Biscaro wrote: > If you are talking about the text on title bar, it is there by design > (because when you are working with non-maximized windows, you need to > know where and what are each of them). > > On Dom, 2011-03-13 at 22:48 -0600, Ian Santopietro wrote: > > I do agree somewhat, though it is useful for finding the identity of > > non-focused windows. > Good point, I hadn't thought of that. > > > > On Mar 13, 2011 10:35 PM, "Jarlath Reidy" > > wrote: > > > After using Unity for the last week or so, the cleanliness and focus > > of the > > > desktop makes an eyesore of anything unnecessary or out of place. > > > Subjective, I know - but in the screenshot below, should the window > > bar not > > > be textless? > > > > ___ > > Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > > Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net > > Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana > > More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp > > > ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Ayatana] Search in Nautilus needs a minor improvement
To quote myself on the forums here: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1783813 "I want to search for a file and I don't know which of my hard disks it is on. So in Nautilus, I choose the 'Computer' icon from the toolbar and search from there. But it seem that from this view you can only search for the 'presence' of drives, i.e. find their icons. I don't think the average user will get this and I certainly don't. How do I search for my file without opening a Nautilus window for each drive?" It turns out that I needed to choose "filesystem" - the most cryptically labelled entry on the side pane - to get the functionality I was looking for. Personally, I think that the behaviour that I was expecting - searching from the "Computer" location - makes much more sense. Would this not be far better? J ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] Search in Nautilus needs a minor improvement
Hi Frederik, Ayatana doesn't have this problem, we are equipped with semantic search in > the Dash, that solves it for us. This only finds files I have already used - so it is not really a search of any part of the filesystem, only my recently used files. By the way, you ought to try Nautilus 3 because the sidebar is > arranged differently now. While you'd probably still need to select > File System for what you're wanting to do, there is no Computer button > to confuse you. Of course, the Nautilus developers aren't going to > make design changes to Nautilus 2; if you're going to report a design > bug, you ought to be using at least the latest stable version of the > software, if not the development version. > > Jeremy Bicha > I hadn't thought of that Jeremy, maybe it will be a bit clearer in Gnome 3. I still think that when I want to search for a file that could be anywhere there is a fundamental problem. At the moment, no search feature I can find on Natty operates centrally or encompasses all filesystems. If nautilus design is out of the hands of developers / designers here then it should be addressed at the unity level. I've been reading about Lenses. I think instead of having to add a lens to have full search functionality, the existing search could be improved in the following way: 1) I choose from Unity launcher to search "Files & Folders". 2) I type "Very Old Document.odt" (which is stored on a seperate disk mounted as /media/Backups with the label "Backups") 3) Instead of only being told "Your seach did not match any files.", you could in this case append the message with "Would you like to search the entire computer?" or "Did you mean 'Very Old Document.odt' from the disk labelled 'Backups'?". Jarlath ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
