Re: [9fans] Arduino programming on plan 9
It turns out it's all in that repo, as the os subdirectory On Thu, 2 Jan 2025, 23:53 Ron Minnich, wrote: > I think somebody who knows where all the bits are could do us a favor > and provide a little writeup on how to do this. I'm lost. > > On Thu, Jan 2, 2025 at 1:12 PM Charles Forsyth > wrote: > > > > i think davros ought to be out there somewhere too > > > > On Thu, 2 Jan 2025 at 20:36, Karin Willers wrote: > >> > >> there is a Plan 9 C compiler za/zc/zl available at > >> https://github.com/forsyth/avr > >> > >> On 1/1/25 14:47, sirjofri wrote: > >> > Hi everyone, happy new year, > >> > > >> > Out of curiosity, I wanted to ask if someone has any experience with > programming arduino boards on plan 9. The question is not only about > writing code and compiling it (as that is probably possible), but > especially for sending the binary over to the chip to make it work. > >> > > >> > I don't know enough about what protocols are used for that, and how > easy they are to implement, or maybe if we even have something like that > already using xyz-modem or whatever. > >> > > >> > Did anyone do experiments on that already, using plan 9? > >> > > >> > sirjofri > >> > >> > > > > 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options > Permalink -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Te49c9f35d98406f5-M4257b09b7452427ae940f0a6 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] NIX experience
On Wed, Jan 1, 2025 at 4:35 AM wrote: > Is the number of TC fixed, or is it at least one TC and the number > can increase if needed (or, put it differently, can a AC, if needed, > switch to a TC and vice-versa)? Fixed, I believe, at boot time? I no longer recall. Nemo and lsub did experiment with dynamic counts, but I came from an HPC/LinuxBios background: nodes boot in seconds, so I did not worry about "fixed at boot time" type issues. Want to change configuration? reboot. Starting a new job? reboot. And so on. > Had you the opportunity to measure how "bad" some application > workloads could be because the number of TC---after the > initialization period---exceeded largely the number of AC with a not zero > pointer? > That would be good to do, now that we have machines with hundreds of cores. > Theoretically, could a machine with different kind of cores, perhaps with > differing architectures (specialized cores) but sharing at least > with a common MMU read/write (data) pages (for the kernel shared > data: locks and so on) be possible, with a system such as NIX in fact > scheduling to the matching kind of AC core for the task to be run? You have that already, nowadays, starting with big/little, and moving to the intel CPUs with widely varying core types. Esperanto has specialized cores too. I think having incompatible architectures is already there, too, with GPUs and smart nics like the AWS and Google ones. Well, hmm, that kind of "sharing with compatible MMU" was started by quadrics in the 90s, so it's not new. This has been a very interesting discussion, thanks all. My offer remains: if anyone wants to revive NIX, I am happy to help. ron -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T7692a612f26c8ec5-M7cfd8da69529213fcf4e109f Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] Arduino programming on plan 9
I noticed a few directories were still GPL; they are now MIT. On Fri, 3 Jan 2025 at 07:53, Charles Forsyth wrote: > It turns out it's all in that repo, as the os subdirectory > > On Thu, 2 Jan 2025, 23:53 Ron Minnich, wrote: > >> I think somebody who knows where all the bits are could do us a favor >> and provide a little writeup on how to do this. I'm lost. >> >> On Thu, Jan 2, 2025 at 1:12 PM Charles Forsyth >> wrote: >> > >> > i think davros ought to be out there somewhere too >> > >> > On Thu, 2 Jan 2025 at 20:36, Karin Willers wrote: >> >> >> >> there is a Plan 9 C compiler za/zc/zl available at >> >> https://github.com/forsyth/avr >> >> >> >> On 1/1/25 14:47, sirjofri wrote: >> >> > Hi everyone, happy new year, >> >> > >> >> > Out of curiosity, I wanted to ask if someone has any experience with >> programming arduino boards on plan 9. The question is not only about >> writing code and compiling it (as that is probably possible), but >> especially for sending the binary over to the chip to make it work. >> >> > >> >> > I don't know enough about what protocols are used for that, and how >> easy they are to implement, or maybe if we even have something like that >> already using xyz-modem or whatever. >> >> > >> >> > Did anyone do experiments on that already, using plan 9? >> >> > >> >> > sirjofri >> >> >> >> >> > >> > 9fans / 9fans / see discussions + participants + delivery options >> Permalink -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/Te49c9f35d98406f5-M35870a7cf37489244e5d6d8b Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] NIX experience
Just saw a review of System76 Thelio Astra (Ampere Altra). An arm64 system with 128 cores and 512GB of memory for under $7500. NIX's model seems more and more applicable to commodity hardware. On Fri, Jan 3, 2025, 11:11 AM Ron Minnich wrote: > On Wed, Jan 1, 2025 at 4:35 AM wrote: > > Is the number of TC fixed, or is it at least one TC and the number > > can increase if needed (or, put it differently, can a AC, if needed, > > switch to a TC and vice-versa)? > > Fixed, I believe, at boot time? I no longer recall. Nemo and lsub did > experiment > with dynamic counts, but I came from an HPC/LinuxBios background: > nodes boot in seconds, > so I did not worry about "fixed at boot time" type issues. Want to > change configuration? reboot. > Starting a new job? reboot. And so on. > > > Had you the opportunity to measure how "bad" some application > > workloads could be because the number of TC---after the > > initialization period---exceeded largely the number of AC with a not zero > > pointer? > > > > That would be good to do, now that we have machines with hundreds of cores. > > > Theoretically, could a machine with different kind of cores, perhaps with > > differing architectures (specialized cores) but sharing at least > > with a common MMU read/write (data) pages (for the kernel shared > > data: locks and so on) be possible, with a system such as NIX in fact > > scheduling to the matching kind of AC core for the task to be run? > > You have that already, nowadays, starting with big/little, and moving > to the intel > CPUs with widely varying core types. Esperanto has specialized cores too. > > I think having incompatible architectures is already there, too, with > GPUs and smart nics like the AWS and Google ones. > Well, hmm, that kind of "sharing with compatible MMU" was started by > quadrics in the 90s, so it's not new. > > This has been a very interesting discussion, thanks all. My offer > remains: if anyone wants to revive NIX, I am happy to help. > > ron -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T7692a612f26c8ec5-M719d20d891666bd4836e4a53 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
Re: [9fans] NIX experience
On Fri, Jan 03, 2025 at 12:32:55PM -0800, Skip Tavakkolian wrote: > Just saw a review of System76 Thelio Astra (Ampere Altra). An arm64 system > with 128 cores and 512GB of memory for under $7500. NIX's model seems more > and more applicable to commodity hardware. > Since there is a plan9 foundation now, and there will be soon (May 22-24, 2025) the 11th International Workshop on Plan9, there are means to put everything together, theory and practice, for example by choosing and buying hardware fit for testing ideas---I would be personnally OK to contribute for some hundreds of $ to the foundation for this. And the goal is, as usual, to find a thundering advertisement. For example: Demonstrate that if the right OS principles were used, and the right software, the savings in electricity for computation of weather evolution and generation of academic papers would be so huge, that the Earth will indeed be facing a glaciation age and not a global warming, so that Miami would be one of the hugest ski resort in the world, exploiting ski slopes on icebergs floating near its costs---put in other words: that this is the modelisations and the diarrhea of academic papers (using TeXlive and not kerTeX :-^) on the present OSes and with the present software that are responsible for the "global warming". > On Fri, Jan 3, 2025, 11:11?AM Ron Minnich wrote: > > > On Wed, Jan 1, 2025 at 4:35?AM wrote: > > > Is the number of TC fixed, or is it at least one TC and the number > > > can increase if needed (or, put it differently, can a AC, if needed, > > > switch to a TC and vice-versa)? > > > > Fixed, I believe, at boot time? I no longer recall. Nemo and lsub did > > experiment > > with dynamic counts, but I came from an HPC/LinuxBios background: > > nodes boot in seconds, > > so I did not worry about "fixed at boot time" type issues. Want to > > change configuration? reboot. > > Starting a new job? reboot. And so on. > > > > > Had you the opportunity to measure how "bad" some application > > > workloads could be because the number of TC---after the > > > initialization period---exceeded largely the number of AC with a not zero > > > pointer? > > > > > > > That would be good to do, now that we have machines with hundreds of cores. > > > > > Theoretically, could a machine with different kind of cores, perhaps with > > > differing architectures (specialized cores) but sharing at least > > > with a common MMU read/write (data) pages (for the kernel shared > > > data: locks and so on) be possible, with a system such as NIX in fact > > > scheduling to the matching kind of AC core for the task to be run? > > > > You have that already, nowadays, starting with big/little, and moving > > to the intel > > CPUs with widely varying core types. Esperanto has specialized cores too. > > > > I think having incompatible architectures is already there, too, with > > GPUs and smart nics like the AWS and Google ones. > > Well, hmm, that kind of "sharing with compatible MMU" was started by > > quadrics in the 90s, so it's not new. > > > > This has been a very interesting discussion, thanks all. My offer > > remains: if anyone wants to revive NIX, I am happy to help. > > > > ron -- Thierry Laronde http://www.kergis.com/ http://kertex.kergis.com/ Key fingerprint = 0FF7 E906 FBAF FE95 FD89 250D 52B1 AE95 6006 F40C -- 9fans: 9fans Permalink: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/T7692a612f26c8ec5-M66a2043de09d8c30493ea650 Delivery options: https://9fans.topicbox.com/groups/9fans/subscription
