On Sat, 10 Sep 2022, 05:34 'Travis Scrimshaw' via sage-devel, < sage-devel@googlegroups.com> wrote:
> I really dislike Github's decentralized approach with PR and having to > have separate clones of the repo within each user. My understanding is if > two people have different fixes, then they individually submit PRs that are > not explicitly linked with each other, much less with a specific bug report > issue. It is not so uncommon that people end up working on competing > proposals or on the same branch, both of which are not natural using > Githubs PR system (I am not even entirely sure how I should do this either; > Do I have to clone from their repo? Is it the same remote? Where is the > documentation on this? Can I still access the branch if someone deletes > their account?). How do other projects at the scale of Sage deal with this? It seems you never reviewed a non-trivial PR on GitHub, no? Well, you can go and have a look how e.g. CPython does it, or SciPy. The PR process and the underlying structure is very well-documented. A PR creates a branch in the git repo of the "main" project. This is really not much different from what we do on trac, except that the branch name satisfied different rules. Have a look at https://docs.github.com/en/pull-requests/collaborating-with-pull-requests/reviewing-changes-in-pull-requests/checking-out-pull-requests-locally E.g. using https://github.com/scipy/scipy/pull/14786 as an example, the underlying branch in the repo of scipy is named pull/14786. To examine it locally on your machine you can use plain git to fetch it, or you can use GitHub's tool called cli (its functionality is close to what git-trac does, not sure if you use or used git-trac, though). It stays there even if the user GitHub account is closed (the latter triggers an automatic closure of the PR, but the underlying branch remains in the repo, it can be worked on just the same using git) Besides, nobody forces you to use a PR to review something. You can open an issue, and ask for a specific branch somewhere (in a fork, or even in a completely unrelated git branch hosted outside of GitHub) to be reviewed, and only do a PR once the branch in question is stabilized. > Honestly, I doubt we are loosing that many quality contributors by not > using Github's system since we can have people with GH login's to access > trac. > except that this is broken now, (along with automatic management of ssh keys in general) and one needs a tricky manual process (modifying a special gitolite git repo used by trac) by one of trac admins to add/modify ssh keys. (and I am not even sure whether this manual process does not lead to an eventual breakage of the ssh keystore, it's all tied up with trac in a rather arcane way). Getting the login credentials was the biggest barrier; everything else is > mostly straightforward and based on very simple git commands. > > Right now, I find there are way too many practical questions and barriers > for how we develop that make moving to Git**b a much bigger pain that > people will think it is. > Travis, many people nowadays never used git without GitHub or GitLab. For such a person it's a major pain to learn our workflow. Some of this could be my lack of experience with Github (and a bit of "get > off my lawn with your facegrams"), but right now I feel like the move to > Github is like starting a car to go to the party in the next town without > learning how to drive, much less knowing the route. > What's the alternative? Would you like to contribute your time to do our time-consuming trac etc devops? Anyway, trac is obsolete software used mainly to maintain legacy projects which don't even use git, and we'd have to move sooner or later to something that is robust and maintained, and is not an endless timesink to keep working. And trac is only a part of the general Sage devops nightmare, created largerly by sticking to semi-obsolete tools for too long. I think you have pointed at exactly one question - you didn't know how to deal with git branches of GitHub's PR. I hope you see now that it's trivial. Do you have any other objections? Dima > Best, > Travis > > On Saturday, September 10, 2022 at 4:08:38 AM UTC+9 dim...@gmail.com > wrote: > >> On Fri, Sep 9, 2022 at 7:58 PM Thierry <sage-goo...@lma.metelu.net> >> wrote: >> > >> > On Fri, Sep 09, 2022 at 04:07:48PM +0100, Dima Pasechnik wrote: >> > [...] >> > > >> > > Several people promised to look for academic hosting for trac. >> Nothing >> > > came out of it. >> > >> > Please do not rewrite history, as it adds violence to violence. There >> > have indeed been offers for academic hosting, the VM were ready, but >> the >> > cloud hosting was enforced, and you was promoting this. >> >> I don't recall any concrete offer like this. If I recall correctly, >> the problem of accessing VMs in French >> universities for outsiders have never been resolved in a meaningful >> way, leading to an unacceptably small >> for the project bus factor. >> >> By the way, another proof of my small bus factor claim is here: >> https://trac.sagemath.org/ticket/33725#comment:30 >> Apparently you want to do everything your way, and your way only. >> You are asked to provide the wiki contents in a suitable for import >> form, and you just pretend you didn't see the request? >> >> >> Dima >> >> >> >> > >> > Ciao, >> > Thierry >> > >> > -- >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "sage-devel" group. >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >> an email to sage-devel+...@googlegroups.com. >> > To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sage-devel/20220909185835.GA20878%40metelu.net. >> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "sage-devel" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to sage-devel+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sage-devel/4e8fe22b-6538-4a1b-a2c4-620127934e48n%40googlegroups.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sage-devel/4e8fe22b-6538-4a1b-a2c4-620127934e48n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "sage-devel" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to sage-devel+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/sage-devel/CAAWYfq3xy-iX%3DuRZR7yrnvz7sAGNSmOKy4nw5inccSsx3_qjcw%40mail.gmail.com.
