Lloyd, I too have a great distaste for the cost of those things. I don't believe that's how developers should be forced to climb the ladder for knowledge. Nor do I believe developers should be pushed to create most of the content for those conferences just to be able to afford attending.
I definitely share your reservations in this regard... I was just not compelled to state it as such until you brought it up, I have never and will likely never attend one. I believe the Academy needs to go along with any effort to recover this project, and I think the material should be open source as well. On Sat, Jul 15, 2017 at 11:41 AM, Lloyd R. Prentice <ll...@writersglen.com> wrote: > Hi Steve, > > Many thanks for your informative and comforting post. The program you're > contemplating sounds sensible and, indeed, promising. > > Successful implementation and operation of Riak among enterprise users is in > everyone's interest. Erlang Solutions has an excellent track record in > support of Erlang. No doubt it would be a fine champion and conservator of > open source Riak. > > As an army-of-one-developer, with big dreams of an Erlang-based product, I > do have one concern. > > I'm totally dependent on web-based documentation, tutorials, and the good > graces of folks on the mailing lists. As much as I'd like to attend Erlang > Solutions conferences and training sessions, they're priced far beyond my > budget. > > So, I do hope that in your support of Riak you don't forget that there are > indie developers with considerable interest in Erlang and Riak who, lacking > corporate backing and travel allowances, simply can't afford your enterprise > offerings. > > Beyond that, you have my vote and support in anyway within my means. > > All the best, > > Lloyd > Writersglen Publications > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Jul 15, 2017, at 4:22 AM, Steve Roberts >> <steve.robe...@erlang-solutions.com> wrote: >> >> Hi All >> >> Great to see there is so much enthusiasm for Riak. >> >> I'm from Erlang Solutions. Just to clarify where things are at the moment. >> The company Basho Technologies still exists - it hasn't filed for bankruptcy >> yet - although we expect it to. There is no grave just yet. We are >> creditors and shareholders so we will be notified when/if they do file for >> bankruptcy. Assuming it goes into liquidation, the receiver will sell >> whatever assets can be liquidated in order to pay the creditors. >> Registered names like Riak are things which can be sold... so we will see. >> it will probably take a long time before Basho is truly dead and buried. >> >> I've asked our CEO Stuart Whitfield (who happens to be a lawyer) to look at >> the legal questions and give a more detailed view. >> >> As Russell correctly points out existing customers are the priority. In >> terms of our thoughts of this situation, our priority is to ensure >> enterprise customers have continuity of support since they are the ones most >> likely to abandon Riak as it will be a forced migration situation if there >> is no support. I expect to launch a paid support service very shortly - >> if you're interested, let me know. >> >> In terms of Riak software, the open source software is safe since it is open >> sourced under a friendly licence. The situation with the code for the >> enterprise version is not clear yet (highly dependent who/if it is bought in >> the fire sale since it is closed source) - although we aim, one way or >> another, to have an open source data centre replication layer. Not sure who >> is using the other functionality like super clusters in the the enterprise >> version - ping me if you are. >> >> In terms of the products, KV is the priority for support followed by CS/S2. >> There aren't many people using TS so it will probably be community support >> for the code. I already have some interest from a former developer to move >> TS forward - if others want to work on TS I can help co-ordinate in the >> interim. >> >> In terms of evolving the code we're happy to co-ordinate a community and >> help steer the future direction for the product. We are looking whether >> this should be done through a similar model to the Linux foundation. >> >> For major feature development, our thoughts are some kind of crowd funding >> model for functionality which requires significant development effort - >> Basho funded this activity through support and being closed source which >> doesnt really work in a completely open source model. Our goal would be to >> have just the open source version and no closed source code. Where possible >> we wouldnt want customers to have closed source forks. >> >> We definitely see Riak has a future and want to focus on getting back to >> basics of a product which is high performance and does it well - before >> adding lots of new functionality. For example ensure there is a clean >> demarcation between the data layer and the control layer - this should make >> it easier to create new storage types and change the replication layer. >> Right now for those of Enterprise, migration back to Open Source is not >> straight forward because of this. >> >> If you are planning to set up groups etc, please let me know and our >> marketing group can help you establish the community. >> >> Steve >> >> >>> On 15/07/17 08:08, Russell Brown wrote: >>>> On 15 Jul 2017, at 01:29, Alexander Sicular <sicul...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> I'm not dancing on anyone's grave. Im a big fan of Riak, you know? I'm >>>> just pointing out that there is in fact a grave and if there is any hope >>>> for a Riak future the project will have to rebrand. >>> This is the thing we disagree on. But like I said before, neither of us is >>> a lawyer, and even if you’re right, it hardly matters. It’s inconsequential. >>> >>>> I'm sorry, but no company in their right mind would seriously consider >>>> using Riak today if they weren't already using Riak. That's today, the >>>> story may change tomorrow. >>> Again, I disagree, but I’m personally not that interested in looking for >>> new Riak users at the moment. I think now is the time to shore up the >>> existing customers who want to stay with Riak. Chasing non-existent new >>> business whilst ignoring the core users is a large part of what did for >>> Basho. >>> >>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 5:41 PM, Russell Brown <russell.br...@mac.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> On 14 Jul 2017, at 23:36, Dave King <djk...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> You asked what difference the tm made. The tm invokes clause 6. So yes >>>>>> it means moving forward means a new name. That's one of the things to >>>>>> be considered. >>>>> Agree, so if we’re sticking to the subject, “Is Riak dead?” the worst >>>>> case is: “No, but potentially the name could be some time in the future”, >>>>> right? >>>>> >>>>> I asked rhetorically what difference the TM made. I’ve also read the >>>>> license, and taken legal advice. This was not in any way a surprise. >>>>> >>>>>> - Peace >>>>>> Dave >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 4:30 PM, Russell Brown <russell.br...@mac.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> On 14 Jul 2017, at 23:28, Dave King <djk...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> No, but I can read. >>>>>> I read it too. I’m not sure what your point is. A day may come when the >>>>>> name has to change? >>>>>> >>>>>>> - Peace >>>>>>> Dave >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 4:27 PM, Russell Brown <russell.br...@mac.com> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 14 Jul 2017, at 23:26, Dave King <djk...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> 6. Trademarks. This License does not grant permission to use the trade >>>>>>>> names, trademarks, service marks, or product names of the Licensor, >>>>>>>> except as required for reasonable and customary use in describing the >>>>>>>> origin of the Work and reproducing the content of the NOTICE file. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> So At minimum I read that as there would need to be a new product >>>>>>>> name, and the docs for that product could say formerly known as Riak. >>>>>>> You are lawyer? >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> - Peace >>>>>>>> Dave >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 4:22 PM, Russell Brown <russell.br...@mac.com> >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 14 Jul 2017, at 23:17, Dave King <djk...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Looks like Basho has the trademark on Riak. >>>>>>>>> http://www.trademarkia.com/riak-77954950.html >>>>>>>> They sure do. And if you look at the Apache2 license you’ll see that >>>>>>>> it grants use of the name to identify the source. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Look, I’m not a lawyer, and I’m guessing you’re not a lawyer. What >>>>>>>> difference does the name or trademark make? There are a bunch of >>>>>>>> active users of Riak, some of whom have made it clear they plan to >>>>>>>> continue using it. Dance on Basho’s grave all you want, but Riak isn’t >>>>>>>> dead yet. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> - Peace >>>>>>>>> Dave >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 4:08 PM, Alexander Sicular >>>>>>>>> <sicul...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Jul 14, 2017, at 11:32, Russell Brown <russell.br...@mac.com> >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> What do you mean “encumbered”? Riak is the name of an Apache2 >>>>>>>>>> licensed open source database, so it can continue to be used to >>>>>>>>>> describe that apache 2 licensed database, please don’t spread FUD. >>>>>>>>> You willing to invest time in a project that could be legally >>>>>>>>> encumbered at some point in the future because lawyers? You willing >>>>>>>>> to put that beyond the clown fiesta that is Basho? I don't think so. >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> riak-users mailing list >>>>>>>>> riak-users@lists.basho.com >>>>>>>>> http://lists.basho.com/mailman/listinfo/riak-users_lists.basho.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> riak-users mailing list >>> riak-users@lists.basho.com >>> http://lists.basho.com/mailman/listinfo/riak-users_lists.basho.com >> >> -- >> Regards >> Steve Roberts >> +44-7887-852-920 >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> riak-users mailing list >> riak-users@lists.basho.com >> http://lists.basho.com/mailman/listinfo/riak-users_lists.basho.com > > > _______________________________________________ > riak-users mailing list > riak-users@lists.basho.com > http://lists.basho.com/mailman/listinfo/riak-users_lists.basho.com _______________________________________________ riak-users mailing list riak-users@lists.basho.com http://lists.basho.com/mailman/listinfo/riak-users_lists.basho.com
