So am I.
Mario
Il 02/04/2025 16:22, Hollenbeck, Scott ha scritto:
I’m interested and willing to attend virtually depending on the date
and time.
Scott
*From:* James Galvin <gal...@elistx.com>
*Sent:* Wednesday, April 2, 2025 10:21 AM
*To:* Jasdip Singh <jasd...@arin.net>
*Cc:* Andrew Newton (andy) <a...@hxr.us>; regext@ietf.org
*Subject:* [EXTERNAL] [regext] PLEASE RESPOND: INTERIM MEETING
PLANNING (was: simplifying the extensions rules)
*Caution:*This email originated from outside the organization. Do not
click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and
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Speaking as co-Chair:
A virtual interim meeting is certainly an option and available.
Meetings can also be held in person but I’m assuming you’re asking for
a virtual meeting. Planning is different if it’s going to be a meeting
in person.
Let’s first start with who is willing and would attend the interim
meeting? Let’s make sure we have more than a few people. Would folks
please respond on list if they will attend? Based on the discussion
I’m presuming that Andy, Pawel, Scott, Murray, Jasdip, and Mario are
at least interested.
In addition, is there anyone who would like to chair the meeting? It’s
not required that one of the co-Chairs do it and it seems to me that
the folks in the discussion should be able to manage the meeting
themselves. In addition to managing the discussion you’d have to make
sure there’s an attendance record and provide a meeting summary for
the record (which really only has to contain action items). Your
Chairs will make sure the meeting gets set up. Please indicate if
you’re willing to lead the discussion.
Finally, note that we’ll need at least two weeks notice for the
meeting. So, once we see that we have a reasonable set of people, I
propose to use a Doodle to find a date and time for the meeting.
Thanks,
Jim
On 1 Apr 2025, at 15:50, Jasdip Singh wrote:
Hi all,
Since this Extensions draft would be a useful contribution for
clarifying the RDAP extensibility, and that there are other drafts
waiting on it for a more definitive naming guidance, would it be
more productive if we held an interim meeting before the next IETF
to focus on ironing out any disagreements, especially the one
about bare identifiers?
Jim/Antoin/Orie, please advise on this matter.
Thanks,
Jasdip
*From:*Pawel Kowalik <kowa...@denic.de>
*Date:* Tuesday, April 1, 2025 at 12:11 PM
*To:* Andrew Newton (andy) <a...@hxr.us>, regext@ietf.org
<regext@ietf.org>
*Subject:* [regext] Re: simplifying the extensions rules
Hi Andy,
On 31.03.25 16:50, Andrew Newton (andy) wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> At IETF 122, Pawel brought up the lack of time to discuss the
> simplification of the extension rules as outlined in the email
below.
> From what I can tell, the working group agrees with the
simplification
> of rules on writing RDAP extensions, with the exception of Pawel. In
> fairness to him, this warrants a bit more discussion as his
position,
> as I understand it, is not a simple "I disagree."
>
> As I understand it (and Pawel please correct me), his position
is that
> violation of the rules should be NOT RECOMMENDED whereas our
statement
> below implies MUST NOT.
[PK] Well, I don't like framing of my position with a lot of rhetoric.
"violation of the rules" sounds so obvious that it should be
forbidden,
that it frames directly any disagreement into a difficult position to
argument for it.
In fact "the rules" set in 2.1 of RFC9083 are no rules, but a
recommendation (SHOULD) itself. So I argument actually to keep the
status quo of RFC9083 as opposed to defining new rules as now the
change
of -05 proposes.
Also in the original E-mail you mentioned "complex set of rules" that
hinder interoperability without actually any evidence which these
are or
would be. I went though all changes in -05 and I didn't find any point
where the rules got simplified in any way.
Finally I argument that the provisions of STD 95 are absolutely
sufficient to maintain interoperability. By including the changes of
-05, even though the document ought to guide extension authors not the
implementations, it might either misguide the implementations which
would implement stricter rules and not be able to handle extension
from
before extension draft publication as RFC - so the interoperability
would suffer in the end.
>
> IMO, things like NOT RECOMMENDED and SHOULD/SHOULD NOT are nearly
> worthless unless they can be qualified. That is, unless we can
> describe the conditions for going against a recommendation then
there
> is no clear need to allow doing so. And that isn't just my opinion:
> the IESG routinely puts DISCUSSes on docs for this.
[PK] That is correct and likely right to do so. Worth mentioning that
the -05 document uses "RECOMMENDED" in 9 places and "SHOULD" in 39
so I
really don't take it as a valid criteria to decide whether to change
RFC9083 / STD 95 or not.
> I probably lack imagination, but I do not see the reason to allow an
> extension author to violate the rules. But that is me. The
purpose of
> this message is to gather other opinions.
[PK] As mentioned above, "the rules" are recommendations, so there
is no
violation taking place.
Kind Regards,
Pawel
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--
Dott. Mario Loffredo
Senior Technologist
Technological Unit “Digital Innovation”
Institute of Informatics and Telematics (IIT)
National Research Council (CNR)
Address: Via G. Moruzzi 1, I-56124 PISA, Italy
Phone: +39.0503153497
Web:http://www.iit.cnr.it/mario.loffredo
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