Franklyn - Thank you for your thoughtful post and questions.
My greatest concern is that everyone is raw enough right now that it doesn't take much to trigger things. I guess I'm asking people to de-escalate rather than intensify any conversations, should that choice be available to them. Regarding "neutral" - I'd again emphasize "neutral ground" rather than "neutrality". In the sense of not arguing about that here rather than not having a position. As far as what's appropriate to this group. It's difficult to answer in the abstract. Most of the time we all disagree a bit without it becoming quite personal. Lately that has not been the case. It might be difficult to talk about GP's posts, ride reports to demonstrations or other topics being influenced by what's going on. I just ask that we give one another a bit of space. There's never been a requirement to own a Rivendell to be a part of this community. As it says above (or at least above on my page right now): *RBW Owners Bunch - Dedicated to the discussion of Rivendell Bicycles and products* Ride reports encouraged, as is a respectful, supportive and polite tone in all posts. This group is not endorsed by Rivendell Bicycle Works. You don't need to own one - just an interest in RBW designs is enough to join in. That's kind of the "center line". Other stuff less so. Yes, that is a bit of a vague answer. But I've always felt that the "respectful, supportive and polite tone" was what helped to make this a good place to hang out. Again, Franklyn, thank you for your comments. - Jim On Sunday, June 7, 2020 at 6:52:18 AM UTC-7, franklyn wrote: > > Jim, > > Appreciate what you do to keep the group going. We have "known" each other > not quite 25 years, but I think I sent my first entry to your cyclofiend > website in the mid 2000's. Since you own this group, your wish to keep the > group insulated from exclusively rivendell-related threads rules the day. I > suspect 90%+ of the threads would not come close to touching the boundary, > though as someone who no longer owns any rivendell, whether I can start any > thread is questionable by your current set of rules. > > "Neutrality" is quite an artificial concept. I don't think that's quite > the proper word here. I think many of us would readily acknowledge we have > views, but what you ask us to do on this forum is to be "silent" about them > here. However, I also think if the group wishes to really be "neutral", > then applying and enforcing the rules fairly is important. Calling > something "divisive crap" is decidedly not neutral. > > As I said, I think 90%+ of threads will be fine, but rules are tested in > the margin, so I just want to check out a few edge cases. > > Is talking about Grant's blahg, if it does not pertain to Rivendell bikes > directly, also off limit now? > > What about a hypothetical ride report that includes the following > observation: I was on the Capitol crown trail in Bethesda, MD, and saw a > cyclist charged three teenagers who were posting fliers about a protest. > Later I found out that the cyclist has been apprehended? > > Could I include in my ride report hostility I encountered from motorists > (there were definitely threads on how many times we have been 'coal rolled' > by diesel trucks)? How about if those hostility were racially motivated? Is > that too much for this "refuge" then? > > I don't know what percent of list members are people of color, women, > and/or members of LGBTQ community. I guess my point of asking that question > is that when I ride, I encounter things that relate to the core issues of > what people are protesting about. Should we exclude those from our ride > reports? > > Finally, I just want to echo what Jonathan D. said in the other thread, > the expectation to be able to insulate oneself from the "noises" is a form > of priviledge. I understand that people want to maintain that privilege > here, and in the context of a bicycle group this maintenance is harmless > enough. But it it's priviledge nonetheless. > > Btw, even our names are political and have systemic racism in it. I came > to this country in the early 90s as a teenager. Before 9-11, immigration > officers and government workers would openly encourage people to pick > americanized names because their native names are "too hard to pronounce". > "Franklyn" borned out partially from that, but also is created from my > internalized colonization, as an attempt to assimilate and fit in. > > I do value the group interactions and the threads, and I want to reiterate > my appreciation for what Jim has done. And all that are not in conflict > with my wish for the group to be more reflective of the time and history we > are living through. > > Best, > Franklyn > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/a3b171bc-4b0d-4f64-b835-edb842dce562o%40googlegroups.com.
