Ok, you guys (Mas, Alex, DP) have convinced me I need the metal fenders. I’m 
looking at VO and now should I choose the black or the silver??? I would have 
never considered black but this Clem seems to beg for it. Which means I need to 
get a black saddle, ugh. 

Look again:  

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Brown grips vs black grips.

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Sent from my iPad

>> On Nov 20, 2019, at 10:01 AM, masmojo <masm...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> Plastic fenders are great until they break or you lose one of the little 
> bits that goes with them. Plus plastic fender make the whole bike look like 
> crap (in my opinion)
> 
> Regarding stem length and fit; here's an old rule of thumb I've used for 30 
> plus years:
> When on the bike with the seat height property adjusted. Put your hands on 
> the grips. Then look down at the front axle. Ideally, in my experience, your 
> hands & possibly the handlebar itself should be directly in-line. In other 
> words with a line extending from your eyes to the axle, the hands should be 
> in that same plane. If the axle is in front of your hands? then a longer 
> stem, behind? shorter.
> On a drop bar typically the bar itself should obscure your view of the axle.
> Now I should qualify this; this isn't an official fit rule; It's my own. I've 
> just noticed over time & many, many bikes that it tends to be true.
> 
> 
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