Steven D'Aprano wrote: > On Fri, 25 May 2018 09:28:01 +0200, Peter Otten wrote: > >> Yet another arcanum to learn for beginners with little return. If you >> cannot refrain from tinkering with the language at least concentrate on >> the features with broad application. Thank you. > > Broader than multi-dimensional arrays? There are a bazillion uses for > them. How many do you need before it is "broad application"? > > https://www.google.com/search?q=multidimensional+arrays
Sorry, I don't see how your suggestion helps with multidimensional arrays which aren't even part of Python's stdlib. In practice newbies will be told to replace bins = [[]] * N with bins = [[]] ** N just as they are now told to replace it with bins = [[] for dummy in range(N)] Someone showing up with [[[[0]*10]*10]*10]*10 should certainly be informed about numpy. > https://www.google.com/search?q=what+are+some+uses+for+multidimensional > +arrays > > "My programming language doesn't support arithmetic, because I only > provide features with broad application. Arithmetic is only useful for > manipulating numbers." > > > Beginners already learn list * operator, and get *extremely emotional* I don't think there is a significant correlation between getting emotional and being right*. > when it doesn't copy lists like they expect: > > https://bugs.python.org/issue33636 > > This is a frequent, recurring pain point. Experienced programmers forget > how confusing the behaviour of * is because they're so used to the > execution model. They forget that writing a list comp is not even close > to obvious, not only for beginners but even some experienced Python > programmers. It may be unexpected, just as animal = Animal() dog = animal dog.noise = "woof" cat = animal cat.noise = "miaou" or def augmented(item, items=[]): items.append(item) return items a = augmented(10) b = augmented(20) assert a == [10] assert b == [20] is if your mental model operates with values rather than references. (*) Perhaps we should try to repeat the success of from __future__ import braces with from __future__ import value_semantics -- https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
