On 02/26/2013 01:32 AM, Larry Hudson wrote: > On 02/24/2013 02:43 PM, piterrr.dolin...@gmail.com wrote: > <snip> >> ... But for the moment I am trying to imitate familiar ground. > <snip> > This is EXACTLY why you're having trouble grasping Python. Python is a > different language and > requires a different mind-set and different approach. In this, it is NO > different from ANY > other new (to you) programming language.
No. Programming languages have far more in common with other languages than differences. This is particularly true of Python which has always seemed to me as a very well-selected compilation of existing programming language features rather than consisting of groundbreaking new concepts. > Of course, don't forget general programming principles -- how to approach a > problem, how to > select algorithms, and such. These apply to any language, but the details of > syntax and such > ARE different in different languages. Trying to apply these old details to a > new language only > hinders your learning process, it definitely does NOT help. > > Actually, your comments and questions make me wonder HOW you are trying to > learn Python. All > the things you're asking about are clearly and completely discussed in any > decent book or > tutorial. It makes me speculate that you're simply trying to use a Python > reference instead of > something that actually teaches anything. A reference may give you the rules > and syntax, but > not much about how to apply them properly. That is sadly true of the Python reference manuals (Language and Library) but need not and should not be true in general. There is no reason why someone with basic programming experience in another similar language should not be able to learn a new language from its *well written* reference manuals. > Please think about finding some better fundamental material -- there is a LOT > available. And > please quit trying to force Python to be something it isn't. That is never > going to be > effective and definitely harmful to your learning. Part of learning, indeed much of the value in learning, a new language when one already knows several others, is mentally unifying the things that are similar in the old and new languages, and distinguishing what is different. You do NOT need to throw out everything you learned about those other language to learn new one. Thinking of the features of the new language in terms of the old one is a necessary part of this process. I still think in terms of C pointers when thinking about how Python references objects. The problem arises when when one assumes that syntax that looks similar *should* behave similarly. As for migrating idioms from the previous language to the new one, such as adding redundant parenthesis around the conditional expression in an "if" statement, I think it is relatively harmless. Contrary to previous claims, it will NOT result in an "unmaintainable mess". I doubt if any maintainabilty difference in such code could even be measured other than that caused by a prima-donna-ish "eew, I'm not going to work on that code because I think it is UGLY!" effect. Perhaps if we were talking about a program manager setting such idioms in stone for 100's of kilolines of code it would be different but for the OPs situation, I see no harm in it. If it helps the OP transition to python, then I say do it. For the record, I did much the same thing coming to Python from Perl. After a while I came to the common view that such parens were more noise than clarifying but I reached that conclusion based on my own experience rather than being bludgeoned into it by extreme predictions of doom read here. > <snip> >> I wanted Python to register what type of variable I'm after... > > Python variables do NOT have any data type. The objects they reference have > data types. > Variables can be assigned and RE-assigned to any data type at any time. > Again, I emphasize, > QUIT THINKING IN ANOTHER LANGUAGE, it simply doesn't work. You might like it > if it were so, but > it simply does not match reality. I have no problem interpreting the OP's statement (as quoted above) as meaning that he wanted to use a Python variable to consistently reference a particular type and wanted a name that would remind him of that type. -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
