John Henry wrote: > On Apr 1, 11:10 am, sprad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> On Apr 1, 11:41 am, mdomans <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> >> >>> Python needs no evangelizing but I can tell you that it is a powerfull >>> tool. I prefer to think that flash is rather visualization tool than >>> programing language, and java needs a lot of typing and a lot of >>> reading. On the other hand python is simple to read and write, can be >>> debuged easily, is intuitive and saves a lot of time. It also supports >>> batteries included policy and you can't get more OO than python. >>> >> One advantage of Flash is that we can have something moving on the >> screen from day one, and add code to it piece by piece for things like >> keyboard or mouse control, more and more complex physics, etc. Is >> there an equivalent project in Python? >> > > I downloaded the "How to Think Like a Python Programmer" book and read > it. I think it's a fine reference book for the purpose you > indicated. > > Here's my 2 cents on the subject. > > I had been a volunteer mentor to my son's middle school robotic team > for several years and I have some experiences, therefore, in how kids > react to "programming". Granted, high school kids are "bigger kids" - > but they are kids nevertheless. > > Last summer, I experimented teaching my own kid Python. He was in 7th > grade going onto 8th grade. He was the main goto person for the > robotic team and had no trouble learning the common applications such > as the Microsoft Office suite, and had some experience in ICONic > programming (Lego Mindstorm). So, I tried to see what would happen if > he tries to learn Python - using somewhat similar approach you are > taking: start with something visually appealing on day one. Instead > of Flash, I used Pythoncard - a no-brainer Python GUI construction > toolkit. He was really excited seeing how easy it was to have tic-tae- > toe type program up so easily (we are taking minutes - not hours) and > was very interested and motivated to continue. So far so good. > However, once I start teaching him variables, expressions, loops, and > what not, I found that (by surprise) he had great difficulties > catching on. Not soon after that, we had to quit. > > We - as adults - take many things for granted and sometimes don't > remember, or don't understand how kids learn. My experience tells me > that in order to teach today's video game generation of kids, the > approach really has to be entirely visual. After I abandoned my > attempt to teach my kid Python, I started them on Robolab - a > simplified version of LabView and to my delight, they were able to > cook up a few simple programs (like fibonacci series and so forth) > without too much effort - although my own kid had some minor trouble > understanding the concept of a container (LabView's version of a > variable). > > I don't know if you have access to LabView or Robolab or similar > packages but if you do, I would highly recommend those. LabView is > every bit as powerful, full-featured, and "real-life" as many of the > other languages and I believe that kids will have a much easier time > learning computer programming with it. > Well I doubt it's the visual environment that makes it more easy, color, shape and position can give some extra information though. I think apriori domain knowledge and flattness of information are of far more importance. The first issue is covered quit well by Robolab / Labview, but the second issue certainly is not. I'm right now working on a Labview like editor in Python, which does obey the demand for flatness of information. The first results can be seen here: http://oase.uci.kun.nl/~mientki/data_www/pylab_works/pw_animations_screenshots.html
cheers, Stef Mientki > And you are going to teach them Java? Oh, please don't. Let the > colleges torture them. :=) > -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
