Apr 8 at 7:38am, Aaron Wolski wrote: > I don't think this thread is tired. As someone who is about to dive into > learning templating more than what I do now...
Tired in the sense that it had degenerated to a personal level that was uncalled for and off-topic. The merits of templating are never tired! > I'll be frank with this next comment and say to you, Kelly, that it was > fine and dandy for you to be antagonistic and demeaning with your tone > towards Justin French when he commented that PHP, itself, IS a > templating engine, but when John turned the tables in regards to those > remarks made you get very defensive and ornery as illustrated in this Here again, because I think it had been taken to a level that did not add anything to the debate at hand, and was antagonistic for the sake of antagonism. I was hardly trying to disrespect the point that Justin was making, in fact I had no disagreement with the approach, other than that it sold the concept of templating short by claiming that there is no difference. If there was no difference, Smarty would not exist. I think it is valid and important to understand that Smarty buys you nothing you can't get with PHP. However, claiming that it's exactly the same to use straight PHP, says to me that Smarty is either not being leveraged or it's true possibilities are not being realized. There is a difference between a conscious choice by someone who is an experienced PHP developer not to use Smarty, and someone who merely doesn't see the leverage or purpose of the tool. Pedantic debates like this surface regularly on topics such as OOP in PHP, to the detriment of those looking for answers to problems they legitimately want to solve. The reason this is frustrating is not because people should not have opinions or that there is nothing to be gained by expressing them. It's much different to say, for instance, "I don't use Smarty because for my purposes it's the same difference to just use a straight PHP approach" and to say "PHP already does exactly this, and thus Smarty is pointless." And thank you for your guidance in regards to my conduct. Apparently you also read the same things INTO my message to Justin, and thus it was okay for a third person to take it to a personal level that was out of line and when I merely respond to that unprovoked attack, you give me the lecture. If someone has an issue with my tone, fine. I think that's a perception or communication issue that can be dealt with by offline clarification, or any number of other approaches. Going off the handle is not an appropriate response, and I think even in my "defensive" response I showed Mr. Holmes a level of decorum that was completely absent in his abusive message. I see a lot of extremely snide messages on here, and yet, I posted an opinionated, on-topic message that did not disrespect anyone--yet managed to raise the dander of a small group--it's then ok with you if some guy lets go with personal invective. But not okay for me to respond. Get real. > I want to learn more about Smarty and it's obvious we have some great > sources here to do so. Let's get past the snide remarks and keep focused > on educating and discussing the merits of Smarty (or another templating > engine) so that we all benefit. Yes, PLEASE! I regretted having to send that message, but I did so for the same reason I responded to this one. It was personally addressing me. Learn to discern the difference between a passionate debate and personal attacks (not that yours was an attack, but it was unnecessary to come in and try to call the shots on an off-topic issue that was already dead). Please, let's get on with the relevant discussion! -- PHP General Mailing List (http://www.php.net/) To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
