Hi again Chris,
Once more, I'd like to explain that my questions do not pertain to CDex or
to the perfectly legitimate principles you describe adhering to for setting
rip parameters. I'm dealing with an interface that does not even present
any of these variables, such as numerical bit rates. Have you ever seen
Easy Cd/DA Extractor? The terms used and the settings offered on the rip
settings tab aren't in terms of numerical bit rate or any of the other
familiar things you mention here. I understand what you're talking about.
Totally I do. But if you would see this program, you'd see that I'd have
to
be more clever than I am to figure out how to associate these terms you're
discussing with the offerings on that settings menu.
I'm rephrasing my earlier response to you because the last thing I'd like
is
for you to feel I was disrespecting your kind offer of advice. Again, I
tried to explain my questions as clearly as possible, and I'm truly sorry
if
I some missed you. thanks again for the offer of advice about your
preferred CD ripping settings. But I went through all this with Kevin when
I was learning CDex. It's just that I made the gesture of buying Easy
CD/DA
Extractor because it's a combination program and I thought that it would be
more accessible to Jaws for me, which it isn't, and thought also that I'd
get over its odd settings and lack of accurate explanation. At this point,
it seems I've misspent my money.
I still hope that Kevin might read my questions that began this thread and
maybe have something helpful to say. But he hasn't responded yet, so I
still have hope. Yo Kevin! Kevin! You there?
Thanks again,
Daniel
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Skarstad" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "PC audio discussion list. " <Pc-audio@pc-audio.org>
Sent: Friday, July 15, 2005 5:03 PM
Subject: Re: Don't understand answers to my Easy CDDA Extractor questions
Hi Dan
I'm not sure if I can answer all your questions in one go, but when i use
CDEX I usually use Average bitrate encoding. I usually rip all my cds at
44.1 KHZ 16 bit, at 192kbps, stereo.
Now this isn't a hard and fast rule. You can get a pretty good rip from a
CD without having to know all this complicated stuff, the same way you can
tell time without having to know how the watch was made to tell the time.
In other words what I did was I watched how other people rip their cds and
figured out that the best way to go about it is to find a sound that *you*
like and stick with that. You do definitely want to rip at 44.1 KHZ 16 bit
stereo for most music. You can probably get away with a lower bitrate like
64k mono if you're ripping an audio book that contains very little music
and a lot of speech, but generally people rip their cds at an average
bitrate of anywhere between 128k, to 320k, but 320 k is more rare because
the higher the bitrate, the larger the file. It's all in what you prefer.
In the early days of all this stuff, some players would choke on files that
were encoded using variable bitrates, but now they seem to handle those
files fine. I just try to make sure that my files are compadible with all
the players I use. So really, if you ripped your favorite Stones or Jimmy
Hendrix CD at 192k stereo, you'll get a beautiful sounding rip.
I know that doesn't directly answer all your questions, but like I said
when it comes to this stuff, you have to experiment a bit and find a sound
that you like. It's a subjective thing.
At 10:20 AM 7/15/2005, you wrote:
> This post is directed especially to Kevin, Clifford and Bruce, whose
> earlier
> explanations about CD ripping and burning programs I've found very clear
> and
> helpful.
>
> I submitted these questions to the developer of Easy CDDA Extractor only
> after reading carefully through the program's documentation, which,
> though
> clearly written as far as it goes, didn't discuss or even mention any of
> the
> details about bit rate and encoding method about which I'd learned so
> much
> when I was learning how to set CDex up with Kevin's help.
>
> this is not related to my inability to locate and identify various
> controls,
> and even some options lists, in the program due to Jaws not seeing many
> elements of the interface. In this case, at least so far as I'm aware, I
> am
> able to find and make adjustments to all of these groups of settings.
> The
> problem is, as you'll see, that I don't know what they are, for the most
> part, and my previous CDex experience doesn't seem to apply, and the
> developer's responses to my questions have left me more at sea than I was
> before I asked them.
>
> I'll paste in each of my questions and his answers, then type my comment
> explaining what it is I don't understand about his answer. Please bear
> in
> mind that I asked these questions as responsibly as I could, using all
> the
> knowledge I'd gotten from going through the CDex mini-course with Kevin.
> My
> suspicion here is that he has left a lot unsaid, and isn't aware of that.
> As I said, he gives no background in his documentation, even in the
> section
> about bit rates and so forth. And at least once, I think he's maybe
> explaining something (Average Bit Rate encoding) in a way that is counter
> to
> what I thought I'd learned, and where his labeling in the options
> contradicts the definitions I thought I learned from CDex.
>
> Thanks very much for your interest and help.
> The exchange went like this. My questions comes first, then his
> responses:
> > > You define ABR (average bit rate) as "variable bit rate,"
>
> ABR uses Variable Bit rate Encoding.
>
> -- what I thought I'd just learned when being taken through CDex was that
> ABR is Average Bit Rate encoding, wherein the program analyzes the
> complexity of digitized sound information in a CD track being ripped and
> then encodes its file, such as an .mp3 file, using a steady bit rate that
> represents the average bit rate that averages out the potential range
> from
> highest to lowest that could be applied to that track. The resulting bit
> rate will be steady, but not in the predetermined way a constant bit rate
> would have been, irrespective of the material being encoded.
>
> One thing CDex, Kevin et al have emphasized unequivocally, it will
> definitely *not* be variable. Average is the opposite of variable. Or
> so
> I
> thought I'd learned. So his explanation makes no sense to me and leaves
> me
> shaking my head in bewilderment.
>
> Next exchange:
> > > With ABR, what is the average bit rate set to?
>
> You can use any of the predefined bit rate settings (150, 175, 200, 225,
> 250)
> or you can set the bit rate from the Config button.
>
> -- What? I saw nothing in the documentation instructing the user in this
> manner, did not encounter a configuration button, and don't know where
> the
> first selection of bit rates is that he mentions. Perhaps he's
> referring
> to some list in the burn tab or options menu that goes by some name other
> than the phrases he's used here? If so, then where?
>
> > > Finally, With the VBR setting at 0, for instance, what are the
> > > lowest
> > > and
> highest bit rates between which the recording is permitted to fluctuate
>
> Lowest: 8kbit/s, Highest: 320kbit/s
>
> -- In CDex, as I learned, you actually *set* the lower and upper
> boundaries
> of bit rate to be used in variable bit rate ripping, supplemented (or so
> I
> thought I learned) by setting the quality level to be used by the
> process,
> from 0 to 9. I confess I didn't quite understand this (intuitively, it
> seemed that the highest quality level would employ either the widest
> range
> of bit rate, or the highest upper level, or something, but I'm just
> repeating what I thought I learned). But it looks as if he's saying that
> he
> designed this so that you don't set the boundaries, but they simply
> fluctuate depending on the complexity of the material from really
> rock-bottom low to the upper limit. Now, how this correlates, if at all,
> with being able to set the quality level, I have no idea.
>
>
> > > what's the meaning of that section of Preset recording settings?
>
> They are the standard settings for the LAME MP3 Encoder. "Preset:
> Standard"
> creates high quality files with reasonable bitrates (about 200kbit/s).
>
> This one is entirely new to me. There's this list of present, well, just
> presets. And they're listed in terms of speed. Slow, fast, fastest,
> insane, and so forth. What does this setting affect? What does it set,
> in
> fact? I thought maybe it meant how quickly the encoding would take
> place?
> If it's referring to bit rate, then what do "slow" and "fast" have to do
> with that? And if there's a numerical value involved (bit rate, or
> something to do with time needed for ripping, or whatever) than why
> aren't
> the levels described, at least parenthetically, by numerical descriptors?
>
> I'm afraid this unfortunate exchange reveals that I don't understand what
> I
> thought I'd learned about .mp3 encoding, at all. Is so, fine. But
> please,
> can anyone explain if he's using different terminology than I learned
> with
> CDex, so that some of the answers are inscrutable for me and others seem
> contradictory or absurd? I'm really baffled.
>
> What I wouldn't give for professionally-written documentation and screen
> nomenclature on just *one* of these programs. Having written
> instructional
> material myself, including end user documentation for some very high end
> pick-and-place robotic electronics manufacturing systems, and less
> technical
> but still exacting things like customer disclosures and higher level
> marketing information for a major financial institution, I'm not unaware
> of
> the difficulty, nor of the vital importance, of accurately defining terms
> and describing procedures.
>
> Daniel
>
> The responses are signed by:
>
> Jukka Poikolainen
> -
> Latest Easy CD-DA Extractor version: 8.2.1
> Download:
> http://www.poikosoft.com/download.html
>
> -----
> Alkuperäinen viesti-----
> Lähettäjä: Joel Deutsch [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Lähetetty: 13. heinäkuuta 2005 9:11
> Vastaanottaja: Jukka Poikolainen
> Aihe: Questions about the .mp3 ripping settings
>
> Hi,
>
> Here's a pleasant digression from the problem of screen reader
> accessibility, about which I hope we'll continue to correspond. I did
> manage, with some guesswork and a lot of trial and error, to rip one of
> my
> jazz CDs (Joshua Redman, if you're curious) to .mp3 files.
>
> I used the setting for VBR at 0 (highest quality). The results sound
> pretty nice both on my computer and on an .mp3 player. Crisp percussion,
> pretty clean bass and piano, and very nice, realistic tenor saxophone.
>
> But I'd like to know some specifics about the available settings. Also,
> one
> correction for the wording in the documentation: You define ABR (average
> bit rate) as "variable bit rate," by accident. You might want to correct
> that.
>
> Okay, here are my questions: I infer that the Near CD Quality setting
> uses
> a preset constant bit rate. What is that bit rate?
>
> With ABR, what is the average bit rate set to?
>
> Finally, With the VBR setting at 0, for instance, what are the lowest and
> highest bit rates between which the recording is permitted to fluctuate
> with
> the complexity of the information?
>
> Last, and this is something I don't understand at all, what's the meaning
> of
> that section of Preset recording settings? They're described by speed,
> rather than something to do with sonic quality or bit rate. I have never
> seen this sort of setting in a context like this. Could you explain,
> please? If you have time, you might consider adding some text to the
> documentation to explain this series of settings, unless I'm the only
> user
> who's never heard of this.
>
>
>
> --
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