Reg, As a guy partly responsible (apologies!) for the list being generally pretty quiet, the only contribution I can make to this at the moment is:
Reg, You Da Man! (written from only a few miles from that Bell Labs you so rightly mentioned…) Lou Picciano > On Jan 29, 2021, at 4:47 PM, Reginald Beardsley via openindiana-discuss > <openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org> wrote: > > > I have been ignoring this torrent of BS as patiently as I can, but I'm really > getting tired of it. > > First of all, computing has a 75 year old history. There have been many false > starts and mistakes along the way. The failure of the new arrivals to learn > from the past results in the same mistakes being endlessly repeated. > > I shall cite a single example from 30 years ago, hard coded filenames. Motif > came out with the name of the keyboard configuration file hard coded > "/etc/keysym.db" IIRC. A the time it was my job to compile and distribute X11 > and Motif binaries on all company research lab systems that did not have > vendor support for X11 and Motif. > > This is a common mistake made frequently before the IBM 360 series appeared > and led to "sysin=" and "sysout=" in JCL for the 360 series (That may not be > the exactly correct syntax, but this does not merit my going into my library > to check). But the "genius" who wrote the Motif code could not be bothered > with the past so he repeated the mistake. > > No one here "hates" Linux, BSD, Windows or any other OS. We don't like > various operating systems for a variety of legitimate reasons which vary by > task to be accomplished, OS and individual. > > Please read the original Bell Labs Unix papers before you subject us to more > of this. Linux has veered so far from the original principles as to be > completely unrecognizable. In any given day I may use Hipster/OI, Solaris 10 > u8, Debian 9.3 or Windows. And I might well spin up Plan 9 or some other > operating systems by inserting the appropriate disk in the machine. In short, > I can crush someone with your attitude in minutes even if they have a PhD. > And have done it more than once. > > At such time as you can write intelligently describing the differences in > implementation and philosophy about MVS (and its predecessors) , VM/CMS, VMS, > RSX, Genix, Multics, Perkin-Elmer 3200 OS and a few others you will have some > credibility with me. But until then you are just some child screaming that > they will "hold there breath until they turn blue". I am quite certain I am > not the only one *very* tired of it. I know the names of most of the people > who have been replying to you and have the utmost respect for all but perhaps > a few. Possibly all, as I've not paid close attention to who replied. The > list is generally pretty quiet except for an occasional nut job. > > If you have many years professional experience as a senior member of staff in > large system environments you care about what seems minutiae to novices. We > care because we either got bit or had to clean up after someone else got bit. > Most of the people on this list have been involved in large system > environments for longer than you have been alive. > > It is certainly true that the organization of the filesystem in Illumos et al > is a bit of a mess. This is true in every extant OS. IRIX, CLIX, HP-UX, > Ultrix and a dozen other *nix systems I've used are long extinct. One of the > great problems during the workstation wars was dealing with all the > conflicting paths and file names. With xterms open on 6 or more different > systems using a common NFS mounted home directory I had a very elaborate > system for hiding the variations so I could work efficiently despite the > variations. I supported software, both proprietary and GNU packages across > all of them. > > Please reply to /dev/null. > > Reg > On Thursday, January 28, 2021, 09:31:12 PM CST, Hung Nguyen Gia via > openindiana-discuss <openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org> wrote: > > Anyone here seems to be hated Linux too much. Does it because their bad past > experience with it or simply because Linux is success and we are loser and > the natural law of the loser hate the winner? > > Someone used to said Linux is a cesspool because it's only a kernel and > hacked together to create a working system. > > Today I cloned illumos-gate and I see the completely different. > > I think Linux is more organized than Illumos. > > Saying Linux is a hacked together work is hypocrite and indeed slapping back > into our own faces. > > We are no different. Illumos is a hacked together work and was an product of > an desperate attempt to continue OpenSolaris. > > We are a mess, too. > > Indeed I found we are more like Linux than the BSDs. > > The large part of our userland is GNU anyway. > > Back to the rant: where actually things were put? > > I have did many 'find . -name' commands to try to discover where things were > put. > > I want to find the source code of pcfs, aka msdosfs. > > The source files with pcfs as part of their names scattered across the source > tree, the same for ufs. > > Which one is the true one to look for? > > I really hope we could be as 'a mess' as Linux, where things were put > organized into linux/fs: https://github.com/torvalds/linux/tree/master/fs > > Oh no, headers scattered everywhere. Which headers really needed and what > they are actually for? > > It might took ages to find the answer. > > Yet the hypocrites still accused Linux of putting everything into > /usr/include. Yes, you, too, the BSDs. > > _______________________________________________ > openindiana-discuss mailing list > openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org > https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss > > _______________________________________________ > openindiana-discuss mailing list > openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org > https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss _______________________________________________ openindiana-discuss mailing list openindiana-discuss@openindiana.org https://openindiana.org/mailman/listinfo/openindiana-discuss
