Hi Graeme This is great to learn about. I think as long as we all will respect each individual's relationship to this, and keep a healthy discussion going, our community is only going to grow.
Cheers Em On Thu, Nov 21, 2024 at 8:43 AM Graeme Fitzpatrick <[email protected]> wrote: > Hello all > > As I've mentioned previously, I'm purely an OSM mapper, not a GIS > professional of any sort, so I can't comment on them professionally, only > as far as OSM goes. > > While everybody else was in talks at Hobart, I was able to sit down & have > a few good chats with Kate, Kate & Gordon, mainly about imagery. > > It's *very* early days yet, but Esri have been playing with new imagery > that they're looking at trialing, & Oceania i.e. the various Pacific Island > Nations (not Oz / NZ), consisting as they do of a lot of small (ish) > islands, is very attractive to them as a test-bed! So fingers crossed that > things may happen there. > > I also mentioned the Esri Clarity Beta imagery that's in OSM, which > confused them all somewhat as they didn't know what it was! Turns out, > after they did some internal digging, that it was discontinued several > years ago, so they have no idea why we're still using it?! They suggested > replacing that entire layer with their Wayback Imagery, which gives a > timeline of shots of that location. > > I've passed that suggestion on to Grant Slater at the OSM Operations Group > but no reply at this stage. > > So as far as I am concerned, they're good people to have on our side! > > Thanks > > Graeme > > > On Thu, 21 Nov 2024 at 07:54, Emma Hain via Oceania < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> Hi All >> Thanks to Andrew for bringing this up. Let me fall on my sword to support >> you here. >> >> For me, it was hard to swallow to have them as a sponsor but I recognised >> they were coming in under the OSM banner. However, I felt there was no >> focus by them on the work they do for OSM and GDAL, either in their keynote >> or on their stand. We also set up a panel that gave them a voice to talk >> about their involvement in OSM and I personally thought that they did not >> espouse it enough when asked. >> >> I felt overall that they failed to harness this opportunity to increase >> their open source credentials and actually reduced them considerably by not >> mentioning and deriding FOSS4G in their keynote, marketing ESRI software in >> their keynote and on their table during breaks and in personal comments to >> myself. This has had to make me feel as a program chair that I let the >> community down and overall did not make it feel like a welcoming conference >> like it usually is. >> >> Don't get me wrong, I want everyone to succeed, and I am up for my mind >> being changed by disruptors. I know FOSS4G isn't all rosy - but we are here >> to solve those problems together. >> >> I feel like they have been given their chance, and their spots are still >> the same. I would not welcome them at any future conferences and would have >> to consider my options if they were to be involved. >> >> Cheers >> Em >> >> On Thu, Nov 21, 2024 at 7:43 AM Martin Tomko via Oceania < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Dear all, >>> Caveat: I was not there this year, regrettably. I knew ESRI is a sponsor >>> (and this was well known before the event. I neither am an ESRI user nor >>> teach with it, but have no beef, and have professional friends in the >>> global arm of the organisation. >>> >>> I do not perceive FOSS4G & SOTM as an organisation+event *against* >>> anyone /anything (again caveat, except unethical practices and conduct), >>> but rather *for* the support of FOSS4G & SOTM, and to create a >>> community. >>> >>> Arguable, see how much ESRI (global arm, local orgs are a diff can of >>> worms) contributes to FOSS4G, especially GDAL, our pillar: >>> https://opencollective.com/gdal/contributions/793583 >>> >>> Also here: https://gdal.org/en/latest/sponsors/index.html >>> >>> That is just one project, let alone OSM (noted earlier). >>> Let's match that, then throw stones. Think of the many other geo >>> companies missing in that list. >>> >>> Martin >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Martin >>> >>> Sent from a mobile device, apologies for typos. >>> ------------------------------ >>> *From:* Oceania <[email protected]> on behalf of Rowan >>> via Oceania <[email protected]> >>> *Sent:* Thursday, November 21, 2024 7:28:37 AM >>> *To:* Violaine <[email protected]> >>> *Cc:* [email protected] <[email protected]> >>> *Subject:* [EXT] Re: [OSGeo Oceania] FOSS4G Hobart - Elephant in the >>> room ESRI >>> >>> * External email: Please exercise caution * >>> ------------------------------ >>> Hi all, >>> >>> I was asked the same question by some of the people that attended with >>> me. My answer to them was that the FOSS4G community often tells people that >>> major companies should care and invest in FOSS4G, Open Standards and Data >>> as ultimately they benefit from it. >>> >>> While have ESRI as a sponsor might seem strange, for me it is the >>> message landing that FOSS4G and big business can coexist and that it >>> ultimately benefits from an independent development community. >>> >>> Hope this perspective helps. >>> >>> Kind regards, >>> >>> Rowan >>> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Nov 21, 2024 at 4:55 AM, Violaine via Oceania < >>> [email protected] >>> <On+Thu,+Nov+21,+2024+at+4:55+AM,+Violaine+via+Oceania+%3C%3Ca+href=>> >>> wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> My quick 2 cents : I felt it weird too, and bring an unconfortable >>> feeling. (It doesnt question the capacity to organize a great event thought) >>> >>> Have a lovely day all >>> >>> >>> Le 20/11/2024 à 03:23, John Bryant via Oceania a écrit : >>> >>> Thanks for bringing it up Andrew J, it hasn't sat especially well with >>> me either. It was a great event, but it seemed incongruous to have a vendor >>> selling ArcGIS at a booth at a FOSS4G. >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wed, 20 Nov 2024 at 21:02, Andrew Harvey via Oceania < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> Hi Andrew, >>> >>> Good on you for speaking up about your concerns! I'm sure you're not the >>> only one who had this thought. >>> >>> Speaking from myself here, as far as I'm aware anyone can support the >>> conference financially through sponsorship without any other requirements, >>> but it would be up to the organising committee and board if they did want >>> to add additional conditions for accepting sponsors. >>> >>> However given ESRI's involvement with OpenStreetMap ( >>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Esri), in particular their "Esri >>> World Imagery" which they provide to OpenStreetMap for tracing features, >>> and their OpenStreetMap powered basemaps which help make it easier for >>> people to consume OpenStreetMap data. I would say they are very much a >>> positive part of the OpenStreetMap community and with FOSS4G SotM Oceania >>> being a State of the Map conference the more financial support we have from >>> entities who want to help OpenStreetMap the stronger OSGeo Oceania and the >>> conference will be. >>> >>> Andrew Harvey >>> >>> On Wed, 20 Nov 2024, at 10:07 PM, Andrew Jeffrey via Oceania wrote: >>> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> I hope everyone that was able to attend the FOSS4G SOTM Oceania Hobart >>> conference had a great time. I'm still very much bummed that I wasn't able >>> to make it down there and my only start at the OO conference remains >>> Melbourne in 2018. I plan on improving my numbers as best I can into the >>> future, but from the outside looking in, it looked like all those that >>> attended had a blast - well done conference committee and OO board. >>> >>> I am writing to the list because I have a question that has been bugging >>> me ever since I talked to a colleague who attended the event. That question >>> is "What's the deal with ESRI being a sponsor?". I have genuine >>> curiosity when it comes to the decision process in having them on board. I >>> understand these things take money to put on and the conference needs to >>> turn a profit, a healthy conference makes for a healthy OO which allows the >>> organisation to do many of the great things that they do. However, I think >>> this sponsorship from ESRI should be reconsidered in the future. >>> >>> Just to be clear, I am not opposed to speakers who work for ESRI coming >>> and talking, from all reports the keynote from Kate Fickas was amazing (as >>> were all the keynotes from what I hear) and these are the industry people >>> that we all crave to hear from - top job in landing that line up! But as >>> for sponsorship I feel that ESRI is putting their brand on a community that >>> a lot of us turned to when looking for refuge from them. >>> >>> I acknowledge that my opinion on this is biased as a QGIS advocate and >>> trainer. But something about this just feels off! I don't see what's in it >>> for the FOSS4G community having ESRI involved in our conferences, to me it >>> looks more of a cheap way for them to buy some good news without doing >>> anything to improve the relationship with the FOSS4G community. >>> >>> However, I know I wasn't there, and I could be wrong about the whole >>> thing. Maybe the overwhelming opinion is that it's a good thing and this is >>> a step in the right direction? I would be interested in hearing what people >>> think and even hearing from someone on the conference organising committee >>> that has more knowledge about this. Is this something the conference would >>> do again? Is there a limit to their involvement? What would have happened >>> if they were a platinum sponsor and got the primary logo placement + verbal >>> mention at opening and closing of the event? >>> >>> Thanks >>> Andrew >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Oceania mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/oceania >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Oceania mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/oceania >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Oceania mailing >>> [email protected]https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/oceania >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Oceania mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/oceania >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Oceania mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://lists.osgeo.org/mailman/listinfo/oceania >> >
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