On Aug 28, 2013, at 1:18 AM, Eric A Louie <elo...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> how is that really much different than "reachability"?  If I look at my 
> present Netflow results, it's actually a pretty amusing mix - lots of Netflix 
> traffic (bear in mind we're a business ISP, not residential), Google 
> (probably YouTube in there, I haven't dissected it thoroughly), Amazon, 
> Yahoo, Microsoft/MSN, and that's all covered in the peering fabric 
> connection.  Outside of that, some private VPN-type traffic, I don't see a 
> lot of government networks, just "normal" Internet browsing and email.

It's really "can reach" versus "how well can they reach."  I can't any provider 
that would have less than a full view of the DFZ but, if your primary traffic 
is to Provider X, and one of your Tier 1's peers locally and the other peers in 
France, then you would look more closely at the closer one.  Unless, of course, 
that local peer was saturated 99% of the time.  Then France might be attractive.

In short, it's good to do a lot of due diligence in finding out exactly how 
your providers of choice are connected to your destinations of choice.

Mike

> 
> Since I'm not at the Data Center much, I don't interact with the other 
> customers there.  (It's 150 miles away)  Due to non-disclosure, the Data 
> Center gang aren't much going to share their customer contact info with me.  
> But it's a nice thought, for sure.
> 
> -e-
> 
> 
> From: Michael Smith <mksm...@mac.com>
> To: Eric Louie <elo...@yahoo.com> 
> Cc: nanog@nanog.org 
> Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2013 6:48 PM
> Subject: Re: Evaluating Tier 1 Internet providers
> 
> You should also consider who exactly your customers (or you alone) want to 
> reach.  Are you mostly looking to connect to eyeball networks?  Enterprise 
> networks?  Government networks?  If you have some target networks you should 
> do some due diligence to find out how well connected your various options are 
> to the networks that mean the most to you.
> 
> If possible, I would also recommend talking to other people that are in your 
> data centers, if that's possible.  You might find out about hidden 
> vendor-specific gremlins in that location.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> On Aug 27, 2013, at 12:02 PM, Eric Louie <elo...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
> > Based on various conversation threads on Nanog I've come up with a few
> > criteria for evaluating Tier 1 providers.  I'm open to add other criteria -
> > what would you add to this list?  And how would I get a quantitative or
> > qualitative measure of it?
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > routing stability
> > 
> > BGP community offerings
> > 
> > congestion issues
> > 
> > BGP Peering relationships
> > 
> > path diversity
> > 
> > IPv6 table size
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > Seems like everyone offers 5 9's service, 45 ms coast-to-coast, 24x7
> > customer support, 100/1Gbps/10Gbps with various DIR/CIR and burst rates.
> > I'm shopping for new service and want to do better than choosing on
> > reputation.  (or, is reputation also a criteria?)
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > much appreciated,
> > 
> > Eric Louie
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
> 

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