> > Maybe some will, but they'd be better off selling them before the RIRs > decide to expand their scope and start mass reclaiming for profit. >
I'm sorry, what? On Fri, Aug 27, 2021 at 9:36 PM Laszlo Hanyecz <las...@heliacal.net> wrote: > > On 2021-08-28 00:58, Tom Beecher wrote: > > Fundamentally I think everyone should care about this situation. As I read > it, it breaks down as : > > - AFRINIC and Cloud Innovation are engaged in a dispute over number > assignment policies. > - AFRINIC invokes the clause that they are reclaiming the space in > question. > - Cloud Innovation files for garnishment, stating that AFRINIG is 'taking' > IP addresses worth millions of dollars, therefore it is entitled to damages. > - The courts grant the garnishment, although such garnishment is at Cloud > Innovation's risk. ( Meaning if they are challenged and lose, they are on > the hook for damages for taking the action.) > - However, in the process, since Cloud Innovation has claimed enough > damages to freeze all of AFRINIC's accounts, they now have no money > accessible to protect their legal rights on the IP address, or defend > themselves against the damaged seizure. > > As Mr. Curran put forth a week ago, 'property rights' of IP allocations > are an unsettled area. What happens if this holds up that the court there > rules that you 'own' the IPs assigned to you from an RIR until you give > them back? That sure creates a mess with any RIR views that allocations as > simply entries in a database. > > > This thing about entries in a database seems to be used when it's > convenient to downplay the market value and operational importance of IP > addresses. Even the people leading the crusade against Cloud Innovation in > this thread are claiming that it's about millions of addresses for dramatic > effect. This kind of dispute is going to happen more as the value of > addresses goes up and the RIRs realize what a gold mine they have by > shaking down spammers and other unpopular resource holders. I imagine some > of the operators on this list have resources they could return if they > wanted to. Maybe some will, but they'd be better off selling them before > the RIRs decide to expand their scope and start mass reclaiming for > profit. Hopefully RPKI, AS0, etc. won't be abused to reclaim resources > just because they're valuable. > > How long would it take before some clown in a boardroom decides that want > to latch onto that ruling and do something stupid to 'maximize shareholder > value' and there's an expensive legal brawl over that? How long before > people start popping up and laying claim as the 'rightful owner' of > addresses from the origin days? Do we really want to see RIRs and our > companies dealing with BS lawsuits for things like this? It only has to > work once... > > > > > > On Fri, Aug 27, 2021 at 11:37 AM Bill Woodcock <wo...@pch.net> wrote: > >> As many of you are aware, AfriNIC is under legal attack by Heng Lu / >> “Cloud Innovation.” >> >> John Curran just posted an excellent summary of the current state of >> affairs here: >> >> >> https://teamarin.net/2021/08/27/afrinic-and-the-stability-of-the-internet-number-registry-system/ >> >> If, like me, you feel like chipping in a little bit of money to help >> AfriNIC make payroll despite Heng having gotten their bank accounts frozen, >> some of the African ISP associations have put together a fund, which you >> can donate to here: >> >> https://www.tespok.co.ke/?page_id=14001 >> >> It’s an unfortunate situation, but the African Internet community has >> really pulled together to defend themselves, and they’ve got a lot less >> resources than most of us do. >> >> -Bill >> > >
