On Fri, Mar 6, 2026 at 2:45 AM Waiman Long <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> On 3/5/26 1:34 PM, Waiman Long wrote:
> > On 3/5/26 12:40 AM, Yafang Shao wrote:
> >> On Thu, Mar 5, 2026 at 12:30 PM Waiman Long <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>> On 3/4/26 10:08 PM, Yafang Shao wrote:
> >>>> On Thu, Mar 5, 2026 at 11:00 AM Steven Rostedt
> >>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>>> On Thu, 5 Mar 2026 10:33:00 +0800
> >>>>> Yafang Shao <[email protected]> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Other tools may also read available_filter_functions, requiring each
> >>>>>> one to be patched individually to avoid this flaw—a clearly
> >>>>>> impractical solution.
> >>>>> What exactly is the issue?
> >>>> It makes no sense to spin unnecessarily when it can be avoided. We
> >>>> continuously improve the kernel to do the right thing—and unnecessary
> >>>> spinning is certainly not the right thing.
> >>>>
> >>>>> If a task does a while 1 in user space, it
> >>>>> wouldn't be much different.
> >>>> The while loop in user space performs actual work, whereas useless
> >>>> spinning does nothing but burn CPU cycles. My point is simple: if this
> >>>> unnecessary spinning isn't already considered an issue, it should
> >>>> be—it's something that clearly needs improvement.
> >>> The whole point of optimistic spinning is to reduce the lock
> >>> acquisition
> >>> latency. If the waiter sleeps, the unlock operation will have to
> >>> wake up
> >>> the waiter which can have a variable latency depending on how busy the
> >>> system is at the time. Yes, it is burning CPU cycles while spinning,
> >>> Most workloads will gain performance with this optimistic spinning
> >>> feature. You do have a point that for system monitoring tools that
> >>> observe the system behavior, they shouldn't burn that much CPU times
> >>> that affect performance of real workload that the tools are monitoring.
> >> Exactly. ftrace is intended for debugging and should not significantly
> >> impact real workloads. Therefore, it's reasonable to make it sleep if
> >> it cannot acquire the lock immediately, rather than spinning and
> >> consuming CPU cycles.
> >
> > Your patch series use wordings that give a negative connotation about
> > optimistic spinning making it look like a bad thing.

Perhaps I didn't phrase that well. I do understand that optimistic
spinning is valuable in use cases where we wouldn't want to disable
CONFIG_MUTEX_SPIN_ON_OWNER.

> In fact, it is
> > just a request for a new mutex API for use cases where they can suffer
> > higher latency in order to minimize the system overhead they incur. So
> > don't bad-mouth optimistic spinning and emphasize the use cases you
> > want to support with the new API in your next version.
>
> BTW, for any new mutex API introduced, you should also provide an
> equivalent version in kernel/locking/rtmutex_api.c for PREEMPT_RT kernel.

Thanks for the suggestion.

-- 
Regards
Yafang

Reply via email to