On Jul 23, 2014, at 3:51 PM, David Kastrup <d...@gnu.org> wrote:
> Mike Solomon <m...@mikesolomon.org> writes:
>
>> On Jul 23, 2014, at 3:19 PM, David Kastrup <d...@gnu.org> wrote:
>>
>>> "Karol Majewski" <karo...@wp.pl> writes:
>>>
>>>> Thanks David, but you answered an old question :)
>>>>
>>>> My current question is related to:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> c4 c8 c8~ c4 c4
>>>>
>>>> vs
>>>>
>>>> c4 c8 c4. c4
>>>
>>> Jazzers would pick #1, Baroque composers #2.
>>>
>>
>> I don’t recall seeing c4 c8 c4. c4 in any scores - I’d be curious to
>> see who would use that and why. The only use case I can think of off
>> the cuff is a compound 3/8 + 5/8 time signature. Otherwise, I think
>> my brain would glitch if I didn’t see the beginning of the 2nd beat in
>> common time, irrespective of the style.
>
> Baroque and Renaissance stuff often does not even heed the bar line
> regarding note lengths, and, as opposed to modern music, putting
> excessive metric stresses to off-beat notes ruins the subtleties.
This is true. In the example you sent at rehearsal B, the feel is 3/4
alternating with 6/8. This is a common convention in Renaissance dance music.
As a result, the measure at B has a 3 feel and is written as such whereas the
second measure has a 6/8 feel and has a dotted quarter.
What I was talking about in the previous e-mail was common time - I can’t think
of a piece I’ve seen that uses the convention Karol was talking about.
> A
> device quite often employed (and partly restricted to some voices) is
> that of the hemiola. Often with Bach it is not readily apparent in the
> notation, but it emerges when you use the normal word stresses on
> syllables.
I’ve never seen a hemiola in 4/4 - the most frequent use of it I’ve seen is in
3/8 in Händel’s music.
>
> Here are fragments from Dowland's "The Earl of Essex his Galliard" (and
> yes, getting this flowing nicely was a bit of a challenge for me even
> though I only had to play the violin). The point here is not that you
> can claim "one measure is this way, another is that, and those are
> actually a hemiola". The whole fun is with the ambiguity. Using more
> ties than absolutely necessary distracts from that by overemphasizing
> the beats.
I completely agree - that is one of the interesting aspects of this music.
My response was purely based on the 4/4 time in the question, but you’re right
that pieces in 3 often play on rhythmic ambiguity.
Cheers,
MS
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