On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 09:54:31 -0500
Jeremy Huntwork <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Gueven Bay wrote:
> > Hi dear LFS devs,
> >
> > I am one of the - I think - many silent readers of LFS-dev.
> > Normally I only read to gain insight how you develop (or better: write)
> > the book but now I want to write some words here.
The point is that building a Linux system REQUIRES you to be able to
USE a Linux system - it's not some stupid restriction thought up by
Gerard when he started this. If you can't be bothered to learn how to
USE a Linux system first, why should we be bothered to help you build
one. You won't be able to use it when you've got it. There are plenty
of free distros out there - even a couple of hours with Jeremy's LiveCD
will do - if you are mega-intelligent. It's just plain RUDE to ask for
help to build when you didn't take the time to learn to use first.
> Part of the problem, too, is that many of them *just don't read*. The
> answers to the questions they ask are right there in the book. Granted,
> with some it's a matter of a simple oversight - they missed a paragraph
> or so, which is easy to do when you're trying to follow instructions
> while reading a book.
I'm prepared to forgive a little of the 'not read' problem, especially
when it's clear from name or wording that the poster is not a native
English reader. I still can't smell the damn language (see!) after 55
years of trying. It's the not TRYING to read, or even THINK that is so
annoying.
> But with others it's easy to tell that this is a pattern for them. They
> just don't read. When they have a question, they don't look for the
> answer themselves. They pop into IRC or send a support question to list
> upon list until some gullible person (like me!) hands them an answer.
> (Most often a simple google search on the question would have provided
> the answer in the first two or three links).
For these there is the killfile, one could wish for a lethal injection,
but the killfile has to do.
> Once someone has handed them an answer, the only thing they've learned
> is 'Here is someone that will help me any time I have a question or
> problem!'. So then they send that nice support-guru email upon email
> (either privately or publicly) until they've sapped them of answers or
> energy. *Why* they do this is beyond me, because it really is a lot
> less work to read the book in the first place, or google for the answer
> yourself.
This is why I don't post in Support much anymore. You help - then you get
personal emails - then you say 'ask on the list'. You get abuse. Then
you get the killfile out.
> What the current support staff *should* do is verify that the users have
> 1) read the FAQ 2) searched the mailing lists 3) searched google, before
> answering their questions. Of course, for those users we already know
> and who have a history of asking intelligent questions or only asking
> them after they've done some research, we can extend a little extra leeway.
Just remember everyone, THERE ARE NO SUPPORT STAFF! Jeremy is using
shorthand for 'The very nice people who without any pay, and often very
little thanks, take time out to help you with your nivelling little
trivial problem that with a bit of research you could have fixed
yourself'. Actually they do it in the hope that sometimes they will
learn something too - and often they do. There are some people who I
would go out of my way to help - others who I'll never help again.
Let's see more 'RTFM' and 'RTFF' (Read the friendly FAQ) and 'RBBG' on
support and stop encouraging them. I'm not sure about the list search
- it usually lets me down - but then maybe I should read more about
queries.... We also need a new acronym: YAAWGA (you are a ....,GO AWAY).
Finally a wee advertisement:
1) For people thinking of doing LFS:
http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/~richard/lfsdocs/LFS-prereading.html
2) For people doubting the LFS instructions:
http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/~richard/lfsdocs/LFS-references.html
I guess as I'm not an editor anymore these might disappear, but, hey,
nothing lasts forever.
R.
P.S. Posting via gmane works a treat! No more mailing lists, back to news....
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