>>>> About the weight estimation of the pcb, considering that in the (probably >>>> near) future a board stackup definition with copper thickness and >>>> dielectric properties will be a part of pcbnew, the weight calculation as >>>> another data of the statistics window will become possible, once the >>>> density of the materials is one of the columns that define the stackup. >>Sounds nice. Not sure whether it may be too complex, though.
Maybe that's not too bad, as far as I remember, copper layers are polygons with get area method already implemented. But for sure that will take hours for debug. >> By the way, a statistics report like the one of pcbnew, with number of nets >> and number of components would be useful also in eeschema. Its typical usage >> would be to estimate he complexity (and cost) of pcb routing. I'm asking >> myself if Alexander's code can be extended to be used also in eeschema, so >> that we can have an almost identical "statistics" window there with minimal >> effort and consistent interface. If we will understand what should be in eeschema statistics dialog, I can do that as well. Maybe they can even use one parent class... It's probably can show pads number as well... But what else? > >On Mon, 29 Jul 2019, 21:19 Dino Ghilardi, < dino.ghila...@ieee.org > wrote: >>Hi, >> >>About the weight estimation of the pcb, considering that in the (probably >>near) future a board stackup definition with copper thickness and dielectric >>properties will be a part of pcbnew, the weight calculation as another data >>of the statistics window will become possible, once the density of the >>materials is one of the columns that define the stackup. >> >>By the way, a statistics report like the one of pcbnew, with number of nets >>and number of components would be useful also in eeschema. Its typical usage >>would be to estimate he complexity (and cost) of pcb routing. I'm asking >>myself if Alexander's code can be extended to be used also in eeschema, so >>that we can have an almost identical "statistics" window there with minimal >>effort and consistent interface. >> >>Cheers, >>Dino. >> >>Il Lun 29 Lug 2019 20:24 Diego Herranz < diegoherr...@diegoherranz.com > ha >>scritto: >>>I agree both are useful. >>>(Max width x Max height) area is useful as a worst case scenario for >>>manufacturing: it may end up being better depending on the shape of the >>>board and panel design. >>>Regarding actual area, I'm working on a project right now where I need to >>>provide an estimation of the weight of the board. Knowing the actual area of >>>FR4 is useful. >>> >>>Thanks! >>> >>> >>> >>>On Mon, 29 Jul 2019 at 14:33, Wayne Stambaugh < stambau...@gmail.com > wrote: >>>>I agree. There is utility in both the actual area of a board and the >>>>manufacturing area. The latter should be fairly trivial to implement. >>>> >>>>Cheers, >>>> >>>>Wayne >>>> >>>>On 7/29/19 9:30 AM, Clemens Koller wrote: >>>>> Hi! >>>>> I think it could be good to see both: >>>>> - The actual PCB area of the outline (well, without drills). >>>>> - The max-width * max-height which is usually what you have to pay for >>>>> when you get it manufactured. >>>>> The second one could be also an interesting task to calculate if you have >>>>> an odd shaped polygonal outline. >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> Clemens >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 29/07/2019 14.43, Alexander Shuklin wrote: >>>>>> Hi! I've been asked to do actually PCB area calculation. Since English >>>>>> is not my first language, maybe I just miss-understood. Do you mean, >>>>>> that area has to be just max width * max height? I never seen that, but >>>>>> there's a message in thread about sometimes you need proper area. >>>>>> I utilized kicad outline functions for that. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Понедельник, 29 июля 2019, 15:35 +03:00 от Mark Roszko < >>>>>>mark.ros...@gmail.com >: >>>>>> >>>>>> Huh, looking at the statistics code, it actually tries and find the >>>>>>more "detailed area" of a board based on any polygonal outline. >>>>>> Is there any value in it this way? PCB manufacturing charges are >>>>>>generally per-square area because ultimately the price is on panel space >>>>>>you are using. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Sat, Jul 27, 2019 at 5:07 AM Diego Herranz < >>>>>>diegoherr...@diegoherranz.com <// >>>>>>e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3adiegoherr...@diegoherranz.com >> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> I've been testing this dialog and I think it is a nice addition. >>>>>>Thanks! >>>>>> >>>>>> There seems to be something wrong with the area calculation, >>>>>>though. See image below: >>>>>> area.png >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>> Diego >>>>>> >>>>>> On Tue, 23 Jul 2019 at 11:18, Ian McInerney < >>>>>>ian.s.mciner...@ieee.org <// >>>>>>e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3aian.s.mciner...@ieee.org >> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Alexander, >>>>>> >>>>>> Instead of declaring the 2 static variables separately, I >>>>>>would suggest creating a struct for the settings then store that as the >>>>>>static variable. For an example of this see the dialog_create_array.cpp >>>>>>file. This way if any new options must be added in the future, they can >>>>>>just be added to the struct very easily. >>>>>> >>>>>> -Ian >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, Jul 22, 2019 at 9:39 PM Alexander Shuklin < >>>>>>jasura...@mail.ru <// >>>>>>e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3ajasura...@mail.ru >> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Damn ><, >>>>>> don't use last patch, please. >>>>>> It doesn't count total vias amount. Use this one. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Понедельник, 22 июля 2019, 22:14 +03:00 от Alexander >>>>>>Shuklin < jasura...@mail.ru <// >>>>>>e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3ajasura...@mail.ru >>: >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi, >>>>>> thanks for sharing experience, as I never used that >>>>>>translations or wxWidgets before. And I have no idea where else could I >>>>>>get that information. )) >>>>>> So, there's the patch with vias information and some >>>>>>tiny improvements. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Понедельник, 22 июля 2019, 13:34 +03:00 от Ian >>>>>>McInerney < ian.s.mciner...@ieee.org <// >>>>>>e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3aian.s.mciner...@ieee.org >>: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mon, Jul 22, 2019 at 11:03 AM Dino Ghilardi < >>>>>>dino.ghila...@ieee.org < >>>>>>http://e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3adino.ghila...@ieee.org >> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Hi Alexander, >>>>>> >>>>>> One possible solution for the translation >>>>>>could be put the ":" in a >>>>>> different column of the table and >>>>>>right-align the field description text >>>>>> (so all the colons will be aligned). A rapid >>>>>>google search shown that in >>>>>> French and Vietnamese there should be a >>>>>>space before the colon, while in >>>>>> the rest of the world there is not, so >>>>>>having the translation for the >>>>>> ":" word seems to make sense. Also another >>>>>>question arises: Is there >>>>>> some language in which the colon should be >>>>>>another character before the >>>>>> word? (I'm thinking about spanish where the >>>>>>question mark upside-down >>>>>> appears before a question...)? >>>>>>...conclusion: keeping "Height:" and >>>>>> "Height" as two different words seem to be >>>>>>the solution that gives >>>>>> maximum flexibility to translators. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> This actually doesn't give them as much >>>>>>flexibility. When translations are done, they need to examine the entire >>>>>>string that needs translating, so the ":" character should be included in >>>>>>the string. Separating out the two portions is the equivalent of saying >>>>>>that every lanugage will follow the same compositional rules. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Another possible solution (probably better >>>>>>then the one above since it >>>>>> just removes the problem) is to remove the >>>>>>":" and have the cell borders >>>>>> in a different color, just like the tables >>>>>>in the "board setup" dialog >>>>>> (so that you can also take a look at that >>>>>>code to solve also the color >>>>>> problem seeing how it was solved there). The >>>>>>advantage of this approach >>>>>> is also having a more consistent "look" >>>>>>through all the dialogs. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> P.S. (a little bit off-topic): >>>>>> If you move the statistic window and >>>>>>check/uncheck one of the checkboxes >>>>>> ("subctract holes...." or "Exclude >>>>>>components...") the window "jumps" to >>>>>> the center of the screen (its default >>>>>>position on open): do you have >>>>>> also this behaviour or it is just on my >>>>>>debian-linux with gtk3? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Cheers, >>>>>> Dino. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 22/07/19 10:13, Alexander Shuklin wrote: >>>>>> > Hi! >>>>>> > I'll have a look to add vias count to >>>>>>dialog. >>>>>> > There's some questions: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > 1)I don't have too much experience with >>>>>>wxdialogs. There was commit on >>>>>> > master, which says: >>>>>> > >> remove settings for fg/bg color: the >>>>>>result is unpredictable: was >>>>>> > black texts on black background on my >>>>>>computer. >>>>>> > And now I have all tables with data just >>>>>>in white boxes. Is it how it >>>>>> > meant to be, or just some misbehavior on >>>>>>different systems? I use >>>>>> > archlinux x64 OS. >>>>>> > there's screenshot in attachment >>>>>> > >>>>>> > 2) Can we use something like _( "Height" ) >>>>>>+ ":" for translation, not _( >>>>>> > "Height:" )? As far as I understand, now >>>>>>we will need to have 2 >>>>>> > translations, first for "Height" and >>>>>>second for "Height:" but that's >>>>>> > basically same word. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > Воскресенье, 21 июля 2019, 23:42 >>>>>>+03:00 от Dino Ghilardi >>>>>> > < dino.ghila...@ieee.org < >>>>>>http://e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3adino.ghila...@ieee.org >>: >>>>>> > >>>>>> > Makes sense. >>>>>> > Instead of a generic "via count" a >>>>>>more complete table similar to the >>>>>> > one generated in the drill report file >>>>>>could be useful, but may be it >>>>>> > can became quite long if a lot of >>>>>>different drill sizes are used (ok, >>>>>> > scrollbars are made to handle that). >>>>>> > Also having "vias", "blind vias" and >>>>>>"microvias" count man make sense >>>>>> > (or at least having something like >>>>>>"microvias used: yes/no"), just to >>>>>> > have in board statistics the >>>>>>information about the need of an advanced >>>>>> > pcb manufacturing process. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > Cheers, >>>>>> > Dino. >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > On 21/07/19 20:54, Mark Roszko wrote: >>>>>> > > > Since making every hole in the >>>>>>pcb costs time, manufacturers >>>>>> > > calculate the price of the PCB >>>>>>using also that number. >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > A long time ago, holes cost alot. >>>>>>These days if your manufacturer is >>>>>> > > charging alot per hole, you should >>>>>>run far away. Usually >>>>>> > manufactuers >>>>>> > > include 20k-40k holes in the base >>>>>>price per panel before they start >>>>>> > > charging you tiny penny amounts for >>>>>>more in some increments of >>>>>> > > thousands. The CNC machines these >>>>>>days as blazing fast at making the >>>>>> > > holes required and they charge more >>>>>>for the drill bit being worn >>>>>> > down >>>>>> > > than the time. >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > What does actually cost money is >>>>>>via type and size. Blind vias make >>>>>> > > layer stackups a pain in the butt >>>>>>and micro vias needing lasers. >>>>>> > > And also going below some via size >>>>>>can significantly add cost >>>>>> > even if >>>>>> > > not at microvia size because it >>>>>>requires different machines with >>>>>> > more >>>>>> > > precision and smaller drill bits. >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > If anything I would say to break >>>>>>down the statistics based on via >>>>>> > type. >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > On Sun, Jul 21, 2019 at 1:55 PM >>>>>>Dino Ghilardi >>>>>> > < dino.ghila...@ieee.org < >>>>>>http://e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3adino.ghila...@ieee.org > >>>>>><mailto: dino.ghila...@ieee.org < >>>>>>http://e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3adino.ghila...@ieee.org >> >>>>>> > > <mailto: dino.ghila...@ieee.org < >>>>>>http://e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3adino.ghila...@ieee.org >>> >>>>>>wrote: >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > I just tried the board statistics >>>>>>dialog and looks good, I like it. >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > A thing I'd like to have to make it >>>>>>better is adding the number >>>>>> > of vias >>>>>> > > to the statistics: Since making >>>>>>every hole in the pcb costs time, >>>>>> > > manufacturers calculate the price >>>>>>of the PCB using also that number. >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > Also the option to save or print a >>>>>>text with the statistics report >>>>>> > > would >>>>>> > > be nice. >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > > Cheers, >>>>>> > > Dino. >>>>>> > > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>_______________________________________________ >>>>>> > Mailing list: >>>>>>https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> > Post to : >>>>>>kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net < >>>>>>http://e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3akicad%2ddevelop...@lists.launchpad.net >>>>>> > >>>>>> > <mailto: >>>>>>kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net < >>>>>>http://e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3akicad%2ddevelop...@lists.launchpad.net >>>>>> >> >>>>>> > Unsubscribe : >>>>>>https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> > More help : >>>>>>https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > -- >>>>>> > Alexander Shuklin >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>_______________________________________________ >>>>>> Mailing list: >>>>>>https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> Post to : >>>>>>kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net < >>>>>>http://e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3akicad%2ddevelop...@lists.launchpad.net >>>>>> > >>>>>> Unsubscribe : >>>>>>https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> More help : >>>>>>https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Alexander Shuklin >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Alexander Shuklin >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net <// >>>>>>e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3akicad%2ddevelop...@lists.launchpad.net >>>>>>> >>>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net <// >>>>>>e.mail.ru/compose/?mailto=mailto%3akicad%2ddevelop...@lists.launchpad.net >>>>>>> >>>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Mark >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net <mailto: >>>>>>kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net > >>>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Alexander Shuklin >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net >>>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>> Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net >>>>> Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>> More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>>>> >>>> >>>>_______________________________________________ >>>>Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net >>>>Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>>More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >>>_______________________________________________ >>>Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net >>>Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >>>More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp >_______________________________________________ >Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >Post to : kicad-developers@lists.launchpad.net >Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers >More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp -- Alexander Shuklin
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