On Sat, Apr 14, 2001 at 08:28:13PM +0200, Rebecca J. Walter wrote: > so the question is... am i the only girl here who is not bothered by > pornography? i actually voluntarily watch it with my husband. although > maybe some of this has something to do with my husband's attitude. what > turns him on is not a girl's appearance, but whether or not she appears > to be enjoying herself. so he finds me extremely attractive even though > i am about 15 KILOs overweight. and he will still find me attractive > when i lose it. and if i dont. so the porn he prefers is usually the > amateur stuff. I am ambivalent towards pornography. Firstly I believe that people more or less have the right to engage in consensual sexual behaviour with each other. (Proviso: yes there are undoubtedly counter-examples, manufactured or not, that are likely to give the lie to this statement. I will probably agree with detractors on at least some of them. Hence do not assume that I am defending this statement as an absolute and therefore attempt to to argue as if I am.) However, I am not especially individualistic. Hence, I believe that harm can be caused without there being a specific person who can raise their hand and say 'I was harmed, here is my wound.' I believe (again, with certain provisos) that, in general, the right not to be harmed supercedes the right to indulge in consensual behaviour.[1] There are various questions that pornography raises: 1) Is the behaviour consensual? In some cases, it is undoubtedly so. However, there are the stories about heavily drugged actors and so on, child porn (against the child's will, if you believe that minors have free choice in matters of appearing in pornography). Or people doing it just to make cash they desperately need. (Again, ambilvalence, I don't condemn temp secretarial work just because some people are in it because they really need the money.) In short, there is high potential for abuse and it does occur? How often? How often in 'mainstream' porn? 2) Is the behaviour harmful? This ties right back into the whole thread about women (assuming women actors/ models only) or people (assuming mixed/male/etc actors/models) being objectified. Women are the most common concern. In answer to 1) I believe that most porn (of the type that could earn what is called an X rating in Australia - non-violent adult porn) is consensual *enough*[2] so that I do not have any grounds for being opposed to porn on this point. For me 2) is undecided. So, no I don't have anything *against* porn in that I at all want to go out and preach to people. I just have lingering uncertainties on all counts (relevant stats and pointers welcome). However, it leaves me cold, sexually. (Third question: I find words sexier. Am I just picking on the non-literary people? I *think* written erotica is less problematic because of the clearer consensual issues - am I slightly prejudiced in thinking that a woman model taking her clothes off is more likely to be under pressure to consent than a woman with a pen and a filthy mind?) Mary. [1] I am not a big fan of 'rights' or at least, of rights rhetoric as such, and am especially ambivalent about positive rights - 'you *can* do this' as opposed to 'no one can do this to you' primarily because they tend to be interpreted and embraced as *duties*. [2] I don't believe that people can choose in a vacuum. Especially a vacuum that excludes society. Incidently, it's time this discussion was cced to issues. It's not 'women and technology' but it is 'gender issues' to an extent, which is moderately on-topic for issues (afaik). -- Mary Gardiner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> GPG Key ID: 77625870 _______________________________________________ issues mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.linux.org.uk/mailman/listinfo/issues
