On Feb 20, 2015 11:35 PM, François Laupretre <franc...@php.net> wrote: > > Hi Pierre, > > > De : Pierre Joye [mailto:pierre....@gmail.com] > > > > I do think we should. We are exactly at the point I was afraid to > > reach with the unrealistic planning for 7. Engine is somehow stable > > from an API changes point of view, so other can start to work on a > > couple of key features. But it is too late. Let face it, some features > > (like your RFC) will never make it post 7.0. We have to be realistic > > about how things work now. > > Agreed. It was announced 4 months from November but in such case, it is much > too short. On the other side, the vote for the 7.0 timeline got 34 yes and 2 > no. So, I assume people knew what they were doing. The RFC heavily insists on > the need to keep the timeline as short as possible, so there probably was a > reason, although it is not clearly explained. > > My main concern is not about not being able to have my RFCs approved for the > date, at least not directly. My concern is about the new features we'll > announce. That's a major version. Everyone will talk about it. We have a > communication window that won't open again before years. After the PHP 6 > adventure, we'd better not fail this one ! So, what's the killer feature ? > What do we put forward ? What do we base our communication on ? What do we > want papers to talk about ? phpng ? That's great work, but low level, not > much to sell except boring statistics ;), I may be wrong but, IMO, not much > to explain to the average user: "Look, that's faster, do you want to know why > ? Absolutely not, thank you". People want *features*, and we don't have so > many to sell. Looking at the list of RFCs for 7.0, most are minor from a > user's pov, or too low-level to communicate on. > > Putting that in parallel with the recent activity on the list saddens me a > bit, because several projects are coming, that can make a difference : STH > (any version), of course, but also DbC, annotations, expectations. Named > parameters would be great too if Nikita is OK. Parser extension API is a > little low level for the average user but very interesting too. This is all > recent, as Pierre explained, because most of these people were busy testing > the core one month ago. > > Now, if we stick to March 15, most of this won't go to 7.0 and some can even > be lost forever. I hear some saying that, if it does not go to 7.0, it will > be for 7.1. I disagree : a good part of this will be killed by BC breaks and > the communication window will be closed by 7.1. 'PHP 7 features' will be > announced everywhere. Definitely not the same for a minor version. > > So, it's time to make a decision. My opinion is that, if we want to build a > good feature list, we need more than 2-3 weeks. I would say roughly another 4 > month : not too short, not too long. > > Thoughts ? > > Regards > > François
As a user-space developer I'd happily wait a few extra weeks/months for 7.0 in order to get a really solid release worthy of the major version increment. Right now I'm not sure the feature list qualifies. Add in scalar typing, annotations, etc and now we're taking. (There was talk of async supporting features, to, but I don't know if anyone was actually working on it.) I won't be able to rely on it for a few years anyway until distros and hosts catch up, so 3-4 months doesn't impact me at all. :-) --Larry Garfield
