On Mon, 2019-10-14 at 12:07 +0200, Svante Signell wrote: > On Sun, 2019-10-13 at 21:44 -0400, Richard Stallman wrote: > > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider]]] > > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies,]]] > > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example.]]] > > > > Indeed, gnu-system-discuss is for system-level technical issues. > > We set up gnu-community-private for nontechnical issues. > > Please, everyone, move this discussion there. > > > > The following is definitely on-topic for the gnu-system-discuss mailing > list, as it is technical. > > I'm also Cc:ing this to guix-devel, who made the big mistake of > publishing the joint statement to that list: (however, I'm a big fan of > Guix, it is a major contribution to really free software, see below)
The only way I see this as on topic is guixsd would need to stop supporting gnome if gnome is not actually free software and guixsd is to remain a purely free distro. The guix developers would have a major interest in that. > > I'd like to bring up two things you Richard was too weak to make a > statement on historically: gnome and systemd. > > Gnome: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNOME When Miguel de Icaza > destroyed the gnome project with his contributions to that project. > > From August 2015: > Me: > > > OK; I understand that you cannot take action for software using the > > GPL that you created (here systemd), even if Freedom 1 is violated. > > > Nevertheless, can you please take your (GNU/FSF) hand off Gnome, it > > is no longer (in my and many others opinion) a GNU project (and > > hasn't been for a long time, since Miguel took over). > > Hi again. Sorry to bother you. In the world of free and open > > software, systemd is one of the most mean creatures. And you from > > FSF/GNU still don't have an opinion? Additionally, why are you still > > supporting gnome; they don't adhere to the free software philosophy > > any longer, it died with icaza :( > > Me: > > > Additionally, why are you still supporting gnome; > > > they don't adhere to the free software philosophy any longer, > > > RMS: > > How so? > > > > > it died with icaza :( > > > RMS: > > On the contrary, he betrayed us totally; GNOME has more or less > > got back on track since his departure. > > I don't agree and many with me don't either. Please exclude Gnome from > ther GNU project list. That would be brave of you, still being the head > of GNU. I am not familiar with what icaza did to gnome. What's a good source for me to read to catch up? > > From May 2015: > Me about freedom 1: > > * The freedom to study how the program works, and change it so it > > does your computing as you wish (freedom 1). Access to the > > source code is a precondition for this. > > Systemd: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Systemd > > violates freedom 1: (as well as the *NIX and KISS philosophy) > > > > The agenda is very clear: Extend, embrace and extinguish. No other > > distros will survive in the long term. > > RMS from August 2015: > > I know Systemd is free software. As for its technical merits or > > demerits, I have never seen it so I don't have an opinion. > > Me: > > Is there any way that you could consider taking away your/FSF/GNU > > support away from Gnome. That would make a large impact in the Free > > Software community (and maybe also in the Open Source community). > > The above statement also applies to systemd. Perhaps we should divide > free software into two groups: 1) Really free software where Freedom 1 > applies and 2) not-so-free software where Freedom 1 does no longer > applies. > Here gnome and systemd are in the second kind. Especially systemd, even > if GPLed, is currently swallowing most of free software excluding large > groups of people to make contributions. This is not a bright future for > free software, it is destroying it (every vendor lock-in dream) > > Thank you for your time. > > > Free software by definition implies freedom 1 applies to it. If software cannot be modified, it is nonfree. If software is nonfree, then guix should not support it.
