Hi All
Thank you for feedback - I *do* take all feedback into account, even if
I don't always agree with them-- and this is from my understanding of
Gnucash evolution(*) rather from any expert knowledge of accounting.
(*: we all know Gnucash has evolved through generations rather than a
grand design <g>)
1) Frank et al requests some analysis of accounts for grouping into
Short/Long, etc. I disagree. The current balance-sheet does not make any
judgements into the types of monies held in various asset/liability
accounts, and I do not particularly think it is universally agreed which
assets should be long/short-term, which ones are fixed etc. The current
balance-sheet will just take a nested list of asset/liability accounts,
and simply list them sequentially, up to depth-limit. The ways that an
account can be tagged fixed, long or depreciation, contra, etc is not
something the current balance-sheet can understand, nor am I willing to
impose my judgement to report. The Tutorial and Concepts Guide does
encourage that Fixed Assets are held in account structure
Assets:Fixed:Asset1 and its depreciation amounts are recorded in
Assets:Fixed:Asset1:Depreciation, and I see no problem in that, and
balsheet (old or new) will diligently report all amounts.
However I do understand there may be a wish for a customized balsheet to
apply heuristics/rules for depreciation/current/fixed etc assets but
this requires expert accounting knowledge.
2) Subtotals being above or below the account-and-children family is
something that current balsheet already does, and I'm keen to preserve.
The current balance-sheet allows 4 combinations of
display/parent-account-subtotal strategies, and 2 of them produce
nonsensical reports. I've distilled 4 into 2 valid possibilities, and I
know the 2 other options are nonsensical. From prior discussion, some
preferred above, and some preferred below, so be it.
Additionally, I have seen numerous examples, from my nested chart of
accounts with account-depth of 4, that the amount indenting is just
wrong. I have fixed it.
3) In the screenshot, EUR Amounts not converted to USD is not confusing
at all. In the test book there are USD/GBP prices but no USD/EUR prices.
The old balance-sheet would convert any EUR amount to 0 USD and display
an incorrect total.4) The amounts being links are a new feature - the
new income-statement links to a transaction report detailing the
amounts, and the new balance-sheet links to the register entry which
documents the exact balance-sheet figure.
4) Amounts being indented are not my preference, however they are
indented in existing balsheet and I'd rather leave the possibility for
those who prefer. It could be done in CSS, but it's not difficult at all
to leave it in scheme.
5) Amounts being clickable is a nice addition... do try and see what it
does.
6) My main concern remains the accuracy of figures -- I use official API
to retrieve xaccAccountBalanceAsOfDate so I don't doubt the amounts are
right, but I'm not sure the outcome when unusual CoA are used eg
depreciation, contra accounts, equity with opening-entries or
closing-entries etc.
7) The sections are copied from balance-sheet and they need
experimentation... I'd be grateful if anyone can review the section
amounts are selecting the correct amounts. I don't think I've got it
100% correct and need feedback.
C
On 31/07/18 09:04, Adrien Monteleone wrote:
Chris,
Here are my impressions and questions, perhaps I’m not understanding what you
were trying to show with the screenshot. (does this contain illustrations of
multiple presentation possibilities all-in-one or is this intended as how the
report will look by default?)
The asset summary at the top seems confusing and isn’t labeled. If I don’t know
who or what this entity is or how their books are arranged, how do I know what
these figures represent?
Each section seems to be missing the standard headings. (Current/Non, Short/Long
Term, Fixed/Intangible etc.) I know other discussions have touched on the
duplication in some reports in the menus, but maybe this is how it’s addressed -
have a basic report that has multiple entries based on the report type desired for
a particular entity. (or determined by book/app preferences, say report defaults
for a particular jurisdiction) So there might be a Personal Balance Sheet, Small
Business Balance Sheet, Public Entity / Non-Profit Statement of Financial Position,
etc. Each would have the appropriate major sections in the report with the standard
headings expected for each. The account structure *might* mimic this but it
shouldn’t have to. The report options should ask the user to select the accounts to
include for each section. (rather than just one account list for the entire report)
So you would select the accounts to include in Current Assets, the accounts to
include in Fixed Assets, the accounts to include in Short Term Liabilities, etc.
Perhaps this can be somewhat determined or guessed by default, but that might be
lots of work. The same would be needed for Income/P&L.
I find totals/subtotals above the child amounts to be odd. Perhaps less
emphasis on the parent label, with maybe a colon indicator (like on the
wikipedia entry) would be cleaner with a bold subtotal/total line will make the
important numbers stand out more. (that is, not showing the amount on the
initial label line at all)
Also, usually single lines are to delineate figures from subtotals and double
lines to indicate totals from subtotals. (again like the wikipedia sample)
I don’t think the figures need to be indented as well, just marked off with
single/double lines and appropriate line-spacing. For account indentions, does
the report indent contra-accounts? Most statements I’ve seen that have them do
so.
I understand and like that I have the option for levels deeper than 1 or 2, but
usually such official statements are intended as an overview, not for detailed
analysis. They should be very easy to read and decipher without extraneous info
or styling. And ideally, you should accomplish this with plain-text monospaced.
Perhaps work it back to that point and then embellish if needed.
A few minor points:
-------------------
Is there is a reason why the child totals are also links? It lends a sense of
clutter.
I noticed in the Equities & Liabilities section that some figures have no currency
symbol. While I might be able to figure out what they are by studying the document,
that info should be more readily discern-able at a glance. I’m puzzled by that section
though. Usually it’s one or the other (separated or consolidated) but not both. Also,
the total for Assets and the total for Liabilities & Equity should be on the same
horizontal line when in 2-column mode.
I see too that some child amounts show in two currencies but not others. (looks
like just the GBP accounts) Is this intended or just an illustration (or an
omission)?
Regards,
Adrien
On Jul 27, 2018, at 8:01 AM, Christopher Lam<christopher....@gmail.com> wrote:
Latest iteration of balsheet
* restored amount-indenting. IMHO this is now producing sane indenting
for any subtotal strategy
* restore dual columns (i.e. left=asset/income, right=liability/expense)
* the above two only enabled when multicols are disabled
* option to toggle amount/account indenting
* incorporated bug 623381 recommendations for sections labels/totals
* added sections for equity, liability+equity
* modify 'original-currency' display to match eguile report i.e.
smaller font, precedes converted currency
I would really like feedback on
* accuracy of amounts
* accuracy of sections
o further tweaking of option names/sections/ordering
Screenshot:
https://screenshots.firefox.com/nhaiX1ehSA2GXA97/null
On 25/07/18 15:53, Frank H. Ellenberger wrote:
Am 19.07.2018 um 13:09 schrieb Christopher Lam:
Hi Frank
Thank you - I can restore the dual-columns when the periods have been
disabled.
I'd prefer to limit the number of options; so, if the "period duration" is
disabled, the report will automatically show dual columns
while intl. IFRS and DE-GOB/HGB reqire one, US-GAAP requires 3 previous
years in the Income statement.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gewinn-_und_Verlustrechnung#Vorjahresbetr%C3%A4ge
(Asset/Income=left, Liability+Equity/Expense = right). This works?
Can you please show me good examples of idealised T-account balance
sheet/income statement? Or the scaled form? I have no idea.
To get an impression you could starting from:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balance_sheet - which has
#US_small_business in account form and #Sample in scaled form -
or
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income_statement and an example in account
form:https://debitoor.de/lexikon/gewinn-und-verlustrechnung-guv
Note: There are several different methods for grouping the positions
with differrent pros and cons allowed for different company types:
Gesamtkostenverfahren, Umsatzkostenverfahren & IFRS. Currently I have no
better idea for the grouping than adjusting the account structure.
Optionally select other languages e.g.
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bilanz#Aufbau_der_Bilanz
HTH
Frank
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