Am Samstag, 12. Mai 2012, 10:34:12 schrieb Mick: > On Thursday 10 May 2012 19:51:14 Mark Knecht wrote: > > On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 11:13 AM, Norman Invasion > > > > <invasivenor...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > On 10 May 2012 14:01, Mark Knecht <markkne...@gmail.com> wrote: > > >> On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 9:20 AM, Norman Invasion > > >> > > >> <invasivenor...@gmail.com> wrote: > > >>> On 9 May 2012 04:47, Dale <rdalek1...@gmail.com> wrote: > > >>>> Hi, > > >>>> > > >>>> As some know, I'm planning to buy me a LARGE hard drive to put all my > > >>>> videos on, eventually. The prices are coming down now. I keep > > >>>> seeing > > >>>> these "green" drives that are made by just about every company > > >>>> nowadays. When comparing them to a non "green" drive, do they hold up > > >>>> as good? Are they as dependable as a plain drive? I guess they are > > >>>> more efficient and I get that but do they break quicker, more often > > >>>> or no difference? > > >>>> > > >>>> I have noticed that they tend to spin slower and are cheaper. That > > >>>> much I have figured out. Other than that, I can't see any other > > >>>> difference. Data speeds seem to be about the same. > > >>> > > >>> They have an ugly tendency to nod off at 6 second intervals. > > >>> This runs up "193 Load_Cycle_Count" unacceptably: as many > > >>> as a few hundred thousand in a year & a million cycles is > > >>> getting close to the lifetime limit on most hard drives. I end > > >>> up running some iteration of > > >>> # hdparm -B 255 /dev/sda > > >>> every boot. > > >> > > >> Very true about the 193 count. Here's a drive in a system that was > > >> built in Jan., 2010 so it's a bit over 2 years old at this point. It's > > >> on 24/7 and not rebooted except for more major updates, etc. My tests > > >> say the drive spins down and starts back up every 2 minutes and has > > >> been doing so for about 28 months. IIRC the 193 spec on this drive was > > >> something like 300000 max with the drive currently clocking in at > > >> 700488. I don't see any evidence that it's going to fail but I am > > >> trying to make sure it's backed up often. Being that it's gone >2x at > > >> this point I will swap the drive out in the early summer no matter > > >> what. This week I'll be visiting where the machine is so I'm going to > > >> put a backup drive in the box to get ready. > > > > > > Yes, I just learned about this problem in 2009 or so, & > > > checked on my FreeBSD laptop, which turned out to be > > > at >400000. It only made it another month or so before > > > having unrecoverable errors. > > > > > > Now, I can't conclusively demonstrate that the 193 > > > Load_Cycle_Count was somehow causitive, but I > > > gots my suspicions. Many of 'em highly suspectable. > > > > It's part of the 'Wear Out Failure' part of the Bathtub Curve posted > > in the last few days. That said, some Toyotas go 100K miles, and > > others go 500K miles. Same car, same spec, same production line, > > different owners, different roads, different climates, etc. > > > > It's not possible to absolutely know when any drive will fail. I > > suspect that the 300K spec is just that, a spec. They'd replace the > > drive if it failed at 299,999 and wouldn't replace it at 300,001. That > > said, they don't want to spec thing too tightly, and I doubt many > > people make a purchasing decision on a spec like this, so for the vast > > majority of drives most likely they'd do far more than 300K. > > > > At 2 minutes per count on that specific WD Green Drive, if a home > > machine is turned on for instance 5 hours a day (6PM to 11PM) then > > 300K count equates to around 6 years. To me that seems pretty generous > > for a low cost home machine. However for a 24/7 production server it's > > a pretty fast replacement schedule. > > > > Here's data for my 500GB WD RAID Edition drives in my compute server > > here. It's powered down almost every night but doesn't suffer from the > > same firmware issues. The machine was built in April, 2010, so it's a > > bit of 2 years old. Note that it's been powered on less than 1/2 the > > number of hours but only has a 193 count of 907 vs > 700000! > > > > Cheers, > > Mark > > > > > > c2stable ~ # smartctl -a /dev/sda > > smartctl 5.42 2011-10-20 r3458 [x86_64-linux-3.2.12-gentoo] (local build) > > Copyright (C) 2002-11 by Bruce Allen, http://smartmontools.sourceforge.net > > > > === START OF INFORMATION SECTION === > > Model Family: Western Digital RE3 Serial ATA > > Device Model: WDC WD5002ABYS-02B1B0 > > Serial Number: WD-WCASYA846988 > > LU WWN Device Id: 5 0014ee 2042c3477 > > Firmware Version: 02.03B03 > > User Capacity: 500,107,862,016 bytes [500 GB] > > Sector Size: 512 bytes logical/physical > > Device is: In smartctl database [for details use: -P show] > > ATA Version is: 8 > > ATA Standard is: Exact ATA specification draft version not indicated > > Local Time is: Thu May 10 11:45:45 2012 PDT > > SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability. > > SMART support is: Enabled > > > > === START OF READ SMART DATA SECTION === > > SMART overall-health self-assessment test result: PASSED > > > > General SMART Values: > > Offline data collection status: (0x84) Offline data collection activity > > > > was suspended by an > > > > interrupting command from host. > > > > Auto Offline Data Collection: > > Enabled. Self-test execution status: ( 0) The previous self-test > > routine completed without error or no self-test has ever been run. > > Total time to complete Offline > > data collection: ( 9480) seconds. > > Offline data collection > > capabilities: (0x7b) SMART execute Offline immediate. > > > > Auto Offline data collection > > > > on/off support. > > > > Suspend Offline collection upon > > new > > command. > > Offline surface scan supported. > > Self-test supported. > > Conveyance Self-test > > > > supported. > > > > Selective Self-test supported. > > > > SMART capabilities: (0x0003) Saves SMART data before > > entering > > > > power-saving mode. > > Supports SMART auto save > > > > timer. > > Error logging capability: (0x01) Error logging supported. > > > > General Purpose Logging > > > > supported. > > Short self-test routine > > recommended polling time: ( 2) minutes. > > Extended self-test routine > > recommended polling time: ( 112) minutes. > > Conveyance self-test routine > > recommended polling time: ( 5) minutes. > > SCT capabilities: (0x303f) SCT Status supported. > > > > SCT Error Recovery Control > > > > supported. > > > > SCT Feature Control supported. > > SCT Data Table supported. > > > > SMART Attributes Data Structure revision number: 16 > > Vendor Specific SMART Attributes with Thresholds: > > ID# ATTRIBUTE_NAME FLAG VALUE WORST THRESH TYPE > > UPDATED WHEN_FAILED RAW_VALUE > > > > 1 Raw_Read_Error_Rate 0x002f 200 200 051 Pre-fail > > > > Always - 0 > > > > 3 Spin_Up_Time 0x0027 239 235 021 Pre-fail > > > > Always - 1050 > > > > 4 Start_Stop_Count 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age > > > > Always - 935 > > > > 5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct 0x0033 200 200 140 Pre-fail > > > > Always - 0 > > > > 7 Seek_Error_Rate 0x002e 200 200 000 Old_age > > > > Always - 0 > > > > 9 Power_On_Hours 0x0032 091 091 000 Old_age > > > > Always - 7281 > > > > 10 Spin_Retry_Count 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age > > > > Always - 0 > > > > 11 Calibration_Retry_Count 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age > > > > Always - 0 > > > > 12 Power_Cycle_Count 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age > > > > Always - 933 > > 192 Power-Off_Retract_Count 0x0032 200 200 000 Old_age > > Always - 27 > > 193 Load_Cycle_Count 0x0032 200 200 000 Old_age > > Always - 907 > > 194 Temperature_Celsius 0x0022 106 086 000 Old_age > > Always - 41 > > 196 Reallocated_Event_Count 0x0032 200 200 000 Old_age > > Always - 0 > > 197 Current_Pending_Sector 0x0032 200 200 000 Old_age > > Always - 0 > > 198 Offline_Uncorrectable 0x0030 200 200 000 Old_age > > Offline - 0 > > 199 UDMA_CRC_Error_Count 0x0032 200 200 000 Old_age > > Always - 0 > > 200 Multi_Zone_Error_Rate 0x0008 200 200 000 Old_age > > Offline - 0 > > Is this 193 Load_Cycle_Count an issue only on the green drives? > > I have a very old Compaq laptop here that shows: > > # smartctl -A /dev/sda | egrep "Power_On|Load_Cycle" > 9 Power_On_Hours 0x0012 055 055 000 Old_age Always > - 19830 > 193 Load_Cycle_Count 0x0012 001 001 000 Old_age Always > - 1739734 > > Admittedly, there are some 60 errors on it (having been used extensively on > bouncy trains, buses, aeroplanes, etc) but it is still refusing to die ... > O_O > > It is a Hitachi 20G > > === START OF INFORMATION SECTION === > Model Family: Hitachi Travelstar 80GN > Device Model: IC25N020ATMR04-0 > Serial Number: MRX107K1DS623H > Firmware Version: MO1OAD5A > User Capacity: 20,003,880,960 bytes [20.0 GB] > Sector Size: 512 bytes logical/physical > Device is: In smartctl database [for details use: -P show] > ATA Version is: 6 > ATA Standard is: ATA/ATAPI-6 T13 1410D revision 3a > Local Time is: Sat May 12 10:30:13 2012 BST > SMART support is: Available - device has SMART capability. > SMART support is: Enabled > > === START OF READ SMART DATA SECTION ===
SAMSUNG HD502IJ ID# ATTRIBUTE_NAME FLAG VALUE WORST THRESH TYPE UPDATED WHEN_FAILED RAW_VALUE 1 Raw_Read_Error_Rate 0x000f 100 100 051 Pre-fail Always - 0 3 Spin_Up_Time 0x0007 085 085 011 Pre-fail Always - 5480 4 Start_Stop_Count 0x0032 098 098 000 Old_age Always - 1864 5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct 0x0033 100 100 010 Pre-fail Always - 0 7 Seek_Error_Rate 0x000f 100 100 051 Pre-fail Always - 0 8 Seek_Time_Performance 0x0025 100 100 015 Pre-fail Offline - 10814 9 Power_On_Hours 0x0032 096 096 000 Old_age Always - 20178 10 Spin_Retry_Count 0x0033 100 100 051 Pre-fail Always - 0 11 Calibration_Retry_Count 0x0012 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 12 Power_Cycle_Count 0x0032 098 098 000 Old_age Always - 1854 13 Read_Soft_Error_Rate 0x000e 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 183 Runtime_Bad_Block 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 8 184 End-to-End_Error 0x0033 100 100 099 Pre-fail Always - 0 187 Reported_Uncorrect 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 188 Command_Timeout 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 190 Airflow_Temperature_Cel 0x0022 082 065 000 Old_age Always - 18 (Min/Max 13/18) 194 Temperature_Celsius 0x0022 079 061 000 Old_age Always - 21 (Min/Max 13/21) 195 Hardware_ECC_Recovered 0x001a 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 2587 196 Reallocated_Event_Count 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 197 Current_Pending_Sector 0x0012 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 198 Offline_Uncorrectable 0x0030 100 100 000 Old_age Offline - 0 199 UDMA_CRC_Error_Count 0x003e 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 200 Multi_Zone_Error_Rate 0x000a 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 201 Soft_Read_Error_Rate 0x000a 253 253 000 Old_age Always - 0 SAMSUNG HD753LJ: ID# ATTRIBUTE_NAME FLAG VALUE WORST THRESH TYPE UPDATED WHEN_FAILED RAW_VALUE 1 Raw_Read_Error_Rate 0x000f 100 100 051 Pre-fail Always - 0 3 Spin_Up_Time 0x0007 075 075 011 Pre-fail Always - 8330 4 Start_Stop_Count 0x0032 099 099 000 Old_age Always - 1399 5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct 0x0033 100 100 010 Pre-fail Always - 0 7 Seek_Error_Rate 0x000f 100 100 051 Pre-fail Always - 0 8 Seek_Time_Performance 0x0025 100 100 015 Pre-fail Offline - 10041 9 Power_On_Hours 0x0032 097 097 000 Old_age Always - 16941 10 Spin_Retry_Count 0x0033 100 100 051 Pre-fail Always - 0 11 Calibration_Retry_Count 0x0012 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 12 Power_Cycle_Count 0x0032 099 099 000 Old_age Always - 1397 13 Read_Soft_Error_Rate 0x000e 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 183 Runtime_Bad_Block 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 184 End-to-End_Error 0x0033 100 100 000 Pre-fail Always - 0 187 Reported_Uncorrect 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 188 Command_Timeout 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 190 Airflow_Temperature_Cel 0x0022 081 065 000 Old_age Always - 19 (Min/Max 12/19) 194 Temperature_Celsius 0x0022 077 064 000 Old_age Always - 23 (Min/Max 12/23) 195 Hardware_ECC_Recovered 0x001a 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 1412 196 Reallocated_Event_Count 0x0032 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 197 Current_Pending_Sector 0x0012 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 198 Offline_Uncorrectable 0x0030 100 100 000 Old_age Offline - 0 199 UDMA_CRC_Error_Count 0x003e 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 200 Multi_Zone_Error_Rate 0x000a 100 100 000 Old_age Always - 0 201 Soft_Read_Error_Rate 0x000a 253 253 000 Old_age Always - 0 i have some more disks, but those clocked the most hours. -- #163933
