[EMAIL PROTECTED] schreef: > Some of us are just lucky <G>. I gave up ATI after the Mach 64! > Unfortunately, we all can't just go out and upgrade - I know that > for sure! > > Thank you for the excellent summary - this will be filed away and > when I find time I'll go visit these sites. I did use Wine and Winex > considerably about a year ago - I was doing CVS from TG (wrote a > Gentoo ebuild) and giving them feedback
Obviously before they made everybody (Gentoo, Debian, etc) stop that horrible "easy install of CVS version" business. Which I could see their point about (even in some respects that I could agree with, alongside the many respects in which I didn't agree at all), but it certainly didn't do anything to help their reputation, which is still pretty bad, even among subscribers, and quite justifiably so, imo-- I certainly don't like them, and I am willing to go quite a few extra miles to avoid using their product). > and I did a bunch with Wine CVS on Gentoo - ebuild there, too and bugs > to Wine bugs <G>. I used the wine apps db but as you said it was pretty > much dead; used Frank's Corner, too. I had Half-Life and Soldier of > Fortune running Isn't SoF native? http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/4381 ... Yes, it's available at TuxGames. > and was working on SOF II and then due to time (Work, family, and > solving a problem on my main Linux box that has been haunting me for a > couple of years) I had to stop working on it so I've been out of it for > a while. For me Wine is about running everything I can under Linux so I > can decrease my use of Windows - I will still have to have Windows for > the InstallShield programming I do and for MS Flight Simulator since I > beta test that but I'd love to have everything else on Linux. I use > OpenOffice so running office on Linux is not a consideration. Same with IE > - I avoid it on > Windows so I sure don't need it on LInux <G>.. Well, of course IE is a special case. I would never use it as a web browser under Linux (I didn't even use it under Windows unless I had to for those few sites that really only would load in IE), but 1) Some programs (like Office, but Office is far from the only one) require the IE backend before they will install or run; 2) If you do web development, you need IE to test your site or page. After all, it's still a majority of the market, so you'd have to know how your page renders in it. But for development like the kind you're doing, it almost sounds like it might be worth it to have VMWare (not sure if that would help with MS Flight Simulator, though). > > After trying TG and Wine I decided I would use Wine first above all > else and not use TG. I'd see if I could get the apps working in > Wine and submit bugs as I found them. Now there's Cedega but I > really don't want to pay for anything and I'd like to support Wine > first.. I don't mind paying if the product is worth it, but there are just too many things I don't like about Cedega-- can't try before you buy (and they don't even accept PayPal, so I actually can't buy, as I don't have a credit card); don't like how they decide what to support; don't like how if something "not important" (i.e., not "super-game of the quarter") breaks, you can just go jump; not too happy with their statement that if "thus-and-so" doesn't work with ATI cards, you can pretty much go jump, as I suspect that at least some of the problems could be worked around if TG really communicated with ATI (which "go jump" does not imply is occurring); they're not really the best FOSS supporter---- for me to twist myself into a pretzel to pay them $15 USD (converted to Euros to pay to a friend with a credit card) in order to buy their product without even a firm assurance that I will get what I paid for (given that I have an ATI card). Codeweaver's Crossover Office costs money too, but they're a great FOSS supporter (plenty of their developers develop Wine), they support Wine financially, they have a demo, and their product is quite good. So it's not just a matter of money, but I prefer to support Wine, because I *can* support Wine. I can lurk on the dev list and see what's in the pipeline. I can add to the appdb and the Wiki. I can give and receive the benefits of FOSS, which are worth more to me than being able to play Half-Life 2 (despite the fact that my boyfriend bought it on the day it came out-- before the boxes were even unpacked to the shelves-- and it's driving me slightly bats not to play it for myself. Nothing said about Myst 4 or The Sims 2, which are both dearer to my personal heart). But, like you, I will suck it up. I will not install Windows (I *hate* dual-booting). I will wait. The nice thing about Wine is that (regressions aside), it really gets noticeably better quite fast-- and because it's a "generalist" rather than a "specialist", when things get better, they get better across the board (a big swath of DX9 games will suddenly work, not just KOTOR 2 or HL 2-- which both supposedly work under Cedega, but Myst 4 apparently does not, if the TG forums are to be believed). > > I've been lurking on the list. and it's good to see the advances like > the appdb coming back and a Wiki. > > My question on getting games was due to frustration and excitement - > I wanted to buy Linux native games but every link I found went to > Loki who was dead and gone. The recent post got me excited that > some ports were being done for Linux and I'd much rather by them. > I've seen some of the games in portage but some require you have > a Windows CD or the paks for the game. I've also got some old games > like Silent Service I want to get running again. Silent Service looks like a console game (available for Commodore 64, Amiga and NES)-- oh, I see it's also available for DOS. In that case, you're in luck, because Silent Service 2, at least, is listed as "supported" (since version 0.58, and we're now on 0.63) on the DOSBox page (dosbox.sourceforge.net), so I would think that Silent Service should run as well (maybe no one's tried it). And of course, Gentoo has tons of console emulators available, if you have one of the other versions. DOSBox is pretty cool, and eases the load on Wine (which is not necessarily the best choice to run those old DOS games or apps). With the GUI front-end (DBoxFE, also in Portage), it's pretty easy to set up, too. I haven't tried too much with it yet, but it's really nice to be able to play "Betrayal at Krondor" again (another old but well-regarded RPG), and I'm looking forward to trying to play Daggerfall (which is known not to install via DOSBox, but is supported and will apparently run from a previous installation. Maybe Wine will install it for me). I hope also use DOSBox to run a DOS application left over from my legally-required Dutch as a Second Language course-- Rastaal, for the Nederlanders on the list (I know you're here), so I can get my grammar straight and stop saying "de" iets when I should be saying "het" iets (Rastaal is basically a forced-memorization program that just keeps throwing the same "_____ word-or-sentence" at you until you learn all those language details that essentially can't be "taught", because you memorized them as a child). So that's another point-- Wine and its variants are not the only options, depending on your needs.... and between one square of patchwork and another, you might find that not only do you not need Windows, but you also don't need to chase the future with Wine or Cedega, because you have so much other stuff-- native, console, DX 7 or 8 games you liked but never finished two years ago, etc.-- to play or do, you don't have time to worry about HL 2-- and by the time you get around to it, it's fixed. I know it's not as "point-and-click perfect" as Windows, but Linux really is "ready" enough that you can generally find an acceptable alternative to amuse yourself with until such time as your preferred solution is complete. Flexibility is the key, as is a bit of patience-- and while it is of course everyone's right to be as inflexible and/or impatient as they choose, I can't really esteem the opinions of such users very highly. Maybe in 3 years (or less, or more) you can run Linux as your sole operating system and remain inflexible and impatient-- and maybe tomorrow you can operate your car without gasoline, too. But that day isn't today, and if one just accepts that and loosens up, one might find that one winds up far less uncomfortable than one expected. > > Thanks again. > Everyone is more than welcome; glad it was of some assistance in creating an overview of the situation. Holly -- gentoo-user@gentoo.org mailing list
